Do You Know Your Shotgun Fit Dimensions?

[roaniecowpony]

Just wondering if many of you know your fit dimensions for a shotgun. You know, Length of Pull (LOP), Drop at the Comb (DAC), Drop at the Heel (DAH), Pitch, Cast, etc..

Over the years I've settled on: 14" (single trigger) or 14 1/2"(double trigger) LOP, 1 1/2" DAC, 2 1/2" DAH, 2-3" Pitch, 0-1/8" Cast Off as being my ideal dimensions when I just have a shirt on, but can shoot some small variations to those dimensions well. We can all do a little "stock crawl" and get up on a gun a little too long or when we put a jacket on.

[Mountaineer]

Yes, Bilinski in Michigan fitted me...LOP, for example, was a tad over 16".
I have the other measurements somewhere.
However, I shoot the standard stock with a LOP of 14 1/4" on an my 16 gauge Auto 5 equally well.
I no longer fret about fit, warm days or freezing and blowing snow, as it is much ado about little re hunting...the other more important factors of a shot enter in and tend to lower "perfect" fit down the importance list in hitting a gamebird...either heavy cover birds or on the plains.
Fit can be of marginal help if your mount is always perfect, the other factors of a shot always consistent, and if you shoot competition but otherwise, spend your money elsewhere....imho.
Basically, "perfect" fit helps if it gives you confidence...as confidence, familiarity and focus are the real keys.
That is not a popular message board idea but 60 years has shown it is true for me and many others.

[Tyler S]

14 1/4" LOP 1 1/2" DAC 2 5/8"DAH 5/16" cast off
I agree on the confidence part. I still duck hunt with a couple of autos with neutral stocks and somewhat shorter LOPs for heavier clothing,and shoot pretty well with them. I was fitted about 10 years ago and it is a great learning experience and IMO can only make you a better shooter. I had a stock customized for me right after that and I bet I could tell that gun out of a dozen blindfolded now.

[DonF]

if I knew those things, I wouldn't have an excuse to miss!

[Sharon]

I had my gun customized by an excellent English gunsmith. Be careful though as gaining weight also increases cheek fat and can throw off custom work. Did you know that when you gain weight even your ears fatten up and can render your hearing aid less effective?

[roaniecowpony]

... Did you know that when you gain weight even your ears fatten up and can render your hearing aid less effective?

Huh?

[roaniecowpony]

Sharon
You must be talking about Stephen Milton. I bought a gun from him and his wife a few years back.

[Sharon]

Nick Malkinson Mount Brydges

[Sharon]

... Did you know that when you gain weight even your ears fatten up and can render your hearing aid less effective?

Huh?

Just a bit of trivia that one thinks of at 1am. LOL

[roaniecowpony]

I think most gunners don't realize the rear sight of a shotgun is the shooter's eye. The proper fit of a shotgun makes it consistent to get your eye in the right place every shot without squirming around on the gun.

[birddogger]

I have no idea.

Charlie

[roaniecowpony]

I think most gunners don't realize the rear sight of a shotgun is the shooter's eye. The proper fit of a shotgun makes it consistent to get your eye in the right place every shot without squirming around on the gun.

[birddog1968]

Ive always just found a shotgun that feels decent then let my brain figure out how to shoot it consistently, and its always worked for me.

[roaniecowpony]

For anyone that may want to learn more about shotgun fit and why it's important to good shooting for most people, a book by an English shooting instructor/gunfitter, Michael Yardley, Gunfitting, The Quest for Perfection for Shotguns and Rifles is a short but good read. Amazon has them.

Mass production shotgun makers pick a set of dimensions that they think will fit the most amount of people. If you fit into their selection of dimensions, chances are you'll have a decent fit and a true custom fit will only pay small percentages of improvement if at all. For a competition shooter, small percentages are what it's all about. For a hunter, he'll probably never know why he missed this shot or that. Some of you have guns that you can't seem to hit as well with as other guns. Or have that one gun that is just perfect for you that you can't miss with. Ever wonder why? It's all in the dimensions, weight and distribution (balance) of weight, with dimensions being a big part of it, often the biggest part.

One mistake we all make is having shotgun that we think is perfect in a shirt and when we hunt in the winter with a big old jacket on, we miss a bunch. You might consider taking that 1" thick recoil pad off during the coldest winter months and try it.

I buy a lot of different types of shotguns from different era's ranging from the early 20th century to some later guns and modern production guns too. I bought a 28ga Parker Reproduction a few years ago specifically to convert to .410 when Galazan announced they were making .410 barrels for the 28ga Repro. What I found was that these guns were mostly made with pretty high dimensions (for me). 1 3/8" DAC x 2 1/4" DAH. I would consistently miss high with this gun. It has to do with my cheekbone construction as well as eye location. I ended up bending the stock down to fit me. There's another option when a stock is too high. You can shave the top of the comb (top of the buttstock) down with a plane or sander and refinish. Gunsmiths will charge $150 - 200 to bend a stock.

My Parker Repro in my bending fixture.

[Tooling]

Having a gun fit is just a pleasure and one that inspires the all important confidence. Hadn't put much thought into it having several guns that are "close" until I came across a s-gun that really actually fit me pretty darn good right out of the box..the shot afield happens so fast there is not an ounce if time to think about it and the instinctual factor comes into play. Pulling that gun up and having it just hit the right spot every time is nice....now I want all my guns fit properly! Hit pay dirt fit-wise with a Merkel 1620..have other Merkels that are close but not quite right like that one is. I think it's in the cast off and cant of that buttstock which I'll have to have a competent gunsmith measure for me...it's more than simply D.A.C./D.A.H. + pull etc..maybe I have a funny shaped head!!

I agree with the confidence thing...for me once it is lost..I'm screwed.

Roainie...funny you bring up the Parker Repro. 28 ga. Mine will arrive tomorrow...vastly different dims than what I am used to but it's for my bride so...that said...bet it's stock is bent for more depth within 6 mos : )

[roaniecowpony]

Tooling,
I know what you mean about having them "right". I messed with two bends on that Repro. The last one got it right.

Most will just accept that a particular gun is "just not a good shooter" or another is a "great shooter". It's usually the pretty one that gets the bad label and the beat to death ugly hand-me-down that is the great shooter. That's just lady luck messin with us.

[Tooling]

Got the Parker...what a sweetheart of a gun!!! SG, 2 triggers the way God intended, 5.5# exactly & I happen to like shorter barrels than most as I like "quick" guns...cc is rather worn but mechanically its easily 99%. Boy those cc's must wear quick because this gun only shows evidence of the right barrel having been fired and very little at that. Anyhow...as w/all Parkers that I have shouldered the fit sucks....even rather high for wifey. Surprisingly it is cast off a bit too much which is unusual for me as I typically need a little cast and also like a thin comb. Maybe 1/4" lower changing the pitch and bringing the cast neutral would be the ticket for this one. It's a "bit" short but not unusable as a jacket would bring it in just about right and of course no interest in cutting/modifying the skeleton...with a t-shirt the change in pitch would likely make it work w/out much "adjustment" of mount.

Roanie..how hard is the bending..is it something to be intimidated with or is it kind of a breeze if using common sense? I own a machine shop so making the fixture is a breeze for me and I have several guns I'd love to tweak. I do have a gun that I could use as my first bend for experience that is a nice gun but not very valuable although it is not French Walnut (I think) as the new Parker is. Parker grain is not crazy and is nice and horizontal at the wrist/receiver.

[roaniecowpony]

I think the actual bending is a feel thing.

The thing that also is most important is deciding if the grain is right for the bend.

[mtlhdr]

Beretta 3901 real close, CZ canvasback not remotely close. I may know more someday, but I think that may be when my 17 month old son is out of college...

[roaniecowpony]

Tooling,
If you have a machine shop, making the fixture is cake. I used 3" alum channel, cut the pieces up to length on a cold saw, milled some slots for the 7/8" bolts, TIG'd it together, drilled the 7/8" bolts to 1/2-20, used 1/2-20 all-thread for the jackscrews, McMaster-Carr or Grainger had the knobs and swivel pads, a woodworking store had the threaded inserts for where the clamps bolt on, the clamps are oak from the discount remnant bin at the woodworking store, I cut the slots and drilled the holes in the clamps and the base in a Bridgeport. The alum frame has 4 large lag bolts attaching it. My base is overkill, but I didn't want any deflection in the base. Bigger is not a problem except for carrying it around.

You really should clamp the cheeks on the stock to keep them from opening up when bending and splitting. Use finger pressure to bend the stock, the screws are just to hold it in place after it's bent. The lamps are 250w R40 red heat lamps kept around 6" from the stock.

You should get on the doublegunshop.com board for more information. Here's a thread from a while back on the subject.
http://www.doublegunshop.com/forums/ubb ... 222&page=1

Bending is a job that you want to think about a bit first. Assessing the grain before you attempt to bend will help keep from cracking a stock.