Are E-collars a necessity?

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TheLukai1100
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Are E-collars a necessity?

Post by TheLukai1100 » Fri Dec 07, 2012 7:48 am

I'm getting a GSP in June (planned breeding anyways), and everyone around here uses a E-collar. but they also say that a e-collar will mess a dog up if you don't know what your doing with them (which I don't).
so I decided to just not get a E-collar. will I be at any disadvantage when training if I don't use a e-collar?

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gotpointers
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Re: Are E-collars a necessity?

Post by gotpointers » Fri Dec 07, 2012 7:54 am

I would rather have just a check cord. The e collar for me is just a backup device.

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Re: Are E-collars a necessity?

Post by slistoe » Fri Dec 07, 2012 8:01 am

If you can't train without one, you can't train with one.

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Sharon
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Re: Are E-collars a necessity?

Post by Sharon » Fri Dec 07, 2012 8:10 am

Well , what other plan do you have for getting your dog to come in when it's out there 100 + yards and is ignoring your voice?
What will you do if it takes off after deer or heads for the road?
Any sane person without anger / low frustration problems can use an e collar effectively.
Couple of principles to follow and you are good to go. :)
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Re: Are E-collars a necessity?

Post by JIM K » Fri Dec 07, 2012 8:42 am

Sharon wrote:Well , what other plan do you have for getting your dog to come in when it's out there 100 + yards and is ignoring your voice?
What will you do if it takes off after deer or heads for the road?
Any sane person without anger / low frustration problems can use an e collar effectively.
Couple of principles to follow and you are good to go. :)

46 yrs hunting with dog and i never had e-collar.
but your points are valid. i had to think,JIM HOW DID YOU GET YOUR DOG TO LISTEN?
i think it comes to breed of dog also. i always seemed to have dogs that LOOKED for me and hunted for me.

but a dog will chase a deer.
what did i do all those years?
i chased the dog yelling, NO.when dog got back to me,i said,NO.
SOME TAKE A TWITCH TO PUP .i dont do that, i dont want him to be afraid of me but i use fly swather at home ,so twitch could be all right .


now on porky most dogs learn by getting quills in their mouth.
so cost of quill at vet will be cost of e-collart.
but will you be able to shock pup before he gets porky? not really.

i use BELL only on my dogs. highways are your biggest problem with any dog.
it seems that rabbit or deer will head to highway .usually your pup gets hit.


so e-collar could help there a lot.

but most of friends that have e-collar on dog very seldom use it ,if any .

saying NO to dog that does wrong thing and using a twitch to spank pup will correct most dogs of chasing deer.

but going towards highway, nothing seemed to work for me .
that is where MAYBE a e-collar would help,dont know.

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Re: Are E-collars a necessity?

Post by duckn66 » Fri Dec 07, 2012 9:28 am

TheLukai1100 wrote:I'm getting a GSP in June (planned breeding anyways), and everyone around here uses a E-collar. but they also say that a e-collar will mess a dog up if you don't know what your doing with them (which I don't).
so I decided to just not get a E-collar. will I be at any disadvantage when training if I don't use a e-collar?
Yes you can train a dog without an e collar. It was going on for centuries before they were invented and will continue happening. I'm with the other poster. If you can't train without one then how do you think you can train with one.

Your dog should know and obey commands before you even press the button on a collar.

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gotpointers
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Re: Are E-collars a necessity?

Post by gotpointers » Fri Dec 07, 2012 9:36 am

What everybody is basically saying is use a. Checkcord and have your dog knowing and obeying all commands. Then use the collar when the dog gets selective hearing on what had already been trained. Also emergencys.

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Re: Are E-collars a necessity?

Post by benelli » Fri Dec 07, 2012 9:59 am

I'm new to this whole thing too (we have an 8 month old GSP) and we started out thinking same as you, that with all the damage it can do we just wouldn't bother. But the vegetation where we live is a bunch of shrubby bushes 2-3 feet high, which doesn't work at all with a check cord - it gets snagged in twenty places before the dog moves ten feet. The dog is pretty responsive and obedient in the yard and on-leash, but not necessarily if he's out running free. Yes, there are other ways to try to combat that, but after doing research it seemed like the most straightforward answer was to get an e-collar.

We're trying to be very deliberate about how we use it and what we use it for, and I'm researching every aspect of e-collar training I can think of so once we turn it on we can be pretty certain we know what we need to do to accomplish our goals. But it's not like we can just plan on the e-collar fixing all the dog's weak areas - he has to know the commands first, and the e-collar will basically just be an invisible, 1/2-mile long leash.

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Re: Are E-collars a necessity?

Post by rinker » Fri Dec 07, 2012 10:29 am

Of course an ecollar is not a necessity. Bird dogs were being trained for many years before an ecollar was even imagined. Indoor plumbing is also not a necessity. People were doing their business for years before indoor plumbing was even imagined, but it sure is nice to have.

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Re: Are E-collars a necessity?

Post by ezzy333 » Fri Dec 07, 2012 10:39 am

No way a necessity but the best luxury you will ever have in the field of dog training. And they aren't hard o use.

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Re: Are E-collars a necessity?

Post by Brazosvalleyvizslas » Fri Dec 07, 2012 10:45 am

An e-collar is merely an extended lead/leash when used properly. I think they are a valuable tool that allows a trainer to make timely corrections at distance. If a dog is properly introduced and conditioned to the collar, it's no more harsh or inhumane than a choke or pinch collar. I can't even feel Triteonics lowest setting and some collars have a vibrate mode. Do I think it's a necessity? Yes and no. It's a necessity to own one but not always use it.

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Re: Are E-collars a necessity?

Post by tdhusker » Fri Dec 07, 2012 1:58 pm

ezzy333 wrote:No way a necessity but the best luxury you will ever have in the field of dog training. And they aren't hard o use.

Ezzy

This^^^^^^^

Can't imagine having to go without. If anything, people are hurting their dogs by not using them enough, IMO.

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Re: Are E-collars a necessity?

Post by cptn » Fri Dec 07, 2012 2:58 pm

I always hear about how someone can severely "mess up" or "ruin" a dog if the collar is not used correctly. What exactly does that mean?
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Re: Are E-collars a necessity?

Post by Brazosvalleyvizslas » Fri Dec 07, 2012 3:10 pm

Usually they expect the collar to magically train the dog rather than using it to enforce commands that the dog already knows 100%. They "burn" up softer dogs because they don't understand how to use the collar properly and they haven't spent the time to condition the dog to the collar.

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Re: Are E-collars a necessity?

Post by Steve007 » Fri Dec 07, 2012 3:32 pm

Get one with a beeper that you can turn on and off from the transmitter. Some day, you'll be very happy you have a "locate" option.

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Re: Are E-collars a necessity?

Post by Sharon » Fri Dec 07, 2012 10:58 pm

Good advice. i discovered that this year with an older dog that gets turned around. Dogtra 2500 B/T
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Re: Are E-collars a necessity?

Post by Toabster » Sat Dec 08, 2012 7:49 am

cptn wrote:I always hear about how someone can severely "mess up" or "ruin" a dog if the collar is not used correctly. What exactly does that mean?
I've read studies where they found that incorrect / inconsistent use of an e-collar lead to permanent elevated stress levels and anxiety for a dog. An anxious, stressed dog will hardly make a good companion (not to mention the cruelty of it).

We got an e-collar at about 7-8 months when Max went through a phase of zero recall. We live in the city and had a few close calls where he ran to chase a flock of birds and on to the road. That was the last drop for me.

Now, we use it sparingly.

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Re: Are E-collars a necessity?

Post by Fester » Sat Dec 08, 2012 8:16 am

I use Ecollars on all my dogs mainly for the locater almost never use stimulation but it is a great tool to have if needed, also a safety factor for the dog
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Re: Are E-collars a necessity?

Post by Trekmoor » Sat Dec 08, 2012 2:11 pm

I have an e-collar but only use it for sheep or deer chasing dogs. I don't train anything with it like sits or recall whistle.

Very probably if I lived in the States I would use an e-collar a lot more but the "culture" is very different here. Somehow, I have managed to train labs, pointing breeds and spaniels to trial standards without using an e-collar for about half a century.

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Re: Are E-collars a necessity?

Post by JIM K » Sat Dec 08, 2012 2:51 pm

Toabster wrote:
cptn wrote:I always hear about how someone can severely "mess up" or "ruin" a dog if the collar is not used correctly. What exactly does that mean?
I've read studies where they found that incorrect / inconsistent use of an e-collar lead to permanent elevated stress levels and anxiety for a dog. An anxious, stressed dog will hardly make a good companion (not to mention the cruelty of it).

We got an e-collar at about 7-8 months when Max went through a phase of zero recall. We live in the city and had a few close calls where he ran to chase a flock of birds and on to the road. That was the last drop for me.

Now, we use it sparingly.
just happened to me today.what did i do? first he is not getting off the checkcord around house.
next i have a wireless dog fence now and last but best.
I ORDERED A GARMIN ALPHA dog collar.

i hated to spend that kind of money but at 59 yrs young, too old dog to be chasing pup around at home and in woods yelling etc.

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Re: Are E-collars a necessity?

Post by JIM K » Sat Dec 08, 2012 2:56 pm

skunk
Fester wrote:I use Ecollars on all my dogs mainly for the locater almost never use stimulation but it is a great tool to have if needed, also a safety factor for the dog
Fester

that sums it up very well. IF a deer,IF a porky,if skunk,IF a highway,IF a rattlesnake,IF cat etc.
you may never need it but its there.
GARMIN ALPHA is good at doing both, finding dog and correcting it.

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Re: Are E-collars a necessity?

Post by cleanslate » Sat Dec 08, 2012 7:20 pm

Go to the web site sitmeanssit.com They are doing amasing things with an e collar. The e collar is soooo much more useful than people really think. I have found that the collar eliminates the heavy handed handler. Sometimes if a person isnt careful he/she can give too hard a correction using the traditional methods. Sometimes frustration gets the best of us, and we dont realise we are doing it until the dog starts to crater. The collar helps eliminate this situation.

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