Most Famous EP Bloodlines Still Readily Available?

shaneroyce · Post by **shaneroyce** » Fri Mar 30, 2012 9:14 am

New to EP's, but have always heard of, and currently have, an Elhew bred pup. What are the 3-4 EP bloodlines that are available currently if I were looking to add another pup to the mix in the near future? I'm not talking so much about a regionally famous, current trend line, but a classic line that is available and consistently sought after and good. Also, if there are any particular trait(s) that makes them unique, I'd love to hear it.

ElhewPointer · Post by **ElhewPointer** » Fri Mar 30, 2012 9:23 am

And AAAWWWWWAAAAYYYYY we go.

PntrRookie · Post by **PntrRookie** » Fri Mar 30, 2012 9:24 am

shaneroyce wrote:but a classic line that is available and consistently sought after and good.

Come on Vagas...give him, er best

Miller, Elhew, Guard Rail, Honky Tonk Attitude, Blackhawk - in no particular order. All depends on what you like for style, run, range, retrieve, etc...they are all available.

shaneroyce · Post by **shaneroyce** » Fri Mar 30, 2012 9:33 am

Miller, Elhew, Guard Rail, Honky Tonk Attitude, Blackhawk - in no particular order. All depends on what you like for style, run, range, retrieve, etc...they are all available.[/quote]

Definitely not trying to open a can of worms. Just looking to add a pup in the future, and want a good one. I foot hunt chukar. Like a dog to range well, but not to the next horizon. Style is important, nothing quirky though...classic. Natural retrieve is important too. I really like the Elhew dogs, but don't know anything else. I'm very new to this EP world, and I love it. Let's hear them. Educate me!

Elkhunter · Post by **Elkhunter** » Fri Mar 30, 2012 9:34 am

Idaho is full of good pointers that are proven in your neck of the woods.

shaneroyce · Post by **shaneroyce** » Fri Mar 30, 2012 9:44 am

I'd also like to steer clear of lines that have a propensity for health issues, conformation flaws (underbites, etc.), and other issues. I realize all lines will have some of this, but also know some are more likely to exhibit them within a particular line.

I'm aware of some proven lines/dogs in my area, but would like to hear what everyone thinks are the classics that are hard to wrong with and have been proven everywhere for years. I'm not looking for a current trend as much as the classics that are still available to a guy like me. Elhew, in my mind is a good example of what I'm talking about. I just don't know any others. I'm looking forward to learning and possibly adding a pup as well from this info.

Rookie trainer by the way!

Cajun Casey · Post by **Cajun Casey** » Fri Mar 30, 2012 10:08 am

I like the dogs that come from Fiddlin' Rocky Boy breeding outside of the Honky Tonk Attitide (he died of cancer at 8 or 9) descendants. I also like Texas Squire breeding and Crow's Little Joe dogs.

gotpointers · Post by **gotpointers** » Fri Mar 30, 2012 10:11 am

They are here at my place

with the exception of the old real elhew if you can actually call them that. I have a Rock acre Blackhawk direct son. Out of a direct daughter of Guardrail from when he was bred to my female kraftsmans ko kane. Kraftsmans ko kane is a full sister of Millers Southern Pride, Wiggins prarie knot, Millers on line. I also have a direct son of Milers ghost rider with millers laci lu both being a direct Mr Miller breeding i would assume.
Also HTA. I have a direct son and daughter here.

My closest Sort of real Elhew was a son of Elhew Bullfrog. I just lost him to old age and he was sterile so i don't have anything out of him here. I don't think he was that good anyways. I have a daughter of Lancelot but i don't consider him all Elhew but just my opinion. There are more grand and great grand here of the big ones you asked about.but that's too far down the line on the ones you are asking about.

Troy08er · Post by **Troy08er** » Fri Mar 30, 2012 11:20 am

I have a friend that still has a few pups available. It's listed in the dogs for sale under EP California, which is ranch 1 kennel bred. I know Hoyle Eaton is breeding Sir Lancelot and Sir Eaton this year. Ranch 1 kennels has a few litters listed on his web page.PM ELKHUNTER I'm sure he could help you out. Maybe some others can post what's being bred at this time. Good luck.

Elkhunter · Post by **Elkhunter** » Fri Mar 30, 2012 11:56 am

shaneroyce wrote:I'd also like to steer clear of lines that have a propensity for health issues, conformation flaws (underbites, etc.), and other issues. I realize all lines will have some of this, but also know some are more likely to exhibit them within a particular line.

I'm aware of some proven lines/dogs in my area, but would like to hear what everyone thinks are the classics that are hard to wrong with and have been proven everywhere for years. I'm not looking for a current trend as much as the classics that are still available to a guy like me. Elhew, in my mind is a good example of what I'm talking about. I just don't know any others. I'm looking forward to learning and possibly adding a pup as well from this info.

Rookie trainer by the way!

Like I said some of the nicest pointers in the country reside near you! Go see em in person, and decide for yourself. Trained and hunted/competed in your backyard, why take someones word/opinion on the internet and buy a dog from the other side of the country?

birddog1968 · Post by **birddog1968** » Fri Mar 30, 2012 12:24 pm

Cajun Casey wrote:I like the dogs that come from Fiddlin' Rocky Boy breeding outside of the Honky Tonk Attitide (he died of cancer at 8 or 9) descendants. I also like Texas Squire breeding and Crow's Little Joe dogs.

better than half the deaths of all dogs over 8 are from some form of cancer.....

tommyboy72 · Post by **tommyboy72** » Fri Mar 30, 2012 12:59 pm

Fiddlin Rocky Boy not through HTA but through Turbo or High View Nickel and the Miller dogs especially going back to Miller's Silver Bullet. I am really fond of the Fiddlin Rocky Boy/Miller crosses.

Cajun Casey · Post by **Cajun Casey** » Fri Mar 30, 2012 1:09 pm

birddog1968 wrote:
Cajun Casey wrote:I like the dogs that come from Fiddlin' Rocky Boy breeding outside of the Honky Tonk Attitide (he died of cancer at 8 or 9) descendants. I also like Texas Squire breeding and Crow's Little Joe dogs.

better than half the deaths of all dogs over 8 are from some form of cancer.....

True.....lymphoma is the one I hate the most, I think.

prairiefirepointers · Post by **prairiefirepointers** » Fri Mar 30, 2012 2:05 pm

tommyboy72 wrote:Fiddlin Rocky Boy not through HTA but through Turbo or High View Nickel and the Miller dogs especially going back to Miller's Silver Bullet. I am really fond of the Fiddlin Rocky Boy/Miller crosses.

+1 on the FRB lines. I know a guy who's putting together a REAL NICE FRB breeding.

Post by **jcbuttry8** » Fri Mar 30, 2012 2:40 pm

prairiefirepointers wrote:
tommyboy72 wrote:Fiddlin Rocky Boy not through HTA but through Turbo or High View Nickel and the Miller dogs especially going back to Miller's Silver Bullet. I am really fond of the Fiddlin Rocky Boy/Miller crosses.
+1 on the FRB lines. I know a guy who's putting together a REAL NICE FRB breeding.

I heard you do, and a "bleep" fine breeding it will be. I will have a step brother to that by way of Jewel later this year. Can't wait.

Joe

gotpointers · Post by **gotpointers** » Fri Mar 30, 2012 2:46 pm

tommyboy72 wrote:Fiddlin Rocky Boy not through HTA but through Turbo or High View Nickel and the Miller dogs especially going back to Miller's Silver Bullet. I am really fond of the Fiddlin Rocky Boy/Miller crosses.

I won't let my HTA son near my 2 White Powder daughters no matter how much Fiddler is on his mom.

. Ranch one does have really nice dogs but i tried to stick to the ones named in the original question.

ymepointer · Post by **ymepointer** » Fri Mar 30, 2012 3:44 pm

go over to this thread on The fiedtrialer site....Very good recap of the modern pointer lines

http://thefieldtrialer.com/forum/viewto ... =12&t=2348

gotpointers · Post by **gotpointers** » Fri Mar 30, 2012 4:14 pm

I don't think there are any millers silver bullet direct offspring alive. Or frozen semen avalible? Miller is still selling dogs last one i heard went for 40,000 rumor has it.

tommyboy72 · Post by **tommyboy72** » Sat Mar 31, 2012 3:15 pm

prairiefirepointers wrote:
tommyboy72 wrote:Fiddlin Rocky Boy not through HTA but through Turbo or High View Nickel and the Miller dogs especially going back to Miller's Silver Bullet. I am really fond of the Fiddlin Rocky Boy/Miller crosses.
+1 on the FRB lines. I know a guy who's putting together a REAL NICE FRB breeding.

Can't wait. Been daydreaming about it since I spoke with you.

tommyboy72 · Post by **tommyboy72** » Sat Mar 31, 2012 3:24 pm

The Whippoorwill line of dogs are nice too. Seems to be a lot of this in the Phantom's Kennel line of dogs which Gotpointers has some of as well.

Troy08er · Post by **Troy08er** » Sat Mar 31, 2012 3:39 pm

NIce,is daisy sparks and snappbutton kay from the same litter?

prairiefirepointers wrote:
tommyboy72 wrote:Fiddlin Rocky Boy not through HTA but through Turbo or High View Nickel and the Miller dogs especially going back to Miller's Silver Bullet. I am really fond of the Fiddlin Rocky Boy/Miller crosses.
+1 on the FRB lines. I know a guy who's putting together a REAL NICE FRB breeding.

Ralph Ford · Post by **Ralph Ford** » Sat Mar 31, 2012 3:58 pm

Shane, What is the lineage on your "Elhew" bred pup?
IMO, It takes quite a dedicated breeder to create a line of dogs. Most aren't even recognized as such until it's in retrospect.

tommyboy72 · Post by **tommyboy72** » Sat Mar 31, 2012 5:56 pm

[quote="Troy08er"]NIce,is daisy sparks and snappbutton kay from the same litter?[quote]

Mother/Daughter I believe. Daisy Sparks is out of Snap Button Kay. Incidentally Daisy Sparks is the dam of Richfield Turbo who is going to be the sire of the fantastic FRB litter that Jess will have and Texasdogtrainer owns Richfield Turbo.

Troy08er · Post by **Troy08er** » Sat Mar 31, 2012 6:05 pm

My bad meant snapbutton belle.

http://www.tiptopwebsite.com/custommusi ... inters.pdf

tommyboy72 wrote:
Troy08er wrote:NIce,is daisy sparks and snappbutton kay from the same litter?

Mother/Daughter I believe. Daisy Sparks is out of Snap Button Kay. Incidentally Daisy Sparks is the dam of Richfield Turbo who is going to be the sire of the fantastic FRB litter that Jess will have and Texasdogtrainer owns Richfield Turbo.

Post by **jcbuttry8** » Sat Mar 31, 2012 6:35 pm

tommyboy72 wrote:
Troy08er wrote:NIce,is daisy sparks and snappbutton kay from the same litter?

Mother/Daughter I believe. Daisy Sparks is out of Snap Button Kay. Incidentally Daisy Sparks is the dam of Richfield Turbo who is going to be the sire of the fantastic FRB litter that Jess will have and Texasdogtrainer owns Richfield Turbo.

I am pretty sure hat turbo dog is throwing another great litter with jewel. If you like we can do some comparison runs

I see a battle Tommyboy. Don't make me wup you with an elhew cross.

Joe.

TRoberts · Post by **TRoberts** » Sat Mar 31, 2012 6:55 pm

Elkhunter wrote:
shaneroyce wrote:I'd also like to steer clear of lines that have a propensity for health issues, conformation flaws (underbites, etc.), and other issues. I realize all lines will have some of this, but also know some are more likely to exhibit them within a particular line.

I'm aware of some proven lines/dogs in my area, but would like to hear what everyone thinks are the classics that are hard to wrong with and have been proven everywhere for years. I'm not looking for a current trend as much as the classics that are still available to a guy like me. Elhew, in my mind is a good example of what I'm talking about. I just don't know any others. I'm looking forward to learning and possibly adding a pup as well from this info.

Rookie trainer by the way!
Like I said some of the nicest pointers in the country reside near you! Go see em in person, and decide for yourself. Trained and hunted/competed in your backyard, why take someones word/opinion on the internet and buy a dog from the other side of the country?

This extrordinary advise! You can't go wrong with proven dogs. JMHO.....good luck!

tommyboy72 · Post by **tommyboy72** » Sat Mar 31, 2012 7:16 pm

Troy08er wrote:My bad meant snapbutton belle.

http://www.tiptopwebsite.com/custommusi ... inters.pdf

Mother/Daughter I believe. Daisy Sparks is out of Snap Button Kay. Incidentally Daisy Sparks is the dam of Richfield Turbo who is going to be the sire of the fantastic FRB litter that Jess will have and Texasdogtrainer owns Richfield Turbo.

Not sure, that would be a question better directed at texasdogtrainer. He knows more about these lines than just about anyone I know.

tommyboy72 · Post by **tommyboy72** » Sat Mar 31, 2012 7:24 pm

jcbuttry8 wrote:
tommyboy72 wrote:
Mother/Daughter I believe. Daisy Sparks is out of Snap Button Kay. Incidentally Daisy Sparks is the dam of Richfield Turbo who is going to be the sire of the fantastic FRB litter that Jess will have and Texasdogtrainer owns Richfield Turbo.
I am pretty sure hat turbo dog is throwing another great litter with jewel. If you like we can do some comparison runs I see a battle Tommyboy. Don't make me wup you with an elhew cross.

Joe.

We might just have to do that Joe. Bring that pup on out here and we will have to see if we can get into some wild birds.

Texasdogtrainer · Post by **Texasdogtrainer** » Sat Mar 31, 2012 8:02 pm

[quote="Troy08er"]NIce,is daisy sparks and snappbutton kay from the same litter?

Daisy Sparks is a daughter of Ch. Snapbutton Kay

shaneroyce · Post by **shaneroyce** » Sat Mar 31, 2012 9:22 pm

Ralph Ford wrote:Shane, What is the lineage on your "Elhew" bred pup?
IMO, It takes quite a dedicated breeder to create a line of dogs. Most aren't even recognized as such until it's in retrospect.

pinehillkennels.com: Stagecoach Jack X Pinehill Elhew Cover Girl. Again, I'm new to the EP world, so maybe my pup is only "Elhew" in name? I don't know the history compared to how the Elhew breeding is now, but I sure like this pup.

prairiefirepointers · Post by **prairiefirepointers** » Sat Mar 31, 2012 11:13 pm

Texasdogtrainer wrote:
Troy08er wrote:NIce,is daisy sparks and snappbutton kay from the same litter?

Daisy Sparks is a daughter of Ch. Snapbutton Kay

Yep. AJ's stud and My female were sired by the same dog "Turbo" and his dog and mine's Dame's were littermates.

sckwest1 · Post by **sckwest1** » Sat Mar 31, 2012 11:36 pm

I think when everyone talks about Honky Tonk Attitude they focus to much on the Fiddler's Rocky Boy. His dam is just as impressive and perhaps even more impressive. His dam is a HOF daughter of HOF CH Addition's GoBoy to 3x NSTRA CH Lady's Pride Notion who herself is a daughter of HOF CH Fiddler's Pride. HTA has produced many champions and you will find his name in many pedigrees. If you are looking for horseback all age type dogs then you may want to look else where, but if you are looking for foot hunting/foot trialing dogs this is one of the more successful lines. HTA dogs are known for great style and super noses. HTA has crossed successfully with many bloodlines with the Elhew and Crow's Little Joe crosses being a couple of the more popular ones. We have dogs off HTA, NC Honky Tonk Highrise, and NC Honky Tonk Gigolo and are pleased with all of them. Here is one of our dogs with a lot of Fiddler in him without the HTA;
http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=3451 SCK

gotpointers · Post by **gotpointers** » Sun Apr 01, 2012 2:29 am

gotpointers wrote:
tommyboy72 wrote:Fiddlin Rocky Boy not through HTA but through Turbo or High View Nickel and the Miller dogs especially going back to Miller's Silver Bullet. I am really fond of the Fiddlin Rocky Boy/Miller crosses.
I won't let my HTA son near my 2 White Powder daughters no matter how much Fiddler is on his mom. . Ranch one does have really nice dogs but i tried to stick to the ones named in the original question.

I am not saying anything bad about HTA or his lines. I just have my White Powder daughters lined up elsewhere where i feel they match up better. Caladens Rail Hawk is going back to Koke and Jenny is set up to another dog also. My HTA son will be bred to a CLJ - HTA line female i purchased from Wrangler kennels. I have also put him in with Wizards Little Angel and Phantoms Sundancer both out of Phantoms kennels.

tommyboy72 · Post by **tommyboy72** » Sun Apr 01, 2012 10:11 pm

I hear a lot of people speak highly of Blackhawk dogs. I have no experience with them but just by looking at a pedigree he looks like a Fiddler/Miller dog to me.

tommyboy72 · Post by **tommyboy72** » Sun Apr 01, 2012 10:19 pm

You could probably get ahold of some fairly good Additions Go Boy line pups as well.

gotpointers · Post by **gotpointers** » Mon Apr 02, 2012 12:23 am

tommyboy72 wrote:I hear a lot of people speak highly of Blackhawk dogs. I have no experience with them but just by looking at a pedigree he looks like a Fiddler/Miller dog to me.

I am looking forward to find how blackhawks offspring are. I had a rockacre powderkeg son out of top deuction. I crossed him to my cliffs elhew belle female. All the pups were great. I kept one named bella and she still to this day is one of my favorites. Style to burn, dark Elhew eyes, built really well. I wish i could post a picture of her she's still here at my place. Her father was short coupled and her moms not bad but not great. I guess it goes back to "takes two ugly people to make a good looking kid"

My new Rockacre Blackhawk son is something that i am still working to learn all about him. He is out of Guard Rails Powder who is a daughter of my female koke when she was bred to Guard Rail. She is also a littermate to Harris kennels Guard Rail Spirit. My dog is also very closely related to Caladens Rail Hawk they share Blackhawk as a father and both of their moms are littermates. Blackhawk came out of a female named Santo who i would consider to be one of the best producers. I would call her the blue hen IMO. I am one of the ones that pays more attention to the matron than the sire line. But i would buy anything out of her and Swami if i had more room. My Kateri dog also has that matron line.

gotpointers · Post by **gotpointers** » Mon Apr 02, 2012 12:35 am

tommyboy72 wrote:You could probably get ahold of some fairly good Additions Go Boy line pups as well.

There was some frozen semen for sale that i contemplated buying over on the fieldtrialer.com but due to my females age i don't think it would have been a good option.

Troy08er · Post by **Troy08er** » Mon Apr 02, 2012 6:10 pm

Looks great,you keep any? If so, make sure you keep us updated ?

prairiefirepointers wrote:
Texasdogtrainer wrote:
Troy08er wrote:NIce,is daisy sparks and snappbutton kay from the same litter?

Daisy Sparks is a daughter of Ch. Snapbutton Kay
Yep. AJ's stud and My female were sired by the same dog "Turbo" and his dog and mine's Dame's were littermates.

sckwest1 · Post by **sckwest1** » Mon Apr 02, 2012 6:16 pm

Anybody know why when you breed Blackhawk tight the litter may have tricolor dogs and dogs with long hair?

birddogger · Post by **birddogger** » Mon Apr 02, 2012 6:22 pm

sckwest1 wrote:Anybody know why when you breed Blackhawk tight the litter may have tricolor dogs and dogs with long hair?

Yep.

Charlie

Texasdogtrainer · Post by **Texasdogtrainer** » Mon Apr 02, 2012 8:26 pm

I know, I know.

Adrian

tn red · Post by **tn red** » Mon Apr 02, 2012 8:31 pm

sckwest1 wrote:Anybody know why when you breed Blackhawk tight the litter may have tricolor dogs and dogs with long hair?

You dont have to breed it that tight to get tri-color if you tight breed Blackhawk you'll end up with setters

Post by **jcbuttry8** » Mon Apr 02, 2012 8:40 pm

What???? I thought all EP's were tri color!!!! I thought it was just the rejects that came out white with a little color.

Joe

gotpointers · Post by **gotpointers** » Mon Apr 02, 2012 8:48 pm

tn red wrote:
sckwest1 wrote:Anybody know why when you breed Blackhawk tight the litter may have tricolor dogs and dogs with long hair?
You dont have to breed it that tight to get tri-color if you tight breed Blackhawk you'll end up with setters

Had i known ahead of time i wouldint have bought all the new setters also

prairiefirepointers · Post by **prairiefirepointers** » Mon Apr 02, 2012 8:58 pm

Troy08er wrote:Looks great,you keep any? If so, make sure you keep us updated ?

I'll sure keep ya'll updated on it. I am waiting for Sam to come in. Jessica (my wife) says it should be around the middle of this month. I know AJ and I are pretty stoked about this breeding. Sit and wait.... (Not something I'm good at unless I have a boat and a fishing pole)

Texasdogtrainer · Post by **Texasdogtrainer** » Tue Apr 03, 2012 5:15 am

It looks like my daughter of Ch. Honky Tonk Gigolo is coming into season. I have two super nice pups out of her already and orginially I was going to bred her to my winning son of Ch. Belfield Silver. However she lines of better with Turbo so I am going to bred her to him.

Ralph Ford · Post by **Ralph Ford** » Tue Apr 03, 2012 1:02 pm

Texasdogtrainer wrote:It looks like my daughter of Ch. Honky Tonk Gigolo is coming into season. I have two super nice pups out of her already and orginially I was going to bred her to my winning son of Ch. Belfield Silver. However she lines of better with Turbo so I am going to bred her to him.

Adrian,
My littermate pup to yours is also pretty nice. Tons of point. High tail all the time. He got a ton of birdwork here last month when the woodcock blew through. He runs so hard through the woods I thought I was going to find him shis-kabobbed somewhere.

up-hunter · Post by **up-hunter** » Tue Apr 03, 2012 2:21 pm

Is turbo still alive?

Texasdogtrainer · Post by **Texasdogtrainer** » Tue Apr 03, 2012 4:15 pm

Ralph Ford wrote:
Texasdogtrainer wrote:It looks like my daughter of Ch. Honky Tonk Gigolo is coming into season. I have two super nice pups out of her already and orginially I was going to bred her to my winning son of Ch. Belfield Silver. However she lines of better with Turbo so I am going to bred her to him.
Adrian,
My littermate pup to yours is also pretty nice. Tons of point. High tail all the time. He got a ton of birdwork here last month when the woodcock blew through. He runs so hard through the woods I thought I was going to find him shis-kabobbed somewhere.

I like the two that I have, really nice on point and right now are showing field trial potential. Check my website and look at how Zoiee is lining up with Turbo.

http://www.pokerstraightkennel.com

Texasdogtrainer · Post by **Texasdogtrainer** » Tue Apr 03, 2012 4:16 pm

[quote="up-hunter"]Is turbo still alive?[/quote

Not sure is Turbo is still alive. He would be pretty old now.

Adrian