ezzy333 wrote:Don't think a dog has muscles in his ears so they can't flip them at will. Some will get them laying back when running in the wind. I'm sure a dog can learn to listen for birds but the primary sense is smell. And that is the way we want them to search. A dog with any experience will possibly know the sound is coming from a bird and might try to find it but hopefully it will stay with you instead as you are the one he is hunting for.Ezzy
Thanks for the input everyone. Let me explain a little better. Sorry for the Long reply but it seems to be the only way.
Ammo shakes his head sometimes or runs and his ear will stay all the way back like in my avatar if he doesn't shake his head again to flip it down. It does fold back and stay so that it requires a little effort if I push it forward. It doesn't just fall down once he stops running is what I'm trying to explain. He has to shake his head to flip it back down. That's normal right ?
He can do this with both ears but never does it with both at the same time. Now let me explain why I think he is listening for the calls and flips one ear to hear better but maybe keeps the other ear down for scenting.
Keep a open mind...
I have a bird pen that Ammo has seen since he was 8 wks old. He sees, hears the quail and pigeons calling and knows what they sound and smell like at this point. I have had one or two birds get out from time to time and they fly off until they feel safe to try and come back to the pen. When they are hiding and calling to the other quail from a location other than the pen (if Ammo is out in the yard when they try to come back) he looks in the direction of the quail that are not in the pen and starts trying to scent it while moving that way. It doesn't take long before he finds it and off goes the quail. I'm explaining this to prove he knows exactly what the quail calls sound like and lights up when he hears them. He is just now learning that he can't catch them and started pointing and holding on his own.
He will be hunting for me in the future but, right now we are just training and he doesn't go more than 50-75 yards away most of the time at his current age. ( I'm a foot hunter so that is fine )When he hears a bird in the grass it's not coming from 1/4 mile away, it's normally pretty close. But when he hears it and recognizes the call he tries to pick up scent in that direction.
How this came about :
pup has been around birds since he was 8 wks old until almost 6 mo. and learned from them, he should know his prey well enough to find them by calls as well as scent shouldn't he ?
Example: Try putting a rabbit call out while hunting and see how many coyotes come running, because they know the sounds of their prey. It wasn't the scent that brings them running.
Without a bird pen it would prob. take a dog 5-10 yrs. to get that kind of exposure and then he still may never put the two together unless he points the bird while it is calling. Ammo grew up looking at the quail while they are calling so he knows their sounds as well as their scent which appears to make a killer combination.
Has anybody with a bird pen full of birds raised a pup close enough to see and hear the birds and if so have you noticed the dog using the calls and scent together to find birds ?
I'm sure my pup is doing it and the combo has to increase the odds of finding birds. Why would you want to limit your dog to only scent ? Isn't his job to find birds ? If he can use more than one of his senses wouldn't that work in his favor ? Your favor if you want to find more birds...
I had asked a question along this line back when I first brought Ammo home and was told dogs don't find birds by sound they find them by scent and birds don't sit around calling all the time etc.
This is why I'm asking again now that I have watched Ammo follow the calls looking for scent.
Anybody else try teaching this combo ?
Thanks again
This is not directed to you Laurie, just a general comment.