Dogs and Neighbors

GUNDOGS · Post by **GUNDOGS** » Fri Jul 01, 2011 3:43 pm

Vonzeppelinkennels wrote:Ruth,if I walk out my door today & someone blows my brains out even though it's against the law please tell me how it protected me.Laws are only after the fact nothing can be done untill a law is broken & even then not much or the same criminals would not keep repeating them.

Your red light analogy doesn't hold much water.A red light means stop & if caught you will be given a ticket but for your own safety it's common sense because if you run a red light your just as likely to get T Boned & crippeled or killed as you are to injure some one else.

I know we will never agree but I live in reality not make believe things are the way I would like them to be.Laws stop very few crimes & do little justice afterwards unless you think it's justice to send some one to prison for 20 yrs or less for murder.

youre right we will never agree and if you think that with no laws the world would be the same thats ridiculous!!..the law does protect you before a person blows your head off, its the law that any person who commits murder faces the consequence for doing so which means the possibility of life in prison or the death penalty, yes its after the fact how else can a consequence be enforced, you have to have a law broken in order to have a consequence obviously but as of now even though you would be dead there would be justice for the crime and im sure your family would appreciate that instead of seeing the person go free to live as they please BUT if there was not a law and consequence preventing them from committing the crime they would do it without a second thought because theres no reason not to..have you not ever met someone or seen someone who does not feel guilty until they are caught breaking the rules or laws?? i have many times, many people dont have guilt until it comes down to the consequence they have to serve then they all of a sudden are sorry, take out the consequence and you will see no guilt, therefore doing what they please gets easier and easier..as far as the red light analogy it holds alot of water, we stop because we respect the LAW that says we have to stop and wait our turn, if we dont stop we pay the price which is a ticket or manslaughter charges for killing someone by doing it..if a law went into effect tomorrow that we dont have to stop lets just go on COMMON SENSE as you said and see how well that works out :roll: for you to say laws stop very few crimes is "living in reality" alright

....ruth

Vonzeppelinkennels · Post by **Vonzeppelinkennels** » Fri Jul 01, 2011 4:39 pm

You say people can't coexist with out laws well we are here & this once was a lawless country.I am probably twice as old as you,We were raised & brought up in different worlds.You are use to laws & more laws you know nothing else.I on the other hand was born & raised when a child could get up in the morning leave at daylight & not come home till dark with parents not worrying about where I was or what might happen to me.I was born & raised where all grades & ages road the same school bus & went to the same school.I was rasised where all the boys carried pocket knives even to school,we played mumbley peg & stretch at school.
We also settled our differences outside & never once did anyone think of pulling a knive & cutting some one,the teachers or principal never had to call the cops much less suspend or expel us.Maybe a detention & repetative trouble makers maybe even a little capital punishment,SWATS God forbid.The thing is most the time who ever was fighting were best friends the next day,no one thinking about bringing a gun & blowing every one away.Now in your day of laws they have cops walking the halls riding on school buses kids running amuck yeah maybe your way is better.Kids respected their parents or got knocked sideways when I was growing up yeah I know that causes them to be criminals & abusers,BS.I got it when I had it coming & should have got it more then I did but guess what I have never been in jail,or arrested,was an honor student,respected my parents & elders,knew when to keep my mouth shut.We didn't have to let criminals out of jail to make room for more yeah more laws has improved society.SURE!!

When this was a lawless country neighbors helped each other in times of trouble now it's all about money & how much you can screw somebody out of.Hope you still feel we need more laws when you reach old age if a criminal doesn't shorten it first.

Mods you can delete this if you like but I couldn't help myself!!

brad27 · Post by **brad27** » Fri Jul 01, 2011 4:51 pm

Von, I don't believe more laws has made our society what it is today. I believe you hit the nail on the head with this statement.

.Kids respected their parents or got knocked sideways when I was growing up

Nowadays parents are absent. Children raise themselves. Idiots are raising idiots. Laws didn't cause this, lack of teaching and respect did.

GUNDOGS · Post by **GUNDOGS** » Fri Jul 01, 2011 5:17 pm

VONZEPPLIN, you have never lived in a lawless country even though youre double my age which makes you 76 years old (alot younger than i thought you were

).. the laws have been there all along and so have the crimes..child/animal abuse always existed it just wasnt labelled child/animal abuse and was commonly accepted as discipline, kids and animals were still treated like punching bags even when you were young, its just now laws have come into effect to protect them..kidnapping and murders still took place from the beginning of time..people that made the decisions to commit crimes created a need for the laws in order to deter others from doing the same..the reason laws are created are because theres a need for them..for instance pocket knives use to be allowed in schools until COMMON SENSE went out the window and billy decided to stab joey one day and now the new rule is NO POCKET KNIVES..in a situation where there are no rules or laws people are sure to make COMMON SENSE decisions that are bad and a law is put into place to prevent it from happening again..and thanks for the comment of the possibility of a criminal cutting my life short, i suppose i would have a lot better chance of that NOT happening if we had no laws or consequences for murder and let people just use their COMMON SENSE of right from wrong :roll: .....ruth

Vonzeppelinkennels · Post by **Vonzeppelinkennels** » Fri Jul 01, 2011 5:57 pm

Brad some of the new laws are why parents don't go upside a kid's head today & the kids know those laws & learn them at school.I could tell you a couple stories of friends trying to disipline there kids & the idioctic results from the courts afterwards.

Sending you a PM.

nikegundog · Post by **nikegundog** » Fri Jul 01, 2011 5:59 pm

What is considered more inhumane, having a dogs vocal cords severed or having them neutered. While it been pointed out there are alternatives for barking I know the same is true of neutering (leash and kennel).

Mountaineer · Post by **Mountaineer** » Fri Jul 01, 2011 6:02 pm

markj wrote:... "If all other options are exhausted tho then it could well be the only choice left"...
Well La Die Dah, you must have actually took the time to read something.

Reckon I mentioned that possibility before you...comprehension appears to be your sticking point, not reading.

markj wrote: Maybe he shoulda gave that dog to you? hahaha

Mebbe so, mebbe so.

markj wrote:I can take you to places where dogs are kept in small cages and put on teh menu. Go tell them how wrong they are and get back to me if you survive it.

Lots of folks have been in lots of places....you really need to consider that fact.
Take care.

*Apples and oranges for the largest part but more should to be considered than which operation, spay or clip, is the most humane....need or reason would seem to be foremost.
Either may have a medical need, either may have an situational need and, either may have an emotional need from someone on two legs.
All aren't equal, IMHO.

Post by **ezzy333** » Fri Jul 01, 2011 6:42 pm

Vonzeppelinkennels wrote:You say people can't coexist with out laws well we are here & this once was a lawless country.I am probably twice as old as you,We were raised & brought up in different worlds.You are use to laws & more laws you know nothing else.I on the other hand was born & raised when a child could get up in the morning leave at daylight & not come home till dark with parents not worrying about where I was or what might happen to me.I was born & raised where all grades & ages road the same school bus & went to the same school.I was rasised where all the boys carried pocket knives even to school,we played mumbley peg & stretch at school.
We also settled our differences outside & never once did anyone think of pulling a knive & cutting some one,the teachers or principal never had to call the cops much less suspend or expel us.Maybe a detention & repetative trouble makers maybe even a little capital punishment,SWATS God forbid.The thing is most the time who ever was fighting were best friends the next day,no one thinking about bringing a gun & blowing every one away.Now in your day of laws they have cops walking the halls riding on school buses kids running amuck yeah maybe your way is better.Kids respected their parents or got knocked sideways when I was growing up yeah I know that causes them to be criminals & abusers,BS.I got it when I had it coming & should have got it more then I did but guess what I have never been in jail,or arrested,was an honor student,respected my parents & elders,knew when to keep my mouth shut.We didn't have to let criminals out of jail to make room for more yeah more laws has improved society.SURE!!

When this was a lawless country neighbors helped each other in times of trouble now it's all about money & how much you can screw somebody out of.Hope you still feel we need more laws when you reach old age if a criminal doesn't shorten it first.

Mods you can delete this if you like but I couldn't help myself!!

I won't delete it but will agree with every word. You just have to wonder how any of us survived when we could carry knives and bring guns to school, rode in cars without turn signals seat belts and only one brake light. Lived in houses with lead paint, had to work when we were 10 or 12, and didn't go to a doctor but once a year. went swimming in the muddy creeks,ate stuff out of the garden without washing it, and drank fresh milk. And that is just the tip of the ice berg of the individual freedoms that no longer exist before you had lived to 18. We won't mentionthe scoresupon scores of freedoms taken away fromthe adults.

Ezzy

nikegundog · Post by **nikegundog** » Fri Jul 01, 2011 7:04 pm

Don't quite understand all this, I went to school late daily during hunting season with shells in my pockets, and my gun in the car, pocket knife. Worked on the farm at age 6, all ages at the same school, on the same bus, lead paint,mud holes,no seatbelts,doctor (never). I'm age 38, how young would one have to be to lose perspective? My great uncle was in his nineties when he passed and that was 10 years ago, he was a police officer.

Post by **kninebirddog** » Fri Jul 01, 2011 7:19 pm

ezzy333 wrote:
Vonzeppelinkennels wrote:You say people can't coexist with out laws well we are here & this once was a lawless country.I am probably twice as old as you,We were raised & brought up in different worlds.You are use to laws & more laws you know nothing else.I on the other hand was born & raised when a child could get up in the morning leave at daylight & not come home till dark with parents not worrying about where I was or what might happen to me.I was born & raised where all grades & ages road the same school bus & went to the same school.I was rasised where all the boys carried pocket knives even to school,we played mumbley peg & stretch at school.
We also settled our differences outside & never once did anyone think of pulling a knive & cutting some one,the teachers or principal never had to call the cops much less suspend or expel us.Maybe a detention & repetative trouble makers maybe even a little capital punishment,SWATS God forbid.The thing is most the time who ever was fighting were best friends the next day,no one thinking about bringing a gun & blowing every one away.Now in your day of laws they have cops walking the halls riding on school buses kids running amuck yeah maybe your way is better.Kids respected their parents or got knocked sideways when I was growing up yeah I know that causes them to be criminals & abusers,BS.I got it when I had it coming & should have got it more then I did but guess what I have never been in jail,or arrested,was an honor student,respected my parents & elders,knew when to keep my mouth shut.We didn't have to let criminals out of jail to make room for more yeah more laws has improved society.SURE!!

When this was a lawless country neighbors helped each other in times of trouble now it's all about money & how much you can screw somebody out of.Hope you still feel we need more laws when you reach old age if a criminal doesn't shorten it first.

Mods you can delete this if you like but I couldn't help myself!!
I won't delete it but will agree with every word. You just have to wonder how any of us survived when we could carry knives and bring guns to school, rode in cars without turn signals seat belts and only one brake light. Lived in houses with lead paint, had to work when we were 10 or 12, and didn't go to a doctor but once a year. went swimming in the muddy creeks,ate stuff out of the garden without washing it, and drank fresh milk. And that is just the tip of the ice berg of the individual freedoms that no longer exist before you had lived to 18. We won't mentionthe scoresupon scores of freedoms taken away fromthe adults.

Ezzy

Ditto x2

GUNDOGS · Post by **GUNDOGS** » Fri Jul 01, 2011 7:39 pm

nikegundog wrote:Don't quite understand all this, I went to school late daily during hunting season with shells in my pockets, and my gun in the car, pocket knife. Worked on the farm at age 6, all ages at the same school, on the same bus, lead paint,mud holes,no seatbelts,doctor (never). I'm age 38, how young would one have to be to lose perspective? My great uncle was in his nineties when he passed and that was 10 years ago, he was a police officer.

Im 38 as well, use to ride in the car in the back windshield with my pillow, got the strap at school in grade 6 for mouthing off to the teacher, use to swim at the local dump which we called "the pond", use to go to my great grandmothers house in OSPRY florida and eat grapefruits and oranges off the tree without washing them off, fist fought with boys one day and dated them the next, walked to school everyday in rain and snow without a ride and if i had a doctors appt i went alone cause my mom had to work day and night to feed us, i babysat at 10 years old to make enough money for new clothes or i got hand me downs from 5 sisters but i guess ezzy and vonzepplin think im too young to have experienced all these things too

....ruth

Vonzeppelinkennels · Post by **Vonzeppelinkennels** » Fri Jul 01, 2011 7:49 pm

Now they have laws against some of those things did we or do we need them.NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Let me ask you how many young parents have you seen wear facemasks & latex gloves to change a babie's diapers,or once they open baby food throw it away if not all used,can't feed anything else till the baby reaches a certain age what ever their rule is.

GUNDOGS · Post by **GUNDOGS** » Fri Jul 01, 2011 8:33 pm

Vonzeppelinkennels wrote:Now they have laws against some of those things did we or do we need them.NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Let me ask you how many young parents have you seen wear facemasks & latex gloves to change a babie's diapers,or once they open baby food throw it away if not all used,can't feed anything else till the baby reaches a certain age what ever their rule is.

YES i do feel some of those things needed laws, for example seat belts..after seeing a person fly threw the windshield or a child end up on the road side after an accident it makes you realize how important they are, my children never get into a car without a seat belt on, why? cause they have been proven to save lives and i want to give them every chance i can for them to live to be old ladies..i have NEVER seen a person wear a face mask or gloves to change a baby diaper but ive changed a few that i should have done that

and i also made my own babyfood with a processor i got from my babyshower to save money

...ruth

nikegundog · Post by **nikegundog** » Fri Jul 01, 2011 8:44 pm

Let me ask you how many young parents have you seen wear facemasks & latex gloves to change a babie's diapers,or once they open baby food throw it away if not all used,can't feed anything else till the baby reaches a certain age what ever their rule is.

Never seen anyone change diapers with a mask or gloves, I have seen baby food wasted. I worked at a casino for 3 years and watched senior citizens come by the busload to throw their money away.

Post by **ezzy333** » Fri Jul 01, 2011 8:57 pm

Ruh, We didn't say you were too young, but you implied it when you said laws don't take freedom away. And you still are missing it. There is nothing wrong with seat belts for you and your kids if you make the decision to use them. But what right do you have to tell m I have to. I just loss the freedom to make my own decision. Why can't my kids say a prayer at school or worse yet they can't pledge allegence to the flag that I offer my life to protect. I remember when they tried to get the seat belt law passed and couldn't so they promised they would never stop anyone for not wearing it. PROMISED!!! And now they wonder why no one believes them anymore. Thousands of examples we could talk about but the thing every one of them did was take the responsibility of you worrying about how you live or raise your kids or many other freedoms we used to have away.

Ezzy

Vonzeppelinkennels · Post by **Vonzeppelinkennels** » Fri Jul 01, 2011 9:47 pm

Ruth & Nike you both are youngsters,my oldest son is 7 yrs older then you.If the laws we have today could be enforced,which they can't we wouldn't need to think about more.

Only I can protect myself!!

OBTW my name is Ted

KFhunter · Post by **KFhunter** » Fri Jul 01, 2011 10:56 pm

whoa!

some of you folks need to chill, your not doing the 4m any good calling people idiots and judging them and their dog ownership skills.
The dog is a piece of property (like it or not) with limited rules of ownership, its not a human. Dog alteration is not illegal. I'm sure you folks have altered dogs so get of your high horses.
Heck my dog is altered, I had a vet slice a gaping hole in her belly and insure me the dog wouldn't ever breed or go in heat. If she had a barking problem you bet your big high horses I'd have a vet debark her if it came to that, yes I'd try other options but if it came to that so be it. Its either that or I take her to the woods and put a bullet thru her brain cause I ain't gonna have a non-stop barking dog.

if neighbors dog barks too much go tell your neighbor its bothering you, if they're nice maybe offer advice and put up ahwile longer till they get the kinks out.
If they ain't nice just tell em you'll be forced to get the police involved and thats no fun for anyone.
if they don't shut the dog up - call cops

keep callin the cops again and again and again until the cops shut the dog up to shut you up.

It's really not that hard folks!

If more people would simply talk to their neighbors maybe we'd have less animals suffering rat poisening, antifreeze and knife wounds?

gittrdonebritts · Post by **gittrdonebritts** » Fri Jul 01, 2011 11:20 pm

A lot of the things you are talking about are Just common sense ruth

I for one am getting tired of the Freedoms me and so many other bleed for are getting taken away because a bunch of dressed up Harvard Educated @$$ holes think we can't think for ourselves and they need to help us before we hurt our selves, Am I gonna make Dam sure my son wears a seat belt in the truck yes (Common sense) am I going to wear it ? if I remember maybe, It should be my choice but its NOT !!!! Ruth how about I come too your house and make every decision for you and tell you what is acceptable and what isn't ? because that is about what its coming to in this country we where founded as a free nation governed by the people for the people, to bad that isn't the case anymore. Do all your decisions get made for you in Canada ?

birddogger · Post by **birddogger** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 3:44 am

It's called socialism and unfortunately the American people have become complacent and taken our freedoms for granted. They are taken away little by little and by the time people wake up it is too late. The country we live in today is a totally different country from what I knew growing up.

Charlie

Doodle · Post by **Doodle** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 4:04 am

Laws are only for those who think that they apply to them and will obey them. Many have a sense of entitlement that says "the laws do not apply to me" or "my lawyer will get me off". More laws only govern those who will obey them.

GUNDOGS · Post by **GUNDOGS** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 4:56 am

ezzy333 wrote:Ruh, We didn't say you were too young, but you implied it when you said laws don't take freedom away. And you still are missing it. There is nothing wrong with seat belts for you and your kids if you make the decision to use them. But what right do you have to tell m I have to. I just loss the freedom to make my own decision. Why can't my kids say a prayer at school or worse yet they can't pledge allegence to the flag that I offer my life to protect. I remember when they tried to get the seat belt law passed and couldn't so they promised they would never stop anyone for not wearing it. PROMISED!!! And now they wonder why no one believes them anymore. Thousands of examples we could talk about but the thing every one of them did was take the responsibility of you worrying about how you live or raise your kids or many other freedoms we used to have away.

Ezzy

EZZY the reason seat belts are enforced is because people DONT have common sense to make the decsion to put them on without a consequence..that law is enforced because if you get in an accident and become paralized or dead the insurance company eats the cost for your accident when they are sued by you or your family to pay for your medical expenses for the rest of your life or a settlement for your death then they have to raise the cost of others insurance that DID wear a seat belt but now have to pay more money for that persons decision..a friend i went to highschool with was killed on the 401 highway here in canada and he didnt have a seatbelt on, his family fought tooth and nail to get rich off that accident AND WON!! that was back when seatbelts were not the law..yes your "freedom" to decide to put a seat belt on you and your child is taken away but with no law wouldnt you do that anyway??..well alot of people wouldnt do it, they need a consequence in order to make the right decision and buckle up...if one time you get in the car and because of knowing the consequence it saves your life then your ability to live another day is worth it and you never know when that might be..i look at it like this, my kids would love it if they had the "freedom" to come home at 1 in the morning cause they are havin fun out with friends but i make them come home at 10pm, why? for their own good, they dont need to be out all hours of the night especially hours when bars let out with all the drunk people who drive and kill people cause they use their COMMON SENSE and end up driving..so many stupid people get into a car and even though its against the law they drive and kill someone every minute of every day, now because of these victims families getting tired of the senseless killing of loved ones they push for more strict laws and eventually because of these law breakers that cant stay out of the dang car when they drink someones family member is killed therefore the laws get more strict and are enforced even more...eventually we will all have to have a breathalizer attached to the steering wheel in order to drive, not because our government want to control us more but because of the stupid people that keep finding ways to break the law and kill innocent people because they dont have COMMON SENSE..should it be your freedom to drink and drive if you want to

sure if you live back in the little house on the prairie and you only have the chance of killing yourself when YOU make the decision to drive drunk BUT thats not what happens, the drunk always lives and the innocent kid on their way home from a friends house gets killed..dont get me started with smoking, they had to make it a law here not to smoke within 10 feet of a business entrance and not to smoke in buildings or bars, WHY?? because the people who smoke dont care about the other people who choose not to die of lung cancer and should not HAVE to inhale it while they are eating or enjoying a game of pool..I USE TO BE A SMOKER FOR 19 YEARS but i never smoked in a vehicle when others were with me that didnt smoke especially my kids and i never smoked hanging outside a public building blowing it in peoples faces as they entered and exited because i have COMMON SENSE but so many people dont have COMMON SENSE that non smokers pushed and pushed for years to get laws in place to stop the ability for those people to make that decision so that the non smokers have the right to live a longer life if they so choose therefore a law was passed..anyway, disagree with laws if you may but its people who dont have COMMON SENSE and make the wrong decisions on a daily basis that have caused these laws to be put in place to start with...and i still dont believe laws take away your freedom, if you would use COMMON SENSE in every situation then the laws wouldnt effect you anyway they would only effect those who would have not used COMMON SENSE and i dont want those people having the ability to decide my fate.....ruth

birddogger · Post by **birddogger** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 5:05 am

Yep, like I said...Socialism.

Charlie

Onk · Post by **Onk** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 5:18 am

This is a good post. As of a week ago, our neighbor across the street got a new Pomeranian and they put it outside most of the day. The little yard rat stands there stares at my house and yips all day long! A bark I think I could handle, this yipping makes me want to pull my hair out! So yes I would clip my neighbors dogs cords!

GUNDOGS · Post by **GUNDOGS** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 5:49 am

Doodle wrote:Laws are only for those who think that they apply to them and will obey them. Many have a sense of entitlement that says "the laws do not apply to me" or "my lawyer will get me off". More laws only govern those who will obey them.

I just dont understand this way of thinking, sorry...laws are there because of people doing things that cause a need for a law to begin with..the ones who obey them would have made the right decision to begin with so the law doesnt effect them.. if i wouldnt drink and drive to begin with how does a law saying i cant drink and drive effect me?? but if im a person who does drink and drive that law applies to me and if and when i make the stupid decision to drink and drive theres a consequence for doing so in order to protect those of us who want to live and avoid being killed by someone elses stupid decision..i dont feel im governed by many laws at all, i bet theres tonnes of laws i dont even know exist because i havent broken them therefore dont need to know them..the only people that pay the consequences for their actions are those who dont use common sense and make decisions that effect others....ruth

GUNDOGS · Post by **GUNDOGS** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 6:05 am

gittrdonebritts wrote:A lot of the things you are talking about are Just common sense ruth I for one am getting tired of the Freedoms me and so many other bleed for are getting taken away because a bunch of dressed up Harvard Educated @$$ holes think we can't think for ourselves and they need to help us before we hurt our selves, Am I gonna make Dam sure my son wears a seat belt in the truck yes (Common sense) am I going to wear it ? if I remember maybe, It should be my choice but its NOT !!!! Ruth how about I come too your house and make every decision for you and tell you what is acceptable and what isn't ? because that is about what its coming to in this country we where founded as a free nation governed by the people for the people, to bad that isn't the case anymore. Do all your decisions get made for you in Canada ?

thats my point joe, too many people just dont use COMMON SENSE therefore laws are put into place to punish those people who make stupid decisions and effect those of us who would not have done the same..YOU may think its common sense to put a seat belt on your child but BRITNEY SPEARS drove with her 1 year old kid on her lap with an airbag in the steering wheel that could have killed him had it gone off or had they got hit by another car, sure its her kid so she should raise it how she wants to and so should those people that keep their kids in cages or locked in a basement until they finally escape right

..there are MANY people that dont use common sense and therefore the laws are there to protect us by detering those people without common sense by giving a consequence..you can come to my house anytime, theres rules here too in order to maintain order and saftey for law abiding citizens..no decisions are made for me, the laws that govern me and that i live by dont effect my life all that much because they are laws that like i said keep order and provide saftey for me and the ones i care about, believe me theres been times i thought about breaking the law like when im in the van with my kids and some moron pulls out in front of me causing me to run off the road and almost kill my family, i thought about following that moron and taking the law into my own hands but i think about the consequence of doing so and i choose to just continue to my destination, after calling the cops with his plate number and them pulling him over to explain to him he could go to jail or get a ticket for not using COMMON SENSE when driving....ruth

Post by **kninebirddog** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 6:18 am

Sad part is all the Laws they pass ..They don't work those people will continue to let their dogs bark and roam free etc etc etc

and when they make many of those laws they make them so that the honest people pay for the ________'S

settergal83 · Post by **settergal83** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 6:20 am

Thought the tread was about dogs and neighbors...must be on the wrong thread.

No I would Never clip a dogs cords. How horrid. Proper training can do a lot. My dogs do not bark unless there is a problem (aka. intruder, be it animal or person). As far as a bark collar...would rather put that on some people v.s. my dog. Too many "tools" are improperly used. And people tend to take the easy way out v.s. truly solving the real problem. Dogs were not meant to be penned for hours on end w/ nothing to DO, especially the hunting/working breeds...we breed a dog to do a task and then expect that trait to only show up when we want it. Sorry just not the way it works. It really annoys me that people don't use their heads in situations like this. Animals, generally speaking, don't just DO things. There is almost always a reason for the action. And from past experiences 90% of the time the problem is human based.

Just like someone on another thread was saying, Pits make awesome dogs. They do. It's people breeding them poorly and training them to fight or be aggressive that makes the breed look bad. Same w/ anything else.

And the worst part is...DOGS ARE NOT TOOLS. They have feeling. Not like humans because they don't have a reasoning process, but you can't tell me that dogs aren't able to be happy, sad, depressed. The main reason that my male is in the house is because his buddy and litter mate died at 6 months of age. The litter mate had a heart problem that was undetected and was found in the vet annalasis after he passed. Charlie was so lost and depressed he went off feed, wouldn't leave the dog house and refused to move even when we went out to the kennel. I brought him to the house expecting him to die. I hand fed him and after almost 2 weeks of much stress to me and much pampering to him he came around. However, every time we even walk past that dog house he tucks his tail and lowers his head. it's been 1 1/2 years since this all took place but try to tell me he doesn't remember, at least that something bad happened when he was in that place. IDK. I'm just saying.

gittrdonebritts · Post by **gittrdonebritts** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 6:58 am

Your not getting it Ruth, this is stupid this thread was about a dog that got beat to death by someone who should be punished, not how a Canadian Citizen thinks America needs more laws.

Ron R · Post by **Ron R** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 7:04 am

gittrdonebritts wrote: Am I gonna make Dam sure my son wears a seat belt in the truck yes (Common sense)

But he is not going to wear a seat belt in a school bus because they don't have them :roll: . Where is the seat belt law? Could you imagine getting pulled over and having 3 or 4 kids in the back seat unbuckled.

GUNDOGS · Post by **GUNDOGS** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 7:34 am

gittrdonebritts wrote:Your not getting it Ruth, this is stupid this thread was about a dog that got beat to death by someone who should be punished, not how a Canadian Citizen thinks America needs more laws.

I know what the thread is about but if you read all the comments you will see i said there should be more laws in effect for the protection of animals and enforced when people break those laws such as the individual that committed this terrible crime, i stated that those laws for animal protection will never be able to be enforced properly unfortunately and EZZY asked me who i thought should make these laws and brought up if i think the QUEEN, THE GOVERNMENT or THE OWNER OF THE DOG should make the laws which in my opinion brought up the discussion of laws and namely laws in canada..and i may live in canada but i am an AMERICAN just like you are and the CANADIAN comments i get are getting old by the way....ruth

GUNDOGS · Post by **GUNDOGS** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 7:39 am

Ron R wrote:
gittrdonebritts wrote: Am I gonna make Dam sure my son wears a seat belt in the truck yes (Common sense)
But he is not going to wear a seat belt in a school bus because they don't have them :roll: . Where is the seat belt law? Could you imagine getting pulled over and having 3 or 4 kids in the back seat unbuckled.

ive always said that makes no sense a bus should DEFINITLEY have seatbelts especially after seeing some video of kids flying around in the air when one turns over but thank god they have seatbelts on airplanes

....ruth

gittrdonebritts · Post by **gittrdonebritts** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 7:47 am

GUNDOGS wrote: who i thought should make these laws and brought up if i think the QUEEN, THE GOVERNMENT or THE OWNER OF THE DOG should make the laws

If you want the Government making the Laws then how can the Owner of the Dog also make the Laws ?

We don't have a Queen

GUNDOGS wrote: i may live in canada but i am an AMERICAN just like you are

In my Opinion You Forfeited your right to call yourself an American by Choosing to live in Canada.

GBranch830 · Post by **GBranch830** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 8:27 am

must not understand citizenship then...

Cajun Casey · Post by **Cajun Casey** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 9:05 am

School busses have seatbelts.

nikegundog · Post by **nikegundog** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 9:09 am

School busses have seatbelts.

Went on a field trip with my son 2 months ago, no seatbelts on the school bus.

GUNDOGS · Post by **GUNDOGS** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 9:20 am

gittrdonebritts wrote:
GUNDOGS wrote: who i thought should make these laws and brought up if i think the QUEEN, THE GOVERNMENT or THE OWNER OF THE DOG should make the laws

If you want the Government making the Laws then how can the Owner of the Dog also make the Laws ?

We don't have a Queen

GUNDOGS wrote: i may live in canada but i am an AMERICAN just like you are
In my Opinion You Forfeited your right to call yourself an American by Choosing to live in Canada.

ARE YOU SERIOUS?? do you really feel that way joe, do you really feel that because i was in kindergarten when my mother and father divorced my mom moved here to canada to work and support us that i should therefore not have the right to call myself an AMERICAN..because i grew up here and when i was 17 years old got pregnant and moved out, worked and then at 18 got married and raised my family here im no longer allowed to call myself an AMERICAN??..i am very thankful for where i live and i have lived here for 33 years went to school here and made a family here, pay taxes like everyone else and bought a home here as well so i love this country i live in, i also love america as well, my entire family lives in the U.S and i am proud to be born an american but it does disappoint me to see you feel the way you do, enough said i think....ruth

Cajun Casey · Post by **Cajun Casey** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 9:39 am

TMI, really.

Ahumphers91a · Post by **Ahumphers91a** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 9:54 am

wow, this thread has gotten a bit out of hand. Is this what happens when it gets too hot for training?

Post by **ezzy333** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 9:57 am

Ahumphers91a wrote:wow, this thread has gotten a bit out of hand. Is this what happens when it gets too hot for training?

Quite often but this one is doing quite well and staying cool and sensible for the most part though getting off course occasionally. Plus it is discussing things that should be of interest or concern ofallof us.

Ezzy

Vonzeppelinkennels · Post by **Vonzeppelinkennels** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 10:35 am

Ruth are you allowed Hand Guns in Canada?

Post by **Sharon** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 10:37 am

I'm all for fewer rules - you choose whether to use a helmet on a motorcycle, a life jacket in a boat, a seatbelt, drink too much, use illegal drugs etc. I don't care., BUT make sure you pay for your own hospital bills ( in Canada all is paid by taxes we cough up). I decry our taxes rising due to people wanting their own choices.

Story from the old days, when laws were few. May offend some.

My Dad's neighbor had a dog that he allowed to bark incessantly. Owners left it outside lose and it snapped and groqled at the kids going by to school.No Animal Control Officer in those days. You solved your own problem. One day I didn't hear the dog. I asked my Dad about it. He said, " You know. If you sit here and open the window( He raised his arms to show holding a gun.) you have a clear shot at their laneway.

This was when you kept your gun loaded behind the kitchen door.

I was kidnapped when I was 7. When I got older I asked Dad, "What happened to that guy? He said, Oh, "we took care of it."

Post by **Sharon** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 10:38 am

Vonzeppelinkennels wrote:Ruth are you allowed Hand Guns in Canada?

Only with a license, complete Police investigation and a training course. Must be locked securely at all times at home and registered. Only be used at a gun club.

GUNDOGS · Post by **GUNDOGS** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 10:49 am

Sharon wrote:
Vonzeppelinkennels wrote:Ruth are you allowed Hand Guns in Canada?
Only with a license, complete Police investigation and a training course. Must be locked securely at all times at home and registered. Only be used at a gun club.

my husband owns a SMITH AND WESSON model 659, hes had it 20 years and in order to carry you have to join a gun club, get a permit to carry to and from the club during business hours..if in the event we move he has to notify the RCMP and get a new permit for the new address we will be moving to.....ruth

Vonzeppelinkennels · Post by **Vonzeppelinkennels** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 10:50 am

So you don't think that was a loss of you RIGHT to protect yourself in my opinion that is a right not a freedom but I'm sure some will disagree.
When I say this I'm not trying to offend anyone but WE DON'T BOW TO THE QUEEN!!
If we should BOW to anyone it should be to ALL OUR SERVICE MEN & WOMEN who have given their life fighting for our FREEDOMS that we are slowly lossing little by little day by day.

That's pretty much all I have to say.

Post by **ezzy333** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 10:51 am

Sharon wrote:
Vonzeppelinkennels wrote:Ruth are you allowed Hand Guns in Canada?
Only with a license, complete Police investigation and a training course. Must be locked securely at all times at home and registered. Only be used at a gun club.

Thats sad, especially when you live in an area where it would be wise to carry one when you are in any of the wilderness areas. I have gotten to where I carry one here when I go to certain areas even if it is against the law made by someone that has no knowledge of the dangers since my well being is more important.

Ezzy

GUNDOGS · Post by **GUNDOGS** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 11:01 am

Vonzeppelinkennels wrote:So you don't think that was a loss of you RIGHT to protect yourself in my opinion that is a right not a freedom but I'm sure some will disagree.
When I say this I'm not trying to offend anyone but WE DON'T BOW TO THE QUEEN!!
If we should BOW to anyone it should be to ALL OUR SERVICE MEN & WOMEN who have given their life fighting for our FREEDOMS that we are slowly lossing little by little day by day.

That's pretty much all I have to say.

maybe its necessary for you ted but i dont have a need to protect myself with a handgun, nobody said you have to bow to a queen and we too have canadian men and women that are in afghanistan fighting for freedom as well, my niece is in the airforce and is stationed in GUAM at the moment.. there were only 632 gun related deaths and injuries here in a year which is a low number and i dont mind keeping it that way....ruth

GUNDOGS · Post by **GUNDOGS** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 11:15 am

ezzy333 wrote:
Sharon wrote:
Vonzeppelinkennels wrote:Ruth are you allowed Hand Guns in Canada?
Only with a license, complete Police investigation and a training course. Must be locked securely at all times at home and registered. Only be used at a gun club.

Thats sad, especially when you live in an area where it would be wise to carry one when you are in any of the wilderness areas. I have gotten to where I carry one here when I go to certain areas even if it is against the law made by someone that has no knowledge of the dangers since my well being is more important.

Ezzy

ezzy more people have been attacked by dogs then bears here in canada and we dont go around shooting dogs with handguns..theres no need to fear the wilderness areas, ive hiked all around canada with my husband and we went through ALGONQUIN PARK for 9 days with just a tent, a canoe and ate fish, had a water filter ate some bull frogs and saw many bears and moose..never had a hand gun and came out of the park just fine..by the way ALGONQUIN PARK is 3000 sq miles and is the size of DELAWARE AND RHODE ISLAND COMBINED so it was quite the work out

..ruth

GBranch830 · Post by **GBranch830** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 11:29 am

what does everyone here have against canada? are you people being serious? My aunt and uncle dont even lock their door and they live in a somewhat urban area. They say they don't know anyone who does. They are some of the safest/easy going people i know. I wish i lived somewhere i could feel that safe

I don't doubt the stopping power of a .45 but i dont really hope to ever have to use it on a human. I feel bad that so many of us(Americans) are collectively ignorant. sorry ruth.
I try to head up to BC at least once a year and I look forward to it all the while I'm back in the states

Vonzeppelinkennels · Post by **Vonzeppelinkennels** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 11:34 am

Where has anyone said ANYTHING about being against Canada????????????????

Vonzeppelinkennels · Post by **Vonzeppelinkennels** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 11:42 am

I guess we don't see or read the same things into what has been said.That being said I am AMERICAN & proud of it this is the only country I will live in.I have never visited Canada but not saying I never will.
There are alot of places in this country I would rather visit & spend my money but I am not against Canada,is that clear enough??