WireHaired Pointing Griffon Questions

[leeave96]

Years ago, I had a Llewellin setter that had two personalites, all bird busines and all play - great dog.

Fast forward, my family would like to get another dog. My kids are 9 thru 14 yrs of age. I have been considering another Llewellin setter, however, I am not to keen on the sheading of hair all over the place like our setter. I'd also like a bit less hyper dog in the house too. Though my family wants a house dog, I'd like to have a good house/family dog and a good grouse dog rolled-up in one package.

My first search started with "a dog that doesn't shed" and that netted me this Wirehaired Pointing Griffon - which to my surpirse is a bird dog too. I searched the archives and read the WPG, in addition to not shedding (they must shed some?), are a calm dog indoors and a hard working dog on the hunt and close working like my old Llewellin.

The WPG sounds like a great fit for us, but I have some quesitons.

1. Does the WPG really not shed or shed very little? This is important in our house.

2. My hunting is 95% grouse and a very occasional quail hunt. How does the WPG perform with grouse?

3. My Llewellin was a great pointing dog. Find the bird and point like a statue. Is the WPG truly a pointing dog?

4. How calm indoor can one expect these dogs to be? Are they a good house dog?

5. I know this sounds like a silly question, but how easy are these dogs to house train (potty train)?

6. Can you recommend a reputable breeder and what kind of ball park cost would one expect to pay for a WPG?

Any tips or suggestions would be most appreciated. I'd like to buy a dog for our family as a Christmas present if I can find some pups ready about that time.

Thanks for your time and advice.

Bill

[Debf]

I sent you a PM of a site with many, many griff owners - if you decide to get one they would be able to steer you towards the best breeders. Our GWPs are very griffon-like in appearance and I would confirm that they do not shed much in the house.

Griffs for grouse hunting....don't know on average but, do know a few people that have been very pleased with their work. A friend of ours, who currently owns GSPs, has stated many times that his very best grouse dog was Griffon. He switched breeds because it was difficult to find well bred griffons back when he owned the one however, it is a breed that has improved considerably in the last 10 years.

Griffs are pointing dogs but, probably won't look like a setter on point.

The rest of your questions are best answered by people with hands-on experience with the breed so go post them on the site I suggested.

Good luck in your puppy search.

[Wagonmaster]

Shorthaired dogs shed more, long haired dogs shed less. But the hairs on the long haired dogs are longer (duh) so it comes out the same. Anyone who tells you that a breed of dogs doesn't shed, is marketing.

[Cactus]

I'm a new Griff owner, so I can only respond based on having a WPG for a little more than two months. I agree 100% that all dogs shed, but our Griff hardly sheds at all. Of course it's just a puppy, and the shedding could change as the dog ages and coat grows in length. House breaking has been fairly easy with the use of a crate and taking it for walks at the appropriate times.

[Steve007]

All dogs definitely do shed, but with some breeds the dead hair stays there (mostly) until pulled out with an easy-to-use grooming tool for that purpose.I switched from Setters (Gordons) to a wirehaired breed (GWP). Both were (or are) 100 % house dogs. There is a dramatic difference in fur around the house.

[Winglish]

Shorthaired dogs shed more, long haired dogs shed less. But the hairs on the long haired dogs are longer (duh) so it comes out the same. Anyone who tells you that a breed of dogs doesn't shed, is marketing.

I don't pipe in much, but now is the time for a little education. Wirehaired pointing griffons have hair instead of fur. Other breeds like the German Shorthair are misnamed. They should be called the German Shortfur because they have fur like most other dog breeds. Do people shed their hair? Yes, a little. Do wirehaired dogs shed their hair? Yes, a little...VERY little. I've only owned 6 different breeds of gun dog in my time and they all shed. The Griffs shed much, much, much less than the other breeds I've had. No disrespect intended, sir, but that's not marketing. The few canine breeds that have actual hair like the WPG or the Bichon Frise simply don't shed much.

[tro182]

I looked into the WPG and was impressed with the breed. From what I have been told they are great house dogs and good hunters. The shedding problem was going to be an issue for my family and we decided on a Wirehaired Vizsla. We are on a waiting list right now but we chose a WV because a good breeder was close to us. The WV may be an option they are very similar in all respects.

[Irish_Tex]

Good afternoon folks,
I am totally new to the site (signed on for the first time today) - the reason i joined was to learn more about dogs that would be suited for work in Texas and I came across this thread - and the WPG is a dog I just love the look of and by all accounts is of the correct style and temperament. [note: i dont own a dog and only started hunting a few years ago].

The worry I have is heat - I know this time of year, probably not a problem on a duck pond - but what are thoughts about a WPG and the Houston summers ?

Any thoughts appreciated.

Thanks

[mcbosco]

Good afternoon folks,
I am totally new to the site (signed on for the first time today) - the reason i joined was to learn more about dogs that would be suited for work in Texas and I came across this thread - and the WPG is a dog I just love the look of and by all accounts is of the correct style and temperament. [note: i dont own a dog and only started hunting a few years ago].

The worry I have is heat - I know this time of year, probably not a problem on a duck pond - but what are thoughts about a WPG and the Houston summers ?

Any thoughts appreciated.

Thanks

The few I know in New Jersey don't do well in the heat at all. They seem to be only slightly better than a Lab in the heat. My dog which is substantially larger and heavier but with similar coat does much, much better, probably because his muzzle and lung cavity are proportionally larger and his beard is always wet in the heat which helps to cool him down.

[Irish_Tex]

Appreciate the feedback - thank you.

[redneck47441]

I too am looking at this breed. How do they compare to say a lab in the house when left alone? Are they as destructive or pretty respective of your property? Would go crazy when left alone. My Boxer wasn't nearly as wound as my Lab.

[troutbum13]

I am a little late to this post, but I have a lab a WPG and a DD.

The WPG hardly sheds at all. But their coat is not maintenance free, they need to be stripped at least twice a year. That means pulling out all the gaurdhairs. My griff has one of the tightest coats of any griff I have seen and he is still a burr magnet. By comparision, my DD has a very tight coarse coat and hardly ever picks up trash in the field, but sheds a fair bit. My lab is a shedding machine, depending on time of year.

My griffon took some time for the lights to come on with birds, but once the lights came on he has been on fire. His point is not as stylish or intense as other breeds, people who have not hunted over him often are not sure if he is on point. but he is honest, and has a great nose. He is constantly getting better.

He is 2 years old and his range is still expanding, but they are generally thought of to be close working. Good stamina, but not super fast. HORRIBLE in the heat. Anything over 60 and he melts fast. He is mellow in the house, but always needs to know where I am. Super easy to train, both house training and field/yard work.

WPGs are mostly thought of as grouse dogs and have a strong following in grouse country.

Hope that helps

[AG74]

Shorthaired dogs shed more, long haired dogs shed less. But the hairs on the long haired dogs are longer (duh) so it comes out the same. Anyone who tells you that a breed of dogs doesn't shed, is marketing.

I don't pipe in much, but now is the time for a little education. Wirehaired pointing griffons have hair instead of fur. Other breeds like the German Shorthair are misnamed. They should be called the German Shortfur because they have fur like most other dog breeds. Do people shed their hair? Yes, a little. Do wirehaired dogs shed their hair? Yes, a little...VERY little. I've only owned 6 different breeds of gun dog in my time and they all shed. The Griffs shed much, much, much less than the other breeds I've had. No disrespect intended, sir, but that's not marketing. The few canine breeds that have actual hair like the WPG or the Bichon Frise simply don't shed much.

Could you please elaborate on the difference between fur and hair? I have a GWP with what appears to be a VERY thin coat. Only a little "wire" hair down the middle of his back, and a few short ones on his sides. I'm just curious and want to learn more.

Thanks,
Al

[DogNewbie]

Shorthaired dogs shed more, long haired dogs shed less. But the hairs on the long haired dogs are longer (duh) so it comes out the same. Anyone who tells you that a breed of dogs doesn't shed, is marketing.

I don't pipe in much, but now is the time for a little education. Wirehaired pointing griffons have hair instead of fur. Other breeds like the German Shorthair are misnamed. They should be called the German Shortfur because they have fur like most other dog breeds. Do people shed their hair? Yes, a little. Do wirehaired dogs shed their hair? Yes, a little...VERY little. I've only owned 6 different breeds of gun dog in my time and they all shed. The Griffs shed much, much, much less than the other breeds I've had. No disrespect intended, sir, but that's not marketing. The few canine breeds that have actual hair like the WPG or the Bichon Frise simply don't shed much.

Fur and hair are the same thing, just different words. We use fur to describe thick, short, soft coats, like rabbits or wolves, and hair for longer thinner coats like humans, or apes. At the end of the day, all mammals have hair and all mammals shed it. How long the hair grows and how much it sheds varies from species to species. Saying a WPG has hair instead of fur so it doesn't shed as much is a complete marketing ploy. However, I would agree that the wirehaired breeds shed much less than the short and long haired breeds. If shedding is an issue for you, get a wirehair.

[ezzy333]

The main reason wirehairs shed less is they are stripped when groomed. Never groom them and they shed like all animals. We all lose most of our hair over any given year and the same with other animals as well. There is a difference in timing as some shed their coat gradually, while some molt and lose practically all of it once or twice a year in a very short time frame. Same is true of all birds. Timing is often controlled by heat and light.

Ezzy

[troutbum13]

All I can tell you is that my WPG sheds far far less than my DD (GWP with a better accent). Despite both having wirehair and getting the same grooming treatment

[SwitchGrassWPG]

1. Does the WPG really not shed or shed very little? This is important in our house.
Yes, Griffons shed. Some more than others. They don't have seasonal shedding like some breeds, but shed year-round. If you keep them combed and brushed, you don't have quite as much clean up to do around the house.

2. My hunting is 95% grouse and a very occasional quail hunt. How does the WPG perform with grouse?
Can't comment on grouse, but they do well on quail.

3. My Llewellin was a great pointing dog. Find the bird and point like a statue. Is the WPG truly a pointing dog?
Yes, they are truly a pointing dog...afterall, it is in their name. The only difference between a setter and a Griffon when it comes to pointing is aestethics.

4. How calm indoor can one expect these dogs to be? Are they a good house dog?
Mine seem to have a switch that turns on in the field and off in the house. I currently have fie that live in the house. They make a good indoor family member.

5. I know this sounds like a silly question, but how easy are these dogs to house train (potty train)?
Some can be easy; some can be stubborn.

6. Can you recommend a reputable breeder and what kind of ball park cost would one expect to pay for a WPG?
You can expect to pay anywhere from $650 - $2,000 or more for a puppy. I've known of them going for upwards of $3,000.

Jay

[Winglish]

This is a very old thread that got resurrected.

Saying a WPG has hair instead of fur so it doesn't shed as much is a complete marketing ploy.

If you want to get technical about it a porcupine quill is hair, genetically. Would you not agree that what comes out of a porcupine is very different than what is on your chest? Never mind, that could be a dangerous question...

The point is that WPG's have a very different hair from what other dogs have. Frankly, your fingernails are made of the same material as what is on your head, genetically speaking. Do people go around complaining that their fingernails are falling off? Some types of hair simply do not actively shed.

The main reason wirehairs shed less is they are stripped when groomed. Never groom them and they shed like all animals.

The Griff does not blow its coat. The hairs will eventually die and turn orange instead of brown, but they remain in place on the dog until the dog is stripped. The WPG coat should not be compared to the GWP or DD coat, which tends to shed much more than the Griff in my experience. Yes, some hairs will fall out.

[nhachman]

Can anyone recommend a WPG breeder in Missouri or Kansas? Might also be interested in a lightly started dog. PM please.

[SwitchGrassWPG]

Check out Aux Lake Kennel in Belvue, Kansas.

[bluestemkennels]

"2. My hunting is 95% grouse and a very occasional quail hunt. How does the WPG perform with grouse?"

Sharptails and snipe are as close as I come to ruffed grouse and woodcock, but I have no complaints with how my griffs handle either.

There is a large group of griff breeders/enthusiasts in the WI/MI part of the country that hunt ruffed grouse and woodcock. There is also a griff contingent in the Northest and Canada that use them for forrest fowl. By all reports they are quite happy with the close working nature of griffs.

Bluestem

[Cactus]

Check out Aux Lake Kennel in Belvue, Kansas.

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