Gun Dog Forum

surferdave

He's still young, I would think the best thing to do is keep it positive and not add pressure quite yet. Continue working in hallways where your pup only has one place to bring the dummy back. Also it may be frowned upon, but in the beginning I used treats as incentive. If he dropped the bumper, I w...

surferdave

Bandito,

I'll send you a PM with more information. If you want I can have you pictures as well. The pigeon coop was barely used for 1 season and is in great condition. I have a person that you can purchase pigeons from if interested.

David

surferdave

Bandito,

I'm located in the Bay Area, but have a loft I need to get rid of. If you want, it's $200, which basically covers the wood purchased to build it.

David

surferdave

Exposure is key right now. I'm not sure you mentioned whether the dog is a pointer or lab. Clipped winged pigeons work really well to build prey drive. I don't know to much about pointers, but when teaching my lab to hunt and flush, I utilized hunt clubs. Even one in Hilmar, which is close to Fresno...

surferdave

It really all depends on how your dog acts on the boat. I'd definitely give it a shot, as it's a great way to have your buddy outdoors with you. When my 1.5 year old Lab was a puppy, I took him out on my little pontoon boat, he did really well, and instantly realized when a fish was on. Now when he ...

surferdave

If you are getting an 8 week old. I wouldn't worry too much about solid obedience training for a while. E-collar conditioning can wait till at least 6 months. A lot of training on a small pup should just be 5 minutes a couple times a day. Much of it can be done inside your home. If they get bored, i...

surferdave

If you are running into issues with the pheasants, I'd maybe try a tuneup on FF with that particular bird. If you see mouthiness on the pheasant, give a solid tap under the jaw enforcing a firm hold. Seems like it's easier for them to get away with it in the field, possibly a reminder on the bench o...

surferdave

I agree, if he's collar conditioned then use the collar. When I was teaching it, I still had a helper with a check cord next to him. I would blow the whistle, have her pull up on his lead while I gave continuous. The moment he put his butt down, stop stim and praise heavily. I then phase out the lea...

surferdave

Just to point out, I would allow my lab to chase the swallows in a fence enclosed field. He has seen them on our walks and on trails, but does not break unless I allow. I wouldn't suggest letting your dog chase birds unless you have complete control over him. Bird crazy is great and all, but if your...

surferdave

Low flying swallows was an issue for me this spring as well. From March through June, my Lab was absolutely obsessed with those little guys. They were always at the field I trained at. I would let him chase them for 20-30 minutes. It gave me opportunities to work on his sit to whistle and obedience....

surferdave

In regards to the lab. Sounds like you just started using the e-collar. Make sure the foundation is good before using it in conjunction with birds. Obedience should be rock solid right now, you should not have run him off check cord. Keep away is not a game you should be playing with a dog that is a...

surferdave

It's strange reading over one of your old post. My dog is 1 year old now. Anyways, I would have to agree with what others are saying. You are doing the right thing by banging pots/slapping 2x4's and making noise when your pup is eating. Be cautious with the skeet range and shooting range. Make sure ...

surferdave

Remember, keep sessions short. Puppies this age have very short attention spans, just 2 or 3 retrieves, never let the puppy get tired or bored of the game. Praise heavily, and as others have said, hallways or narrow areas to work in are the best. If the pup is food driven, give a bit of his kibble t...

surferdave

One last time. Using an e-collar whether it be for hunting or dog parks is the SAME!!!!!!!!! Why can't you get that through your head? There is NO difference to us. If really do want to learn about the proper introduction and use of an e-collar there are PLENTY of resources. http://ponderosakennels....

surferdave

My dog loves nothing more than to steal something and be chased with it. But I have taught him drop it. I've turned it into a game and mixed in premack. So when I tell him drop it, he thinks it's all part of the game. Dropping said item is a continuation of the game. Will he get it back? Will I thr...

surferdave

Sato, Again, as I've said MANY times. To a hunter, obedience at a dog park is identical to obedience in the field. If we are talking about having fun, my dog has far more fun out on a hunt than a dog park anyways. Let me give you two examples, one at a dog park and one out in the field. Both situati...

surferdave

I did. I asked if an e-collar was just used as a correction or if it was ever used as a cue. Yet the only responses I get are that I'm a bunny hugger who is close minded and only came here for a fight. How can I ask any more questions if those are the answers I get? I believe I answered this questi...

surferdave

"So wait...is the e-collar being used as a correction or have you trained it as a cue to return to you? If it's a correction, that's where my uncertainty lies. What is the dog associating the correction with?" In a dog park situation, my dog understands that when I say "come" he is expected to run b...

surferdave

I apologize for the my dog vs. your dog banter, that never leads to anything productive. If you really are here to learn more about how e-collars are utilized with hunters you have to understand the training process. We don't strap e-collars on puppies. Most dogs start at 7 months to a year. Some st...

surferdave

Also Sato, doesn't training and corrections go hand in hand? When you tell your dog to stay, and it doesn't, what do you do? You probably say Ah Ah! Or repeat the command... no? Aren't those verbal corrections? E-collar is a tool, it doesn't train the dog, it only assist in training. I'll bet you th...

surferdave

Lastly, I find if coupled with positive reinforcement, even when he is not wearing the collar, he becomes extremely consistent with compliance. Properly timed corrections also helps to enforce the alpha role in the relationship, which we all know is necessary. Ok...compliance...that's a word that's...

surferdave

This is a fascinating discussion. I find it interesting because I am currently in the process of assisting a friend in training with an e-collar outside of hunting. His Labrador is probably 3 months younger than mine, he has no ambition to hunt it, but seeing the results I've produced in training my...

surferdave

Absolutely normal puppy behavior, at first you're so happy those days are over, but now I miss my guys puppyhood. Be forceful without being abusive. Patience is the key. 8 1/2 weeks is still a baby, your pup is curious with a VERY short attention span. You'll see their attention grow with age. Raisi...

surferdave

Take the necessary precautions to ensure that your dog doesn't mishandle the birds. Are you using a check cord if your dog isn't collar conditioned yet? Also doves are very small birds that easily fit in a labs mouth, retrieving larger game to start may work better. Corrections and reinforcement is ...

surferdave

Also agree with GH, try a clipped wing pigeon. If there is no desire for that, you might be at a loss. At 7 months, has your pup been introduced to birds, feathers? You might want to wrap a pheasant or chukar wing around a bumper, that should get him fired up as well. I for one understand where you'...

surferdave

Thanks.

surferdave

A friend and I took Raglan for his last preserve hunt of the season. Basically planted chukar and pheasant hen. On one of the first couple birds we shot, my friend didn't wait long enough for the chukar to get out, and basically destroyed it. The bird was sloppy and kind of in two pieces. Raglan wou...

surferdave

Definitely all about fun right now. Plus him showing off his retrieve lets you know that he's enjoying it and having a good time. That's what you want in a young pup. As my dogs retrieving became more formalized, he easily distinguishes a "work" bumper and a "fun" bumper, as all dogs do, and many wi...

surferdave

I don't know if you should follow this advice, as it's not part of a force fetch program, but when I was first training my puppy to retrieve, I used treats, he would not receive the treat until he brought the bumper back to me hand delivered. It's possible a combination of pressure along with praise...

surferdave

It's just a technique to not making them sound shy. They are focused while eating, just like they will be focused while hunting, so getting them used to loud sounds is exactly what introducing them to the gun is all about. Also eating is a positive and rewarding thing to them, so they start associat...

surferdave

There's lots of stuff online regarding proper gun introduction. I hear slapping two 2X4's together while she's eating is a good start. Here's a video tutorial on it.

http://www.gundogsonline.com/video/hunt ... unfire.htm

Take it slow and good luck.

surferdave

Alright, this might be a little funny, but one of my pigeons I was training with today escaped under my deck. I've had this happen before, but that was when my pup was still being left in his crate. The pigeon at the time eventually explored out and I was able to catch him (their wings are clipped)....

surferdave

Day one he was just getting used to things and really didn't put together a significant pattern, but on the second day he proactively worked ahead of us and started with some natural quartering. It was fun seeing him gain more and more confidence with each bird he flushed and retrieved. AZ you're so...

surferdave

I just got back from 2 days of chukar hunting with my first gun dog Raglan. It was his first time, and the birds were planted and flagged for us on a smaller field the first day, and we worked flagged birds on the second day on a larger field. I had an absolute blast. Raglan had no problem finding t...

surferdave

Training to retrieve tennis balls is not training to retrieve birds. You have to link that retrieving ability he has with balls to the birds you shoot. This involves using dummies not balls, dummies with wings attached, and of course, dead birds or live birds. Again with what others have said, runni...

surferdave

I agree, see how your dog does on clipped wing pigeons, and live birds. Just make sure to work him on a check cord as you don't want to promote bad handling in the future.

surferdave

Thanks Snips. You're right, I never mentioned anything about Pheasant, and after talking to the people at the game reserve which bird they'd suggest putting first time pups on, they also said Chukar. Try reading my forum question before assuming that I'm doing everything "bleeping" backwards. Plus t...

surferdave

Crackerd, I do appreciate you keeping tabs on my forum postings. Being very new at this, I don't have fellow hunters, or trainers to help me first hand with some of the issues I might have along the way. Which is why I do ask questions on this forum, which has been really helpful. I'm asking the que...

surferdave

Sorry if I wasn't clear in my response. I had a friend using a 9mm from 75 yards and let my pup chase clipped wing pigeons while he got closer. Eventually he was shooting within 15 feet of him with no signs of gun shyness (this was at a private property). Then when starting him with the 12 gauge sho...

surferdave

Gone' Huntin'. I live in and around cities, so I haven't found land to shoot birds around him, but I have taken him to the shotgun range to shoot some clays multiple times, and he has no problem around a 12 gauge. If one of us happens to miss a clay, he gets antsy and wants to retrieve where it land...

surferdave

A friend and I are going to to shoot planted chukar over my pup (7 months) head next weekend. I've only work with pigeons, and so far he has only retrieved live birds with clipped wings. He will retrieve to hand and hold them until commanded to give. He hasn't killed one yet, and has a super soft mo...

surferdave

Nice Job, and great looking dog.

surferdave

Good stuff. I'll probably FF him this summer when there is more light in the evenings and I'll have more time. I've heard that done properly the dog should run stronger with more confidence. Still, he goes after birds HARD, so I'm definitely proud of him.

surferdave

Don't purchase an e-collar yet, before all of this, I'd start working obedience with the dog and creating that bond. If you've only had him for a couple weeks, you have to gain his trust, let him know who's the alpha, and make him realize that the previous obedience training (if any) must also be ap...

surferdave

I guess I should be happy my dog is bringing back birds to hand, and holding until commanded to drop. And in the 3 months I've worked with him, he hasn't killed a clipped wing yet. He runs at about 70% when steadied, and 90% on "fun bumper" retrieves. I guess for training purposes, I love seeing tha...

surferdave

My 7 month old lab has TONS of drive when it comes to birds, but when retrieving bumpers, it's not a full sprint, jump up trying to get them, type of deal. He always gets them for me, but I just don't see the drive. He is purebred, but does not come from a hunting line. I plan on FF'ing him pretty s...

surferdave

I'm sure everyone is gonna say it, but sounds like you need to FF him. It's as if he chooses to retrieve when he wants to, and when he doesn't, you let him get away with it.

surferdave

Are you planting them in heavy cover? From what I heard pigeons don't spring up like pheasant, so they need to have a little room for their wings to create lift. One thing I've noticed is, once you notice their necks become limp they are pretty much dizzy, and even once they are un-dizied, I wouldn'...

surferdave

Gone huntin' I think you're absolutely right, and I'm realizing that his conditioning to here in a distracted situation is nowhere near perfect. His performance in the yard is near perfect. knine, to answer your question, when he does get distracted in the yard, and "blows me off", I increase the le...

surferdave

If you read my original post, I did talk about proper conditioning and introduction to the e-collar. I used a check cord in addition to the e-collar so my guy knows exactly how to turn off stimulation. My question is in regards to now that my dog understands the e-collar, and that not complying to m...

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