best dog for my needs???

mattman · Post by **mattman** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 1:27 am

Hey all, I was recommended to this site by someone on another forum. I'm currently in the market for a good gun dog but unsure what breed to go with. Things i'm looking for are an intelligent breed that trains fairly easily and isn't extremely high maintenance. I want a dog that will work equally hard in the upland field for pheasant as he will in a duck blind. This is the part where i think it gets tricky. I also want a dog that will make a good guard dog. Not overly aggressive, but protective of the house, willing to bite if necessary but more inclined to bark and warn me (and anyone in earshot) that trouble is lurking. The breeds i'm currently considering are the Chesapeake Bay Retriever and Labrador Retriever. I know there are some awesome pointing dogs out there that would most likely suite my needs, but my experience with pointing dogs has been that they are generally very high strung and need a lot of attention. Don't get me wrong, the dog i get will get plenty of attention, i just want to be able to leave it at home while i'm working a 12 hour shift knowing that it will/should be ok alone.
Thanks

Post by **Ayres** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 2:15 am

I believe that any pointing breed that is trained and disciplined properly will suit your needs. Some of the more specific requirements you're looking for, such as mild aggressiveness (territorial aggressiveness), really aren't a breed-specific thing as much as they are a bloodline and training thing.

I don't know your situation, but you might also rethink the guard-dog thing if you've got children, will expect children, or ever have people over to the house. It's not a switch that you can flip on and off with your dog, it's something you must have constant control over. And if the dog's going to be left alone... well.. you don't want to get sued by the gas meter reader guy because he's missing a hunk from his calf muscle.

I would recommend looking into the versatile bloodlines, continental breeds for a pointing dog to really suit your retrieving requirements. Some folks might not agree (Heaven knows that issue always starts a war around here), and they'd be right in that you can always train a dog to retrieve, but any natural ability in that department always helps things along. Examples: German Shorthaired Pointer; German Wirehaired Pointer; Weimaraner; Vizsla. Other breeds to consider, just look for bloodlines that have some natural retrieving desire, examples: Brittany, Pointer; English Setter; Llewellyn Setter. Still another breed you might consider is a Pointing Lab (yes, there are labs that point). To find a Pointing Lab, it's all about the bloodlines.

Good luck!

Mav&Lizzy · Post by **Mav&Lizzy** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 10:08 am

I have a yellow lab that comes from some pointing lab stock. She is and awesome all around dog. She points/retrieves quail, pheasant, prairie chicken and woodcock. She will track a wounded pheasant for miles, ranges out to about 50 yards, give or take, but then can sit in a blind awaiting waterfowl or in a ditch for dove or prairie chicken.

She is now 11 years old and has arthritis so she doesn't hunt but I learned when she was young to watch her around other children (not mine). She has never bitten anyone that she wasn't told to. I found out when my kids were little that she is very protective of them. My son would play football (actually anything that looked like people were chasing him) and she would sound so visious and try to escape her kennel. The occasional time she was out she would never bite anyone but would get between the kids and whoever was appearing aggressive towards them and growl and bark. Does the same when someone comes to the door when my wife and/or I aren't home. She will allow the kids to answer the door but places herself between them and the door until my kids assure her they are friendly. If I get on to one of the kids or even argue with my wife she will put herself between us. Always head and tail tucked and will NEVER show signs of aggression but once I'm done scolding or arguing she caters to the kids or my wife showing them that she loves them!! Its actually quite neat.

Now I say she has bitten when told to. I used to be a K9 officer and another K9 officer used to bring his partner to my house and we would train in the back yard. All my setters could've cared less but when we were doing handler protection stuff my lab would go nuts when my buddy would grab me. One day we put up the K9's and let out the lab. She ran around happy as a lark. My buddy would pet her and throw a ball and the two would play fetch. Then he'd grab me and she would try to put herself in between us. As soon as I yelled for help the hair on her back would stand up, the teeth would come out and she looked mean as heck but she never would bite him. Once I patted his pocket, similar to telling a drug dog to "sniff here" and said "get him Belle". She grabbed a hold of his pant leg, wouldn't bite his whole leg just the clothing, and ripped his pant leg right off. As soon as I told her it was "ok" she went back to being his buddy. I tried this with my wife and son once. If it was me being agressive towards them or them towards me she simply attempted to put herself in between the 2 of us with tail and head tucked but if it was my buddy being aggressive toward them or them towards him she would bristle up and go after him!!

Great hunter and all around dog!!

Hotpepper · Post by **Hotpepper** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 10:52 am

I would suggest a lab or a shorthair, too many issues in training with the chessie.

The wound up bird dog can be overcame. Don't but something out of someone backyard program with 2 good old boy owners who jus hunt together. Ask questions, you will know.

In Germany the GSP lives in the house, sleeps on a rug in the kitchen.

Send me a PM and I will tell you more.

Pepper

snowman · Post by **snowman** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 12:16 pm

I have had several different types of dogs from Saints, Labs, Jacks, and Malimutes and they all protected the house and family when it came down to it. What I am geting at is I think any dog that is raised with the family and knows who the family is they will protect if need be. The best gaurd dogs I have had so far are my Jacks. I obviously wouldnt recomend them for bird hunting but they can tell if anyone is in or arround the house. They did slip up one time and let a cat sneak in through the dog door. Once they noticed it in the house though it was GAME ON!

Casey J.

Post by **ezzy333** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 1:58 pm

Wouldn't a GWP be the best choice for a pointing breed and the chessie maybe for a retrieving breed but I do think you have more training problems with them?

Ezzy

Ruffshooter · Post by **Ruffshooter** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 2:13 pm

I too, think the GWP fits the bill perfectly. They are good pointing dogs, great endurance, good coats, sharpness etc. They are a good all around dog.

Lab Man · Post by **Lab Man** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 3:34 pm

If you do alot of Duck hunting I would get a Labrador Retriever. I do alot of waterfowl hunting and I have German Shorthairs for Upland hunting and my retrievers for duck hunting.

Fowlplay · Post by **Fowlplay** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 3:44 pm

With your criteria...I would say you need to decide which you're going to hunt most..upland or waterfowl. If it's upland, then I would go with the GWP. If waterfowl, either the Chesie or the Lab.

Good luck,

Rick

Razor · Post by **Razor** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 4:08 pm

DD or GWP- both would fit the bill.

john · Post by **john** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 5:59 pm

Deutsch Drahthaar
http://www.vdd-gna.org/index.php

highcotton · Post by **highcotton** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 7:24 pm

Ayres wrote:I believe that any pointing breed that is trained and disciplined properly will suit your needs. Some of the more specific requirements you're looking for, such as mild aggressiveness (territorial aggressiveness), really aren't a breed-specific thing as much as they are a bloodline and training thing.

I don't know your situation, but you might also rethink the guard-dog thing if you've got children, will expect children, or ever have people over to the house. It's not a switch that you can flip on and off with your dog, it's something you must have constant control over. And if the dog's going to be left alone... well.. you don't want to get sued by the gas meter reader guy because he's missing a hunk from his calf muscle.

I would recommend looking into the versatile bloodlines, continental breeds for a pointing dog to really suit your retrieving requirements. Some folks might not agree (Heaven knows that issue always starts a war around here), and they'd be right in that you can always train a dog to retrieve, but any natural ability in that department always helps things along. Examples: German Shorthaired Pointer; German Wirehaired Pointer; Weimaraner; Vizsla. Other breeds to consider, just look for bloodlines that have some natural retrieving desire, examples: Brittany, Pointer; English Setter; Llewellyn Setter. Still another breed you might consider is a Pointing Lab (yes, there are labs that point). To find a Pointing Lab, it's all about the bloodlines.

Good luck!

As a die hard setter man it pains me to say this but I agree totally with your post.

The V dogs would be my choice for the needs described.

Cora's Shadow · Post by **Cora's Shadow** » Sat Feb 02, 2008 10:57 am

I think that you will find that most DDs are much calmer than a lab or chessie. They have to be because of their testing requirements. I know that a lot of people like to assume that pointing dogs are higher energy and many are, but DDs are an exception.

I would also like to point out that most any dog of German breeding will have the qualities you are looking for. You could get a Deutsch Drahthaar, a Deutsch Kurzhaar, or a Deutsch Langhaar. All three breeds have their temperaments evaluated by judges before being bred so they tend to be calmer than a lot of other pointing breeds. All three breeds are also encouraged to be very vocal. In my breed (the langhaars), each dog must bark in a test before they can be certified for breeding. In the other 2 German breeds, the dogs have loud requirements as well. I would imagine that when you say you want a guard dog, you are primarily interested in a dog that will bark to let you know that someone is there and become aggressive only in extreme situations. The German-bred dogs will suit you well in that department. I can't speak for the Kurzhaars as I have not seen many, but Drahthaars and Langhaars are equally impressive in upland work and water work. They are both definitely breeds where you can go duck hunting all morning and pheasant hunting all afternoon with equal proficiency.

If you are really into retrievers, you could probably find a kennel that produced the type of dog that you are looking for. But it would be much easier to find a German-bred versatile dog to satisfy your requirements.

mattman · Post by **mattman** » Sat Feb 02, 2008 5:37 pm

Thank you all for your opinions. You gave me quite a few different breeds to consider, and i spent a few hours researching them all. I decided to go with the lab for the simple fact that this will be my first dog, other than the dog i had growing up. I decided for a first dog it would be best for me to get a breed that would be easy to train. Now i know that a lot of folks say the GSP's are easy to train and learn quickly, and i don't doubt that one bit. I've seen a couple of them in action and they are an extremely intelligent dog. I just decided that since I've been around several labs (buddies and other family members dogs) that i feel more comfortable with the breed. My basic plan is to find a good lab pup from a reputable breeder. Raise and train it, and in a year or two after i've got some training experience under my belt i'll get a pointer, most likely GSP, as well. Thanks again guys, you've really helped me in my quest quite a bit.