Vehicle Choice

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OTP Outdoors
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Vehicle Choice

Post by OTP Outdoors » Mon Jun 05, 2023 12:55 pm

Hello all, I am in the market for a new vehicle and am also expecting my first bird dog pup this fall. I am located in Central Pennsylvania, but I work remotely with my job and am planning to travel to different states starting in the fall of 2024 to chase birds with my dog. I am mostly interested in hunting grouse and woodcock so the top of my travel list include Maine, Minnesota, Michigan, Wisconsin etc.

I have never hunted these states and am curious what type of road conditions to expect when traveling to and from clearcuts? Right now I am considering a Subaru Forester/Outback or a Silverado.

The Subaru would come with a cheaper price tag and I would be able to get a rooftop tent and a fly rod holder. It gets significantly better gas mileage which is important to me, but not a deal breaker since I don't travel to and from work on a daily basis.

The downside to the Subaru is the towing capacity (not a huge deal to me now, but it is a handicap) and no four wheel drive. I don't have experience with AWD vs 4WD so I'm not sure how the Subaru would handle in the types of roads I may encounter while hunting.

I would love to hear some feedback on what condition roads you have encountered in your travels as well as any input on AWD vs 4WD. Feel free to post any pictures of your setup as well!

Mosby
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Re: Vehicle Choice

Post by Mosby » Mon Jun 05, 2023 5:54 pm

I grew up in Central PA and have both an Outback and a 4x4 Chevy Colorado. The Outback is great for fall trips and bad weather isn't expected but when the weather starts to turn, I take the truck. I can hunt areas right off paved roads or well maintained gravel roads with the Outback but I don't take it back into un-maintained roads or trails, which does limit my hunting.

Heavy rains can turn those back roads and fields into a sea of mud and car tires won't cut it. Ice and snow storms can come in quickly off the lakes too and can be pretty heavy. While I might be able to get by with my Outback, the truck is more capable and safer for both me and my dogs, so that is what I take on the longer trips or if I expect bad weather later in the year. The mpg between them is only about 5 mpg but my Colorado is a small diesel.

My Colorado is lifted w/front and rear locking differential and I bought the most capable 4x4 I could afford specifically for hunting but I like to get away from other hunters and don't want to be limited by my vehicle. I also go bear, elk, deer hunting etc., and has more room for equipment and more versatile.

nick613
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Re: Vehicle Choice

Post by nick613 » Mon Jun 05, 2023 6:43 pm

Subarus have a very unearned reputation IMO... Something like that I'd be looking at a Jeep or Toyota. Even a Nissan.

Wrangler, grand Cherokee,Cherokee, 4runner, rav4, Tacoma, frontier...

Anyone of those would be suitable to varying degrees. 1/2 ton if you have another use for it but I wouldn't buy one especially not brand new just for chasing birds.

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cjhills
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Re: Vehicle Choice

Post by cjhills » Tue Jun 06, 2023 5:13 am

OPT
I live in north Minnesota grouse country, and have hunted most of the grouse country Minnesota, Wisconsin and the UP of Michigan plus pheasants. sharptails and huns in the Dakotas.
My favorite vehicle is a Ford Expedition. I like that access to every thing is easy from the ground. I can haul four dogs in my insulated dog box. It can be raise up to make room for guns beneath it. Some of the late hunting gets very cold, so I like having a warm place for the dogs when we return to the vehicle. Also early season hunting in the west can be very hot, so air conditioning can save a overheated dog. It will go anywhere you can go with a truck and can comfortably haul 4 adults. I generally pull a small trailer on the trip and only take what I need on the day trips.
The big drawbacks with all offroad vehicles are that the are expensive gas guzzlers. But they are very good.
The other thing is you need to be aware of the fact that weather can change quickly at that time of year in the grouse and pheasant country and become extremely dangerous. No highway vehicle will get you everywhere. There are a lot of bogs in the the grouse country........Cj

OTP Outdoors
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Re: Vehicle Choice

Post by OTP Outdoors » Tue Jun 06, 2023 6:52 am

Mosby wrote:
Mon Jun 05, 2023 5:54 pm
I grew up in Central PA and have both an Outback and a 4x4 Chevy Colorado. The Outback is great for fall trips and bad weather isn't expected but when the weather starts to turn, I take the truck. I can hunt areas right off paved roads or well maintained gravel roads with the Outback but I don't take it back into un-maintained roads or trails, which does limit my hunting.

Heavy rains can turn those back roads and fields into a sea of mud and car tires won't cut it. Ice and snow storms can come in quickly off the lakes too and can be pretty heavy. While I might be able to get by with my Outback, the truck is more capable and safer for both me and my dogs, so that is what I take on the longer trips or if I expect bad weather later in the year. The mpg between them is only about 5 mpg but my Colorado is a small diesel.

My Colorado is lifted w/front and rear locking differential and I bought the most capable 4x4 I could afford specifically for hunting but I like to get away from other hunters and don't want to be limited by my vehicle. I also go bear, elk, deer hunting etc., and has more room for equipment and more versatile.
Thanks Mosby, this is good feedback. If I went with a truck I think I would have to go full sized as I would likely add a cap and turn the bed into my "campsite". I currently drive an F150 that has seen better days and is starting to require a lot of maintenance. I don't mind driving a truck, but I do a lot of fly fishing and am in and out of a lot of busy parking lots throughout the spring and I don't enjoy trying to maneuver a full sized truck at times. I also can't enter a busy lot without seeing a couple of Subarus which is why I am considering one.

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Re: Vehicle Choice

Post by OTP Outdoors » Tue Jun 06, 2023 6:54 am

nick613 wrote:
Mon Jun 05, 2023 6:43 pm
Subarus have a very unearned reputation IMO... Something like that I'd be looking at a Jeep or Toyota. Even a Nissan.

Wrangler, grand Cherokee,Cherokee, 4runner, rav4, Tacoma, frontier...

Anyone of those would be suitable to varying degrees. 1/2 ton if you have another use for it but I wouldn't buy one especially not brand new just for chasing birds.

Sent from my Pixel 4a using Tapatalk
I'm definitely not a jeep guy but I understand where you are coming from. I do a lot of fly fishing and am constantly seeing Subarus in the lots and everyone I talk to is happy with them which is why I'm considering one. But there is obviously a difference in road conditions fishing mostly well maintained lots/gravel roads in the spring vs hunting in the late fall and early winter.

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Re: Vehicle Choice

Post by OTP Outdoors » Tue Jun 06, 2023 7:00 am

cjhills wrote:
Tue Jun 06, 2023 5:13 am
OPT
I live in north Minnesota grouse country, and have hunted most of the grouse country Minnesota, Wisconsin and the UP of Michigan plus pheasants. sharptails and huns in the Dakotas.
My favorite vehicle is a Ford Expedition. I like that access to every thing is easy from the ground. I can haul four dogs in my insulated dog box. It can be raise up to make room for guns beneath it. Some of the late hunting gets very cold, so I like having a warm place for the dogs when we return to the vehicle. Also early season hunting in the west can be very hot, so air conditioning can save a overheated dog. It will go anywhere you can go with a truck and can comfortably haul 4 adults. I generally pull a small trailer on the trip and only take what I need on the day trips.
The big drawbacks with all offroad vehicles are that the are expensive gas guzzlers. But they are very good.
The other thing is you need to be aware of the fact that weather can change quickly at that time of year in the grouse and pheasant country and become extremely dangerous. No highway vehicle will get you everywhere. There are a lot of bogs in the the grouse country........Cj
Thanks for the input. I currently drive an older F150 but it's getting to the point where it's more trouble than it's worth. I don't love maneuvering a full sized truck in busy fishing parking lots in the spring and I really don't like the gas mileage. From a driving standpoint I would definitely prefer a Subaru or something similar but I'm just not sure how practical it would end up being for my needs.

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Re: Vehicle Choice

Post by slistoe » Tue Jun 06, 2023 8:03 am


Steve007
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Re: Vehicle Choice

Post by Steve007 » Tue Jun 06, 2023 10:07 am

As is the case with cjhills, I too have a 4wd Ford Expedition. You might find someone who has one and drive it, as they are much more like a large car in driving characteristics and maneuverability than your F150 truck. Nevertheless, not everyone needs the space and admittedly, gas mileage is not ideal. A 4WD Explorer might work for you.

I would absolutely stay with a 4wd vehicle, which is probably why many serious hunters say that Subarus are overrated. AWD is a good fit for everyday all-weather conditions and very light off-roading. 4WD is the better choice for taking on heavier workloads and traveling over challenging terrain, which is what you will definitely encounter at times.

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Re: Vehicle Choice

Post by OTP Outdoors » Tue Jun 06, 2023 10:48 am

Steve007 wrote:
Tue Jun 06, 2023 10:07 am
As is the case with cjhills, I too have a 4wd Ford Expedition. You might find someone who has one and drive it, as they are much more like a large car in driving characteristics and maneuverability than your F150 truck. Nevertheless, not everyone needs the space and admittedly, gas mileage is not ideal. A 4WD Explorer might work for you.

I would absolutely stay with a 4wd vehicle, which is probably why many serious hunters say that Subarus are overrated. AWD is a good fit for everyday all-weather conditions and very light off-roading. 4WD is the better choice for taking on heavier workloads and traveling over challenging terrain, which is what you will definitely encounter at times.
I appreciate the feedback. I know if I was just hunting PA I would be fine with AWD, as the grouse covers I've hunted are in natural gas country with well maintained roads and clearcuts at the tops of mountains. But I've never really been out of PA for hunting/fishing and it looks like I may be better off with 4WD for when I travel.

cjhills
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Re: Vehicle Choice

Post by cjhills » Tue Jun 06, 2023 1:52 pm

One more point. or maybe the same point in a different way.
If you plan to hunt where you say you do, later than October you need a real truck with four wheel drive. Maybe you could do alright with chains on a two wheel drive. Everybody who lives in the real country in the states you mention has a full size at least 1/2 ton truck. I have got in serious trouble from land owners for hunting by myself in the early winter. It can get bad really fast and below zero temps are common. be safe saving a few dollars on fuel is not worth your life...............Cj

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Garrison
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Re: Vehicle Choice

Post by Garrison » Tue Jun 06, 2023 3:41 pm

I have a Subaru Forester that I haul my dogs around in and it has been a great vehicle. Very utilitarian, simple and well engineered. My OCD doesn’t allow me to have anyone perform maintenance on my vehicles, and the Subaru is by far the easiest to work on. With a set of Nokian all weather tires it is hard to beat in the snow or in any poor weather conditions. What it is not, is a proper hunting rig. All wheel drive is fantastic for slippery plowed or soon to be plowed roads, but it is no substitute for 4wd, especially 4wd with a locker or lockers and low range. The Subaru doesn’t have adequate ground clearance articulation/traction or a full size spare for many of the places I hunt out here in the west. I have pulled out quite a few stuck vehicles where all wheel drive gave the driver an inflated sense of capability and have been pulled out myself. It also lacks space for gear once you get a dog box or boxes in the back. I do use it in select locations, and for the every day exercise jaunts.

On the other side of the spectrum my current hunting rig is a 7.3 diesel Ford Excursion 4x4 with a bit of a lift (F350 springs) and taller tires. I have an aluminum dog box and a truck vault in the back. It has been great, the thing is an absolute tank that plows through anything that gets in the way. We hunt some pretty desolate country so I keep a set of chains, a shovel, tow straps, stakes/sledge hammer and a come along that I hope I never need for myself. It also allows me to haul my travel trailer as a base camp. The weight and torque allow it to get through some pretty deep stuff. It is however getting a bit long in the tooth and not the smoothest off-road ride, so it does have me thinking about what’s next, if and when it finally dies. For a dedicated hunting rig, I have been thinking hard about many of the available options and think a Nissan Frontier Pro 4X with a camper shell checks all the boxes for my needs. A full size truck obviously has more versatility, but many of the forest roads I find myself on have difficult turn arounds and a lot of brush that does a number on a paint job. I do like having the ability to give the dogs some heat or AC, but it is also nice to be able to close them off if they run into a skunk or something stinky. Also like the ability to lock everything up while on the road. A Toyota Tacoma is also a great option, but spendy for a hunting rig. I think I would opt for the older V6 to see how the new turbo plays out. I like Nissan’s new power train with a 9 speed and at 6’4” I fit a bit better.

Just have to talk the wife into driving a suburban or full-size for our boat and trailer!😉

FYI, The Ruffland Intermediate SUV crate fits in the Subaru.

Garrison
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OTP Outdoors
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Re: Vehicle Choice

Post by OTP Outdoors » Tue Jun 06, 2023 7:02 pm

cjhills wrote:
Tue Jun 06, 2023 1:52 pm
One more point. or maybe the same point in a different way.
If you plan to hunt where you say you do, later than October you need a real truck with four wheel drive. Maybe you could do alright with chains on a two wheel drive. Everybody who lives in the real country in the states you mention has a full size at least 1/2 ton truck. I have got in serious trouble from land owners for hunting by myself in the early winter. It can get bad really fast and below zero temps are common. be safe saving a few dollars on fuel is not worth your life...............Cj
I do think most of my out of state hunting would be when the season opens late September and then again sometime in October. But with our PA grouse season closing Christmas Eve, I would probably hunt New York some in the late season (as long as they continue to have one). It definitely sounds like 4WD is the ticket.

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Re: Vehicle Choice

Post by OTP Outdoors » Tue Jun 06, 2023 7:04 pm

Garrison, it does look like space is limited in that Subaru with the dog box. I will probably end up going with a Silverado 1500. One day I want to get a Subaru and another day I want to get a truck. It really is a tossup as far as preference goes, and practicality is pushing me towards the truck.

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Re: Vehicle Choice

Post by Garrison » Tue Jun 06, 2023 7:14 pm

OTP Outdoors wrote:
Tue Jun 06, 2023 7:04 pm
Garrison, it does look like space is limited in that Subaru with the dog box. I will probably end up going with a Silverado 1500. One day I want to get a Subaru and another day I want to get a truck. It really is a tossup as far as preference goes, and practicality is pushing me towards the truck.
👍🏻 If I didn’t drive so far for work, I would be much happier with a truck. The 5.3 with the 10 speed is a really good combo for mixed use. Also, the fuel mileage penalty with the newer full size trucks is a lot less than it used to be. Many do almost as well (or maybe as bad) as the midsize trucks. The trail boss with the diesel that gets 30 mpg is very tempting!

Garrison

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Re: Vehicle Choice

Post by Mosby » Fri Jun 09, 2023 9:52 pm

I do think most of my out of state hunting would be when the season opens late September and then again sometime in October. But with our PA grouse season closing Christmas Eve, I would probably hunt New York some in the late season (as long as they continue to have one). It definitely sounds like 4WD is the ticket.
[/quote]

I lived in Maryland years ago and was coming back home to visit family in PA late on a Friday night. Driving on Route 15 outside of Williamsport, PA I started down a steep incline on icy roads and did a couple of 360's in my car. Regained control, drove home on Sunday and traded that car in the next week on a Chevy Blazer 4x4. If I lived in PA again and only had 1 vehicle....it would be a 4x4.

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Re: Vehicle Choice

Post by RayGubernat » Sun Jun 11, 2023 8:19 pm

I have gotten myself into trouble with a 4X4 becasue it CAN go places other vehicles cannot. That also means that you CAN get stuck where only another 4X4 can get to you and help. Just something to consider. A 4 ton comealong and a few lengths of 5/16" trucker's chain, as well as a lithium ion battery charger are things I carry all the time. I also have a can of "fix a flat" rattling around somewhere. I never needed an electric winch, but I have had to use a comealong several times over the years both on my own vehicle and to help out other folks.

If I am carting dogs around, I want a pickup because a dog that has rolled in something that was dead for a week, or got sprayed by a skunk is not something I want to ride home in the same compartment with. Been there and having to drive a hundred miles with the windows open in the dead of winter so I wouldn't toss my cookies from the smell... just plain sucks.

I have fournd that a shortbed pickup with a small back bench seat(Xtra cab, etc) is incredibly handy. I can put all my gear in the back seat and know it is relatively safe from the weather and theft. An intermediate kennel will also fit sideways in most. I had one years ago whose bench seat flipped up, making for an awesome amount of storage. Also, nobody ever wants to sit back there, so I don't get asked to cart more than one person around very often.

I would stick with a full sized P/U mostly because the compact pickups that have what you want in them are nearly the same price as the full size and the space is limited. As far as SUV's are concerned, I think I'd stick with something the size of a Ford Explorer. The bigger ones are pretty gas hungry.

There are several good brands of all terrain tires to give you good traction off road and a decent, if slightly noisy ride on pavement. I have Cooper's. My tires had a tread depth of nearly 1/2" when they were new. They hummed a bit on the highway, but they do a great job on snow and in the slop.

RayG

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