New Dog Question

[scoutin]

Ok this might be a dumb question. But I grew up hunting with labs a hunting over flushing dog and have a few questions about pointer breeds. My question comes from today I did a disabled veteran hunt and hunted over two german wire hairs and a german short hair. they were awesome but ranged really far from us and sometimes far enough to where we had to wait for 2 or 3 minutes for them to come back. i know this could be training but are there pointing breeds that like to hunt closer?

[Sharon]

Welcome to the forum.


Breeds? Hmmm I don't think so when it comes to pointing breeds. Not ALL dogs range the same distance naturally though . They can be trained to hunt closer if that's what you want.

good discussion here on that subject:

viewtopic.php?f=89&t=47871

** The idea is that they don't come back , but rather you keep up.

[scoutin]

thanks for the info. I would love to get a brittany because of the size and temperment. But after working with these GWP/GSP it has me kind of scared because of the way they range out. Im a disabled vet and my mobility can be an issue and being that im only 28 my father at 50 tends to move faster than me. But i love the the way they work and point. Maybe i will stick to the labs.

[Grange]

First, thanks for your service. My parents raise brittanies and I spend a lot of time with that breed from field trialling to hunting to taking care of them while my parents are away. They really are a great breed. The ones that my parents have generally have a wider range than what you seem to be looking for, but I know there are closer working brittanies out there. The good think about a well trained pointing dog is that they will hold a point for as long as it takes for you to get there. A good pointing dog can also hold the bird until you get there as well.

I also hunt with GWP's and they tend to have a shorter range than my setter and my parents brittanies.

[RayGubernat]

thanks for the info. I would love to get a brittany because of the size and temperment. But after working with these GWP/GSP it has me kind of scared because of the way they range out. Im a disabled vet and my mobility can be an issue and being that im only 28 my father at 50 tends to move faster than me. But i love the the way they work and point. Maybe i will stick to the labs.

Thank you for your service and I would like to give you a slightly different perspective on the pointing dog subject.

Pointing dogs have been called a lazy man's hunting dog because they do most of the work.

A pointing dog is supposed to go and find birds, wherever they may be. THEN a pointing dog is supposed to point them and hold them for, not ten seconds, not thirty seconds, not two minutes...but for as long as it takes you to get there. Believe it. Fifteen minutes on point is very much something that you can expect of a good, well trained pointing dog. That is what they do. That is what they are bred for. I have come on to a dog of mine that was locked up on point and that dog was MIA for over a half hour. More than once. Like I said...that is what they do.

Now...what does that mean to you the hunter? Simply this.... You can now walk down the middle of a field while the dog goes to the right, goes to the left and in the process, goes through the middle too, and all you gotta do is watch. The dog goes to all the birdy places and covers the entire field and all the edges...so YOU DON"T HAVE TO. If and when the dog goes on point...THEN you walk over , kick up the bird and shoot it. Otherwise, you just keep on walking and let the dog hunt it all out for you. I don't know about you, but I kinda like that.

I will be the first to admit that, if you are accustomed to the way a lab or other flushing dog hunts, a pointing dog's hunting manner is VERY different and can take some getting used to, especially if the dog fades out of sight...like mine usually do. That can be downright uncomfortable until you realize that the dog is doing what it is bred to do and if the dog does not pop back into view to checkup on you in a couple of minutes...it is most likely on point somewhere out front...just waiting for you to get there... so start looking and saddle up.

One of the most disconcerting sights and feelings in the hunting field is to watch your dog go "over the hill" and out of sight. For me too. One of the most fantastic sights and most wonderful feelings is to top a rise, or come 'round a blind corner and see your dog stacked up on point...just waiting FOR YOU!

The thing is you cannot have one without the other. You cannot experience that fantastic feeling... part joy, part relief, part amazement...without first allowing the dog to get out of your sight.

You can train a pointing dog to hunt fairly close and there are dogs of every pointing breed that are naturally closer workers than others, but if you have to have them in gun range all of the time, then a pointing breed is really not what you want.

Different strokes for different folks. It is all good. What matters is that you enjoy the out of doors, whatever way you choose.

RayG

[AZ Brittany Guy]

A quick story to follow Ray's thought process. In southern Arizona their are rolling hills with Oak Savannas that serve a habitat for Mearns quail. These hills converge into grassy canyons and for us older guys can be a tough terrain to cover. A fellow Brittany owner / hunter / competitor has an "all age" dogs that can venture out very far and is usually competed on horse back. When he is hunting Mearns in southern Arizona he hauls his dog on the back of a quad and puts him down at the mouth of a canyon. He has a GPS on the dog so he waits at the mouth of the canyon and watches his GPS until he locks up on a covey then he either rides or walks to the location of the dog on point.

Just a little food for thought.

[Becassier]

Ok this might be a dumb question. But I grew up hunting with labs a hunting over flushing dog and have a few questions about pointer breeds. My question comes from today I did a disabled veteran hunt and hunted over two german wire hairs and a german short hair. they were awesome but ranged really far from us and sometimes far enough to where we had to wait for 2 or 3 minutes for them to come back. i know this could be training but are there pointing breeds that like to hunt closer?

First of all THANK YOU for your service!! It's not about how far or how long the dogs are gone, but rather the training.. Our dogs stay until we get to them. IMO depending on your physical limitations your focus should be on the cover and type of birds you would like to hunt.

Depending on what state you live in NSTRA club by you, you should go and see some pointing breeds in action. They will be more than happy to let you ride on the back of a 4 wheeler with a judge and talk dogs.

This video is of me with one of my dogs in the Michigan Woodcock woods this year. My husband and dogs were more then patient with me this year as I was really out of shape.
http://youtu.be/kmvs4RihKQs

Please let me know if you need any help

[Stoneface]

If you get a new dog that's one of the big four (Pointer, E. Setter, Shorthair, Britt), it's a cinch to bring them on to where they are out of sight a few minutes. It's also a cinch to reel them in. All you have to do is overexpose them to birds in a small area when they're young and it can really do the trick.

I love Britts to death, but keep in mind if you decide to get a new dog keep in mind you can find virtually any size and disposition in any of the four breeds mentioned above. Just as important, know that you can't just pick out any dog of a particular breed and automatically get what that breed is stereotyped to be. Pointers are stereotyped to be cold and non-personable. Nothing could be farther from the truth. Setters are stereotyped as being soft, warm and very personable. I've got a friend who told me the other day his Setter likes people, but always likes to keep his distance. It's all relative.

[Mills51]

Take a look at the French Brittany, typically will work closer to the hunter than many pointing breeds.

[shags]

Spinoni work close.

[Aslowhiteguy]

I too went from a lab to a pointing breed (GWP) many years ago and have had a Brittany and setter since then.

The concern you have with range might be unfounded and once your dog is up to speed and holding its birds, you may wish he ranged further. IMO, if you hunt your pointing dog too close, you may as well have a flusher. At first I wanted them where I could see them at all times. Now I want a dog to range a bit.

An Astro or Alpha really helps with keeping track of a ranging dog. It's not an issue when you can't see them and you know how far away they are and can call them back if they range too far.

Shags mentioned the spin. Another breed that generally has a closer working natural range is a pudel pointer. They are great dogs, but a little pricey.

Good luck to you

[MonsterDad]

Spinoni work close.

Agreed Spinone or a Bracco would be good choices. Both are very mild mannered, docile and easy to handle.

These two are a lot easier to handle than a Lab.