Range

[Modi]

This ought to start a debate.

I am curious as to whether range is mostly born with a dog or taught or conditioned. To what degree can it be influenced? How and when can you begin to get an idea of your dog's natural range?

How much does it change depending on cover? If your dog hunts mostly in open fields, do they tighten up when you bring them into thicker woods?

Thanks in advance.

[Brittguy]

I believe dogs can be shortened . I don't feel the same way about increasing range, I feel it is genetic but I have seen big running dogs come from foot handled gun dogs and short running dogs from all age dogs. I feel you can tell what you have by 6 months if you have been giving him enough opportunity.
Dogs do adjust range to the cover. They also adjust range to type of transportation the handler has. If I walk I could keep my dogs in a small field all day. If I have the same dog and run him off horse or 4 wheeler he will increase range dramatically if the cover permits.

[Dave Quindt]

I don't believe a dog is born with a natural range; I don't believe range in inherited.

I don't believe range is a trait, but the result of many traits (multiple conformation traits, intelligence, desire, etc) and can be greatly influenced by environmental factors.

Many dogs are limited in their ability to range due to natural limitations; a poor gait, a lack of confidence, etc. On the other hand, some dogs range can't be adjusted either due to natural limitations; a lack of intelligence or cooperation or desire to work as a team. But for the vast group of the dogs in the middle; the ones with a balanced set of natural instincts and good to excellent physical structure, nurture plays as much, and probably a greater role, in what the dog's ultimate hunting range and pattern will be.

Most people can't tell the difference between speed and range; an extremely fast dog, even of moderate range, will put the fear of God in many people that they've got a "huge running dog". Most people can't easily tell if the dog is running or hunting, when doing so at anything more than close to very moderate distances. You basically have to run the dog on a variety of big grounds, often with moderate to heavy cover, to truly evaluate the dog, and it must be done either on horseback or wheeler. In the grand scheme, few dogs are ever put in a position where their complete hunting range/pattern can be shown, outside of FT dogs.

Give me a dog with a huge desire to find birds, a physical body that allows for a fluid gate and good stamina, and a good amount of natural cooperation and intelligence, and I can make him look like he was born to be a 75 yard dog or born to be a 750 yard dog just by the way he's developed. And he'll be happy at whatever range he's patterned to run, if he knows he's going to find birds.

JMO,
Dave

[AHGSP]

Give me a dog with a huge desire to find birds, a physical body that allows for a fluid gate and good stamina, and a good amount of natural cooperation and intelligence, and I can make him look like he was born to be a 75 yard dog or born to be a 750 yard dog just by the way he's developed. And he'll be happy at whatever range he's patterned to run, if he knows he's going to find birds.

JMO,
Dave

Great post Dave and I think right there is the crux of it. Put heavy training on a young dog and stay on it all it's life, take it's confidence and independence from it and it won't matter how big/hard it was "born" to run. Gradually develop a young dog to instill confidence and heighten it's desire and I believe they can learn to go as hard as you'll let them.

[JKP]

I have always felt that range is a by product of confidence, desire, physical attributes and conditioning/patterning....you don't breed range.....you breed the ability to develop it and then try to stay out of the way.

[slistoe]

Not much to add to this series of posts.

[Redfishkilla]

To some degree range is inherted. My mom's yorkie loves quail but can't be taught to push out to 400 yards.

My general observation is that it's easier to reel one in rather than push em out. Training and cover of course can influence range.

[Ryman Gun Dog]

Modi,
IMO Range is mostly genetic based and although it can be altered thru repitition to some degree, it pays to understand the breed line you are purchasing form, and
not fight the genetic imprint of the individual animal when training.
RGD/Dave

[RayGubernat]

Modi -

I believe that the genetic portion of range is mostly and "ability". The dog is born with the ability to range out so far.

How that "ability" is managed is, to a very large degree, the result of training and experience.

A puppy from AF horseback All Age parents has the genetic ability to run at ranges of a half to one mile from their hunter handler... perhaps even more. I am quite sure that such a puppy can be trained to hunt at any distance the trainer chooses down to and including within shotgun range. Training and experience.

I wouldn't choose to do that, but it could be done.

A dog that does not posess the genetic "ability" to range out cannot be made to hunt at significantly greater ranges than it's ability limit.

RayG