Westminster - Sporting Group

Vonzeppelinkennels · Post by **Vonzeppelinkennels** » Wed Feb 16, 2011 4:13 pm

You are correct no ticking or body patches other then the one that goes across her rear & slightly up her back something like a 3 leaf clover.This dog has unbelieveable conformation though in the show ring would probably be considered small but well within the standard.I haven't seen her since she was a little over a yr but my guess is around 45 lbs.

Post by **kninebirddog** » Wed Feb 16, 2011 4:14 pm

The brittany was there. Tucker didn't make the first cut of dog to be considered for a second look and go around.

wems2371 · Post by **wems2371** » Wed Feb 16, 2011 4:26 pm

Cajun Casey wrote:When I see a clear white in the GSP Ring at The Garden, I may believe that everyone is working together. Until then, it is sour grapes as usual, IMO.

Dog showing is pretty much like anything else in that, you can't win without entering, and you can't change what you don't like without participating. And just because you enter, doesn't mean you should win.

In showing this year, I have seen zero "clear" white shorthairs entered. I'd enjoy seeing some pics though of any that have been entered into the ring and been "ripped" off.

Cajun Casey · Post by **Cajun Casey** » Wed Feb 16, 2011 4:51 pm

Is "clear" white different from clear white? The color is recessive and has always been part of the breed, Many solid livers, actually marked in the Irish pattern are clear white carriers. Esser's Chick is a good example.

wems2371 · Post by **wems2371** » Wed Feb 16, 2011 4:58 pm

I was using your term, hence the quotes. Let me remove them for you, so the meaning of my post is not lost. :roll:

Dog showing is pretty much like anything else in that, you can't win without entering, and you can't change what you don't like without participating. And just because you enter, doesn't mean you should win.

In showing this year, I have seen zero clear white shorthairs entered. I'd enjoy seeing some pics though of any that have been entered into the ring and been ripped off.

Vonzeppelinkennels · Post by **Vonzeppelinkennels** » Wed Feb 16, 2011 5:29 pm

The odd thing about Kay Dee the pic of the clear white female I posted,out of 9 pups & as white as she is she had the heaviest,thickest coat of all the litter.I have had GSPS with longer coats but none as thick.You could actually dig you fingers into it to get to the flesh & it was slick as silk.The other pups were all patched & ticked with clear white behind.One female just ticked with pretty much solid head.

Wems I have been to several hundred dogs shows but never showed GSPS,if you have been to many you learn which judges like the type,color,etc you show & which don't so you don't waste your entry fees on those judges.There are some judges that will put up white & Brenda (Snips) can atest to that but not alot.As some of the older judges retire & new come onboard you will see more.

snips · Post by **snips** » Wed Feb 16, 2011 6:54 pm

Clear white????

snips · Post by **snips** » Wed Feb 16, 2011 6:56 pm

I guess clear white is no ticks???

wems2371 · Post by **wems2371** » Wed Feb 16, 2011 7:01 pm

That is what I took it to be Brenda, from VZ's post/pic...no ticking. I'd never heard of it otherwise. Thought it was white & patched or ticked & patched. Obviously I didn't forget showing with Sam Man!

VZ, I respect your opinion and agree, but I think to change that mindset you have to have more entered to represent. I don't think you can change the status quo by 1 out of 30 (and I'd be curious to know that #) shown dogs being white. Is that right? No, but I think you have to overcome being the minority in the ring. I also think folks have to be open to the fact, that they might not have had the best dog in the ring, white or otherwise. Hopefully like you said, the tide will change. Maybe it's just my neck of the woods, but I think folks would be surprised, about some of my competitors too. They are not all purely show bred dogs with the complimentary JH.

Vonzeppelinkennels · Post by **Vonzeppelinkennels** » Wed Feb 16, 2011 7:07 pm

Clear White to me is no or very little ticking,but a few yrs ago GSPS with very much white behind the ticking or even white with patches had a hard time in the show ring.I t is improving with younger judges taking over for the judges retiring.I showed Dobes back in the late 70's & very early 80's & there was & still is colors favored by the judges.Just the way it is,I know this will not set well with some but in most cases I believe a whiter dog whether clear,patched,or ticked,has to be a little better then the liver roan dogs to win under most judges.
In the Dobe ring Black over RED,Red over Blue,& Blue over Fawn.

JMO

Just an after thought,the Solid LVRS don't do aswell as the Lvr Roans either but better then the whiter dogs.

Vonzeppelinkennels · Post by **Vonzeppelinkennels** » Wed Feb 16, 2011 7:48 pm

Brenda actually I would say Sam Man is clear white behind the ticking meaning that he is not so heavily ticked that it looks gray.Regardless of how you want to describe his color he is a VERY NICE DOG!!!! My avatar dog Star has clear white behind her patches & some slight ticking that don't even show up in most pics.Like most things in the standards of all dogs it's subjective that's why the same dogs do not win under every judge.One judge sees one thing another judge sees something else.That's why I say if you go to enough shows you learn which judges like what & only spend your entry fees there.

Dobes were & probably still are one of the most competitive breeds in the show ring,even the best of dogs ALMOST always took a pro handler to finish them.
GSPS atleast when we were showing,alot were finished by amateur owners or breeders.

fuzznut · Post by **fuzznut** » Wed Feb 16, 2011 7:54 pm

Something to keep in mind... anything different is... well different! A white GSP in a ring full of ticked dogs is going to stick out like a sore thumb. Any flaw, any problem is going to be right out there and extremely obvious and hard to over look. No different for a solid liver. They are different... and they have to be good to get past the "norm".

Now to relate this to the field... let's face it... if you are running in a stake with 30 GSP's and you have the only Vizsla.. that Vizsla has to be a wonder dog to get piece of it, much less win.

Take your good white dogs/solid liver dogs out there and they will do their share of taking home the ribbons. I always hear that some judges won't use white, or liver, or heavily patched, or, or, or...

As a Wire owner I hear it all the time that judges wouldn't put up a good short wire coat because they can't be floofed and poofed. I don't buy that either. A good short hard wire coat is only one piece of the dog... if that coat is on a dog that can't walk, is cow hocked with yellow eyes.....

One reason to show your dogs is to allow others in your breed to see them. Let them see nice, well put together field dogs. We know they are out there...Fuzz

Vonzeppelinkennels · Post by **Vonzeppelinkennels** » Wed Feb 16, 2011 8:14 pm

Back when I was showing Dobes the top GSP in the country was CH. Gretchenhof Columbia River,a Gorgeous beautiful moving dog that was pushing the limit on height in my estimation if not over.
He was also a true SHOWDOG & show people no there are show dogs & then there are SHOW DOGS!I believe he won more Best IN Shows of any GSPS at the time & still may be since I don't keep track of all that anymore.He was inducted into the GSPCA HOF in 1986 & can be seen on the GSPCA site under HOF Dogs.
At that time there was a German Shepherd named Lakesides Gilligan Island that was said to be the BEST Ger Shep ever they butted heads over Best In Shows & cost each other even more BIS awards.

Oh since this is about Westminster G C R call name Traveler was the fist GSP to ever go Best In Show at Westminster 1974.

My Dobe bitch that we showed was sired by Ch.Mikadobe's Cupid he won the Breed at Westminster in 1978 if I rember correctly.That is incorrect & I'm not sure what yr but might have been 1974 & that's why I remember the GSP BEST IN SHOW Win so well.

Post by **ezzy333** » Wed Feb 16, 2011 8:51 pm

Back when I was showing you had trouble with a liver Brit. Most GSP's were dark roan and liver, and many of the dobes were red. Few years later the liver Brits do fine. the GSp'd are mostly light roan and ticked over the whole body, and I don't know what happened to the Dobes but I know they went back to black. Point is things change over time and many times due to an outstanding dog that isn't the 'right' color.

They are called trends withint the breed. Years ago before the dogs came here from England the Irish Setters went to all red because everyone thought they were prettier than the red and white ones. That went so far as to split the dogs into different breeds and it started the Irish on the down slide in the field.

Ezzy

3Britts · Post by **3Britts** » Wed Feb 16, 2011 9:00 pm

The liver britts are doing better, but the judges still favor the orange britts, than move to the livers and finally to the tri-colors.
Maybe someday they will simply check to see if the colors are within conformation along with the body, etc, instead of bringing their own biases to the ring.

I'll tell you what is blantly unfair, Cockers getting three breed placement. I say that Britts should get three breed placements too.
1. orange
2. liver
3. tri

Cajun Casey · Post by **Cajun Casey** » Wed Feb 16, 2011 9:29 pm

snips wrote:Clear white????

Tough to be 100% from a picture, but I'd call him clear white and ticked. There doesn't appear to be any roaning on the legs, which is where it shows up if nowhere else. I would call your Rebel dog a clear white, for example.

snips · Post by **snips** » Wed Feb 16, 2011 10:42 pm

I always thought a white background, whether having ticks or patches was considered clear white...

Cajun Casey · Post by **Cajun Casey** » Thu Feb 17, 2011 12:12 am

snips wrote:I always thought a white background, whether having ticks or patches was considered clear white...

I go by the pink feet when they are born. I'd seriously have to dig out the books for the whole explanation, but I know white and roan cannot exist on the same dog.

Neil · Post by **Neil** » Thu Feb 17, 2011 12:49 am

I knew there was a Brittany, there is always a Brittany:

23 Ch Willowick Talltean
Breed: Brittany

Neil

JKP · Post by **JKP** » Thu Feb 17, 2011 7:37 am

As a Wire owner I hear it all the time that judges wouldn't put up a good short wire coat because they can't be floofed and poofed. I don't buy that either. A good short hard wire coat is only one piece of the dog... if that coat is on a dog that can't walk, is cow hocked with yellow eyes....

.

I agree in part...but a dog with enough hair to "assist" in the angles creates a better optical picture...and in many breeds hair is being used to "shape" the dog. Wirehaired breeds shouldn't be shown with feathers - if its feathered/brushed back/sprayed on chest, legs and stifles, the dog most likely has a made up coat that shouldn't be in the ring, much less rewarded with placement. The persistent winning by such dogs changes the perception of what is a proper coat over time. (BTW, I never saw a Deerhound with 'bags" of dead hair hanging from the stifle and I'm sure a working dog wouldn't have that.)

One reason to show your dogs is to allow others in your breed to see them. Let them see nice, well put together field dogs. We know they are out there...Fuzz

Can't argue with this but seldom do you see the serious working guys at dog shows and only a handful of show folks are serious in the field/water. I would guess the Britts and GSP are doing better than the rest, even though the Britt has all but disappeared as a versatile dog.

Post by **ezzy333** » Thu Feb 17, 2011 7:45 am

I see very few versatile dogs since to be one they have to be owned by a versatile guy that hunts versatile game. Not many around anymore that hunt that way or use the dogs if they do.

Ezzy

JKP · Post by **JKP** » Thu Feb 17, 2011 7:58 am

I see very few versatile dogs since to be one they have to be owned by a versatile guy that hunts versatile game. Not many around anymore that hunt that way or use the dogs if they do.

I assume you are referring to Britts...years ago, the owner of the first VC Britt was in my NAVHDA chapter...his name was Bob Owens and his little dog Rusty was a POWERHOUSE package....equal of any "big" dog I ever saw in the swamp..40 lbs of pure "tough" and no amount of muck, weeds or "lumber" could hold that dog back from tracking down a duck...hit the water like a freight train...bring you live ducks to hand. Haven't seen a Britt near that good in the water since. Ran a perfect UT on his first try and then ran a max score at the Invitational...don't think the dog was ever used more than 3-4 times...real shame. But you're right, Bob was a duck hunter too...dog grew up with it.

Post by **ezzy333** » Thu Feb 17, 2011 8:17 am

I assume you are referring to Britts

I was refering to all breeds. If you want to see one being used as a versatile you about have to go to somewhere they are doing testing. But in the real world can't remember when I last saw one.

Ezzy

ElhewPointer · Post by **ElhewPointer** » Thu Feb 17, 2011 2:00 pm

Neil wrote:
ElhewPointer wrote:If you'd stick one of those AKC show pointers in the field, it'd have a heart attack! Wouldn't have a clue what to do. A totally different animal. Hunting pointers are American Pointers, show pointers are English Pointers.
That is a myth, the winner of the AKC Pointer National was judged by a friend of mine, he won both the Open and Amateur and is now in Shawn Kinklaar's string and showing some promise on the major Shooting Dog circuit. I don't know his breeding, but I doubt he has much show dog in his background, but he is AKC registered.

I suspect if shaved down the little cocker could be trained to hunt some.

And remember as some have said, it is the breed clubs not AKC that causes the split when there is one.

Neil

Neil,

Read my post Neil. Before you hit the send button please read it. I stated that "AKC show pointers". I am well aware of that dog Neil, however he isn't a show dog.

ElhewPointer · Post by **ElhewPointer** » Thu Feb 17, 2011 2:06 pm

BDBD wrote:My avatar is of a strictly field bred Pointer I own -- small in stature, but put together reasonably well for a FDSB Pointer. Excellent temperament, and has passed health checks for heart/eyes/etc. He's conditioned for trialing, not hunting, and that's what he does well.

Here are photos of several of my AKC Pointers that have shown/won in conformation shows both in and out of the USA... all excellent bird dogs with lots of drive and nice retrieving skills, just no 12 o'clock tails on point -- they bring home the bacon (er, birds) though!

Wyoming hunting:

p1 (Small).jpg

12 week old puppy on bird in Pennsylvania:

p2 (Small).jpg

Young dog, summer work in Montana:

p3 (Small).jpg

Another during summer work in Montana:

p4 (Small).jpg

Nice looking dogs. Just different animals. American bred pointers are smaller, more compact, faster. English Pointers are longer, more stowick.

wems2371 · Post by **wems2371** » Thu Feb 17, 2011 2:44 pm

This pointer is suppose to be completely American Field bred, and only the 10th DC in the history of the breed. I don't know pointer pedigrees at all, but RU CH Triplecross Bo x Santo is what comes up with a google. I don't claim to know how she achieved the show CH. I just happened to pick up that exact magazine off a table at the local kennel club last year, because the cover surprised me.

http://www.hainespointers.net/aboutus.htm
(scroll to bottom magazine cover)

Neil · Post by **Neil** » Thu Feb 17, 2011 6:13 pm

ElhewPointer wrote:
Neil wrote:
ElhewPointer wrote:If you'd stick one of those AKC show pointers in the field, it'd have a heart attack! Wouldn't have a clue what to do. A totally different animal. Hunting pointers are American Pointers, show pointers are English Pointers.
That is a myth, the winner of the AKC Pointer National was judged by a friend of mine, he won both the Open and Amateur and is now in Shawn Kinklaar's string and showing some promise on the major Shooting Dog circuit. I don't know his breeding, but I doubt he has much show dog in his background, but he is AKC registered.

I suspect if shaved down the little cocker could be trained to hunt some.

And remember as some have said, it is the breed clubs not AKC that causes the split when there is one.

Neil
Neil,

Read my post Neil. Before you hit the send button please read it. I stated that "AKC show pointers". I am well aware of that dog Neil, however he isn't a show dog.

Which is why I said:

but I doubt he has much show dog in his background,

I recognized the distinction in your post, I was not sure everyone did, I have pretty good reading skills, but thanks anyway,

Neil

Bird Dog 67 · Post by **Bird Dog 67** » Fri Feb 18, 2011 9:42 am

Not a huge fan of dog shows but always tune in for the hound, sporting, and BIS of Westminster. I have to say being a fan of Weims, physically speaking, it was the best looking representative of that breed that I've seen at this show in years! Not saying he was perfect but better than what has been there before. Docked a bit short for my taste not that it matters all that much.

Nice to see the Scottish Deerhound take home the prize.

SpinJen · Post by **SpinJen** » Fri Feb 18, 2011 11:10 am

Dave Quindt wrote:
The question is not "do they hunt"; the question is "do they hunt well enough that breeding them will result in an improved breed?" It's the breeding of those dogs generation upon generation that has resulted in segments of all breeds being incapable of being reasonable effective sporting dogs.

JMO,
Dave

Not all breeds.

Spinoni don't have the split and I hope they never will.

Jenna · Post by **Jenna** » Fri Feb 18, 2011 2:34 pm

Bird Dog 67 wrote:Not a huge fan of dog shows but always tune in for the hound, sporting, and BIS of Westminster. I have to say being a fan of Weims, physically speaking, it was the best looking representative of that breed that I've seen at this show in years! Not saying he was perfect but better than what has been there before. Docked a bit short for my taste not that it matters all that much.

Nice to see the Scottish Deerhound take home the prize.

My friend Keith shows that Weim

Bird Dog 67 · Post by **Bird Dog 67** » Fri Feb 18, 2011 2:43 pm

Tell him congrats and nice work!

Jenna · Post by **Jenna** » Fri Feb 18, 2011 3:20 pm

Will do! Every year he has a top winning weim, he really loves the breed. There are so many crazy show weims (not just happy crazy, like certifiable crazy) but Keith's are always sane and normal.

1vizsla · Post by **1vizsla** » Tue Feb 22, 2011 11:37 am

Fault and responsibility fall on both sides, show and field. There are good and bad dogs on both sides.

Most of the dogs I know show first and hunt after the show title is achieved. Konner is a prime example of showing first then going onto hunting. Winning-est Vizsla in history is now a SH and VC holder. Mine got his show title first and is now working on hunting and I have a friend with and Irish Setter that needs only one more leg for MH and already has a show title. So I think any breed can do both if you want.

Carla

phermes1 · Post by **phermes1** » Tue Feb 22, 2011 11:54 am

1vizsla wrote:Fault and responsibility fall on both sides, show and field. There are good and bad dogs on both sides.

Most of the dogs I know show first and hunt after the show title is achieved. Konner is a prime example of showing first then going onto hunting. Winning-est Vizsla in history is now a SH and VC holder. Mine got his show title first and is now working on hunting and I have a friend with and Irish Setter that needs only one more leg for MH and already has a show title. So I think any breed can do both if you want.

Carla

That's pretty much what we do; get the CH out of the way then focus on the field - although even then, puppy/derby comes first.

Post by **ezzy333** » Tue Feb 22, 2011 12:17 pm

I want to see some field abilities before I bothered to show them but it is easier to get that title fiest and then finish the fiels work.

Ezzy

GUNDOGS · Post by **GUNDOGS** » Tue Feb 22, 2011 12:48 pm

3Britts wrote:Boy, reading this makes me glad I have Brittanys, most DC in the group.

I did watch the Sporting Group and was amazed at the winner. I had to wonder if that Cocker had ever been hunting. My bet was, it hadn't.

Now, show people, don't hate me for saying this next bit. JMO is that no sporting dog should be shown if it has not proven itself in the field in some manner: Hunting legs, Trial entrance. something.

sporting dogs should do what they were bred to do. In the sporting dog group, that means hunt.

agreed 100% 3britts... the sporting dogs should have to prove their abilities by having field titles on them in order to compete and prove they are in fact a "sporting dog"..some of those dogs probably have never seen a field because if their tail got injured, or they had scars from brush and cover their career would be over..that bearded collie had a perfect coat, whens the last time you think it was out hearding sheep?..another issue i have is with the GSP'S ..why is it you can have every darn colour of cocker, lab, english pointer, but only liver is accepted for GSP'S and not black?....ruth

Post by **ezzy333** » Tue Feb 22, 2011 12:51 pm

Because that is the way the sponsoring GSP Club has written the standard and voted to accept it.

Ezzy

Vonzeppelinkennels · Post by **Vonzeppelinkennels** » Tue Feb 22, 2011 12:58 pm

I hope Ruth didn't open up another can of worms but if she did I will stay out of it!!

GUNDOGS · Post by **GUNDOGS** » Tue Feb 22, 2011 1:14 pm

heres our GSP ruger (liveridge's restricted weapon)with his handler at a show..and with my husband brian on birds..he did well in both....ruth

Post by **fourseasons** » Tue Feb 22, 2011 1:18 pm

Guess this is kind of a "sideways" to the Westminster topic, FWIW -- my better half, who is fairly knowledgeable regarding canine coat color genetics, says that one major reason for concern about black color in GSPs has to do with color dominance and that black would push out the traditional liver color fairly quickly unless breedings to blacks were managed in order to maintain the liver gene.

Georgia Boy · Post by **Georgia Boy** » Tue Feb 22, 2011 4:19 pm

ezzy333 wrote:
I assume you are referring to Britts
I was refering to all breeds. If you want to see one being used as a versatile you about have to go to somewhere they are doing testing. But in the real world can't remember when I last saw one.

Ezzy

I live in the real world and see versatile dogs everyday :roll:

Post by **ezzy333** » Tue Feb 22, 2011 5:04 pm

Good I knew there were some . What do they do?

Ezzy

jarbo03 · Post by **jarbo03** » Tue Feb 22, 2011 5:37 pm

Georgia Boy wrote:
ezzy333 wrote:
I assume you are referring to Britts
I was refering to all breeds. If you want to see one being used as a versatile you about have to go to somewhere they are doing testing. But in the real world can't remember when I last saw one.

Ezzy
I live in the real world and see versatile dogs everyday :roll:

My lab and my britt were both versatile dogs, from marsh hunting ducks, field hunting geese, dove, prairie chisken, phez, quail, and so on, if I went hunting they went and both did really well no matter the situation.

Post by **ezzy333** » Tue Feb 22, 2011 9:42 pm

Don't think hunting different birds qualifies. If it does then all dogs are versatile.

Ezzy

Cajun Casey · Post by **Cajun Casey** » Tue Feb 22, 2011 9:53 pm

Versatile means fur and blood tracking, although NAVHDA has restricted it to water work and bird trailing.

Crashola · Post by **Crashola** » Wed Feb 23, 2011 1:21 pm

As a former golden owner, I always find this interesting. I see those show goldens and have to shake my head. Big, blocky, bleached blonde dogs with super-long coats. I can't see how they could spend more than an hour hunting in thick cover. I remember calling one breeder when I was looking for my first golden and told her I wanted a hunter, preferably with some field titles in the pedigree. She said "do you mean those little hyper red-haired dogs?" I said "if you mean the ones that are still bred to do the things the breed was meant to do, then yes." Needless to say, I went and found one of those little hyper red-haired dogs and my little predator and I spent 12+ unforgettable years hunting pheasants and waterfowl.

Georgia Boy · Post by **Georgia Boy** » Thu Feb 24, 2011 6:05 pm

ezzy 333 wrote:Good I knew there were some . What do they do?

Ezzy

Upland = Quail, Pheasant, Grouse (3 species), Woodcock, Chukar, and Snipe. Hope to add more in the near future. Fur = Fox, Raccoon, Rabbits, Bobcat, Opossum, Squirrel and the occasional Coyote and Groundhog. Big Game = mainly Wild Boar and where legal Deer. Waterfowl = Ducks, Geese and Swans. Cant forget about Blood Tracking. There is a difference between a versatile dog and a versatile hunting dog. Some people think a show dog and a JH make it versatile

Post by **ezzy333** » Thu Feb 24, 2011 10:30 pm

Georgia Boy wrote:
ezzy 333 wrote:Good I knew there were some . What do they do?

Ezzy

Upland = Quail, Pheasant, Grouse (3 species), Woodcock, Chukar, and Snipe. Hope to add more in the near future. Fur = Fox, Raccoon, Rabbits, Bobcat, Opossum, Squirrel and the occasional Coyote and Groundhog. Big Game = mainly Wild Boar and where legal Deer. Waterfowl = Ducks, Geese and Swans. Cant forget about Blood Tracking. There is a difference between a versatile dog and a versatile hunting dog. Some people think a show dog and a JH make it versatile

Ya think so! I see all of the things a versatile dog should be able to do and I think most breeds can do those things if they are trained. But what I am asking is what do your versatile dogs do and how often are used for those purpouses?

I am familar with the breeds we call versatile but honestly have never seen them used for any of those things listed that any other dog doesn't do. I've hunted both birds and small animals with practically every breedtheir is but that is about as much as I have seen done with any.

Ezzy

Georgia Boy · Post by **Georgia Boy** » Fri Feb 25, 2011 6:07 am

ezzy333 wrote:
Georgia Boy wrote:
ezzy 333 wrote:Good I knew there were some . What do they do?

Ezzy

Upland = Quail, Pheasant, Grouse (3 species), Woodcock, Chukar, and Snipe. Hope to add more in the near future. Fur = Fox, Raccoon, Rabbits, Bobcat, Opossum, Squirrel and the occasional Coyote and Groundhog. Big Game = mainly Wild Boar and where legal Deer. Waterfowl = Ducks, Geese and Swans. Cant forget about Blood Tracking. There is a difference between a versatile dog and a versatile hunting dog. Some people think a show dog and a JH make it versatile
Ya think so! I see all of the things a versatile dog should be able to do and I think most breeds can do those things if they are trained. But what I am asking is what do your versatile dogs do and how often are used for those purpouses?

I am familar with the breeds we call versatile but honestly have never seen them used for any of those things listed that any other dog doesn't do. I've hunted both birds and small animals with practically every breedtheir is but that is about as much as I have seen done with any.
Ezzy

That is what my dogs are used for all year long,.

northern cajun · Post by **northern cajun** » Mon Feb 28, 2011 11:09 am

Cajun Casey wrote:Versatile means fur and blood tracking, although NAVHDA has restricted it to water work and bird trailing.

Versatile means, water, upland, tracking. Fur or Feather. More of those Navhda dogs can track fur much better than you think. Some not so well I believe it is all in what the owner wants and the time willing to be put in. IMHO.