Horses for field trials

AlPastor · Post by **AlPastor** » Fri Oct 09, 2015 3:46 pm

Even though I'm currently on a hunter bred quarter, at 275lb including saddle, I'm too heavy for this horse. My daughter's Trakehner is also too small. Although, I doubt that I'd ever want ride it since it is her eventing horse.

So I'm pondering the cold bloods, I'm eyeing something like a baroque style body Friesian, a Percheron, or maybe even a Clydesdale.

Anybody have experience with saddled cold bloods?

Neil · Post by **Neil** » Fri Oct 09, 2015 4:12 pm

No, and neither has any other serious field trialer.

Post by **ezzy333** » Fri Oct 09, 2015 4:25 pm

AlPastor wrote:Even though I'm currently on a hunter bred quarter, at 275lb including saddle, I'm too heavy for this horse. My daughter's Trakehner is also too small. Although, I doubt that I'd ever want ride it since it is her eventing horse.

So I'm pondering the cold bloods, I'm eyeing something like a baroque style body Friesian, a Percheron, or maybe even a Clydesdale.

Anybody have experience with saddled cold bloods?

I would think you might have a great deal of trouble getting on and off of them as often as it is required during any field contest.

Ezzy

AlPastor · Post by **AlPastor** » Fri Oct 09, 2015 4:38 pm

Neil wrote:No, and neither has any other serious field trialer.

@Neil - Why?

@Ezzy - I'm 6'6" and in excellent physical condition.

Neil · Post by **Neil** » Fri Oct 09, 2015 4:58 pm

It is not just the height, I have owned some 17 hand Tennessee Walkers, but draft horses lack the athleticism, agility, and most importantly gaits. A good trial horse must have a smooth flat walk, smoother running walk, and canter. A training/scouting horse must have those and a safe gallop.

A rough estimate of the breeds used; 75% Walkers, 15% Missouri Fox Trotter, 10% Rocky Mountain, Spotted Saddle, Pasa Fina, Icelandic, and some I don't remember.

Many of the first 4 can carry a 300 pound rider with ease. I prefer the stout MFT.

AlPastor · Post by **AlPastor** » Fri Oct 09, 2015 5:23 pm

Neil wrote:It is not just the height, I have owned some 17 hand Tennessee Walkers, but draft horses lack the athleticism, agility, and most importantly gaits. A good trial horse must have a smooth flat walk, smoother running walk, and canter. A training/scouting horse must have those and a safe gallop.

A rough estimate of the breeds used; 75% Walkers, 15% Missouri Fox Trotter, 10% Rocky Mountain, Spotted Saddle, Pasa Fina, Icelandic, and some I don't remember.

Many of the first 4 can carry a 300 pound rider with ease. I prefer the stout MFT.

I'll take a look at them.

While not gaited, I know that the Friesian sporthorse is quite athletic. They're being used as eventing horses and jumpers.

Neil · Post by **Neil** » Fri Oct 09, 2015 6:08 pm

I am not familiar with Friesians, but you did pick up on gaited being most important? It is not unusual to log 30 - 40 miles a day for 10 days in a row. More if scouting.

Now might be a good time to find out what type trials you are interested in. If it is AKC walking, and you are not going to scout any, only the smooth flat walk is important. A borro might work.

The weak spot in some TWH' s is their rather slender legs, pick one with care. For that reason I mostly have had MFT' s.

Good luck.

AlPastor · Post by **AlPastor** » Fri Oct 09, 2015 6:56 pm

Neil wrote:I am not familiar with Friesians, but you did pick up on gaited being most important? It is not unusual to log 30 - 40 miles a day for 10 days in a row. More if scouting.

Now might be a good time to find out what type trials you are interested in. If it is AKC walking, and you are not going to scout any, only the smooth flat walk is important. A borro might work.

The weak spot in some TWH' s is their rather slender legs, pick one with care. For that reason I mostly have had MFT' s.

Good luck.

I've seen so many small Rocky Mountain Horses and delicate Tennessee Walkers that I've never considered them viable mounts.

I'll check out the MFT and look for big cannons and hooves.

Ps. I'd assume the higher rider weight to animal weight percentage because they're single footers so the suspension ligaments font get the same abuse?

Luminary Setters · Post by **Luminary Setters** » Fri Oct 09, 2015 7:18 pm

Although good ones are few and far between and from your needs, you might want to look into some of the gaited mules.

Neil · Post by **Neil** » Fri Oct 09, 2015 8:25 pm

I have a friend that owns mules for other uses that is 6' 5", 260 or so, and when asked about gaited mules, he told me he could not find any big enough that were easy going, his words. It defies my observations, but he is still looking. Pro trainers Faye Thornberry and Bubba Moreland were over 300 pounds and 6' 7", both Gates 270+, and there are many others of NFL size. All rode/ride TWH' s on the large side, 16+ hands, but not unusually large or special.

I really don't think it is as big a challenge as you believe. There are many big ole' boys in field trials. Not many as tall, but as heavy and heavier.

You will be fine.

birdogg42 · Post by **birdogg42** » Fri Oct 09, 2015 8:35 pm

Sounds like you know horses. Get what you want and like. Maybe go to a few trials and see if you can ride a few different horses. You will figure it out.

Mike

Donnytpburge · Post by **Donnytpburge** » Sat Oct 10, 2015 10:26 am

google Adams Horse and Mule company and take a look at the "macho man" I think he would get the job done.

db

RayGubernat · Post by **RayGubernat** » Sat Oct 10, 2015 2:02 pm

AlPastor wrote:
Neil wrote:I am not familiar with Friesians, but you did pick up on gaited being most important? It is not unusual to log 30 - 40 miles a day for 10 days in a row. More if scouting.

Now might be a good time to find out what type trials you are interested in. If it is AKC walking, and you are not going to scout any, only the smooth flat walk is important. A borro might work.

The weak spot in some TWH' s is their rather slender legs, pick one with care. For that reason I mostly have had MFT' s.

Good luck.
I've seen so many small Rocky Mountain Horses and delicate Tennessee Walkers that I've never considered them viable mounts.

I'll check out the MFT and look for big cannons and hooves.

Ps. I'd assume the higher rider weight to animal weight percentage because they're single footers so the suspension ligaments font get the same abuse?

Alpastor -

I am over 225 pounds and my saddle ain't light , so my horse routinely carries pretty close to the weight you mentioned. My go to horse is a 15-2 TWH that is just about 1000#. I have been riding him since 2001 and I plan to ride him for the forseeable future. He will be 20 this year and shows absolutely no signs of slowing down.

Oh and when I first got him, I had no place to put him so I boarded him with a dog pro that makes me look like a welterweight. The pro and his son, who was every bit as big as his dad, used him...a lot... for the best part of a year, and in the process, turned a nice plantation horse into a dog horse for me.

A couple years later, I bought another similarly built and similarly sized TWH, mostly for my son, and he carries me just fine also.

BTW, that pro and his son changed over to rocky mountain horses several years later, and like I said, those boys ain't small and their horses do a day's work.

I am not a horse person, so I cannot recommend what someone else should or should not do.

I don't know if what I have been doing is right or wrong, good or bad, just that it has worked fine for the last 15 years or so.

RayG

shags · Post by **shags** » Sun Oct 11, 2015 7:24 pm

OP,
I wouldn't even bother with a walk-trot horse. Neither one of you will be happy. They just aren't made for the kind of work a dog horse does. Been there, done that. So have several other folks I know, who used whatever horse they could easily get when they first started. Every one of them soon went to easy-gaited horses.

Check out some of the horses the major circuit pros use. Big, stout walkers are out there. My old fox trotter was a big guy, and while my current FT is shorter, he's stout. My husband's walker has hauled around a NFL defensive lineman who makes most big guys look like TinkerBell.

Sometimes you can find a real bargain horse, but IMO it's so much easier and safer to spend a bit more and purchase a trial horse with experience. Then you can concentrate on handling your dog instead of training your horse. If you put up WTB posts on the various field trial forums. Someone will point you in the right direction. I think there's a horse for sale at www.thefieldtrialer.com that is too big for the current owner.

Good luck in your search.

RyanDoolittle · Post by **RyanDoolittle** » Mon Oct 12, 2015 7:56 am

Shags you touched on a point that I have found is the most important in a trial horse and thats the training. I am in the market for a horse too and after spending 2 years riding various gaited horses at trials it is so much nicer to ride a horse that already knows his job but is a true dog horse. When you are new and your dog is new the last thing you want to worry about is a horse that steps on a dog or kicks out at a dog. The 2 traits that stick out in my mind are a horse that pays attention to a dog thats being roaded (ie wont steps on them if they get under foot and wont freak if a checkcord gets wrapped up) and a horse that sees the dog standing out there and only needs a light sqeeze to let him know its time to get there, now. After riding one particular horse a few times he started watching my dog for me. If id loose him you could look at the horse and sure as heck of he was looking left that dog was off to the left.

If you can find a good dog horse he is worth every penny.

On a side note we were at a multicourse trial last month and one guy had a quarter horse. It sure came in handy when the cows were trying to get through the open gates but by the end of the day you could tell the rider was feeling it trying to keep up with the walkers.

RayGubernat · Post by **RayGubernat** » Mon Oct 12, 2015 9:20 am

shags wrote:OP,

Sometimes you can find a real bargain horse, but IMO it's so much easier and safer to spend a bit more and purchase a trial horse with experience. Then you can concentrate on handling your dog instead of training your horse.

Shags -

I bought my first horse from a plantation. He was a guest horse. As I said above, I put him with a pro until I could make arrangements and it was the best thing I ever did for myself as an amateur field trailer.

I paid a good price for the horse...$3500, back in 2001. I can't tell you how many folks scolded or made fun of me for paying way too much money at that time. I CAN tell you that of all of those folks, I am the ONLY one still riding the same horse. The pro I put him with NEVER said to me I paid too much. One good friend told me that I had no idea how lucky I was to get such a horse, first time out.

Many field trialers can keep their horses on their own place, so boarding is a relatively inexpensive additional expense. But if you have to pay $250-500 per month for board, that is $3000 - 6000 per year, it makes no sense at all to me to buy a "bargain" horse that may not be able to do what you need. When you board a horse, you are, essentially, buying that same horse every single year. Why not get a good one to start with?

Similarly, if you are not... or do not want to be... a horse trainer, it makes very little sense to buy an untrained horse. I am NOT a horse trainer and I do not want to be. I love playing with the dogs...they are much more my size.

To each their own.

RayG

Post by **ezzy333** » Mon Oct 12, 2015 11:06 am

I agree a gaited horse is really nice though I have just been on one a few times. I do get a kick though out of the comments about how hard it is to spend the day on a horse at a trial. I would have trouble counting the days I and many of my friends spent on a non-gaited horse and didn't think a thing about it. Spent days working cattle, riding fences, breaking broncos, and following dogs and then going on a trail ride for recreation on Sundays. My favorite was an Arabian I had and then later I had a crossbred TWH and Arabian that was really good. I think it is more what you are use to but have to agree that the smoother rides are easier since it reduces the leg work that is needed to keep a ride smooth.

I always think of the old time cowboys that spent most of the daylight hours in the saddle on a quarter type horse when ever I hear how hard it is spend a few hours in the saddle at a trial. Sometimes I think we all forget just how easy we have it today.

Ezzy

Neil · Post by **Neil** » Mon Oct 12, 2015 11:40 am

There is reason most cowboys are on 4-wheelers today.

But when they worked cattle from horseback, they used only 2 gaits 90% of the day, a walk and a canter/short lope, and a quarter horse is extremely smooth at both. It is the unique pace of 6 - 8 mph of a field trial that is ideally suited for the running walk and fox trot and just jaring for any other movement.

I am not new to fox trotters, my Great Uncle owned a horse registered F-9, I grew up with them, rode them long before my first trial.

But Ezzy is right, we are spoiled and I like it.

RyanDoolittle · Post by **RyanDoolittle** » Mon Oct 12, 2015 11:53 am

ezzy333 wrote:I agree a gaited horse is really nice though I have just been on one a few times. I do get a kick though out of the comments about how hard it is to spend the day on a horse at a trial. I would have trouble counting the days I and many of my friends spent on a non-gaited horse and didn't think a thing about it. Spent days working cattle, riding fences, breaking broncos, and following dogs and then going on a trail ride for recreation on Sundays. My favorite was an Arabian I had and then later I had a crossbred TWH and Arabian that was really good. I think it is more what you are use to but have to agree that the smoother rides are easier since it reduces the leg work that is needed to keep a ride smooth.

I always think of the old time cowboys that spent most of the daylight hours in the saddle on a quarter type horse when ever I hear how hard it is spend a few hours in the saddle at a trial. Sometimes I think we all forget just how easy we have it today.

Ezzy

I could sit in a sports car all day but the caddilac has a better ride.

Post by **ezzy333** » Mon Oct 12, 2015 12:03 pm

RyanDoolittle wrote:
ezzy333 wrote:I agree a gaited horse is really nice though I have just been on one a few times. I do get a kick though out of the comments about how hard it is to spend the day on a horse at a trial. I would have trouble counting the days I and many of my friends spent on a non-gaited horse and didn't think a thing about it. Spent days working cattle, riding fences, breaking broncos, and following dogs and then going on a trail ride for recreation on Sundays. My favorite was an Arabian I had and then later I had a crossbred TWH and Arabian that was really good. I think it is more what you are use to but have to agree that the smoother rides are easier since it reduces the leg work that is needed to keep a ride smooth.

I always think of the old time cowboys that spent most of the daylight hours in the saddle on a quarter type horse when ever I hear how hard it is spend a few hours in the saddle at a trial. Sometimes I think we all forget just how easy we have it today.

Ezzy
I could sit in a sports car all day but the caddilac has a better ride.

And an SUV is a lot more comfortable. Everything has its good points as well as it's bad. But I think I already agreed with your point.

Neil · Post by **Neil** » Mon Oct 12, 2015 12:40 pm

Would that make the Caddilac SUV, the Escalade the most comfortable of all? Then that is the TWH.

AlPastor · Post by **AlPastor** » Mon Oct 12, 2015 12:44 pm

To be honest, I'm not a horse guy. If it wasn't for a love of big game hunting, especially wilderness areas, and field trials, I'd have no desire to own a horse.

Now my mom, sister, wife, and daughter are horsewomen so I've always had Arabians and Quarters around. Funny enough, when I first brought my wife to be home for a family dinner, it turned out that she was already acquainted with myom and sister from some horse rescue stuff.

Anyway, my pro offered to allow me to use his spare twh this season. He's a big boy with, at least according to him, big boy walkers.

Grommet · Post by **Grommet** » Mon Oct 12, 2015 1:32 pm

Neil wrote:There is reason most cowboys are on 4-wheelers.

Ah the old "Japanese Cuttin' Horse". Tough to beat the ride in that saddle.

Trekmoor · Post by **Trekmoor** » Mon Oct 12, 2015 7:19 pm

Fascinating reading ! You have no idea how "easy" you have it being able to ride a horse in pointing dog trials. I competed in my first trial for about 20 years last Saturday and it was all uphill , or it seemed to be ! I had to be rescued by quad bike part way up one of the hills down in the Scottish borders .... I was on the point of having a heart attack and I didn't even win the trial !

We walk everywhere we need to go to in our trials but we obviously do not cover as much ground as you need to do. Once you get around 70 years old trialing becomes a bit difficult !

The judges at Saturdays trial made one concession to me, I was given permission to use a walking stick !

What I really needed was a 4 wheel drive zimmer frame !

Bill T.

Post by **ezzy333** » Mon Oct 12, 2015 8:23 pm

Bill, I know where of you speak. Approaching 83 and with a bad leg has basically put an end to my days afield.

AlPastor · Post by **AlPastor** » Mon Oct 12, 2015 8:33 pm

ezzy333 wrote:Bill, I know where of you speak. Approaching 83 and with a bad leg has basically put an end to my days afield.

We built a Honda Ruckus for a friend's dad that had double knee replacement. He rides it right up to the point.

Post by **ezzy333** » Mon Oct 12, 2015 8:58 pm

AlPastor wrote:
ezzy333 wrote:Bill, I know where of you speak. Approaching 83 and with a bad leg has basically put an end to my days afield.
We built a Honda Ruckus for a friend's dad that had double knee replacement. He rides it right up to the point.

I had both hips replaced and got along pretty good but then had to have back surgery twice in the past coupl of years and the nerves died in one leg and that has been a real problem as far as rough ground and thick cover. Pretty much stopped the hunting but I still race my training pigeons.

Post by **Sharon** » Tue Oct 13, 2015 2:32 pm

RyanDoolittle wrote:
ezzy333 wrote: ....................................................I always think of the old time cowboys that spent most of the daylight hours in the saddle on a quarter type horse when ever I hear how hard it is spend a few hours in the saddle at a trial. Sometimes I think we all forget just how easy we have it today.

Ezzy

I don't know. When I watch the old Western movies, the guys are all bent over in the saddle - back pain?

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