FF wont open mouth

[JoshHaker]

This is my first time FF a dog. (GSP) I am using the NAVHDA green book method. For about the first week and a half I have been telling him fetch and opening his mouth and placing a paint roller in his mouth. he will hold it for a while usually I tell him drop it after about 20 seconds. I would tap the ends of the roller and he would still hold it well. So I decided to move to the next step with the ear pinch and he will not open his mouth! I have tried usuing my fingernail against his collar, the flat part of my thumb against the buckle still nothing. I started firmly and then pushed very hard and still he will not open his mouth. He did whine and squirm but never opened mouth. So after that I reverted back to the previous step and finished the lesson. That was today. What sould I do next continue with the previous step?

[Johng918]

Start on the ear from the beginning open his mouth and make him take it when he does let off he will get it but only leave it in about 5 seconds at a time until he gets it. Take your time with it don't rush it. How old is the dog?

[Wildweeds]

How old is the dog?

[JoshHaker]

3.5 yrs canyou describe pinching the ear and opening the mouth and inserting the bumperat the same time. Iam having a hard time understanding how to do all three at the same time.

[Wildweeds]

At 3.5 years I might change the method and get that lockjaw a moving the Robert Wehle style, throw the bumper on the ground stand over the dog as if saddled,step on the backfoot until you get a yip and force the dog to scoop up the bumper ................ then release the pressure.............It's in the wing and shot book with pictures.

I saw a lab pro demonstrate the FF technique,he didn't open the mouth,he pinched the ear until the dog basically tried to bite him and then shoved the bumper in the dogs mouth before he did get bit.

3.5 yrs canyou describe pinching the ear and opening the mouth and inserting the bumperat the same time. Iam having a hard time understanding how to do all three at the same time.

[brad27]

I saw a lab pro demonstrate the FF technique,he didn't open the mouth,he pinched the ear until the dog basically tried to bite him and then shoved the bumper in the dogs mouth before he did get bit.

Yikes! That sounds more dangerous then defanging a rattlesnake.

[steamer]

i am in no way an expert on this and there are people on here that are this is just what has worked for me.the ear pinch needs to be very sharp from the start you need to be able to make him yelp as soon as you start the pressure. as soon as he opens his mouth to yelp shove the roller in. i put on the e collar high up on the neck tight enough i can get my fingers underneath and flip the ear back and use my thumb nail to pinch against the buckel.the e collar just makes a better hand hold for me.i would probably go back and re read this section of the book a few times . if you belong to a navhda chapter i would ask some one for help . you can do it but it helps to have some that has done it before to help out.good luck

[tasi devil]

i had exactly the same problem your having ; i went to a toe hitch pulling forward with not much more success.
then a friend told me to stick with the toe hitch & pull back down the dogs body towards the back leg.
worked a treat.

................tasi

[JoshHaker]

Here is an update. This morning I used the ear pinch with my left hand on the collar and used my right thumb while holding the bumper to pry betweeen the jawsbehind the canines and insert the roller. It worked well. Had his tail down while applying the pressure but would wag it after the pressure was released and he was holding the bumper. At the end of this short lesson he was opening his mouth faster than at the beginning.

[Johng918]

People think Im crazy but I have found that the dog takes to it better with least amount of force on the ear just enough to make them uncomfortable you don't need to hurt them for them to understand what your asking them to do.

[birddog1968]

People think Im crazy but I have found that the dog takes to it better with least amount of force on the ear just enough to make them uncomfortable you don't need to hurt them for them to understand what your asking them to do.

+1


I personally like the toe hitch, mouth goes towards the discomfort which is down towards the table which is where you want them picking up the bumper in the long run....and as John said more pressure is not the answer....

[gonehuntin']

Here is the correct grip to use when forcing with the ear pinch.



This is the training collar I use. It has a golf spike, blunted, in it for applying pressure to the ear. My dog's ALWAYS wear an ecollar in training or at play, even it it's a dummy collar.



The more pressure you apply to the dog, the faster he will force, BUT you CANNOT apply so much pressure that he is in too much pain to complete the task. It's a precise ballet of pressure and response.

[DonF]

I much prefered a 1 1/4" hardwood dowel to a paint roller. Couple of reasons. When the pressure starts, the dog will have a tendicity to bite down hard, I don't want it crushing a buck. Next step is a frozen bird, frozen for the same reason. When I started, I'd opeen the mouth had put it in several times. then I would go to the ear pinch. holding the dowell at the dogs jaw in front, fetch, pinch and roll the dowell in all at the same time. Roll the dowell toward the dog pushing down a bit on the lower jaw, it helps get the dog to open it's mouth.

[Georgia Boy]

Another thing to consider is where you are pinching the dogs ear, if you are out around the edges or even anywhere on the "flap" there is not much feeling, kind of like our ear lobe. If you look inside a dogs ear down closer to the base of the skull you will see roughly a pea sized "lump" in the contours of the ear. Applying the pressure in this area yields much better results.

[JoshHaker]

Dang, I really appreciate the help guys! (and girls of coarse!) I just finished the afternoon session with him and what a difference! He is now reaching for the roller immediately. I am now barely applying any pressure on the ear before he is reaching out and taking it.