i got hosed!

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birddog1968
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Re: i got hosed!

Post by birddog1968 » Sat Jan 15, 2011 6:56 pm

That's pretty crappy.......Pm sent.
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kensfishing
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Re: i got hosed!

Post by kensfishing » Sat Jan 15, 2011 7:06 pm

tcjack wrote:well as many of you no ive been pretty pumped to get my hta pup. i received him about a month ago and as happy as i was i was a bit disapointed to see he had a severe underbite and a umbilica hernia. i called the breeder and he told me not to worry about it it wont effect him. well i figured thats my luck but not a crisis, well that was about 3 weeks ago, now my pup has developed a severe case of cherry eye. i called the breeder this mourning to see what he had to say and he called me a liar, cussed me out, and then hung up on me. the the problem is i have a 5 month pup that i really like, that needs over a 1000 in sugery. i paid 500 for the pup plus spent money getting it home, i guess i expected to get a healthy pup or atleast have a breeder to stand behind his animals. i really dont have the money to get these things fixed so im kinda at a cross roads. any advice would be appreciated!
A hernia is nothing to be concerned about, unless it's severe. I've got a Ricky daughter that had one as a pup and now you don't know it there. As far as the Cherry Eye you can treat that with seroids (sp). It doesn't have to be surgery. Most of the time Cherry Eye is from something or cold in the tear duct.

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prairiefirepointers
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Re: i got hosed!

Post by prairiefirepointers » Sat Jan 15, 2011 7:15 pm

kensfishing wrote:A hernia is nothing to be concerned about, unless it's severe. I've got a Ricky daughter that had one as a pup and now you don't know it there. As far as the Cherry Eye you can treat that with seroids (sp). It doesn't have to be surgery. Most of the time Cherry Eye is from something or cold in the tear duct.
Agreed to a degree. An UH can go forever and be of no concern at all. However if it gets larger it can loop inside and catch part of the intestine and then its bad news. At least that's the explanation I got. ALL our dogs are sent with a "puppy packet" which includes all the health clearances, disclaimers, general info, Medical tri-fold, ect.

We paid a claim on a pup for an UH because it was a 50/50 chance it would need surgery to correct. Instead of having the client take the dog for a second opinion, I just waived that and paid half the claim, and they paid the other half. Everyone was happy.

Whats this yuck not sell pups with a health gaurentee or what? :|

Hope it works out.
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Re: i got hosed!

Post by Wildweeds » Sat Jan 15, 2011 7:23 pm

Whoa.................1000 bucks in surgery,Is that including fixing the hernia? Sounds really steep to me kinda like almost like your vet and the breeder is kissing cousins, I'd be nasty about it and throw that breeder under the wheels of the bus.Between the bite the hernia and the cherry eye what you ended up with genetically should be neutered.In the olden days it would have been throwed in a hole but liberals these days can't understand the concept.

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Re: i got hosed!

Post by ymepointer » Sat Jan 15, 2011 7:39 pm

Well that is a tough break sorry to hear about your loss, I remember seeing a litter of pups that all had cherry eye years ago...The breeder was a vet and he had a male pup that was a world beater at 3 months old but that Cherry eye kept me from buying him. I probably made a mistake not doing it cuz I have not seen a pup with that much natural abillity for sale since. I hear it only takes a sucture in each eyelid to take care of Cherry eye( basically a ligiment that holds the tear gland is to long or broken)
How old was your pup when you got her? I know teeth can look good up until the adult set come in and then go off. I had that happen with a pups I have bought and with pups I have sold so I don't guarantee teeth, but I would definately guarantte for other health defects and either discount or take the pup back.
I gave a really nice male pup to a friend and it was perfect when he left, and he developed a undershot bite(uppers behind lowers) when his adult teeth came in. I also offered a nice female to a fellow at a discount thinking she was perfect but discovered her bite had gone off too, when her adult teeth came in so I emailed him and told him I would knock off another 50 dollars for the teeth if still wanted her.

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Re: i got hosed!

Post by tommyboy72 » Sat Jan 15, 2011 7:42 pm

It is sad even on a site like this that you can sing someones praises when you are done right but if you are screwed you are given the gag order, kinda like the government huh. :roll: Ridiculous in my opinion. If you are done wrong by a breeder then this should be exactly the place to voice your concerns, opinions and experiences. That is why guys like me come here. I don't mean for the drama but if a breeder is acting in a manner that is subpar, to be polite, then it should be taken care of in house and by in house I mean within a circle of his peers and clients or potential clients like us. The breeder on the other hand should have the opportunity to also give his side of the story as well. I would not want to deal with a situation like this and would rather avoid the chance of it by talking to someone in advance who has dealt with the breeder before. Perhaps that would be a nice new forum area. Rate a breeder or kennel so that newbies and those in the market for a pup could get a rating in advance before buying.

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Re: i got hosed!

Post by PntrRookie » Sat Jan 15, 2011 7:56 pm

Totally agree tommyboy. tcjack...I would be pi$$ed! Nice thing about the internet is it is a great resource for cross referencing http://www.gundogbreeders.com/forum/gen ... t1139.html

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Re: i got hosed!

Post by dudleysmith » Sat Jan 15, 2011 8:08 pm

why is breeder responsible for cherry eye?? just something that happens, simple fix, you can have it done for $100 or less.

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prairiefirepointers
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Re: i got hosed!

Post by prairiefirepointers » Sat Jan 15, 2011 8:20 pm

dudleysmith wrote:why is breeder responsible for cherry eye?? just something that happens, simple fix, you can have it done for $100 or less.
Be careful doing so. He sounds like an jackarse. He might be the kind to sue YOU.

I'd be hiring me an attorney or at least talking to the district atty in his area.

Good luck.
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Re: i got hosed!

Post by bossman » Sat Jan 15, 2011 8:32 pm

I can certainly understand your frustation. But I'm a little confused. Why did you buy a pup from this breeder in the first place?. Are you familiar with them? Did you have referances on them or know them by reputation? How far away is the breeder from you, if you couldn't go look at the litter, did you get pictures? I think when buying a pup, both the seller and buyer have responsibilities...for the benefit of the pup...Just my opinion..... Good luck

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Re: i got hosed!

Post by prairiefirepointers » Sat Jan 15, 2011 8:36 pm

My guess is this is gona be chalked up as a lesson learned. We all know that.

Lets not turn this around on him. Even un-intentionally. We've all been taken one way or another. :oops:

Seriously tho.. Check with the DA office in his or your area. Maybe they'll listen.
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Re: i got hosed!

Post by Vonzeppelinkennels » Sat Jan 15, 2011 8:53 pm

Tc the bite could correct itself in time,probably not likely but it does happen.
I had a male I didn't reg because of an underbite after the adult teeth came in gave him away at 1 1/2 yr old.
When the guy came to pick him up I opened his mouth to show him why I was giving him away & liked to ---- my pants when his bite was perfect.
I have no idea when it corrected but can tell you the dog was over a yr old when I quit looking.I doubt that is the norm but it does happen.

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Re: i got hosed!

Post by Vonzeppelinkennels » Sat Jan 15, 2011 9:01 pm

I agree those need to be taken care of & I guess there are cheaper ways then I mentioned but most times you get what you pay for.I have seen some of those cheaper remedies & not always pretty.

Good Luck!!

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Re: i got hosed!

Post by Cajun Casey » Sat Jan 15, 2011 9:10 pm

I think it might be a good idea if you pretended you didn't know anything was wrong, got some pet insurance, rode out the waiting period and got the defects taken care of. You can keep the eye cleaned and moist with isotonic eyewash and the hernia shouldn't be an issue if it's just an opaque "outie" at this stage. I have a Pekingese that had an umbilical hernia that was fixed when I had her spayed. The vet went through the navel to spay her and repaired the hernia on the way out. Can't tell she ever had an incision, let alone a hernia. You can do your best to strengthen the pup's jaws and correct the bite by providing her with plenty of things to chew on, but an underbite usually indicates a deformity in the maxial structure, so it often won't correct the way an overbite will.

It's a shame what happened, both for you and the pup. But, unless you and the buyer live in states with puppy lemon laws, little can be done. Caveat emptor.
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Re: i got hosed!

Post by Ryman Gun Dog » Sat Jan 15, 2011 10:15 pm

tcjack,
You have just experienced why my business only deals with certain breeders. We recommend certain breeders to our clients, if they choose to purchase the animal
from a different breeder, we let that breeder train their Grouse dog. We charge nothing for our recommendation and take no part of the money payed to the breeder
from the client. The only money we make is by actually training the client & his companion Grouse dog. Sorry you got hosed, your experience was a costly one.

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Re: i got hosed!

Post by snips » Sat Jan 15, 2011 10:40 pm

Thats very sad that a breeder be like that. It seems sometimes when a dog has 1 genetic defect, they can have more..Do not know why. This person should give your money back...Period....Would help in vet bills too!
brenda

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Re: i got hosed!

Post by ezzy333 » Sat Jan 15, 2011 10:49 pm

snips wrote:Thats very sad that a breeder be like that. It seems sometimes when a dog has 1 genetic defect, they can have more..Do not know why. This person should give your money back...Period....Would help in vet bills too!
Absolutely right but this is also a product of what happens when we breed strictly performance with no concern or worse complete disdain for a breed standard. I have always and always will look at the breed standard first as to general characteristics of the breed and then if they qualify will breed the best performance dogs you can find. They do not have to be show dogs but they have to have the correct size, color, and physical qualities if I am going to spend money trying to put any title on them. And those that don't make the cut physically go to homes as a pet or hunting dog or whatever you want to do with them except breed them.

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Re: i got hosed!

Post by Brushbustin Sporting Dogs » Sat Jan 15, 2011 10:50 pm

Ryman what does that picture have to do with the problem at hand??
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Re: i got hosed!

Post by rkappes » Sun Jan 16, 2011 7:10 am

I think the most frustrating thing is that the breeder is acting like a butt. The guy could at least act professional and work something out with you. Not sure how someone like this stays in business. Ditto tommyboy!

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Re: i got hosed!

Post by DougB » Sun Jan 16, 2011 9:33 am

What does your contract say about condition and health guarantees? No contract, it's your word against his.
Two ways to take care of cherry eye-the cheap way and the right way. Maybe talk to a couple of vets to check price.
A hernia can be nothing, or can strangulate. Check with your vet.
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Re: i got hosed!

Post by JKP » Sun Jan 16, 2011 9:34 am

I know so many breeders that agonize over their breeding decisions and the pups they sell...all that I have dealt with have been serious devoted people. We reveal everything we have observed about a pup, physical and mental, to all buyers. Much of what a pup will become is determined by the "hands" they go to but we call it as we see it at 8 weeks. Our policy has been the same for 30 years...any genetic physical defect or genetic condition that requires maintenance treatment.... that prevents the dog from being a full blown working dog, we either make it right at our expense or we buy the dog back...liability is limited to the price paid. It is IMPOSSIBLE to breed perfect dogs...if you breed dogs long enough, you WILL have a pup with a genetic issue. I have always thought that its what you do at that point that reveals where your interest really lies.

As a small breeder, I lose money breeding dogs...all I can do is hope to minimize the cost of my passion for these dogs.

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Re: i got hosed!

Post by AzDoggin » Sun Jan 16, 2011 9:47 am

JKP wrote:I know so many breeders that agonize over their breeding decisions and the pups they sell...all that I have dealt with have been serious devoted people. We reveal everything we have observed about a pup, physical and mental, to all buyers. Much of what a pup will become is determined by the "hands" they go to but we call it as we see it at 8 weeks. Our policy has been the same for 30 years...any genetic physical defect or genetic condition that requires maintenance treatment.... that prevents the dog from being a full blown working dog, we either make it right at our expense or we buy the dog back...liability is limited to the price paid. It is IMPOSSIBLE to breed perfect dogs...if you breed dogs long enough, you WILL have a pup with a genetic issue. I have always thought that its what you do at that point that reveals where your interest really lies.

As a small breeder, I lose money breeding dogs...all I can do is hope to minimize the cost of my passion for these dogs.
Very good information, JKP. All you can do is represent what you know. The limitation of "purchase price" makes complete sense. I have heard from others that being a dog breeder is not a way to get rich - quite the contrary.

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Re: i got hosed!

Post by smokinsam » Sun Jan 16, 2011 11:08 am

that suck's!
It's a "bleep" shame when folk's do this type of stuff.
That's a breeder that won't be around long.word of mouth is very powereful even more so when it's bad.IMHO
you are prolly not the first person with a bad expierience with this "breeder".that pup should of never left his place until the issues were resolved.
good luck.pm sent.

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Re: i got hosed!

Post by tommyboy72 » Sun Jan 16, 2011 11:27 am

I am not a breeder just a hunter who has bred a couple of litters and has by far given away more dogs than I will ever sell but I even tell people if the dog won't make you a hunting dog or doesn't turn out how you want I will take the dog back and give you another dog out of the same litter or find you another dog from one of the kennel owners I know. I have never had anyone ask me for another dog, never had anyone return a dog, everyone has always been happy with their pups. As a business owner and breeder this person disturbs me since he should make it his business to make his customers happy. I believe in the dog world that most successful marketing and advertisement is done by word of mouth. You can advertise on the net but so does everyone else, you can run trials but chances are there are people out there winning as much or more than you, you can run adds in the paper but then you look like a backyard small time breeder. When it comes down to it all you have is word of mouth with people bragging on your dogs and people complimenting you on the transaction or experience they had with you. I believe all experiences should be related so that an educated decision can be made on whether to use this breeder, good and bad.

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Re: i got hosed!

Post by ezzy333 » Sun Jan 16, 2011 11:38 am

tommyboy72 wrote:I am not a breeder just a hunter who has bred a couple of litters and has by far given away more dogs than I will ever sell but I even tell people if the dog won't make you a hunting dog or doesn't turn out how you want I will take the dog back and give you another dog out of the same litter or find you another dog from one of the kennel owners I know. I have never had anyone ask me for another dog, never had anyone return a dog, everyone has always been happy with their pups. As a business owner and breeder this person disturbs me since he should make it his business to make his customers happy. I believe in the dog world that most successful marketing and advertisement is done by word of mouth. You can advertise on the net but so does everyone else, you can run trials but chances are there are people out there winning as much or more than you, you can run adds in the paper but then you look like a backyard small time breeder. When it comes down to it all you have is word of mouth with people bragging on your dogs and people complimenting you on the transaction or experience they had with you. I believe all experiences should be related so that an educated decision can be made on whether to use this breeder, good and bad.
We all feel the same way about a bad experience like this and I wish we could post here on the board. Would be no more than fair. On the other hand, and we have had it happen here on this very board where someone made up the whole sordid scenario about being cheated and it was all because of some completely different event that made the poster mad and he was trying to get even. All it takes Tommy is for me to get mad at you and I can smear you, your dogs, and everything about you. And that sure isn't fair. So all we can do as a board is be as fair and neutral as we can be and let you or anybody else who has a bad experience handle it in private. And that can happen in this case also. Talk by private message if you want but even then remember the story you are hearing may be completely false if you don't know the people involved.

Hope that makes sense and also hope if what we have read here is accurate that this breeder get to reap his just reward.

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Re: i got hosed!

Post by Ron R » Sun Jan 16, 2011 11:50 am

Sorry that you got hosed. Would it be possible to post some pics of the problem areas (bite, eye, heria).
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Re: i got hosed!

Post by ruff- neck » Sun Jan 16, 2011 1:06 pm

TC I know of of at least three dogs in that litter that have the same problem. One the breeder kept. the other was passed on to our buddy in JD. He was told it was just an infection when the dog was delivered. Yours is the third. Sure is a shame. GRIFF

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Re: i got hosed!

Post by ElhewPointer » Mon Jan 17, 2011 9:46 am

Its to bad this forum has to be so "PC". Now, since we can't find out the breeder, someone else might get stuck with the same problem.

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Re: i got hosed!

Post by prairiefirepointers » Mon Jan 17, 2011 11:25 am

You don't have to be a rocket scientist to send a PM. I am sure the OP would gladly share with anyone who wants to know.

However, I feel that if you cannot openly discuss a breeder/kennel in a unflattering fashion, then you should not be able to discuss breeders/kennels at all.. For whatever reason it may be. Good, bad, anything.. Period.

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Re: i got hosed!

Post by BoJack » Mon Jan 17, 2011 12:36 pm

PM the breeder's name to anyone that wants to know here,(no board control there).I did exactly that a year ago after 6 mos of phone calls and e-mails to them that they ignored.I Posted - Breeder to stay away from in _______(State).Then after getting numerous PM's inquiring who the breeder was I told them.After an aquaintence of theirs told the breeder what was going on I got a call from them the next day- willing to rectify the problem(which they did-Then).The Power of the Internet,the best advertisemnet in the World.And bad news usually travels faster then good.This board has too much control as to what's discussed and stated here.I've exposed a couple of Shysters On the net and other boards(and was thanked by more then a few for saving them from being Hosed.One was(on Three different boards including this one))was posting as his Mother(Linda) and asking people if they could giver her Son a Free pup or dog,Talked to 5 different Reputable breeders who was on the verge of sending Him a pup, til I prooved to them it was a Sham.Seems like this board doesn't believe in keeping fellow bird doggers from being hosed,but I do.Take it to the Net.Have your pictures and a diagnosis from your vet that you can send to anyone who wants to know.And let the breeder know your plans.
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Re: i got hosed!

Post by ezzy333 » Mon Jan 17, 2011 1:30 pm

BoJack wrote:PM the breeder's name to anyone that wants to know here,(no board control there).I did exactly that a year ago after 6 mos of phone calls and e-mails to them that they ignored.I Posted - Breeder to stay away from in _______(State).Then after getting numerous PM's inquiring who the breeder was I told them.After an aquaintence of theirs told the breeder what was going on I got a call from them the next day- willing to rectify the problem(which they did-Then).The Power of the Internet,the best advertisemnet in the World.And bad news usually travels faster then good.This board has too much control as to what's discussed and stated here.I've exposed a couple of Shysters On the net and other boards(and was thanked by more then a few for saving them from being Hosed.One was(on Three different boards including this one))was posting as his Mother(Linda) and asking people if they could giver her Son a Free pup or dog,Talked to 5 different Reputable breeders who was on the verge of sending Him a pup, til I prooved to them it was a Sham.Seems like this board doesn't believe in keeping fellow bird doggers from being hosed,but I do.Take it to the Net.Have your pictures and a diagnosis from your vet that you can send to anyone who wants to know.And let the breeder know your plans.
That is exactly the way to do it and you keep yourself and any other party from a potential liability suit. Don't think any of us need that. Spread the word and keep everyone out of trouble.

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Re: i got hosed!

Post by ACooper » Mon Jan 17, 2011 1:35 pm

ElhewPointer wrote:Its to bad this forum has to be so "PC". Now, since we can't find out the breeder, someone else might get stuck with the same problem.
It wouldnt be a shame if you were the breeder. :roll:

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Re: i got hosed!

Post by Vonzeppelinkennels » Mon Jan 17, 2011 1:42 pm

If you breed and sell very many pups or dogs I will bet sooner or later you will sell to some one that is unsatisfied about something.I'm not trying to excuse breeders like Tcjack has mentioned above but there are buyers that sometimes turn out to be just as bad. :D

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Re: i got hosed!

Post by ezzy333 » Mon Jan 17, 2011 1:47 pm

Vonzeppelinkennels wrote:If you breed and sell very many pups or dogs I will bet sooner or later you will sell to some one that is unsatisfied about something.I'm not trying to excuse breeders like Tcjack has mentioned above but there are buyers that sometimes turn out to be just as bad. :D
Exactly right ans as I said before it happened here on this board. And it could be happening to ny one of you .

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Re: i got hosed!

Post by scott townsend » Mon Jan 17, 2011 7:31 pm

ezzy333 wrote:
Vonzeppelinkennels wrote:If you breed and sell very many pups or dogs I will bet sooner or later you will sell to some one that is unsatisfied about something.I'm not trying to excuse breeders like Tcjack has mentioned above but there are buyers that sometimes turn out to be just as bad. :D
Exactly right ans as I said before it happened here on this board. And it could be happening to ny one of you .

Ezzy
I have had just that happen to me right here on this board by a member that is pretty regular here. There is nothing stopping anyone from posting a blatant bald faced lie if they choose to. The sad part is the damage is done as soon as it is posted. I was accused of a wrong doing in a dog deal that I had absolutely nothing to do with. I have no idea how long the thread went on before someone told me it was on here. I am not a frequent visitor to this site, so it went on for sometime before I found out about it and quickly proved the individual wrong. But like I said the damage was done as soon as it was posted.
I can totally relate to why someone should not be able to post that type of stuff at all on here.
Last edited by scott townsend on Tue Jan 18, 2011 9:58 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: i got hosed!

Post by BoJack » Mon Jan 17, 2011 8:02 pm

"can totally relate to why someone should not be able to post that type of stuff at all on here"

And why not if they have Documanted Proof of the problem and the breeder Ignores any attemps of taking care of the problem? May clean up some bad breeders ways of doing bad business.
In your case when you proved the auccusations wrong about you did you post to that on here? If so then that should've rectified any negative outlook on you.And What liablity is there in making statements that you have documentation to back it up? I call that Exposure .If the shoe was on the other foot and You got Hosed,would your opinion be the same?
I can see your point in Your situation,But as many know that's not Always the case either.
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Re: i got hosed!

Post by ezzy333 » Mon Jan 17, 2011 9:01 pm

BoJack wrote:"can totally relate to why someone should not be able to post that type of stuff at all on here"

And why not if they have Documanted Proof of the problem and the breeder Ignores any attemps of taking care of the problem? May clean up some bad breeders ways of doing bad business.
In your case when you proved the auccusations wrong about you did you post to that on here? If so then that should've rectified any negative outlook on you.And What liablity is there in making statements that you have documentation to back it up? I call that Exposure .If the shoe was on the other foot and You got Hosed,would your opinion be the same?
I can see your point in Your situation,But as many know that's not Always the case either.

You hit on the problem Bojack, there never is any documentation on the net. It is all just what anyone wants to post. How do you document something you want to post? Just like now you are being critical of what we have to do here even though a lawyer has said how to handle these type of things. But I can't document it so we continue to get criticized.

The same can happen to you, and we are trying our hardest to keep it from doing just that. And it seems sometimes the people you are trying to save are the ones that want to run right back into the fire.

Ezzy

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It's not how many breaths you have taken but how many times it has been taken away!

Has anyone noticed common sense isn't very common anymore.

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Re: i got hosed!

Post by BoJack » Mon Jan 17, 2011 10:07 pm

I guess we can just try and do what we can do.There will always be some sheep walking towards the wolves,without any shepherds on the hill.
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Re: i got hosed!

Post by Sharon » Tue Jan 18, 2011 12:16 am

You can have all the contracts and promises you want but in the end it is the integrity of the breeder that will make the difference.

I just had a friend buy a pup from a guy. The next day he found out his wife was dying from breast cancer. The last thing he needed was a pup around. He called the breeder to see if he could return the pup - no refund expected . The breeder said no. No I know i would have taken the pup back and given the refund.

PS (previous post) " I think it might be a good idea if you pretended you didn't know anything was wrong, got some pet insurance, rode out the waiting period and got the defects taken care of." quote

That is not what I call integrity.
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Re: i got hosed!

Post by BoJack » Tue Jan 18, 2011 1:27 am

Sharon,
The World's full of all kinds isn't it? I wonder what that guy would've thought if the shoe was on the other foot? What a jerk.
And it sounds like some are even capable of Insurance Fraud.I'm glad that the biggest percentage of dog people I Know and respect do have Integrity.The rest I always keep at an Arm's length.
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Re: i got hosed!

Post by rkappes » Tue Jan 18, 2011 6:48 am

Don't know much about the dog breeding business. I'm assuming that with like any type of business your going to have those clients who are just unsatisfied no matter what the situation but I believe its how you handle it as an individual that shows what type of person you are. I have clients that are always tough, I could give them a million bucks and they would want two million, its just the way it is. But I never avoid them. If we have a problem we communicate and figure something out. I'd be very upset if the breeder wouldn't at least talk about things. I think thats very unprofessional. I would hope if I were thinking about getting a puppy from this breeder that someone would give me a heads up about them so that I wasn't in the same situation.

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Re: i got hosed!

Post by Greg Jennings » Tue Jan 18, 2011 8:31 am

ElhewPointer wrote:Its to bad this forum has to be so "PC". Now, since we can't find out the breeder, someone else might get stuck with the same problem.
If you want to sign a contract and post a bond to cover legal bills from lawsuits generated by public postings here impacting small breeders, we'll be thrilled to change the policy. It'd be less headache for all of us. Where do I send the paperwork?

Joshing aside, there is absolutely no policy that keeps people from corresponding about this via email or PM. Have at it. When you do, you're speaking in the first person and assuming all liability.

Some History:

I've been moderating here since the beginning. I've seen 1. People getting screwed by breeders, 2. Misunderstandings, and 3. Buyers trying to screw small breeders. Probably the bulk are misunderstandings. (See note at the end about his particular case)

In one case that comes to mind, a buyer that had a question about a pup that "wasn't acting right" got on here and absolutely trashed a well-known, *highly* respected small breeder because they hadn't answered email or the phone in three days. After a lot of trash talking by the buyer, and a lot of people jumping in and saying how terrible the breeder was, etc., it turned out that the breeder was away for a few days hunting in rural Montana (this was before cell phones and coverage are as common as they are today) and the pup had a stomach ache. No matter how innocent, the small breeder's business suffered for a while.

Now, I'm not saying that any of that pertains to this situation. I'm just explaining why GDF has a policy that keeps it from getting in the middle.

I sure would want that breeder to talk. Nothing gets resolved without talking about the issue.

FWIW, Greg J.

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Re: i got hosed!

Post by Cajun Casey » Tue Jan 18, 2011 9:17 pm

Sharon wrote:You can have all the contracts and promises you want but in the end it is the integrity of the breeder that will make the difference.

I just had a friend buy a pup from a guy. The next day he found out his wife was dying from breast cancer. The last thing he needed was a pup around. He called the breeder to see if he could return the pup - no refund expected . The breeder said no. No I know i would have taken the pup back and given the refund.

PS (previous post) " I think it might be a good idea if you pretended you didn't know anything was wrong, got some pet insurance, rode out the waiting period and got the defects taken care of." quote

That is not what I call integrity.
The pup's defects aren't critical. The owner might appreciate the coverage when the pup, which is obviously compromised structurally, blows an elbow, shreds a CCL, or needs cancer treatment later on.
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Re: i got hosed!

Post by ezzy333 » Tue Jan 18, 2011 9:19 pm

Cajun Casey wrote:
Sharon wrote:You can have all the contracts and promises you want but in the end it is the integrity of the breeder that will make the difference.

I just had a friend buy a pup from a guy. The next day he found out his wife was dying from breast cancer. The last thing he needed was a pup around. He called the breeder to see if he could return the pup - no refund expected . The breeder said no. No I know i would have taken the pup back and given the refund.

PS (previous post) " I think it might be a good idea if you pretended you didn't know anything was wrong, got some pet insurance, rode out the waiting period and got the defects taken care of." quote

That is not what I call integrity.
The pup's defects aren't critical. The owner might appreciate the coverage when the pup, which is obviously compromised structurally, blows an elbow, shreds a CCL, or needs cancer treatment later on.
The contracts can't be enforced so why have one.

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http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=144
http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=207

It's not how many breaths you have taken but how many times it has been taken away!

Has anyone noticed common sense isn't very common anymore.

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Re: i got hosed!

Post by birddog1968 » Tue Jan 18, 2011 11:23 pm

Cajun Casey wrote: The pup's defects aren't critical. The owner might appreciate the coverage when the pup, which is obviously compromised structurally, blows an elbow, shreds a CCL, or needs cancer treatment later on.
How do we get from cherry eye and an umbilical hernia to all that ?
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Re: i got hosed!

Post by Cajun Casey » Tue Jan 18, 2011 11:40 pm

birddog1968 wrote:
Cajun Casey wrote: The pup's defects aren't critical. The owner might appreciate the coverage when the pup, which is obviously compromised structurally, blows an elbow, shreds a CCL, or needs cancer treatment later on.
How do we get from cherry eye and an umbilical hernia to all that ?
Depends on the breeding. The underbite is a factor, also, in structural integrity.
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Re: i got hosed!

Post by birddog1968 » Wed Jan 19, 2011 12:04 am

Never known a bad bite to mean a dog is structurally not sound and will blow knees and acl's.......Ive had bad bites and the dogs where built like brick $@*$houses. 30 mile a day dogs.
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Re: i got hosed!

Post by bossman » Wed Jan 19, 2011 6:26 am

We'll, we are going into the 4th day (I think) of this issue. Would like an update on the pups health and what you are doing with the pup..thanks

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Re: i got hosed!

Post by snips » Wed Jan 19, 2011 8:28 am

Well, this pup has already 3 things that I consider to be genetie...Guess that cab be debated too, but this is MO. When this occurs the dog can possibly be plagued with issues all his life...
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Re: i got hosed!

Post by DougB » Wed Jan 19, 2011 8:48 am


The contracts can't be enforced so why have one.

Ezzy


It takes effort to enforce a contract. Small claims court, maybe a lawyer. It may not be worth the effort to enforce the contract, but the contract at least tells you what the dog is supposed to be, what the seller promises to do if there is a problem. If I were working with a stranger, as either the buyer or seller, I would prefer the agreement be in ink on paper just to avoid confusion. There are a lot of things I don't know, but I am fairly sure that when things go to court, written documents trump a handshake every time.

You hit on the problem Bojack, there never is any documentation on the net.

The contract is your documentation, along with vet reports, photos, reports from quality breeders.

Does the original posters state have a puppy lemon law. MN does, and would give some recourse even with out a contract. Some states have laws that effect hobby breeders and apply to any sale of pups or even cats.
http://www.malteseonly.com/lemon.html lists some states puppy lemon laws.
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