When is it TOO cold?

PntrRookie · Post by **PntrRookie** » Sat Oct 29, 2011 6:54 am

How do you know when it is too cold for your dogs to be outside in their kennel? I have english pointers. 2 outdoor kennel runs, each with it's own Dog Den. NO heater in them, just hay, blocked on 3 sides from the wind (I added a decorative fence to the side of the kennel in the picture below - only the door side is open). I live in SE Wisconsin. Any idea what the temp increase is inside the Dog Den with the dog and hay in there? Is is 20 degrees more than outside, 30, etc.? How do I know when I should bring them inside?

DSCN2594 (640x480).jpg

Post by **slistoe** » Sat Oct 29, 2011 8:07 am

Mine come inside the shop when it is -25 F outside.

Ahumphers91a · Post by **Ahumphers91a** » Sat Oct 29, 2011 8:11 am

I live in Utah, and for winter I put plywood and tarps all around the kennel, and not to mention lots and lots of straw. Also, when I feed them around 3-4pm I put hot water in their food so they can have a warm belly.
Edit: Oh I have 2 male shorthairs.

mountaindogs · Post by **mountaindogs** » Sat Oct 29, 2011 9:20 am

I do the warm water too. Seems to make a pretty big difference in holding weight. AND they like it.
We only have winters down to about 10F with that being a low. Might be a high of 18 or 19 for about 2 weeks a few times a winter.
-25F

yikes!

Post by **slistoe** » Sat Oct 29, 2011 9:22 am

mountaindogs wrote: -25F yikes!

I put warm water on the dogs food as well - so that they get to drink it!

DonF · Post by **DonF** » Sat Oct 29, 2011 9:32 am

My dogs do a lot better in the house anytime the temp falls below 65*!

steingre · Post by **steingre** » Sat Oct 29, 2011 10:25 am

I live in Iowa- similar temps to SE Wisconsin, I suspect!

I've had pointers, setters, and now shorthairs...in the 40+ years of keeping bird dogs...I've always had them in their kennels. As an Iowa farm boy, my Dad always said about all our animals, including dogs..."Feed 'em right, keep 'em out of the wind, and give 'em plenty of dry bedding"...and that has always seemed to work!

I have the Dog Den 2 as well for each of my three shorthairs- they pop out each morning raring to go, no matter what the temperature!

You set-up looks fine; I assume you have something to keep their water from freezing? I think fresh water is just as important in the frigid cold as it is in the stifling heat!

Ahumphers91a · Post by **Ahumphers91a** » Sat Oct 29, 2011 10:49 am

exactly. In utah, it has gotten I think -5 or -10 below since I have lived here these 8 years. My dog's have never come in, I keep it dry and wind free. They aren't bothered one bit by it. And yes, I don't know what it is but the warm food seems to help keep weight, or maybe just a super full tummy

Ruffshooter · Post by **Ruffshooter** » Sat Oct 29, 2011 11:55 am

A few things I see with your set up.
1) You have it in a corner which is good for wind from those sides but not so good as far as rain and snow build up. If you get a lot of wet snow you may have trouble.

2) I would close that side in as well. Maybe you did that. What is the predominanat direction of the wind where you are? Coming out of the NW? Make sure that side has good protection.

3) I have one brit that on the coldest of - 20 will stay out in her outside kennel with her nose peaking out. They have option to go in the garage which I keep at 45.
The others go inside. I have not had any problems duirng days but must admit they all come in at night.

Post by **ezzy333** » Sat Oct 29, 2011 11:56 am

Turn the houses so the opening is towards the house so they aren't in the wind and they will be fine no matter how cold it gets if they have plenty of bedding. We had pointers, vizslas, and about every other breed of sog and never had a problem. it would get down to -30 occasionally. The cold did seem to bother the vizslas but they were the only ones. Our dogs now that are in the kennel all day get too warm in the house and head to the basement where they can lay on the cold floor.

Ezzy

Neil · Post by **Neil** » Sat Oct 29, 2011 1:32 pm

With your set up, my dogs would spend more time on top of the dog house than in it (I have rubber mats on mine), unless it is bowing rain.

Before I put on the roof, I have come out and they would be curled up on top covered in snow and ice, didn't look comfy, but they are fine.

Keep their weight up, as said, dray bedding and they will be OK.

Now I always have from 6 to 8 adult dogs, so I never bring more than two in the house at one time, but they rotate, I just like having them around me, so it is for me not them.

Neil

Post by **Sharon** » Sat Oct 29, 2011 1:33 pm

I don't think it is temperature as much as it is the wind. When an Ontario blizzard hits town , nobody's staying outside. An outside kennel should definately have a place where a dog can get out of the wind.

Garrison · Post by **Garrison** » Sat Oct 29, 2011 2:06 pm

They make a heating pad that goes on the floor of the dog house and only gets as warm as the dogs natural body temp that would be easy to wire up because your kennel is so close to the house. Then you don't have to fuss with straw and your wife will sleep better at night. We installed them in the same dog house for my father in-law and uncles dogs in illinois and they work well. I would bolt a piece of plywood on the exposed side up of the ground a couple inches so you can still hose off the concrete and don't have to shovel out the kennel. We also had a hot water hose bib plumbed off the side of the house which is nice to melt away the snow and frozen dog piss.

Post by **ezzy333** » Sat Oct 29, 2011 6:13 pm

Sharon wrote:I don't think it is temperature as much as it is the wind. When an Ontario blizzard hits town , nobody's staying outside. An outside kennel should definately have a place where a dog can get out of the wind.

I think most do, they call them dog houses. :roll:

Ezzy

Post by **Sharon** » Sat Oct 29, 2011 6:16 pm

Ah yes Ezzy but many dog houses have no cover ( tarp etc. on the opening.) :roll:

Post by **ezzy333** » Sat Oct 29, 2011 6:20 pm

Sharon wrote:Ah yes Ezzy but many dog houses have no cover ( tarp etc. on the opening.) :roll:

Thats why I always built them with a hallway to get back to the door of the sleeping chamber. When it is warm they use the hall and when it is cold or windy they get in the sleeping room. Thats why I suggested turning the houses so the openings are protected by the house.

Ezzy

Post by **Sharon** » Sat Oct 29, 2011 6:21 pm

Now that is good advice and exactly what i was talking about.

birddogger · Post by **birddogger** » Sat Oct 29, 2011 6:28 pm

I've had pointers, setters, and now shorthairs...in the 40+ years of keeping bird dogs...I've always had them in their kennels. As an Iowa farm boy, my Dad always said about all our animals, including dogs..."Feed 'em right, keep 'em out of the wind, and give 'em plenty of dry bedding"...and that has always seemed to work!

Same here, except for the Iowa farm boy.

That's all they need. When mine come out of the kennels stretching and yawning, I know they are doing fine.

Charlie

Christopher · Post by **Christopher** » Sat Oct 29, 2011 7:47 pm

Call me a softy but when I look out and see my GSP curled up in his house (which has tons of dry chips for bedding) and see him shivering as he is trying to sleep, I bring him in the shop. This happened last week when it was under 30 degrees.

In the winter I use a radiant heater to keep the chill off. When it gets down real cold, like 0, he sleeps in the house.

jimbo&rooster · Post by **jimbo&rooster** » Sat Oct 29, 2011 7:51 pm

My only thought is that I would use straw instead of hay..... Sems like hay has alot more fine particles that couse irritation.

JIm

Mike50 · Post by **Mike50** » Sun Oct 30, 2011 7:35 am

If you want to know the temp inside. Pick up a indoor outdoor thermometer. Put the out side sending unit in a large mason jar and stick it in the kennel. I say a large mason jar because Fido shouldn't be able to pick it up and drop it. If you think of something else that's dog proof use it.

Gertie · Post by **Gertie** » Sun Oct 30, 2011 8:53 am

Christopher wrote:Call me a softy but when I look out and see my GSP curled up in his house (which has tons of dry chips for bedding) and see him shivering as he is trying to sleep, I bring him in the shop. This happened last week when it was under 30 degrees.

In the winter I use a radiant heater to keep the chill off. When it gets down real cold, like 0, he sleeps in the house.

+1

Shivering = cold and uncomfortable = coming in

cutty72 · Post by **cutty72** » Sun Oct 30, 2011 9:08 am

My lab is outside year round. I'll put her in the garage during blizzards and the -60 wind chills we get here in ND, but that's about it.
-15 degrees? Perfect for hunting and playing in the snowbanks in her mind.

Post by **slistoe** » Sun Oct 30, 2011 9:14 am

Christopher wrote:Call me a softy but when I look out and see my GSP curled up in his house (which has tons of dry chips for bedding) and see him shivering as he is trying to sleep, I bring him in the shop. This happened last week when it was under 30 degrees.

In the winter I use a radiant heater to keep the chill off. When it gets down real cold, like 0, he sleeps in the house.

If you can see your dog in his dog house then it is small wonder he might be getting cold.

Post by **ezzy333** » Sun Oct 30, 2011 10:28 am

slistoe wrote:
Christopher wrote:Call me a softy but when I look out and see my GSP curled up in his house (which has tons of dry chips for bedding) and see him shivering as he is trying to sleep, I bring him in the shop. This happened last week when it was under 30 degrees.

In the winter I use a radiant heater to keep the chill off. When it gets down real cold, like 0, he sleeps in the house.
If you can see your dog in his dog house then it is small wonder he might be getting cold.

I was going to say the same thing when I saw that post. I would have to take the roof off to see the dog in the bedded sleeping chamber.

Ezzy

Vman · Post by **Vman** » Sun Oct 30, 2011 10:34 am

PointerRookie, maybe put one of those remote thermometers in the dog den and you can read it from inside the garage or house. That way you know how warm or cold the dogs are at the time. As long as they are comfortable you are fine.

Birdman250 · Post by **Birdman250** » Sun Oct 30, 2011 12:32 pm

Gregg, I never have any problems with my dogs..They stay outside all day and night in their doghouse and kennel. In the winter I use marsh hay to help wih the warmth, and tarps on the sides of the kennels to help keep out the wind.

PntrRookie · Post by **PntrRookie** » Sun Oct 30, 2011 5:54 pm

Thx Paul and everyone. I do have that long side (you see in the pict) covered now with a decorative fence. I also use hay/marsh grass. I like the warm water/food mixture, I will start that as water begins freezing. I also keep one empty water bowl inside and each morning put it out with new fresh water. I have a digital wireless thermometer on one of the walls of the kennel so I know what the exterior temp is. I will check into putting one inside one of the Dog Dens.

RayJ · Post by **RayJ** » Sun Oct 30, 2011 6:09 pm

Since the door on a dog den closes shut - is that enough to shield a dog from the wind?

PntrRookie · Post by **PntrRookie** » Sun Oct 30, 2011 7:47 pm

Even though it is a swinging door, I have never seen it "flap in the wind" and with the hay inside, that keeps it from flapping. IMO, I think it is enough.

birddogger · Post by **birddogger** » Sun Oct 30, 2011 7:56 pm

Dogs have been kept outside forever, except for the dainty little pets that were meant to be house dogs, and I have never known of any to have any negative affects, as long as they were properly fed, watered and were protected from the wind. I know people do things different now days but when I was growing up, I never heard of a hunting dog being brought in the house.

Charlie

Birddogz · Post by **Birddogz** » Mon Oct 31, 2011 6:55 am

Dogs that live inside, live longer on average, and have less joint problems. Ideally, leave them out in a kennel when the weather is nice for 4-6 hours per day, but bring them in at night. They bond with you with out any trouble. Ask any Vet which is better. If you can't have a dog in the house, that is one thing, but if it is a "messy" issue, get real.

PntrRookie · Post by **PntrRookie** » Thu Jan 19, 2012 6:44 am

Just an FYI for all of u...my dog den has a 150 watt ceramic heat bulb in the heater. I put a thermometer inside it to see how warm it gets. There is some straw in there as well...but NO dog...the outside temperature last night was 5 with a wind chill of nearly -10, the temp inside the Dog Den, WITHOUT a dog in it, was 46 this morning when I checked it. I m sure if I left the pup out there it would have been even warmer. Those things are GREAT!

Post by **jcbuttry8** » Thu Jan 19, 2012 7:04 am

Birddogz wrote:Dogs that live inside, live longer on average, and have less joint problems. Ideally, leave them out in a kennel when the weather is nice for 4-6 hours per day, but bring them in at night. They bond with you with out any trouble. Ask any Vet which is better. If you can't have a dog in the house, that is one thing, but if it is a "messy" issue, get real.

Kona stays outside in the kennel all day. I built a dog house like ezzy talked about. She has a sleep chamber that she gets into from the back of the house. It is filled with hay and a few blankets. I also have the roof on hinges so I can lift the roof and get in to replace hay or clean it out. My wife saw it and accused me of building a whelping box but that was not at all my intentions. I merely wanted a place to keep my dog out of the wind. :roll: :roll:

She comes in the house every night at 8 and hangs with the family and has dinner and treats. She is then put in the crate when we all go to bed and seems to do very well with this set up. She is a very happy and healthy pup. I like this set up because she can handle anything. She has manners in the house or can be kenneled and really no issues.

Joe

AzDoggin · Post by **AzDoggin** » Thu Jan 19, 2012 8:22 am

jcbuttry8 wrote:
Birddogz wrote:Dogs that live inside, live longer on average, and have less joint problems. Ideally, leave them out in a kennel when the weather is nice for 4-6 hours per day, but bring them in at night. They bond with you with out any trouble. Ask any Vet which is better. If you can't have a dog in the house, that is one thing, but if it is a "messy" issue, get real.
Kona stays outside in the kennel all day. I built a dog house like ezzy talked about. She has a sleep chamber that she gets into from the back of the house. It is filled with hay and a few blankets. I also have the roof on hinges so I can lift the roof and get in to replace hay or clean it out. My wife saw it and accused me of building a whelping box but that was not at all my intentions. I merely wanted a place to keep my dog out of the wind. :roll: :roll:

She comes in the house every night at 8 and hangs with the family and has dinner and treats. She is then put in the crate when we all go to bed and seems to do very well with this set up. She is a very happy and healthy pup. I like this set up because she can handle anything. She has manners in the house or can be kenneled and really no issues.

Joe

Sounds like an idea setup to me. Dogs need some regular time away from family just like they need some regular time with family, IMO. They need to be able to accept the 'restriction' - it becomes important at so many other times, e.g., traveling, hunting, etc. I've seen some dogs that are so accustomed to being around their owners that they whine like babies any time the owner steps away for awhile. That's an 'owner caused' problem, IMO.

Post by **ezzy333** » Thu Jan 19, 2012 9:41 am

jcbuttry8 wrote:
Birddogz wrote:Dogs that live inside, live longer on average, and have less joint problems. Ideally, leave them out in a kennel when the weather is nice for 4-6 hours per day, but bring them in at night. They bond with you with out any trouble. Ask any Vet which is better. If you can't have a dog in the house, that is one thing, but if it is a "messy" issue, get real.
Kona stays outside in the kennel all day. I built a dog house like ezzy talked about. She has a sleep chamber that she gets into from the back of the house. It is filled with hay and a few blankets. I also have the roof on hinges so I can lift the roof and get in to replace hay or clean it out. My wife saw it and accused me of building a whelping box but that was not at all my intentions. I merely wanted a place to keep my dog out of the wind. :roll: :roll:

She comes in the house every night at 8 and hangs with the family and has dinner and treats. She is then put in the crate when we all go to bed and seems to do very well with this set up. She is a very happy and healthy pup. I like this set up because she can handle anything. She has manners in the house or can be kenneled and really no issues.

Joe

Sounds almost idenical to what I have found works great.

Ezzy

SHORTFAT · Post by **SHORTFAT** » Thu Jan 19, 2012 10:08 am

My dog hates the extreme cold, but if I get the gun and her collar out, she don't care what the temp is... She's an indoor dog tho', just like our Lab was, so I can't say, but I do think the breed matters. Some dogs are built for it and some aren't. My brother had a huskey that would burrow into the snowbank and stay there all night, but I don't think my pointer cares for the cold much...

Christopher · Post by **Christopher** » Fri Feb 17, 2012 12:35 pm

I used to be pretty set on keeping my bird dogs outside year round. At some point, I began putting the crate in the shop where the dog would sleep every night and would go when it was cold and nasty outside, especially in the winter.
Now, the crate is in the house where the dog spends a lot of time. He sleeps in it every night, I let him out in the morning and feed him and let him run around a bit on his tie out. Then, he's itchin' to get back into his crate when I leave the house for the day. He loves his crate! When the wife is home in the afternoon, he gets tied out in the back yard. I get home, take him for his daily run, feed him and typically he goes back into his crate or is loose inside the house with me. This works fine for us.

He doesn't sleep on my bed, he goes into his crate when we have company and he is never left alone loose in the house, he likes to chew everything, hopefully he will outgrow this soon as he will be 5 years old.

rinker · Post by **rinker** » Fri Feb 17, 2012 4:04 pm

The coldest temperature that I have ever experienced was 35 below zero. I had a litter of lab puppies that were a few days old at the time and they were outside in a dog house with their mother. I thought long and hard about bringing them inside but I honestly thought that the cold blast they were going to get when I raised the lid on the house would kill them before I could get them inside. I went out the next day and peeked in the house expecting the worst, but they were all fine. I did not lose a puppy.

At one time I had two young lab females kenneled together. They would not tolerate bedding in their house. I tried straw, hay, cedar chips, blankets, you name it. They would not stop digging until every piece was out of their house. I battled this for a few winters and then gave up. They spent several winters after that with no bedding in their house and seemed as happy as they could be.

These stories were about labs, but I have predominately had pointers over the years. Based purely on my own observations, and I could be wrong, but I think the average dog is most comfortable when the weather is in the 30's. I think as long as they have a decent house their is no weather in the lower 48 that they can't deal with.

I will occasionally have a conversation with someone that is just astonished that my dogs stay outside in all weather. I always ask them, "should I bring my horses inside too, how can I bring the dogs in and leave the horses out there to freeze?" No one ever seems to have an answer for this.

cjhills · Post by **cjhills** » Fri Feb 17, 2012 9:50 pm

We maintain our kennel temp at 63 degrees. What we spend on electricity we save on food and vet bills, I hate to see humped up shivering shorthairs
j

dakotashooter2 · Post by **dakotashooter2** » Sat Feb 18, 2012 12:04 am

My springer were always out during the day in at night. Quite often the days would get down to -20. Sometimes they would be curled up in the doghouse others they would be out running around. Usually when they came out of the doghouse their fur would be warm so I never worried about it. Some days they would hop up on the straw bales and absorb the sun (even at -10)

cjhills · Post by **cjhills** » Thu Feb 23, 2012 10:27 am

A dog normally sleeps 18 hours in 24 so if they have a warm place to sleep they are probably good to go. My question is do these dogs get any training, excersize or any other attention when it is 0 or below. that would take about 5 months out of our schedule if it all had to be outside. WE have plenty of room for condition retrieve, whoa training and 7 kennels in a 12X30 heated and AC kennel attached to a unheated garage. Didn't cost much and works great. Only time they are out is when we take them out twice a day for a run in the field. The only thing a dog learns in a outside run is how to bark, barrier frustration and how to stand on their hind legs with their front feet on the fence. A pointing dog don't need to know any of these things.
Dogs are also quite happy in grates for 8 to 10 hours at a time with two three runs a day. This works very well with a heated garage or shop.
J

SHORTFAT · Post by **SHORTFAT** » Thu Feb 23, 2012 10:56 am

rinker wrote:I will occasionally have a conversation with someone that is just astonished that my dogs stay outside in all weather. I always ask them, "should I bring my horses inside too, how can I bring the dogs in and leave the horses out there to freeze?" No one ever seems to have an answer for this.

I see no reason why you can't bring a good horse into the house... as long as he's "house broken" cuz that's a big stain on the carpet if he ain't!