Search found 115 matches

by Thornapple
Mon Jul 21, 2014 11:46 am
Forum: Training
Topic: What launcher is recommended?
Replies: 16
Views: 3952

Re: What launcher is recommended?

If the consensus is Dogtra, is the quail /pigeon launcher large enough to hold either a chucker or a homing pigeon? I would gather yes, I just want to make sure.
Thornapple
by Thornapple
Sun Jul 20, 2014 4:22 pm
Forum: Training
Topic: What launcher is recommended?
Replies: 16
Views: 3952

Re: What launcher is recommended?

rich, thanks for clarifying. You are supporting what i have have heard from others.
Thornapple
by Thornapple
Sun Jul 20, 2014 3:41 pm
Forum: Training
Topic: What launcher is recommended?
Replies: 16
Views: 3952

Re: What launcher is recommended?

I know a lot of my NAVHDA friends use them. Even though they are more expensive several mentioned they are like tanks. As I have experienced battery powered launchers before they always were out of "juice" just as I was either putting birds out or in fact had a dog on point. All occurring at the wro...
by Thornapple
Sun Jul 20, 2014 3:05 pm
Forum: Training
Topic: What launcher is recommended?
Replies: 16
Views: 3952

Re: What launcher is recommended?

Rich, is there any reason why you like the DT or is it just what you have, are familiar, and are happy with it?
by Thornapple
Sun Jul 20, 2014 2:06 pm
Forum: Training
Topic: What launcher is recommended?
Replies: 16
Views: 3952

What launcher is recommended?

I am considering purchasing four DT or Dogtra quail/pigeon launchers. I realize one is battery powered and other
re-chargeable, other than that does anyone recommend one over the other?
Thornapple
by Thornapple
Wed Oct 02, 2013 6:18 am
Forum: Training
Topic: NA Test
Replies: 10
Views: 1359

Re: NA Test

Hafe4825.
High Voltage gave you probably the best advice anyone in NAVHDA, dog trainer, or on this forum will give you. Remember your objective is to, "Enjoy your dog!" Training is a means to an end, the testing or its preparation is not the end to itself!
Thornapple
by Thornapple
Mon Sep 23, 2013 5:50 am
Forum: Hunting
Topic: Apron string syndrome
Replies: 12
Views: 3387

Re: Apron string syndrome

roostersmom,
Sorry for the delay in responding, but I am trying that now that it is cooler and it seems to work. So thank you!
Thornapple
by Thornapple
Mon Sep 23, 2013 5:42 am
Forum: Training
Topic: A question on Boldness and Search
Replies: 12
Views: 2785

Re: A question on Boldness and Search

Sharon, Neil, and DonF, Interesting response. You are probably right. I was obviously trying to equate the statement made by Woody Hayes, "Give me a kid who is the shortest, least likely to succeed by those around him, but has heart and drive; and I will show you ambition, willingness to take on the...
by Thornapple
Sun Sep 22, 2013 7:18 am
Forum: Training
Topic: A question on Boldness and Search
Replies: 12
Views: 2785

Re: A question on Boldness and Search

Yes Smitty that was my first reaction. However I was simply curious if what I experienced is more common than not.
Thornapple
by Thornapple
Sun Sep 22, 2013 5:20 am
Forum: Training
Topic: A question on Boldness and Search
Replies: 12
Views: 2785

A question on Boldness and Search

I would like to ask those of you that have experienced the difference between a young pack puppy (17 months) and another of the same breed that is not in a pack. Let me explain the situation and the question. I have a 17 month old male that I wanted to start developing confidence in the field. I wro...
by Thornapple
Sun Sep 22, 2013 4:44 am
Forum: Training
Topic: Alternative to Force Fetch and Clicker training?
Replies: 60
Views: 10206

Re: Alternative to Force Fetch and Clicker training?

A2Brit, Regarding training for honor in an upland dog. I can only share what worked for one of my dogs that also did not honor. I went back to basics on whoa. I found that I had slipped in time with discipline so I started again with whoa at the front door until I and or everyone exited. I then rele...
by Thornapple
Sat Aug 31, 2013 8:41 am
Forum: Training
Topic: Alternative to Force Fetch and Clicker training?
Replies: 60
Views: 10206

Re: Alternative to Force Fetch and Clicker training?

Polmaise, Dr. William James early in the 19th century wrote of a concept he is credited to understand called, "Stream of Conscious Thought." We in the States practice this a lot, if you have not noticed particularly in open forums. I guess it is our contrarian method of sharing ideas if even 180 deg...
by Thornapple
Thu Aug 29, 2013 2:01 pm
Forum: Training
Topic: How to help establish a Bold dog that is under foot?
Replies: 48
Views: 7291

Re: How to help establish a Bold dog that is under foot?

Mark, I asked about cougars while in Grand Rapids for a few weeks and no one has seen any. Of course that does not mean anything. In fact a regional director for the National Park Service that just moved in from Colorado saw one jump a back yard fence in the suburbs of Washington, DC many years ago....
by Thornapple
Thu Aug 29, 2013 6:01 am
Forum: Training
Topic: Alternative to Force Fetch and Clicker training?
Replies: 60
Views: 10206

Re: Alternative to Force Fetch and Clicker training?

Birddog1968, What i had hoped to achieve here with my initial question is an opening to new ideas, new techniques, alternatives to current training that might attract and bring in more to working with and developing our hunting breeds. I expected resistance, "it worked in the past why change it?" An...
by Thornapple
Thu Aug 29, 2013 5:01 am
Forum: Hunting
Topic: conibear traps
Replies: 147
Views: 24793

Re: conibear traps

Greg, I was remiss in not mentioning, if no one has not been done at this point, the most important consideration for you and your dog in the woods. That is safety, and it is not a trap. First thing is to get a good book on canine first aid. One that is designed for hunters. Dr. Randy Acker's Advanc...
by Thornapple
Wed Aug 28, 2013 5:02 pm
Forum: Hunting
Topic: conibear traps
Replies: 147
Views: 24793

Re: conibear traps

Greg, First and foremost welcome to the world of Bonasa umbellus. Whether you hunt on private property or public your world in the outdoors hunting these wonderful birds is about to change. I will not tell you why, it just will. It will have nothing to do with the number of flushes or birds in the b...
by Thornapple
Wed Aug 28, 2013 3:05 pm
Forum: Training
Topic: How to help establish a Bold dog that is under foot?
Replies: 48
Views: 7291

Re: How to help establish a Bold dog that is under foot?

Winchey, My experience whether in Minnesota, the Up of Michigan, New England or NB is identical to yours with birds and dogs. The only difference is that in the midwest there are wolves to be concerned with now, and apparently a lot of them. This has changed in the last five or six years as the wolf...
by Thornapple
Wed Aug 28, 2013 6:05 am
Forum: Training
Topic: grouse, pheasant and ducks
Replies: 3
Views: 1716

Re: grouse, pheasant and ducks

roostero14, I am on my second versatile dog. I only had setters/pointers before and they eschewed anything that made their dainty feet wet as if it were Bubonic plague! So the Spinoni presented new challenges. I made a lot of mistakes on the first dog as we all do. I am a force fetch adherent, but t...
by Thornapple
Wed Aug 28, 2013 3:57 am
Forum: Training
Topic: How to help establish a Bold dog that is under foot?
Replies: 48
Views: 7291

Re: How to help establish a Bold dog that is under foot?

Mountaineer, Az Brittany Guy, and others, My comment on running to a dog on point has more to do to two criteria than anything; one is age the other not being stupid! The not being stupid part is that i normally prefer to hunt alone with my dogs. Hunting alone is a whole separate subject of which we...
by Thornapple
Wed Aug 28, 2013 3:00 am
Forum: Training
Topic: Alternative to Force Fetch and Clicker training?
Replies: 60
Views: 10206

Re: Alternative to Force Fetch and Clicker training?

Bill, Thank you for the advice on the Spinone. Yes they are timid, yes the e-collar application was used, and yes birds are now on the itinerary. Fortunately I know how to use an e-collar well enough to understand its limits and application. The e-collar however was not the only cause of feckless se...
by Thornapple
Tue Aug 27, 2013 6:19 pm
Forum: Training
Topic: Alternative to Force Fetch and Clicker training?
Replies: 60
Views: 10206

Re: Alternative to Force Fetch and Clicker training?

Bill, The problem I have found is that many of the techniques used by bird hunters for upland dogs here in the States prior to Force Fetch may have worked, but they were helter skelter; never consistent, never reliable, took a long time to develop, and were always ad hoc. Meaning a lot of individual...
by Thornapple
Tue Aug 27, 2013 2:16 pm
Forum: Training
Topic: Alternative to Force Fetch and Clicker training?
Replies: 60
Views: 10206

Re: Alternative to Force Fetch and Clicker training?

Bill, You maybe correct that all hunting dogs are inherently flushing dogs, from a historical context. However it is my understanding that for the last one hundred plus years or so, the so-called Pointing breeds and Versitale breeds are considered just that, not a flushing dog whether in Italy, Fran...
by Thornapple
Tue Aug 27, 2013 8:27 am
Forum: Training
Topic: Alternative to Force Fetch and Clicker training?
Replies: 60
Views: 10206

Re: Alternative to Force Fetch and Clicker training?

Your question is more like is there any way people who have no interest in learning how to train a dog can train a dog. The answer is sort of, lots of people don't train there dogs and just take them hunting and are completely satisfied. I stole some time here so I can respond. Winchey, the folks t...
by Thornapple
Tue Aug 27, 2013 7:31 am
Forum: Training
Topic: How to help establish a Bold dog that is under foot?
Replies: 48
Views: 7291

Re: How to help establish a Bold dog that is under foot?

I promise to get back to this later. i should have known better than have two posts while try to run a business, train a dog, cook dinner, do the wash, vacuum the floor and most importantly take care of a very sick puppy!
Thornapple
by Thornapple
Tue Aug 27, 2013 7:29 am
Forum: Training
Topic: Alternative to Force Fetch and Clicker training?
Replies: 2
Views: 615

Re: Alternative to Force Fetch and Clicker training?

Meller, I just saw your post. In my initial question I attempted to be clear that I was seeking alternate ideas in this forum ideas to train for obedience. I wrote, " Force fetch for you folks that think it is a method to teach a dog to retrieve and bring to hand your shot bird is not correct. it is...
by Thornapple
Tue Aug 27, 2013 7:17 am
Forum: Training
Topic: Alternative to Force Fetch and Clicker training?
Replies: 60
Views: 10206

Re: Alternative to Force Fetch and Clicker training?

Forgive me but I do not have time to get on the forum this morning. I spent the evening with a very sick dog, overslept, and need to get to the office. I promise Higgins, Birddog 1968, Winchey, Brad, and Bill to get back to this later. As much as this is an open forum I would like to stick to the su...
by Thornapple
Mon Aug 26, 2013 3:13 pm
Forum: Training
Topic: How to help establish a Bold dog that is under foot?
Replies: 48
Views: 7291

Re: How to help establish a Bold dog that is under foot?

will respond tomorrow to all, I have work to do outside. No Winchey I did not live in St. John, I almost got arrested by the RMC at the airport for spying! Yes, that is what i said! They thought I had something suspicious in my salmon rod tube and brought me in for interrogation. I was with some Def...
by Thornapple
Mon Aug 26, 2013 3:07 pm
Forum: Training
Topic: Alternative to Force Fetch and Clicker training?
Replies: 60
Views: 10206

Re: Alternative to Force Fetch and Clicker training?

All, thank you for taking the time to write. I think it important to restate my reason for writing the question. It is a question for hopefully a considered response or some experience that can add positively to the conversation. I do not have the answer(s). In my short 71 years, experience, educati...
by Thornapple
Mon Aug 26, 2013 6:32 am
Forum: Training
Topic: Alternative to Force Fetch and Clicker training?
Replies: 60
Views: 10206

Alternative to Force Fetch and Clicker training?

I am going to make an attempt here to bring up a subject that might require some thought, and I am sure some conversation! Does anyone know a proven technique that teaches a dog obedience that does not included Force Fetch or clicker training? First I should state I am an ardent Force Fetch trainer ...
by Thornapple
Mon Aug 26, 2013 6:29 am
Forum: Training
Topic: Alternative to Force Fetch and Clicker training?
Replies: 2
Views: 615

Alternative to Force Fetch and Clicker training?

I am going to make an attempt here to bring up a subject that might require some thought, and I am sure some conversation! Does anyone know a proven technique that teaches a dog obedience that does not included Force Fetch or clicker training? First I should state I am an ardent Force Fetch trainer ...
by Thornapple
Mon Aug 26, 2013 4:10 am
Forum: Training
Topic: How to help establish a Bold dog that is under foot?
Replies: 48
Views: 7291

Re: How to help establish a Bold dog that is under foot?

Big Shooter, Thanks for the information. The chart is not surprising information and I am sure useful to someone starting out. The first thing that came to mind however was a conversation I had with one of the top breeders of GSHPs, John Rabidou owner of Uodibar Kennels in Texas. John is one of the ...
by Thornapple
Sun Aug 25, 2013 8:24 am
Forum: Training
Topic: How to help establish a Bold dog that is under foot?
Replies: 48
Views: 7291

Re: How to help establish a Bold dog that is under foot?

Mountaindogs, I understand completely what you wrote only because I too lived a few generations of wonderful pals, my Rymans. I use the description Ryman's here only to describe what I am referring to, but they were much closer than the type of Setter implies, but you know that and I do not need to ...
by Thornapple
Sat Aug 24, 2013 6:32 am
Forum: Training
Topic: How to help establish a Bold dog that is under foot?
Replies: 48
Views: 7291

Re: How to help establish a Bold dog that is under foot?

Shags, That is a very interesting point about not establishing steadiness before the dog has developed its innate desire to hunt. I clearly forgot that one can not learn to drive if there is no gas in the tank. Yes, it makes sense in retrospect, but hindsight proves nothing. Other than a lesson reme...
by Thornapple
Fri Aug 23, 2013 6:52 pm
Forum: Training
Topic: How to help establish a Bold dog that is under foot?
Replies: 48
Views: 7291

Re: How to help establish a Bold dog that is under foot?

Winchey, Yes he is steady, but not to the flush. It is very easy to establish steadiness on point. Purchase a pigeon harness (Lion Country supply) or just tie a leg with a string. Next bring the dog up on a whoa table, barrel, or something that you do not have to bend over for and tie the other end ...
by Thornapple
Fri Aug 23, 2013 2:05 pm
Forum: Training
Topic: How to help establish a Bold dog that is under foot?
Replies: 48
Views: 7291

Re: How to help establish a Bold dog that is under foot?

kninebirddog, I like your suggestions of birds in a short duration so he wants more and changing up the leadership role. On that subject, as much as most of us know better in the heat of the battle we fall into old bad habits. This includes some of the best trainers we know! It is always helpful to ...
by Thornapple
Fri Aug 23, 2013 12:41 pm
Forum: Training
Topic: Can a UTV be used successfully for road condition?
Replies: 5
Views: 681

Re: Can a UTV be used successfully for road condition?

Agreed. Even though I have seen dogs running in front of a UTV I am not sure how safe it is for the reasons you just mentioned, let alone the lack of visibility right in front. Which would not be great if a dog were to stop suddenly. In retrospect the ATV outfitted with a road runner from Lion Count...
by Thornapple
Fri Aug 23, 2013 11:18 am
Forum: Training
Topic: NA Test
Replies: 10
Views: 1359

Re: NA Test

Hafe4825, After running several NA tests, tracking in my estimation is the one area where you have the least control. Let me explain. I have practiced with dead roosters dragging them around my property at all sorts of angles and conditions except one. Ultimately my puppy in very short order figured...
by Thornapple
Fri Aug 23, 2013 11:03 am
Forum: Training
Topic: How to help establish a Bold dog that is under foot?
Replies: 48
Views: 7291

Re: How to help establish a Bold dog that is under foot?

Well, I asked for good advice and I got what i asked for. What I find interesting is that I thought I knew how to use and e-collar, I did not! In particular the beeper locator button that I miss used. All of you said, take it off in the field! I will do that. Vinman, I like the idea of the pigeon. I...
by Thornapple
Fri Aug 23, 2013 10:36 am
Forum: Training
Topic: How to help establish a Bold dog that is under foot?
Replies: 48
Views: 7291

Re: How to help establish a Bold dog that is under foot?

vinman, Thanks for the thought and suggestions. It is good to hear yours and others ideas. The dog does like to chase game and will run after birds, but not search for them. Also, you are right a Spinone is a pointer. They are also retrievers. Meaning they are versatile dogs. After writing I was won...
by Thornapple
Fri Aug 23, 2013 10:27 am
Forum: Training
Topic: Can a UTV be used successfully for road condition?
Replies: 5
Views: 681

Re: Can a UTV be used successfully for road condition?

Neil,
this is an excellent idea, thanks.
Thornapple
by Thornapple
Fri Aug 23, 2013 7:04 am
Forum: Training
Topic: How to help establish a Bold dog that is under foot?
Replies: 48
Views: 7291

How to help establish a Bold dog that is under foot?

I would like to ask some of you more experienced trainers a subject that has been bothering me for sometime. That is what is boldness in a puppy, can it be subdued, and then "reactivated"? About 15 months ago I picked what appeared to be a bold puppy (Spinone). He showed all the signs of drive and b...
by Thornapple
Fri Aug 23, 2013 6:20 am
Forum: Training
Topic: Can a UTV be used successfully for road condition?
Replies: 5
Views: 681

Can a UTV be used successfully for road condition?

I need to get and keep my dogs in physical shape and provide the same cardiovascular work out i require. I am in the process of evaluating purchasing either an ATV or UTV to do this. The limitation is my property has narrow trails (all woods) that both will maneuver, but not all. The roading rigs so...
by Thornapple
Mon Jun 24, 2013 11:34 am
Forum: Training
Topic: Thoughts on age for NA test
Replies: 44
Views: 9003

Re: Thoughts on age for NA test

A Bradley, Familiarity is a positive experience with a puppy you are working with for anything. Here are a few ideas that I have used thanks to George Hickox. For swimming see if he or she will go into the water on its own to swim after its favorite toy (assuming it can float). Since it is summer ge...
by Thornapple
Mon Jun 24, 2013 4:02 am
Forum: Hunting
Topic: Early Season Preserve?
Replies: 3
Views: 633

Re: Early Season Preserve?

Sorry, Mason Dixon is off of I-83 near the Pa. border north of Baltimore.
by Thornapple
Mon Jun 24, 2013 3:48 am
Forum: Hunting
Topic: Early Season Preserve?
Replies: 3
Views: 633

Re: Early Season Preserve?

Scott, States in most cases control the season for preserves. They usually start October 1 through the end of March. You have several less than 3 hours from Northern Virginia. A couple of the better managed near you are Mason Dixon off of I-81 in Maryland, Shenandoah in W. Virginia, and others furth...
by Thornapple
Sun Jun 23, 2013 10:53 am
Forum: Training
Topic: Thoughts on age for NA test
Replies: 44
Views: 9003

Re: Thoughts on age for NA test

Regarding your last comment; remember, what I mentioned earlier, the NA evaluation is there to help you in future training. It is simply an evaluation of how your dog is performing at one moment in time. It is a very early snap shot of a puppy that most often will mature, grow, and change beyond wha...
by Thornapple
Sun Jun 23, 2013 8:40 am
Forum: Training
Topic: Thoughts on age for NA test
Replies: 44
Views: 9003

Re: Thoughts on age for NA test

“ The Natural Ability Test which is designed to evaluate the inherent natural abilities of young dogs and gain insight into their possible usefulness as versatile gun dogs. It rates seven important inherited abilities: nose, search, tracking, pointing, water, desire and cooperation. The natural, inh...
by Thornapple
Wed Jun 19, 2013 12:13 pm
Forum: Hunting
Topic: A question on tapping a dog's head as "Fetch" is given
Replies: 10
Views: 2196

Re: A question on tapping a dog's head as "Fetch" is given

MillerMS06 The answer to your question I believe is what others mentioned here. After I posted this question I spoke to a friend this morning who ran two national field trial GSHP champions many years ago. He mentioned it was designed for a couple of reasons in field trails many years ago. 1) To not...
by Thornapple
Wed Jun 19, 2013 6:01 am
Forum: Hunting
Topic: A question on tapping a dog's head as "Fetch" is given
Replies: 10
Views: 2196

A question on tapping a dog's head as "Fetch" is given

For years I have always trained and successfully released my dogs standing next to them using the "go", "heel", or "Fetch" commands. Each is used consistantly, has a specific purpose, and the dogs understand what each means. However I have been told recently that with my "Fetch" command I should tap...
by Thornapple
Fri May 10, 2013 5:19 am
Forum: Hunting
Topic: Apron string syndrome
Replies: 12
Views: 3387

Re: Apron string syndrome

Yes, the dog has been hunted occasionaly over birds: chucker, quail, and preserve pheasants; enough to emonstrate it has the prerequisite inherent skills. Yes, the dog is "birdie".
So I get back to my question, does anyone have an effective technique for getting a bird to push out?