Pedigree question - is this a quality dog (Griffon)?

[nooblet]

Hey all,

I did a search and was not clear whether or not I can post a pedigree here for some help regarding its quality.

So - Is this the proper place to post it and get a little assistance?

[topher40]

Your in the right place.......post away!

[nooblet]

Okay - I understand there is more to the dog than just the numbers. But given this will be my first gundog, I just want to make sure I am making an informed decision. I'll just post the information that seems applicable to me.

Note this is a 9 month old dog who does not fit into the breeder's program because it scored a .53 on the PENNHIP test (which does not seem to be that big of a deal given the research I have done).

Breed - WPG
Reg No - GR-003328

Sire

VC Alders Edge Orion
GR-000780
NA 107 II; UT 199 I; IT 190 PASS

Dam

Wayfarer's Winter
GR-0001329
NA 112 I

Note the grandparents of the dog averaged an NA 99 II

Is this enough information?

[postoakshorthairs]

I don't know anything about gwp's so I can't help. I wasn't aware they checked hips that young.

[Dave Quindt]

Sure, go ahead and stump us with a Griffon!

You are dealing with a pretty obscure breed, which sees participation pretty much limited to NAVHDA. Outside of the Griffon folks, it would be hard to find someone who could give you an educated answer.

Having a VC sired pup probably gives you as good of odds as you're going to get. Considering you're talking about a 9 month old pup that probably has already been exposed to birds, gun fire, field work, basic obedience, I'd say that you need to judge the dog as a dog, and not by its pedigree. You can screw up the best bred dog by 9 months of age, and regardless of pedigree, never undo the damage that's been done. Go see the dog in the field, and on game. Does it point? Does it hunt? Does it show desire to search for game?

I'll be honest; I'm not a huge fan of the Griffs (or any of the other less-popular versatile breeds) for first time gundogs. They, as a group, are incredibly quirky. Most often, they have problems with point instinct, hunt desire and ability to accept normal training pressure. They tend to be weak in areas where the newbie needs a dog to be exceptionally strong. IMO, a GSP or GWP is going to give you much better odds of success as a first time gundog owner. There are some nice individual dogs within these smaller versatile breeds out there; but they are the exception and not the rule.

JMO,
Dave

[Prairie Hunter]

Dave makes a good point. I would be less concerned about the PennHip score than how the dog performs in the field before you decide if you want it. You need to see how the dogs works for yourself.

[Debf]

It's not a lot of information to go on. Alder's Edge I'm familiar with since it's Bill Jensen's kennel, he's a long time NAVHDA judge and been in Grifs for many years. For what it's worth I've been out with Odie a few times when his owner was training him for the Invitational a few years back. He was a very nice dog - excellent temperament. What I remember the most is how little training his owner had to put into him to perform well at the Invitational - he just seemed to be a natural.

Although I'm a DD/GWP diehard, I have to admit the griffon's have been really coming on strong the last several years in NAVHDA - there are a number I've seen that are very good.

[SwitchGrassWPG]

Based on the 5 generation pedigrees of both the sire and Dam, on paper, it shouldn't be a bad dog. Yes, Griffs can be a challenge for first time pointing dog owners. I have yet to see a Griff with issues when it comes to pointing instinct and hunt desire. Their temperament can be on the softer side and don't accept harsh handling. They have an incredibly strong desire to please, almost to a fault.

I'd be concerned about a Penn Hip measurement of .53. These are very loose hips for a Griffon. If you do decide to take it, you may have a dog that will be on an anti inflammatory its whole adult life. If you don't plan to hunt it hard, may not be a bad choice.

Definitely need to know if its been exposed to all the things a bird dog needs to be exposed to. If you can see it work, that much better.

[Jed]

Not much I can add to what Switchgrass has said about the pedigree.

But I have a dog out of the same sire (different dam). If you want to chat about what he is like send me a PM with a PH# and I will give you a call.

Cheers
Jed

[nooblet]

pm sent.