Make the WHINING STOP!!!!

[recon033]

Ok, Ive posted about Hans before he is an 8 month old GSP, lastly about his broken leg that he has fully recovered from now only 13 weeks later and he is back to full speed and activity. We bounce back and forth between two houses, one back home and one up here at school. Back home he is fine, other dogs to play with and people to keep him entertained. But up here at school he drives us nuts. He wants to go outside, nonstop. He runs from window to window, door to our feet whining the whole entire way. If we ignore him he will come over and sit right in front of us just whining and we cant get him to stop. When we do give in we get his attention bring him to the kitchen make him sit stay high five and distract him from whining for a good 5 or 10 minutes and then let him outside while hes not expecting it. What are we doing wrong, we dont think we are associating his whining to letting him go outside. I go out there and wear him out as well when he is out there. But sometimes he will wait by the door to go back in, you let him back in and he is window to window again wanting to go right back out there. What do we do? We dont have an outside kennel for him at this house, just a crate I would hate to crate him when he knows we are home in between school classes. Any ideas?
Thanks

[jimbo&rooster]

you have a dog that needs to RUN. if you are not taking him out and letting him burn off that energy then you have to deal with the consequences. When my GSP lived in the house if he didn't go to the field 3-5days a week to run for an hour or more he was un bearable in the house.

A walk on the leash will not get the job done.

Jim

[AzDoggin]

What does your pup's day look like? How much time outside training/exercise/free play/whatever? How much time in crate?

[recon033]

Ha all this dog does is run. He is up around 730 when my girlfriend goes to student teaching. She lets him out for 20-30 minutes brings him in and feeds him. He usually comes by me and naps for about 30 minutes after that and then its on for him. Usually between 10 and 12 in the morning I am out there throwing the ball for him for usually at least 45 minutes straight or until he stops. When we are done playing I leave him outside until I see him want to come back in ( he stands by the back door when hes ready.) Then depending on my school schedule depends what he does. Thursday is the only day he is crated and thats is from 10am until 330pm. Other than Thursdays I throw the ball for him in the afternoon for at least 45 minutes again and then start doing my homework. We leave him out there all the time we have a fenced in yard, but he wants in and out on his own all the time. This dog runs and runs and runs and runs. When we leave him out there on his own he usually just sits at the side of the fence and watches the neighbors yards and the road. When we are at home he runs non stop with other dogs and my roomate has a dog that is his best friend and that is where we train as well so I think thats why its a non issue there.

[ultracarry]

Lol Imagine how he feels... Prob the frustration your going through. You mist have read how they need an outlet and plenty of exercise... Right?

The whining will not stop, the running in the house won't stop, you can't change that ... Unless you run him hard for an thirty minutes to an hour.... Then he will sleep and lay around for a day maybe two if your lucky. Sounds like a good dog to me.

Running is not at his own pace ... Running is with you in the truck or on a atv at 18-25 mph....

[recon033]

Haha no, I didnt misread I knew what I was getting into with this dog and honestly I can not complain. He has been awesome so far, and fits in with the family perfectly, this is really the only thing he needs to work on outside of his bird training other than whining he knows what he can and cant do and knows all his basics. As for the running at his pace, I dont know how he could run any fast this dog is a bullet. I dont mind him running and having fun in the house, I just wish he wasnt so vocal. Ultra carry is your name based on the kimber by any chance? lol

[AzDoggin]

Not sure you want to run an 8 month old on a sustained run quite that much - hips are still maturing. As an adult, you definitely need to run him that much...

Dog needs outlets though. Training and mental exercise can tire him as well. Might have to get up just a little earlier and work in a vigorous training session. Just running on his own in the yard is NOTHING for this pup.

How's his OB coming? I can't tolerate whining - makes me nuts. Make sure that whining NEVER gets him his way. Chances are it's been reinforced somehow every now and then. Sounds like your time with him now is pretty much play, play, play. There are no demands on him to start developing some impulse control. At 8 months he's ready to get started on some yard training.

Some won't agree with this, but I'd have him tethered to me in the house with a prong collar on him. He wouldn't whine more than a time or two and he wouldn't need a correction that often. He'd learn to quietly hang with me. Don't give him free run in the house - he only earns it through calm, quiet behavior. When he starts to calm down, give hiim some run of the house (or lengthen his tether). If the hyper behavior starts up again, reel him back in - he needs more "reassurance" of his place in your pack. Some working/sporting dogs can't be left out in the house until up to about age 2!
Put him through this program and he'll start to shape up. He needs to know who the leaders are in the house, and understand that he reports to them, not vice versa. This link is for cattle dogs - also prone to be vocal and try to be dominant, but still applies: http://www.nhcdrescuecolorado.com/nilif.htm

[Sharon]

you have a dog that needs to RUN. if you are not taking him out and letting him burn off that energy then you have to deal with the consequences. When my GSP lived in the house if he didn't go to the field 3-5days a week to run for an hour or more he was un bearable in the house.

A walk on the leash will not get the job done.

Jim

Exactly. Well said.

[recon033]

you have a dog that needs to RUN. if you are not taking him out and letting him burn off that energy then you have to deal with the consequences. When my GSP lived in the house if he didn't go to the field 3-5days a week to run for an hour or more he was un bearable in the house.

A walk on the leash will not get the job done.

Jim

Exactly. Well said.

Im guessing my definition of running is different than everyone elses. He does run, he runs non stop and with the ball after he has been playing out in the yard he quits out of boredom yes but he quits MORE from being tired. I guess I should have asked the question different. I know he wants to run, is there any way to get him to not whine when he wants out to run and instead go by the door? Train him like you do other things? He runs, He gets on birds at home regularly and he runs some more. The only difference from back home to here is he doesnt get birds up here and he doesnt have 4 or 5 other dogs that he goes to or come visit him. Other than that, we play regularly outside at least twice a day, we go on long walks or try to at least everyother day when school work allows etc etc. In no way am I complaining, people on this site are quick to think oh boy you shoulda known and now your in over your head. Im not over my head I love this dog I know hes a GSP I know hes high energy balls to the wall. All I am asking is with an 8 month old puppy what can I try to do to get this to cut down some? Run him more? Ok check Im going to start even more tomorrow but is there anything else anyone knows of to try?

[birddog1968]

He's also in the process of training you.....

Now after he's been run he needs to learn to settle, put a lead on him in the house and put it on your foot or stand on it while you are reading, on the computer, phone......whatever. He needs to learn to settle and lay by you until your ready to attend to him. Eventually he will lay quietly and wait his turn, if not he's not found his off switch or has a screw loose.

Thats all assuming he's being exercised enough....

[recon033]

He's also in the process of training you.....

Now after he's been run he needs to learn to settle, put a lead on him in the house and put it on your foot or stand on it while you are reading, on the computer, phone......whatever. He needs to learn to settle and lay by you until your ready to attend to him. Eventually he will lay quietly and wait his turn, if not he's not found his off switch or has a screw loose.

Thats all assuming he's being exercised enough....

Thank you this was the kind of thoughts I was looking for. I did think of doing something along these lines but wanted to see what others have thought of or tried.

[birddog1968]

He's also in the process of training you.....

Now after he's been run he needs to learn to settle, put a lead on him in the house and put it on your foot or stand on it while you are reading, on the computer, phone......whatever. He needs to learn to settle and lay by you until your ready to attend to him. Eventually he will lay quietly and wait his turn, if not he's not found his off switch or has a screw loose.

Thats all assuming he's being exercised enough....

Thank you this was the kind of thoughts I was looking for. I did think of doing something along these lines but wanted to see what others have thought of or tried.

Ive done this with all mine, make the lead secure and ignore him, he will learn to lay quietly or should learn pretty quickly. At first something to chew may make him more willing to lay down and keep himself occupied, later it shouldn't take any distraction.

[Redfishkilla]

I have a "get in your bed" command for when they come in the house, after they clear the house of strangers I make them lay down and chill out.

[larue]

The pup has learned if it whines,it gets outside,which no doubt was part of its house breaking.
I would put the dog in a crate for a while when he whines.
Teach him whining gets him into a crate,no anger just matter of fact.he whines he goes in crate for awhile.
One of my year old pups has learned to bark when I talk on the phone,as I let her outside so I can hear,so she has me well trained.
She knows I will let her outside when I am on the phone,if she barks.It is sort of funny,yet it shows how smart they can be.

[Benny]

+1 for getting the dog to lay down.

That being said, I remember when I was going to college with my shorthair at her age of 2...$%*#@ that!!! It was awful
You are doing the best you can between classes and study to get the dog out, you consider yourself an outdoorsy person so it's no problem right? What a person considers outdoorsy compared to what a GSP considers outdoorsy is the difference of probably 5 to 6 hours more
You will both hate each other during college...that's just it. You'll get along fine on the weekends and during bird season because you'll skip classes anyway for early morning roosters...other than that, it's like all the other roomates you've had that left dirty dishes in the sink or played video games on LOUD until 2am...you will pass eachother in the hallway with dirty looks, but come friday it will all be forgotten. Come post Bac, or Post Masters, you'll be best friends again!

ENJOY!

[SD Pheasant Slayer]

Sounds to me like you need second pup! Playmates are a lifesaver

[RoostersMom]

Google NILIF, Nothing in Life is Free. Sounds like your boy is a bit spoiled. I do totally agree that exercise is a huge component of this, but letting a dog run willy-nilly around the house and act like a jerk is not acceptable. He needs to be taught to settle down when you need him to. A crate or tethered supervision is a good way to start. NILIF is a great way to help the process go a lot faster. And adding an obedience class probably wouldn't hurt at all.

[recon033]

+1 for getting the dog to lay down.

That being said, I remember when I was going to college with my shorthair at her age of 2...$%*#@ that!!! It was awful
You are doing the best you can between classes and study to get the dog out, you consider yourself an outdoorsy person so it's no problem right? What a person considers outdoorsy compared to what a GSP considers outdoorsy is the difference of probably 5 to 6 hours more
You will both hate each other during college...that's just it. You'll get along fine on the weekends and during bird season because you'll skip classes anyway for early morning roosters...other than that, it's like all the other roomates you've had that left dirty dishes in the sink or played video games on LOUD until 2am...you will pass eachother in the hallway with dirty looks, but come friday it will all be forgotten. Come post Bac, or Post Masters, you'll be best friends again!

ENJOY!

Sounds like you know exactly what Im saying.

As for people saying hes spoiled I dont know how he is spoiled. He does not go outside when he whines, he only goes once he is settled down or does some other things for me first. I think there is a problem with people replying without reading all information in a post on this forum

[AzDoggin]

As for people saying hes spoiled I dont know how he is spoiled. He does not go outside when he whines, he only goes once he is settled down or does some other things for me first. I think there is a problem with people replying without reading all information in a post on this forum

Don't be so sensitive.

When you post a question on a public forum, you get ALL answers, not just the ones you agree with or the ones you like.

I doubt you will help yourself by complaining about the answers you don't want to hear.

If you will read and reflect on the information posted by some very experienced dog folks, you will learn something even if it doesn't feel all warm and fuzzy.

[recon033]

Don't be so sensitive.

When you post a question on a public forum, you get ALL answers, not just the ones you agree with or the ones you like.

I doubt you will help yourself by complaining about the answers you don't want to hear.

If you will read and reflect on the information posted by some very experienced dog folks, you will learn something even if it doesn't feel all warm and fuzzy.

I appreciate every bit of information on this forum, thats why I come here. I have no problem with any one that takes the time to reply and I thank all those that do reply, but you just told me to read and reflect on the information, when that is what I complained people who are all experienced dog folks of not doing when they reply. Anyway its not a big deal to me, I was simply just making a statement. And thanks again for all the input.

[Benny]

Sounds like you know exactly what Im saying.

Oh I feel your pain...my dog gave me heck all day today just trying to lay on the couch and take a sick day...she won.
I do like the "lay down" command when they're restless but unreasonable. Other times you just have to know it's unfair having a GSP boxed in for very long, it's a balancing act that I'm sure you're well aware of.

I don't envy you...and I'm never going back to college lol!

[Sharon]

For any behaviour you don't want , the key is to be consistently firm/tough and redirect to the crate etc..
I have 3 dogs in the house. I have one who is very vocal. That behaviour is never rewarded. I put her in a down and tell her off - - no noise! She gets the picture. You sound like a very nice man but maybe it's time to act a little fierce about what you will tolerate.

PS Doggin's first post is right on.

[AzDoggin]

Last night I was reading a section in Training the Sporting Dog (orange book by Donald Smith and Ervin Jones, 2002) http://www.ahdc.org/ahdcsite/storeitems.php.

Chapter 37 is Whining, Barking, and Howling. Here's what they had to say...it pretty much matches what folks have posted on this thread in terms of handling requirements:

"A dog that barks, whines, or howls (they are all the same, it's just a matter of degree) when he is left in a kennel, staked out, in the care, at your side, in a blind or boat hunting is a nuisance to everyone withing hearing range. He is wasting energy...It tells you one very important thing about his training - the dog has not accepted the very basic principle of restraint, which is to remain in position quietly. Barking is a protest against and refusal to accept restraint. Like any bad habit, it is easier to prevent than to correct after it is well established. (p329).

You will know the difference between the nervous fidgeting and whimper of the pup that needs to relieve himself and the whine of protest against restraint. Get after the protest immediately; do not let it become a habit. To physically punish a puppy is unfair and unnecessary. A show of displeasure (his dam growled at him) and a quiet Negative command is often adequate. If not, pick him up by the scruff of his neck and shake him lightly (which is what his dam did to chastise him). If he is really tuned up, give the Negative command and rattle and/or bang his crate. He will get the message quickly. In dealing with a somewhat older dog that starts to bark on restraint, you must get after him no matter where you are or where he is.

1. You hear the dog bark (whine)
2. Get to him quickly and aggressively
3. Negative command given harshly
4. Appropriate reinforcement (show displeasure, pick him up and shake him, put him down roughly, rattle his crate)
5. Dog is quiet (if you took him out of his crate to shake him, put him back in and close the door)
6. Walk away.

Repeat the sequence every time you hear the dog whine, bark, or howl. If this is done every time you hear a noise from the dog, he will learn fast that it is more pleasant if he stays quiet. Even the slightest whine is a protest against the restraint - get after him. Every time you return to the dog and he has been quiet, praise him generously. (p 329-330)"

IMO tethering the dog to you makes it very easy for you to modify his behavior - he's right there. I'd do a leash pop, or bump him with your knee and deliver a sharp No, very consistently with every noise he makes. He'll quiet in a hurry. From now forward, you can't let him keep practicing the "whine." Once you decide to stop the behavior, stop it.

[JKP]

I respect Don Smith but I would not use this method. I would use the collar and aversion training. Find the highly irritating level (don't punish the dog) and use it every time the dog starts to whine in the crate.

I would get in touch with owners who have littermates...if this is typical behavior for the litter, you may have a dog with weak nerves...dog that can't be calm....confidence issues....and this will never really be cured. But right now it is too early to tell. However, I wouldn't confront, bang the crate, shake the dog....that just breaks down the trust between you and the dog....let the dog learn that he can avoid unpleasantness by being quiet. Say nothing...just tap the collar...raise the level til he gets it. This dog is 8 months old and you need to get a handle on this behavior right now...because he thinks he runs you at this point.

[DogNewbie]

It sounds like a lot of the running takes place in the backyard. Could be that the dog needs the mental stimulation of running in a new place. You got any place you can let the dog run off leash and explore a bit? I think he's just bored with your backyard and doesn't know how to release his energy in a better way.

As for the whining, I follow those 6 steps as well. I generally don't shake the pup (I save that for when he does something really bad like tear something up) but I'll give him a sharp rap on the nose with a knuckle or the end of a leather lead (if he's on leash) and give a stern no.

[RoostersMom]

I was the one who wrote "spoiled", by that I mean a dog that is continually running around the house whining until you do something to pay attention to him. And being unwilling to crate him to help him settle down is a bit closed-minded. If he's getting proper exercise, which you say he is, then it won't kill him to crate him inside, even if you're home, until he learns to behave appropriately. OR, you can tether him to you and make him behave OR you can google NILIF and follow those steps - take the good advice with what you consider the "bad". I'm not saying he's spoiled rotten, just that he is getting his way (your attention) when he runs around the house and whines.

[Buckeye_V]

I thought you were talking about some of the posters on here

[POk3s]

I am new to this site and probably won't EVER have much advice to the dog training world as I am new to that myself....but in this case I think I can make an exception because I deal with this with my dog (just over a year old...15 months). He's done it forever and I honestly think it's a sense of "I wanna go home". When you mentioned you have two "homes" ...at home and at school, that seems to be the key. If I bring my dog somewhere, he's good for a little, he'll run around and get familiar to everything before calming down for a little. After a few hours he gets unbearable. He'll lay down for a second, then he's up and at the front door of the house, even though that's not where he gets let "out" to go to the bathroom while he's there, obviously. He's always pacing between me and the front door, then he's scratching at the front door, then he runs back to me then back to the door. It gets unbearable and finally I just have to leave which is probably the wrong way to go about it because he gets what he wants in the end.

I know you spend a lot of time in both places and hopefully he'll maybe just get used to it, and maybe the ways others have mentioned is indeed the way to fix it. But I do know the feeling because at the house my dog lays around quite a bit, even for a young dog. Get him somewhere else and he rarely ever lays down and just looks stressed. To wrap it all up I truly believe he's just not thinking that that house is also "home". Your other home is home and he wants to feel comfortable in his territory and go back there.