NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
Gary Lester set the bar with Miller's Dailing In this morning. 7 finds, 1up finishing the 3 hours. We will know how high when the handlers get to 90 minutes, if most pick up, it will be telling. They will not waste the judge's time, or run the risk of injury if they are not beating what they already have.
If it holds up Gary will be the first amateur to repeat in the modern era.
Neil
If it holds up Gary will be the first amateur to repeat in the modern era.
Neil
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Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
wow! hows the weather looking?
Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
The Ames site gives the weather each day, predictions from the Weather Channel dot com says lower 40's am mid 50's pm, but it is West TN, it is sure to change, and is usually a factor.dead mike wrote:wow! hows the weather looking?
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Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
weather for sure a factor and bird numbers. They released an additional 500 quail, i wonder how many will be around for the later braces? Kind of feel bad for the guys running at near the end.
Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
Plenty of birds pointed every year towards the end Happy Jack had 6 or 7 a week in last year.
- birddog1968
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Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
wish i was there tomorrow Happy Jack and sno in the same brace.....
- PntrRookie
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Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
+1!birddog1968 wrote:wish i was there tomorrow Happy Jack and sno in the same brace.....
Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
will be interesting to see how Happy Jack reacts......and also how Lester reacts if he finds himself in position of protecting his current status with Dialing In....if Anderson can handle the situations that could possibly arise......yes this is the brace I'm most interested in as well - so much contrast between both handlers and dogsbirddog1968 wrote:wish i was there tomorrow Happy Jack and sno in the same brace.....
Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
I've watched jack go and he goes no matter who is in the saddle. Should be a great bra e though.
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Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
That whole scenario is interesting because of so many variables.Redneck wrote:...how Lester reacts if he finds himself in position of protecting his current status with Dialing In...
A. Mr. Lester is an Amateur, thus does not have any client to answer to (other than the Company ).
B. How confident is he that Dialing In's performance will stand.
C. If he has another dog putting down a good performance, I highly doubt he would protect anything...let the dog roll and let the judges figure it out. I bet he would LOVE to have multiple dogs finish with great performances.
D. Like ANY other handler, they know if the dog is getting the job done and will pick up with respect to judges and other handlers.
Cool to be a sideline/gallery quarterback! IMO...he will not protect anything.
Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
Saddle wrote:I've watched jack go and he goes no matter who is in the saddle. Should be a great bra e though.
I've seen and competed against both these dogs many times......I've judged both handlers and competed against one many times.......If it were just about turning a couple of great dogs loose and seein' what happens that would be interesting enough, but throw in the extenuating circumstances involved with this brace, and it becomes intriguing to me. I have no doubt that Happy Jack will "go", that's his strong suit in my opinion, but this aint Ok or Ks. The last thing Lester wants in this situation is a horse race, and he'll do what he can to avoid that. These are 2 very different types of dogs, and i would enjoy watching these handlers try to command the situation to their dogs advantage - of course the dogs could "take over" and make the handlers irrelevant .
Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
A. only in the strictest sensePntrRookie wrote:That whole scenario is interesting because of so many variables.Redneck wrote:...how Lester reacts if he finds himself in position of protecting his current status with Dialing In...
A. Mr. Lester is an Amateur, thus does not have any client to answer to (other than the Company ).
B. How confident is he that Dialing In's performance will stand.
C. If he has another dog putting down a good performance, I highly doubt he would protect anything...let the dog roll and let the judges figure it out. I bet he would LOVE to have multiple dogs finish with great performances.
D. Like ANY other handler, they know if the dog is getting the job done and will pick up with respect to judges and other handlers.
Cool to be a sideline/gallery quarterback! IMO...he will not protect anything.
B. dont know how confident Gary is, but it was interesting that Ike left his dog down with half the finds, either he thought it was beatable or he had something to prove
C. Obviously you dont protect by picking up your own dog having a good performance :roll: but if his bracemate is having a good performance he could protect what he's already done
D. there are always points to prove and hidden agendas
It is fun and thanks to Vera, the Ames website, and friends with phones who are lucky enough to attend, we are able to follow.
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Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
Good points Red...on B - I thought the same on yesterday's afternoon brace. May also had something to do with Jax getting picked up half way through...I believe Keith handled Ring of Fire, Ike scouted FWIW understand answer to C, just threw it out there.Redneck wrote: A. only in the strictest sense
B. dont know how confident Gary is, but it was interesting that Ike left his dog down with half the finds, either he thought it was beatable or he had something to prove
C. Obviously you dont protect by picking up your own dog having a good performance but if his bracemate is having a good performance he could protect what he's already done
D. there are always points to prove and hidden agendas
It is fun and thanks to Vera, the Ames website, and friends with phones who are lucky enough to attend, we are able to follow.
Last edited by PntrRookie on Tue Feb 12, 2013 10:45 am, edited 1 time in total.
Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
I would call jack a pretty good birddog as well. Not just all run. heck you've run against him. He's a hard dog to run down if you're chasing him in his own tracks. I think randy will dial him down enough to make a good showing. This is one of the reasons they're not running Sam (Three Ten to Yuma). He's getting hard to finish.
Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
1 of the exciting things about Randy's string is his derbies might be just as good if not better than the dogs hes running now.
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Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
I like tracking the scouts.
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Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
Two more bite the dust.
Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
Looks like the unwritten 2 UP rule took out two great dogs this morning, that coupled with a low bird score.
Never really understood why it is the same UP rule for three hours as for one.
It comes from not wanting a false pointing, lying dog, but I believe it is time to rethink it since prerelease birds (and even wild ones) tend to run more these days.
On to this afternoon.
Never really understood why it is the same UP rule for three hours as for one.
It comes from not wanting a false pointing, lying dog, but I believe it is time to rethink it since prerelease birds (and even wild ones) tend to run more these days.
On to this afternoon.
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Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
There is no "UP rule" it's just that these handlers know if they are getting it done or not and the last hour would have to be pretty spectacular with two UPs in the book. And a UP is a UP whether the birds ran, flew or took a crap there an hour earlier.
Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
It is unwritten, but it is very much a rule.
I have never heard of a dog winning a major stake with 3 UPs.
And I am not saying it shouldn't be, just seems interesting it is the same no matter the length of heat. As a hunter, after a haul my fat butt in front of a dog, I won't accept 2 in a day, he best find them on relocation or he is going to be someone's pet..
I have never heard of a dog winning a major stake with 3 UPs.
And I am not saying it shouldn't be, just seems interesting it is the same no matter the length of heat. As a hunter, after a haul my fat butt in front of a dog, I won't accept 2 in a day, he best find them on relocation or he is going to be someone's pet..
Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
It is written in the AFTCA Guidelines to Judicial Practice in such a way that pretty much precludes the use of a dog for placements with a 3rd UP.
Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
I've heard it said by some folks that I trust that will be really hard for a Miller prefix dog to win the National.
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Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
They put one in the HOF this year. Out of "that" breeding, no lessSaddle wrote:I've heard it said by some folks that I trust that will be really hard for a Miller prefix dog to win the National.
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Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
why?Saddle wrote:I've heard it said by some folks that I trust that will be really hard for a Miller prefix dog to win the National.
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Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
Erin dog up, bracemate finished.
Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
I do not ever reading in the brief write up following the running about "-a questionable piece of birdwork". Look for that to be edited.
But nothing changed.
But nothing changed.
Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
Jack is a strong dog that always gives you a good run, with his race you don't need a bunch of birds. I was a little surprised last year that with the number of finds he had that he didn't win. As for Sam, the handler change didn't seem to work out well - they never seemed to gelSaddle wrote:I would call jack a pretty good birddog as well. Not just all run. heck you've run against him. He's a hard dog to run down if you're chasing him in his own tracks. I think randy will dial him down enough to make a good showing. This is one of the reasons they're not running Sam (Three Ten to Yuma). He's getting hard to finish.
Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
[quote="Neil"]It is unwritten, but it is very much a rule.
I have never heard of a dog winning a major stake with 3 UPs.
And I am not saying it shouldn't be, just seems interesting it is the same no matter the length of heat. As a hunter, after a haul my fat butt in front of a dog, I won't accept 2 in a day, he best find them on relocation or he is going to be someone's pet..[/quot
I saw Erins Heyu Suzie win a SD CH with 3 up's........upset a lot of people
I have never heard of a dog winning a major stake with 3 UPs.
And I am not saying it shouldn't be, just seems interesting it is the same no matter the length of heat. As a hunter, after a haul my fat butt in front of a dog, I won't accept 2 in a day, he best find them on relocation or he is going to be someone's pet..[/quot
I saw Erins Heyu Suzie win a SD CH with 3 up's........upset a lot of people
Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
I now understand the "questionable birdwork" was just a handler calling flight of birds and firing, but not observed by judiciary. Happens often, not a big deal, will go in the book as a nonnevent.
Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
Went back and looked at the photos of Dailin In, after hearing he let down at 2 hour mark, usually when they do slow the tail goes down and they sag in the middle. He looked high and tight to me. He is looking better and better.
But I am surprised more often than not when we gather at the steps, even when I rode more.
But I am surprised more often than not when we gather at the steps, even when I rode more.
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Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
Miller wasn't a very popular guy upon his exit from trialing. Bernie doesn't have a strong conviction for Miller or his dogs. I'm sure it burned him up that southern pride was elected into the hof this past year.dead mike wrote:why?Saddle wrote:I've heard it said by some folks that I trust that will be really hard for a Miller prefix dog to win the National.
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Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
All that may be true but I would dearly hope that in any trial we judge the DOG and not the handler/owner or name. AND the judges have the professionalism to do what is right...if the name is Banana Joe or Miller's Banana Joe.Saddle wrote:Miller wasn't a very popular guy upon his exit from trialing. Bernie doesn't have a strong conviction for Miller or his dogs. I'm sure it burned him up that southern pride was elected into the hof this past year.dead mike wrote:why?Saddle wrote:I've heard it said by some folks that I trust that will be really hard for a Miller prefix dog to win the National.
Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
That all sounds nice in theory Greg but if that's the case then why did they ban Millers dogs and not just him. How long do you think it'll take before white powder gets into the Hall of Fame. Does anyone on this board really think that game maker and southern pride contributed more to the pointer breed and to the sport then white powder did. No 1 here or anywhere else can even make that argument because it would be nonsense.
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Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
Agreed...do you think it puts a spur in Bernie's saddle when he is reporting at the National and up rides Ferrel? Would love to be inside his head when that happens.Saddle wrote:That all sounds nice in theory Greg but if that's the case then why did they ban Millers dogs and not just him. How long do you think it'll take before white powder gets into the Hall of Fame. Does anyone on this board really think that game maker and southern pride contributed more to the pointer breed and to the sport then white powder did. No 1 here or anywhere else can even make that argument because it would be nonsense.
Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
Oh boy I bet that would be a funny sight.
Most judges I think are honest but you get what I'm saying. The prejudice from the top levels is very real. Towards Miller dogs
Most judges I think are honest but you get what I'm saying. The prejudice from the top levels is very real. Towards Miller dogs
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Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
From the photos, I'd say he'd be hard pressed to see anything around that riding helmet. It's been nine years. It's over. Tempest in a teacup.PntrRookie wrote:Agreed...do you think it puts a spur in Bernie's saddle when he is reporting at the National and up rides Ferrel? Would love to be inside his head when that happens.Saddle wrote:That all sounds nice in theory Greg but if that's the case then why did they ban Millers dogs and not just him. How long do you think it'll take before white powder gets into the Hall of Fame. Does anyone on this board really think that game maker and southern pride contributed more to the pointer breed and to the sport then white powder did. No 1 here or anywhere else can even make that argument because it would be nonsense.
Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
Lot more to some stories but most are about money.Pic from yesterdays running.
Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
I have no doubt that Bernie doesn't care for Mr. Miller, and White Powder is not getting in to the hall of fame any time soon. I don't believe, however, that there is any judicail bias against Miller dogs. If you rule out all of the pointers with any Miller breeding, then one of the three setter owners and handlers are going to be very happy.
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Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
PntrRookie wrote: All that may be true but I would dearly hope that in any trial we judge the DOG and not the handler/owner or name. AND the judges have the professionalism to do what is right...if the name is Banana Joe or Miller's Banana Joe.
Yes it would be nice if personal issues and prejudice were left out the door. I have seen it not be the case in other competing formats however. It all comes down to the individual judging and whether or not the governing body overseeing activity condones such behavior.
Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
Bernie controls American Field and the Hall of Fame. He does not control the National Campionship, and "bleep" sure does not control the judges, nor would he even try.
If he held the bias some are suggesting, he could just refuse to register ant Miller prefixes, as he also controls FDSB.
I know the judges and Bernie, they are honest gentlemen, all. To suggest otherwise is classless.
If he held the bias some are suggesting, he could just refuse to register ant Miller prefixes, as he also controls FDSB.
I know the judges and Bernie, they are honest gentlemen, all. To suggest otherwise is classless.
Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
Deleted............adds nothing to the conversation.
Last edited by Saddle on Wed Feb 13, 2013 4:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
that me be so but it will have no effect on the judges outcome of this trialSaddle wrote:Miller wasn't a very popular guy upon his exit from trialing. Bernie doesn't have a strong conviction for Miller or his dogs. I'm sure it burned him up that southern pride was elected into the hof this past year.dead mike wrote:why?Saddle wrote:I've heard it said by some folks that I trust that will be really hard for a Miller prefix dog to win the National.
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Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
SETTER GUYS, CHECK IT!
"Overnight drizzle added to the already wet terrain. Damp and 38 degrees at the start. Shadow Oak Bo tallied seven finds and also had three backs. Rivertons Funseek'n Scooter notched five and also had an unproductive. Both dogs finished the three hours."
"Overnight drizzle added to the already wet terrain. Damp and 38 degrees at the start. Shadow Oak Bo tallied seven finds and also had three backs. Rivertons Funseek'n Scooter notched five and also had an unproductive. Both dogs finished the three hours."
Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
dead mike wrote:SETTER GUYS, CHECK IT!
"Overnight drizzle added to the already wet terrain. Damp and 38 degrees at the start. Shadow Oak Bo tallied seven finds and also had three backs. Rivertons Funseek'n Scooter notched five and also had an unproductive. Both dogs finished the three hours."
Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
We have a field trial!
I first saw Bo as a pup, and was around his grandsire often. He is a great dog.
The three backs could be cause for concern, sounds like he may have been behind the other dog some. The judges will know.
There is another way a dog can get that many backs.
I first saw Bo as a pup, and was around his grandsire often. He is a great dog.
The three backs could be cause for concern, sounds like he may have been behind the other dog some. The judges will know.
There is another way a dog can get that many backs.
Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
I like rooting for the long hairs. I've always heard that a back won't win a trial, but what about three? So far a setter is the only dog to have a clean run. Long way to go, but I imagine the handler has a smile on his/her face.
Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
Well considering he had 7 finds vs 5 finds I would hope he was behind because he was working a covey.Neil wrote:We have a field trial!
I first saw Bo as a pup, and was around his grandsire often. He is a great dog.
The three backs could be cause for concern, sounds like he may have been behind the other dog some. The judges will know.
There is another way a dog can get that many backs.
Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
If a setter wins they get an extra $10,000?
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Re: NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP
After 43 years the money is not an issue but will be nice. Do you think the stud fee will go up? I would have liked to see Jetsetter offspring win but now its GO BO GO.