QUESTIONS

skippy · Post by **skippy** » Wed Aug 30, 2006 12:01 pm

I have been reading this site for a while. I have lots of questions but I will not ask them all at once.

I have 2 GSP's. My main question is I would like to run in trials. I do not have a horse is their other options. I know that there is NSTRA. I am confused is why NSTRA is not looked upon like others. What do you guys think that my best options are. I live in Utah I have 2 GSP's A puppy and a 2 yo. HELP ME PLEASE.

Post by **ezzy333** » Wed Aug 30, 2006 12:58 pm

Welcome aboard! There are several people in Utah w3ho are interested in trials of different kinds and I'm sure some of them could help you. Watch for Addict, Tak, Casper, and several others. You can find them many night in the chat room.

Hope you get your answers.

Ezzy

Dirtysteve · Post by **Dirtysteve** » Wed Aug 30, 2006 1:31 pm

Skippy
There is alot of NSTRA trials held in Utah, get ahold of TAK he will get you a schedule. Also the GSPCU will be holding a hunt test on Nov. 11th. We are also going to try and hold a walking fun trial before the end of the year.
NAVHDA holds several test throught the year also but you would have to get ahold of Addict for that info.

I am confused is why NSTRA is not looked upon like others

That is a can of worms that somebody else can answer. I personally like NSTRA but also like broke dog stakes so I can go either way.

PntrRookie · Post by **PntrRookie** » Wed Aug 30, 2006 1:52 pm

Skippy, NSTRA is a great place to get your start. It will all snowball after that...either within NSTRA or other trial venues. NSTRA is set up to extend your hunting season. Go, enter, and enjoy.

PointerMan · Post by **PointerMan** » Wed Aug 30, 2006 2:14 pm

I may have this wrong, so others can correct me if I am.

Hunt test = Everyone can be a winner or a loser, your dog is judged against a standard for the test you pick, i.e.. Jr. Hunter, Sr. Hunter, Master Hunter. Pass/fail. No direct competition. I believe all is done from foot.

Field Trials (AKC or American Field) = dogs are braced together and judges keep notes on a dogs performance no real scoring system. They are judged to a standard by stake. Like Open Derby would mean a dog younger then 2.5 years old (Am. Field) that does not have to be broke to wing and shot, that runs to a All Age standard(range). Only the top 3 competitors will place based on their performance. They have walking and horse back versions of this. They also have different classes of puppies, derbies, and adults in Amateur and Professional classes.

NSTRA = dogs are braced together, judges score the dogs on ground coverage(0-100), Obedience(0-75), Finds(0-100) each, Retrieves(0-100) each, Backs(0-75) only 1. The dogs must be broke to flush at a minimum. After your brace it is easy to see you score and see where the judge marked you up and down. For the most part the trials, amateurs and professionals all run together, and sometimes they do have derby awards.
Top 4 competitors based on they scores get placements.

ckfowler · Post by **ckfowler** » Wed Aug 30, 2006 3:04 pm

Pretty concise descriptions already. Add in tournament types of events where the dog that finds the quota of birds fastest and the handler that misses the fewest shots wins.

Arguements over "my dog found more birds than the others" and "my dog has more style and class than yours" seperates many of us. NSTRA tries to do both as each bird found is a scoring opportunity. The dog that finds more birds has more chances to earn points so often does better. How well they handle the birds seperates the ones who found the same number of birds (usually). NSTRA and tournaments are run on smaller courses than traditional AF events which is another point of discussion.

Run in something so you have a base to compare to other types or what you like and dislike.

skippy · Post by **skippy** » Wed Aug 30, 2006 3:05 pm

Dirtysteve wrote: We are also going to try and hold a walking fun trial before the end of the year.

What is a walking fun trial. Is that something that I do at night with my pigeons? I am a prideful person

ok not really but I would like things recongnized if the dog deserves it.

Why is NSTRA not recognized. I do LIKE NSTRA and its set up I think it is the way to go.

I want to thank you all for helping me I think this is the best site hands down. So I hope no one thinks that I am a A$$ I just want to learn.

sharptailhunter · Post by **sharptailhunter** » Wed Aug 30, 2006 3:12 pm

Skippy,

What part of UT are you from? You can just PM me if you want to, I can give ya the names of a few shorthair boys down yer way and they can help ya get a look at what trialn' is all about.

skippy · Post by **skippy** » Wed Aug 30, 2006 3:17 pm

Besides HT is NSTRA the only thing in UTAH.

GsPJustin · Post by **GsPJustin** » Wed Aug 30, 2006 4:01 pm

There are probably Field trials and other AKC events. Also NAVHDA.

www.NAVHDA.com

You dont always need a horse to trial. There should be some walking ones to.

skippy · Post by **skippy** » Wed Aug 30, 2006 4:21 pm

GsPJustin wrote: You dont always need a horse to trial. There should be some walking ones to.

that is the answer I am looking for. Walking trials.

Post by **ezzy333** » Wed Aug 30, 2006 4:26 pm

Skippy,

I can guarantee no one on here will think you are an a$$ unless you act like one so I don't know why you brought that up. If there is a question in your mind then maybe you said something you thought was kind of out off bounds and you are the one to change that.

Hope you get your questions answered and take part in the many discussions that take place on the site.

Ezzy

PointerMan · Post by **PointerMan** » Wed Aug 30, 2006 4:52 pm

Skippy,
It looks like you have the AKC hunt test and field trial in the next couple months.
http://www.akc.org/events/search/blocks ... 1-Dec-2006
You also have a NSTRA trials too.
http://www.arizonaregion.netkennel.com/ ... al%20Dates

I believe you are part of the AFTCA region 9 up there??

Casper · Post by **Casper** » Wed Aug 30, 2006 6:47 pm

Utah is tough for AKC walking or horse back trials you will just end up having to travel some distances to attend those.

I dont know much about the AF regions and the trials they hold. Looks like "PointerMan" might be able to help you there.

NSTRA is not so much looked down apon it is just different. It is more suited for the guy that wants to play more with their dogs but doesnt want to do the traditional horsy trials.

The only reason I can think of as to them not being recognized is on paper. Only AKC and AF and NAVHDA have a registry that will list a dogs accomplishments.

This is to the best of my knowledge as of now.

No matter what you end up doing with your dog if it is a good dog it will be recognized by anyone that knows a good dog. Regardless of breed preference. People will always be biased but they still know what a good dog is

Have fun and enjoy them in what ever you please

PointerMan · Post by **PointerMan** » Wed Aug 30, 2006 9:28 pm

Skippy,
when you ask

Why is NSTRA not recognized

People will get on the defensive. I won't, but some might.
I will give you a simple answer. Money.
I don't believe the AKC has ever sanctioned NSTRA trails, meaning put wins or championships on their pedigrees. American Field or the Field Dog Stud Book has in the past, put both wins and championships on their pedigrees. They no longer do this. (Money)
To combat this NSTRA has started their own registry, well kind of. I believe you must have a dog that is a registered breed from a recognized registry in order to register your dog with NSTRA. Regardless, if your dog gets a 1st - 4th place it is recorded and displayed free of charge on the NSTRA website.
So will your placements in NSTRA show up on your AKC or FDSB pedigree? No, but will your AKC hunt test or field trial wins show up on a FDSB pedigree or vise verse? Not sure, but doubt it.

My take is we are entering if not already there, into a era where like horses you have a animal dual or even triple registered.

GsPJustin · Post by **GsPJustin** » Wed Aug 30, 2006 9:42 pm

I think he asked one time? Dont take it so offensivly. It was a question.

Addict · Post by **Addict** » Wed Aug 30, 2006 10:22 pm

Skip,

I have run in Nastra and Navhda tests. I like them both. I have been more involved with Navhda lately. The reason for this is the weekly thursday night training sessions held in the ogden area. I believe they were holding one in the SLC area as well. I made the drive down from Logan every week and I have learned a lot from attending them. The training sessions are over but will probably resume next spring to get ready for next years tests.

If you let us know what city you live in we can probably get you together with someone that is training.

Addict

skippy · Post by **skippy** » Thu Aug 31, 2006 6:45 am

Thanks, you have all assisted me greatly. I am going to attend this upcoming NSTRA trial. It will be neat to actually see how it is ran and so forth. What should I expect?

snips · Post by **snips** » Thu Aug 31, 2006 7:08 am

To have fun

One thing about NSTRA, for all the good friends and fellowship, ALL is forgotten when you turn loose!

Thats what I like about it the most!

TrueBlu Shorthairs · Post by **TrueBlu Shorthairs** » Thu Aug 31, 2006 7:26 am

Skip, you just need to go and see what floats your boat. AKC Hunting Tests, AKC walking trials, and NSTRA are all from foot. You are welcome to walk a dog at all AKC horseback trials. If you have no intention of buying horses, saddles, trailers, 3/4 tons, etc. then I would tell you to go with NSTRA, if you are competitive. Hunting Tests are scored and are not competitive. The JH is a nice way, though, to get started. NSTRA is tough for those wanting to gallery as it is not allowed. One can sit at camp and see some, but the best gallery potential is in trials, on horseback. For a new trainer, trials are quite competitive and to place dogs need to be the real deal, lots of range, tons of style, speed, etc. In broke stakes the dogs MUST be steady to the kill. However, from what I have seen at the ONE NSTRA event I attended, the dogs are about hunting dog broke and the people are very nice.

If you decide to go the trial route and truly be competitive, be prepared to spend around $10,000 a year to run two dogs. My Ex wife called my first Field Champion, our "half a million dollar birddog". Bought him for $600 as a pup. Then needed two horses, saddles, trailer, bigger truck, then a house and land for all of it. NSTRA can be expensive also. Most of the best dogs are more broke, guys usually have big dog trailers, 4 wheelers with dog boxes, etc.

STOP NOW, before you enter heck!!!! Personally, I wouldn't change a thing about any of it. But, my ego is as big as Texas!!!!

Richard *UT* · Post by Richard *UT* » Thu Aug 31, 2006 3:07 pm

I am with you Skippy. I am new to the trial world in Utah. I lost my GSP pup to a car a few months back and I will be getting a new pup in the Spring. The reson so many of us here in Utah run in NSTRA is because if you don't have a horse, NSTRA is by far the most active trial org around. I am not sure how NAVDA fits in but all those I have met have been very friendly and helpful. I might not be winning trials any time soon, but it is fun and I have to start somewhere. Walking trial might be picking up some momentum but we will have to see. Congrats on finding this site, and good luck finding the venue that works best for you.

skippy · Post by **skippy** » Thu Aug 31, 2006 3:35 pm

I am going to the the NSTRA trial. I know that it is around Vernal. Will someone please tell me directions to the trial next weekend?
Thanks in advance.
skippy

Addict · Post by **Addict** » Thu Aug 31, 2006 4:01 pm

This was posted by Tak on another forum.

"The trial is held on the Rim Rock Ranch. From Vernal Ave turn East 500 towards the Jone's Hole Fish Hatchery. When you see the big CRP fields and a wood cut out of a Setter on Point you have made it!"

Also go here:
http://www.wildlife.utah.gov/forums/vie ... hp?t=13968

That link will have the contact information.

The GUPDC events are AKC I believe.

Addict

skippy · Post by **skippy** » Wed Sep 06, 2006 6:08 am

Well I am still planning on attending a trial this weekend. There is two trials this weekend. I am kind of torn, there is an AKC trial as well as a NSTRA. Disapointing that both of the trials are on the same weekend. I will be attending the NSTRA. What should i take? (binos, chairs)
thanks

PntrRookie · Post by **PntrRookie** » Wed Sep 06, 2006 7:02 am

Skippy,
You can take binoculars, but you can not "watch" the bird planter while he plants. Just a simple "can not do" NSTRA incorporated a year or so ago. You sure can watch the dogs when they run.

Take a chair, you may keep it in the truck til you find a nice place/person to watch with. If and when you make eye contact with ANYONE, introduce yourself. We all love talking dogs and trials. I am pretty sure anyone would love to "take you under thier wing" and describe the brace that is going at the time.

There is always (should be) a field marshal coordinating all the braces. Here again, introduce yourself. If you are interested, ask the field marshal if You can walk/ride along during a brace. Most judges are willing to let people ride along. Bring an orange hat or shirt.

I really think you'll enjoy yourself.

Dirtysteve · Post by **Dirtysteve** » Wed Sep 06, 2006 2:53 pm

Skippy
I will be going to the NSTRA trial on Saturday and the AKC trial Sunday so if you want you can catch a ride with us to one or the other or both if you would like.

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