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Go!!!

Go!!!

Postby Brushbustin Sporting Dogs » Tue Mar 02, 2010 3:22 pm

This is a stupid question and feel free to make fun of me! I bought my first ever unbroke horse he is very smart and very calm. I have him where I can sit in the saddle on him. Today I decided to reach down and take the lead rope loose and see if we could ride around the little pen a bit. He did good with the lead in my hand he backed up away from the fence and I could get him to turn around in a circle. I had no drive though. I would touch him a little with my boots but I couldn't get him to go forward! What's the trick to drive him forward. Note Saturday was the first faxt he had a saddle on so he's doing well so far but I'm not ready to get to rammy with him but would just like to be able to ride him around the round pen without going in reverse.
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Re: Go!!!

Postby tn red » Tue Mar 02, 2010 6:17 pm

First make sure the teeth are good, have them floated ,wolf teeth removed, so no bad habits with the bit later on.I ts fine if he doesnt step right off, first few steps are the hardest . just let him move around dont pull on the reins or fight him. Small circles are fine at first as long as he's moving that's good. Let your circles get wider in any direction. Don't try to correct him, this is to get him used to feeling the bit. When you feel like hes moving forward well you can start giving him pressure in his mouth, either right or left. You can do this from the ground if you are more comfortable.

If you have any more quetions just let me know. Send me a PM if you need help.

Eric
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Re: Go!!!

Postby daniel77 » Tue Mar 02, 2010 9:30 pm

For a little background, I start high end cutting prospects for a living. My colts have won 100's of thousands of bucks, and I've started over 600 head, so I've been where you are. Getting those first steps is often the hardest part, so don't feel like having a problem at that point is a reflection on you. Take your time, use good sense, and watch out because that first step can be a big one. LOL

When working colts on the ground, one of the most important things I'm teaching the colt is to move when I kiss or cluck to them. The noise tells them to move, my directions tell them where. For those first steps on a ride, I want just a few small circles in each direction. If you get two steps, stop and pet. Remember to build on what you can get, and don't ever ask for something you don't know you can get. Two steps will become five, ten, thirty, and so on. Keep them circling small at first, because if things get western, you can shut them down a LOT easier by pulling them around than if they get strait and line out across the pen. If there is someone you TRUST, you can have them lunge you around the pen. I've not worked with many folks that I trust enough to do this for me. I do not like for the horse to be on a line you have them lunged, as you can get tangled in the rope if things go badly. Remember, just because they lunge perfectly normally, doesn't mean they will if they get scared and decide to buck. Biggest thing is to get them VERY comfortable with moving in the pen. Don't try and control them very much for the first few rides. Some of them don't want to walk much at first and go pretty fast. Relax and keep your hand down, you've loped a lot more than that colt has. Let him feel confidence from you, like he can turn to you when he relaxes a bit more. Many times they don't want to move at all, and then they don't want to stop. They can do no wrong on the first ride. Just be there to help when they need it, and stay out of the way when they don't. I know it is scary doing this at first, but it is pretty darn scary for the colt too. My hand is down 95% of the time. I do use my legs to cue right from the start. IMO, if your colts aren't slowing down with your seat, you aren't ready to start picking up your hand yet. Most of my colts never do buck, so don't let me scare you, but do have a game plan just in case.

The biggest places to watch out for bucking to set in are changes in speed, and direction. The changes in speed include from zero to a walk, walk to a trot, and of course, trot to lope. The change in direction comes in that little place where your horse can't see you when changing direction of bend. He has you in he left eye, then not at all, then on the right. The point when he no longer raises his head in the middle (when he no longer sees you) is a real good indication of how comfortable he is.

I like my first ride to last about 10 minutes and no more. Next ride will be longer and faster (lots of walking at first, then more trotting, then more loping). If you feel comfortable enough, feel free to wave your hat around, and swing a rope off of them from the start. Might as well add just one more new thing while everything is new. Later on, a new thing will be a bigger deal. By the second ride, I'm wanting my colts to stay on the outside of the pen from nothing but leg pressure, and trot a decent figure 8 using the whole pen. By the third ride, I want a clue of a stop to begin to appear, as well as a step or two back. I also want to be able to trot smaller circles within the round pen. When I'm pretty comfortable with the smaller circles, it's time to go to a bigger pen.

Do remember that if things get western, lean back and RELAX. It probably won't be nearly as bad as you think, and, I PROMISE you that you are MORE likely to get hurt trying to get off of a bucking colt than if you just try and ride him. Also, keep looking at the base of his neck or your saddle horn. You land where you look. Take a peak at the ground, or the sides of the pen, and be ready to land on them.
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Re: Go!!!

Postby kninebirddog » Tue Mar 02, 2010 10:06 pm

Great posts so far

also one way to get forward motion is to ask to move to the side this is an easy trick on the ground

One of my favs for some great foundation training is Richard Winters he trained under pat parelli but richards approach has a little less ego about it Dont get me wrong Pat is extremely good but he tends to showboat a bit to much for my liking when it comes to a horse and a person learning

Anyway just remember there are 2 kind of riders those that have had unauthorized dismounts and those that will :wink:
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Re: Go!!!

Postby Brushbustin Sporting Dogs » Wed Mar 03, 2010 6:23 pm

Well JJ did a little better today. We found out that we can in fact move forward with me on his back!! He doesn't like the bit in his mouth yet though. We walked around the circle pen alittle today and actually got into a fast walk a couple of times. He's gonna be SMOOTH!!!! Next step how do I get him to respect the bit versus just fight it?? I could see he was starting to get frusterated by the bit so I elected to quit while I was ahead and wait for another day. He leads great off the ground with a lead rope should I start leading him around off the ground via the reins and bit?? would this help him learn to turn and stop??

I'm probbaly in over my head breaking this colt but you never learn till you try. I think i've picked a great one to learn on though.

Thanks

Robbie
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Re: Go!!!

Postby tn red » Wed Mar 03, 2010 6:39 pm

snaffle bit ? Sounds like you are doing fine.Dont worry too much just take your time and get him to flex left and right he should take to the bit in a day or two if there is no teeth problems.When he gets in a gait you want just steddy him in with the bit he will just get better about the right gait.Sounds like you have a nice animal.Do you know what his breeding is? Good luck and have fun.
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Re: Go!!!

Postby kninebirddog » Wed Mar 03, 2010 8:47 pm

Again as stated before barring any teeth issues

What I like to do it have halter on and then place bridle over the halter and let the horse just get used to having the bit in the mouth and lead around with the halter

I did all my stuff with a full check snaffle..never needed to go any stiffer then that reining horse again this should have nothing to do with the mouth but leaning the rein up against the neck

Light hands...If one never gets out of a horses mouth then the horse learns to ignore the bit and then get labeled as a hard mouth horse

Jon Lyons is awesome ..i Burnt out his tapes years ago when I was working and training horses...He is for the person that has the round pen but went to his symposium and Super stuff watching him take a young horse with some issues and had never been ridden or even had a saddle on and he was on the horse by the end of the day with the horse comfortable about it far from being broke but again the process of work with the horse by the end of the second day he had the horse in and out of the trailer loading and unloading.

Again I still refer back to Richard Winters as his approach is a little more applicable for the average person
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Re: Go!!!

Postby daniel77 » Wed Mar 03, 2010 9:30 pm

Like kninebirddog, I like mine to just wear the snaffle for a while. Usually within 20 minutes or so, they stop mouthing it. I REALLY like a sweet iron bit with copper inlay. Take that chrome crap and chunk it. I actually start mine is a sidepull for the first few rides, and after they've softened up to that, I start using the bit. Treat that mouth like it's made of glass. I do tie mine around to each side, especially the ones who fight somewhat. I tie them at about 45 degrees. More than just slightly bent, but not snubbed to the saddle. I simply tie them to the back D ring for the rear cinch. I let them move around a bit and let them find the release. If they haven't yielded yet, keep moving them. This should take less than 5 minutes per side. I never tie one up and leave them or do this for extended periods of time, as that simply teaches them to lean on the bit. I also do not drive my colts around with driving lines, as I have yet to ride a horse done this way that has any feel left in their mouth. Remember that the most important aspect of the bit is when you RELEASE the pressure on their mouth. If you don't give it to them THE MOMENT they BEGIN to give to you, things will progress much slower and with a lot more frustration for both of you. Horses do not learn from being pulled on, they learn from being released. Read that again, cause it is pretty much the essence of how to train a horse.

Sounds like things are going pretty well for you. good luck.
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Re: Go!!!

Postby daniel77 » Fri Apr 16, 2010 7:20 am

any updates for us?
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Re: Go!!!

Postby Blue Dawn Kennel » Mon Apr 19, 2010 8:13 pm

Robert you've gotten lots of good advise and sounds like from guys who know what their talking about. I been breaking colts for years now. I don't have a round pen and do all my ground work first along with letting the colt wear just a argentina snaffle or tomb thumb snaffle in (your pen or when I do it while he's standing tied and I'm brushing and getting him ready). When it comes to getting on his back I'll stand in one stirrup and lay over the saddle on both sides (I like my horses to know both sides you can mount from) then once I put full weight in the saddle my husband (or whoever may be around to help you out) leads me around for a few days (depending on how well the colt is doing in response) I generally the first half a dozen times just let him lead me with out me doing anything with the reins or my feet/legs. Then the more comfortable he gets my husband will continue to walk next to me but will hand me his lead rope and wala I'm riding and doing everything by myself. I don't rush or push and only give as much as I feel the colt(s) will take/handle. Anyway I hope I've helped a little bit too. I've got horses all over the USA that I've broke out and that are field trialed and trail ridden so guess I do an ok job. :)

Best of luck and look forward to reading your progress reports and you'll have to post some pictures for us all as well.

Robbi
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