How Many Of You Run "Naked"? Why And How?

[bigbob]

I was thinking this morning about all of the gadgets I have on my dog when we're out hunting, and started to wonder why. I understand all of the benefits of e-collars, gps units, launchers, etc, but was wondering how many of you that hunt wild birds in broken and steep country do it without all of the gadgets? I'm talking start to finish...no e-collars, launchers, gps units, etc in the training to finished hunting dog process. FYI, I am considering taking the e-collar off the dog, going to using all wild birds (running the dog in the bird hills) for training (I have an abundance of wild chukar, huns, and quail near me) to see if I could actually do it. I am a beginning trainer at best with a pretty bold 18 month old EP, but it seems like for a dog that you only want to be staunch on point, wild birds, a recall command, a turn command, and whoa (strictly for manners around the house) would be sufficient (kennel is a good one too). The big question for you guys that do it that way or a similar way is why do you do it that way, and how do you get there. These pointers seem to have selective hearing at 12-24 months (mine is in that age), and I wonder if I can take the stuff away and still put together a bird dog that is a pleasure to hunt over and with. Do you have to be willing to deal with occasional run-offs, or do you do other things to make sure things go great while in the field. My dog knows these commands, but needs a little "reminder" with the collar pretty regularly. What are your thoughts? Am I crazy to think that I could accomplish this with this particular and my future dogs? Again, I have nothing against the gadgets. I have way over $1,000 in electronics so I don't need convinced that they are very helpful. Necessary...no, helpful...yes. Let's hear all of you "minimalists"!

[topher40]

It depends on the dog. I have an old Setter that I have run "naked" for the past 5+ years. I know I cant lose him, never have and he is as steady on his birds as they come. He doesnt try to get away with stuff. On the other hand I have a 3.5 yr old pointer that I wouldnt feel comfortable turning loose without at least a tracker, but I have lost her before. These two dogs run the same ranges so that doesnt matter, mile +. The setter is 13 and I trust him, thats the difference. As a dog gets older they "earn:" the right to run naked but again it all depends on the dog.

[Troy08er]

I always run an E-collar or GPS, it's back up for the dogs safety.

[JIM K]

46 yrs in wild woods of pa and nothing more than BELL on dog.i do like the new beeper collars when dog is on point .
but most likely just use my bell.

i TRY to make sure i have dog that is always looking for me while he hunts.some dont like this BUT its nice to know you have dog that will not just hunt for himself and forget you.
labs are great dogs at this.
so far my SMALL MUNSTERLANDER is showing this too, he looks for me.

but i do things like HIDE from him if he goes to FAR out.
it works. he will hunt closer this way.
whiskers will hunt in rain/snow/wind/dark when we both get thru with growing up in woods.
my biggest worry is rattlesnakes this year.
i saw some of biggest ones this weekend,i mean BIGONES.

[AZ Brittany Guy]

When their are safety belts in a truck/car, I use them no matter where we are going. If you have a tracker collar and don't use it, I have to ask why not. Field Trialers need to "proof" their dogs with no ecollar for a trial but a tracker / GPS is always a good percaution regardless of the dog. $tuff Happens

[Ruffshooter]

Bells and beepers on the bigger running dogs. That is it.

I do not like gadgets. I am in the woods to be in the woods I am hunting not there to play will electronics.
I am not sophisticated enough to use them easily anyways.
I don't even like the sound of Beepers but have a couple dogs that I need it. Especially as my hearing has dropped off the past couple years. I do not have the cell Phone on when in the woods not that there is much reception where I primarly hunt. I have a walky talky for just in case. I have a compass and a simple GPS etrek just in case I get messed up.

Just me and My Opinion.
Rick

[JIM K]

Bells and beepers on the bigger running dogs. That is it.

I do not like gadgets. I am in the woods to be in the woods I am hunting not there to play will electronics.
I am not sophisticated enough to use them easily anyways.
I don't even like the sound of Beepers but have a couple dogs that I need it. Especially as my hearing has dropped off the past couple years. I do not have the cell Phone on when in the woods not that there is much reception where I primarly hunt. I have a walky talky for just in case. I have a compass and a simple GPS etrek just in case I get messed up.

Just me and My Opinion.
Rick

you are like me. i have garmin handheld GPS and still dont know how to use it.1 time due to leaves on trees it went dead on satellites.
10 minutes before dark and wind blowing etc with toby my lab.
thank gosh i had compass.
NO MORE RELYING ON GPS IN HEAVY WOODS.

i too like just bell but now i also like bell and the beeper collar if on point.i wish it had a LOCATOR beeper also.

to me, thats most important thing in woods.
remote in your hand and a way to BEEP your dog only.to locate him/her.

but the bell is fine for me too and i just ordered the best one and i cant hear it.
bummer,so going back to cow bell type.

[Elkhunter]

I do it for the safety of the dog, out here they are tons of people that trap and many places a dog could get hung up. I had a dog fall in an abandoned man hole and I did not put his tracker on him. Took me 2 days to find him, another guy had his dog get ledged up hunting chukar and took him 2 days to find him. A dog could get caught in a trap and without a tracker or GPS you would never find em. JMO

[Trekmoor]

Maybe If I lived in the U.S. I'd use gadgets like locator collars but I don't. I train and I work my dogs with no gadgets at all other than a slip lead and a whistle. I also use a couple of training dummies and maybe something to make a bang from time to time but that's it. I normally take a dog out with just a lead and a whistle.

I teach other people to train their dogs, spaniels, retrievers and hunt-point- retrievers in the same way too. It works so I keep on training dogs and people in that way ..... as does almost everyone else over on this side of the pond. It takes longer to train the dogs probably but I'm not competing in a race.

Recently I bought a couple of radio release pigeon launchers and a loft load of pigeons and I haven't ever used them ! Wild game and an attentive trainer make the best training gadgets. I also have a hand held dummy launcher which has been unused for so long it is now a heap of rust and I have a 15-20 feet long checkcord that rarely sees the light of day.

I think gadgets can make training easier so I am not against them , I just rarely find them neccessary. The one gadget I would like to have is a helper to throw and place dummies and to fire shots.

Bill T.

[JIM K]

I do it for the safety of the dog, out here they are tons of people that trap and many places a dog could get hung up. I had a dog fall in an abandoned man hole and I did not put his tracker on him. Took me 2 days to find him, another guy had his dog get ledged up hunting chukar and took him 2 days to find him. A dog could get caught in a trap and without a tracker or GPS you would never find em. JMO

you are right on traps but most of time your dog will yell like h when he is in one.
you will hear that .it sends chills up your spine. :roll:
new traps catch your dog around the neck. yes they could choke your dog.
i am not against the new GPS collars. they dont work in pa under leaves of trees.
i have had dogs for 46 years and never lost one YET. :roll:
beagles sometimes would not return until midnight.

my biggest concern is copperheads/rattlesnakees.with the weather getting WARMER in october now in pa during the grouse season,snakes are out.
years ago it was too cold. leaves are now staying on longer too so brush is thicker later.

[Hondo]

I believe that the quote below from a article I read a while back makes a compelling argument as to why you may want to use the technology that has been developed to train dogs quicker and faster. I'm not saying people aren't successful without technology, but why not take advantage of every tool afforded to us.

“The E-collar can make a good dog great and a great dog a champion,” he said. “A retriever has only so much lifespan. With an E-collar, you pack two years of manual training into six months and get two extra seasons with a finished retriever.” Jerry Simmons

Read more: http://www.gameandfishmag.com/2011/03/0 ... z22W3epzf8

Hondo

[JKP]

I can hunt without the ecollar, even for days at a time, but I prefer to have them on for safety. There are dangers out there that sometimes need to be avoided. With the trained dogs, I only use the "pager"...the dogs know its a come around/to the front signal...keeps us away from roads, rail, property owners, etc. Don't need GPS...my dogs are pretty much in that 100-200 yd zone all the time.

[birddog1968]

I believe that the quote below from a article I read a while back makes a compelling argument as to why you may want to use the technology that has been developed to train dogs quicker and faster. I'm not saying people aren't successful without technology, but why not take advantage of every tool afforded to us.

“The E-collar can make a good dog great and a great dog a champion,” he said. “A retriever has only so much lifespan. With an E-collar, you pack two years of manual training into six months and get two extra seasons with a finished retriever.” Jerry Simmons

Read more: http://www.gameandfishmag.com/2011/03/0 ... z22W3epzf8

Hondo

You can also end up with a collar wise/Trial wise dog who's days of competing are over or never got started.....Im not against the collar, but i believe it needs to be used
thoughtfully.

[Elkhunter]

I do it for the safety of the dog, out here they are tons of people that trap and many places a dog could get hung up. I had a dog fall in an abandoned man hole and I did not put his tracker on him. Took me 2 days to find him, another guy had his dog get ledged up hunting chukar and took him 2 days to find him. A dog could get caught in a trap and without a tracker or GPS you would never find em. JMO

you are right on traps but most of time your dog will yell like h when he is in one.
you will hear that .it sends chills up your spine. :roll:
new traps catch your dog around the neck. yes they could choke your dog.
i am not against the new GPS collars. they dont work in pa under leaves of trees.
i have had dogs for 46 years and never lost one YET. :roll:
beagles sometimes would not return until midnight.

my biggest concern is copperheads/rattlesnakees.with the weather getting WARMER in october now in pa during the grouse season,snakes are out.
years ago it was too cold. leaves are now staying on longer too so brush is thicker later.

I look at it as worst case scenario, say your dog gets bit by a rattler and shuts down and huddles up somewhere. My garmin or tracker will tell me where he is, or the one time your dog happens to chase a deer or rabbit and gets turned around or injured somewhere. I think there is a stigma with tracking collars that if you are using one it means your dog is out of control or you have not trained him. The tracking collar for me has been one of the best tools I have ever used, in chukar country a dog can drop off a ridge and disappear, normally I would have no idea where he was and end up hollering and hacking him till he came back. Now I just watch my Garmin and know he is at my 2 o'clock and headed to the front.

[Trekmoor]

I have never used a tracking collar but a friend of mines has one and I am quite impressed with how useful it can be. There seems to be no stigma attached to running a pointing breed over here wearing a tracker collar but put an e-collar on a dog and there is lots of trouble from just about everyone that sees it ! I am pretty sure that if I lived in America a tracking collar would be a "must have" for me.

Bill T.

[JIM K]

GPS is hard to get to work here in pa do to leaves on trees etc.
but, if you can enter your truck into it and it works in your area,THAT IS BIG PLUS.
this would allow you to hunt anywhere in my area and not know where you are going, JUST GO HUNT and know at end of hunt you can find your truck at dark.

if GARMIN GPS dog collar can do that, its a must for hunting where you dont know area.