The ever popular question...Which Breed?

[Lowcountry]

I have a tendency to be long winded but I'll do my best not to ramble too much. However, I do believe it best to give a good background so that any answers provided are based on specific information versus a random shot in the dark. My childhood and youth was spent hunting with dogs. My father throughly enjoyed watching dogs work and as such, we ran deer, rabbits, squirrels, and coon. I worked on a plantation in my mid-20s and got the pleasure of seeing bird dogs work a few times. Besides the guide, I think I might have been the only one who paid more attention to the dogs than the birds. I was soon married and moved to the foothills of South Carolina. My wife and I rescued a Weimaraner, and I'll be the first to admit that the energy level was something I'd never experienced. Luckily, obedience training helped greatly and after that I had no problem handling his energy. Because of my lack of knowledge concerning pointers, I had always planned on sending him to school but life always seemed to get in the way. Currently, our Weimaraner lives with my wife and I have moved to the other end of the state. Some things were happening in my marriage that I didn't agree with nor supported and am currently going through a divorce. I'm staying with family for the time being in the lower part of South Carolina near the Georgia state line.

Being a novice, I'd like advice on which breed would best suit my needs.

My preference on size would be a breed that is on average 60 lbs or smaller.

My sister has a Yorkie mix so I'd also need a breed that is tolerant if not acceptive of small dogs.

I plan to hunt by foot and would prefer a dog that doesn't leave the country. I'm okay having one that reaches out a ways but I'd rather it stay in sight the vast majority of time. With that said, I'd rather have a dog that hunts hard and reaches out a little than a dog that stays close but doesn't put in the work.

I don't necessarily like the idea of long hair considering heat and burrs but wouldn't turn a long haired dog down for those reasons alone. My in-laws have German Shepards and while I understand that all dogs shed, I'd rather not have something that sheds like they do.

Energy levels are a concern but after adjusting to that of a Weimaraner, I'm confident that I can handle it and provide a dog with the necessary outlets. That isn't to say I'd prefer the energizer bunny, just that I'm aware of the energy of bird dogs in general.

The dog would live indoors as I'm seeking a companion just as much as a bird dog. Everyone seems to like the idea of getting a puppy but I have no problem getting a young started dog and would probably prefer it. The last bit of information could quite possibly the biggest problem. I'm currently living in an apartment, it's about 1000 square feet and on the ground level but an apartment nonetheless. Luckily, the dog would spend little time alone as my sister is a nurse who works night shift. That being said, some breeds are known for their anxiety when left alone and I'd like to avoid that disposition. I don't mind and actually welcome a dog that barks when hearing a knock on the door but out of respect for my neighbors, I don't want a breed that is traditionally loud.

I think that about covers it all. I'm fully aware that even within the same litter, dogs can have vastly different personalities. However, breeds and bloodlines as a whole have specific qualities and an accepted temperament. I have no problem being told that I'm asking too much and I probably am but I'd rather get something that suits the majority of my wishes over getting a dog just for the sake of getting a dog. I'll never get to see my Weimaraner lock up on a bird, but now I have the time to fix that with another dog.

[marysburg]

Well, you may be disappointed in this answer. Having said that; I don't think you should focus on which BREED, but instead, which DOG. What if you looked for a started dog from those breeders who sell them? Then you would know exactly what you HAVE, instead of what you might have. It would take a lot of puppy stress off your sister and off you. Sometimes, the individual is more useful than the breed.

[greg jacobs]

Unless your sister understands TOTALLY what living with a hunting pup means you better think twice about this. Sounds like a shaky situation. My wife works nights. That means she has to sleep when she gets home. Two different shifts means someone is trying to sleep 14 hours out of every 24.
I have a back porch with a dog door and a 6 foot fence around a big back yard with holes dug in it. I have three gates in the house that offers different access to the house. My wife has helped raise shorthair pups for 40 years and we can barely survive pups.
If you can make all that work I would suggest a navhda bred shorthair from a breeder that breeds for an off switch. Even at that no pup has an off switch.
A two year old dog that has been raised in the house and taught manners might be your best bet. Not a dog that has been kenneled for two years. And have a plan B already in place

Sorry for being negative
Good luck, i really hope you can have a dog soon.
Greg J

[Urban_Redneck]

As a guy who waited 30 years until I knew I could take good care of a bird dog, I don't think you are in a good spot.

I may be way off base (that's what the internet is for ) but, life sounds pretty unsettled, go volunteer at a shelter until things truly stabilize.

I wish you well.

[randomnut]

As a guy who waited 30 years until I knew I could take good care of a bird dog, I don't think you are in a good spot.

I may be way off base (that's what the internet is for ) but, life sounds pretty unsettled, go volunteer at a shelter until things truly stabilize.

I wish you well.

As a guy who waited 30 years until I knew I could care for a dog, get a dog

If you wait, something will always come up. I've had dogs for almost two years now, and wonder how I made it before.

I could afford the dogs, and care, vet bills, etc., but, as I always do, I wanted to be as prepared as possible.

Get the dog.

Oh yeah, breed? Non versatile. Brittany.

[RayGubernat]

The two salient points have already been hit upon.

First - You are really not in a position to take on a hunting breed puppy. To do so now would probably be very unfair to the dog.
Second -

As far as pointing breed dogs go, it matters VERY little which breed. There are individual dogs injust about every pointing breed that could fit your needs and there are lots of dogs in each breed that will not. Unless you are a fairly good trainer, or have a goodly amount of time on your hands, you would be well advised to get a pup from parents that hunt the way you want to, or...even better... get a started dog that hunts the way you want.

Use the time you now have wisely. Get your own situation under control and yourself settled. Then start looking into differentbreeds and breeders for the kind of hunting partner you want to spend the next ten years with.

RayG
\

[ezzy333]

I will give you a little differenyt take probably because when reading your history I came to a different conclusion. Though you didn't ask or give enough info to make a reasonable judgment, I agree with Ray if you are wanting a hunting dog then maybe you should wait but if, as you stated, you are wanting a family dog that hunts then yesterday would be a good time to get one. I have never seen an unhappy dog that is a family companion, but on the other hand if it is going to just be a hunting dog, kept in a kennel, and not hunted or exercised on an almost daily basis you may be in trouble and so might the dog.

Which breed is strictly up to you as all have dog that qualify. I have always been partial to the Britts mainly because of size and partially because of personality. But those are what I look for and your eye may be looking for something completely different and that is OK. There is no correct answer to your question and probably is a waste of time even asking. You are the only one that can say which breed.

Good Luck and happy hunting first for a pup and then for a bird.

Ezzy

[oregon woodsmoke]

The English Springer that we had would have suited you perfectly. He was a bout 40 pounds (a big Springer), shortish coat, born fully trained, not an aggressive bone in his body, loved everybody including any dog he met, and a well behaved dog in the house. Although a lot of energy, he was never destructive. He hunted with the gun as a partnership and wasn't too fast to keep up with on foot.

I don't know what you get when you buy a field Springer from the USA. Ours was from Britain and had a pedigree filled with British Field Trial Champions and being a bird dog was bred into him for generation after generation. I know there are Springer people here on this forum that have American bred Springers and they can say what it is like to hunt with one.

The Welsh Springer was pretty good, too. Not born as fully birdy, but she followed the English and just did what he did, so she was as good gun dog and a great house dog. She'd just flop down in the nearest lap and not move.

[Lowcountry]

I think everyone made great points and I thank everyone for the time they took to respond. I will have to admit that I'm looking for a companion first and bird dog second. More interested in a meat dog than a crackerjack, just go out and have fun. I'm not in an extreme rush at the moment but am trying to research breeds as well as bloodlines. I'll keep the board informed as my research and eventual purchase continues.

[mnaj_springer]

What's your sister think of this idea? Whoever you co-habitate with will need to be fully on board. I'm not in your shoes and I don't know you, so I'll avoid saying you're not ready for a pup/dog. Only you are able to answer that question. I believe the others here are just looking out for what would be best for all parties in the long run.

Regarding the apartment. My wife and I got a springer together while living in a 1400 square foot apartment (third floor). That wasn't a problem at all. I found safe places to let her out and roam freely, and potty training was not bad at all. She is a wonderful house dog, and now she is usually found laying underneath the coffee table. But keep in mind, I treat every interaction with my dogs as a training moment. They sit (or whoa for my pointer) before eating. They sit or whoa before going outside. When I hope the doors to their crate they don't leave until I give the release command. If I say "kennel" they run to their crates and I leave the doors open because they won't leave until given the release command. They are good house dogs because of training, not because of the breed. With that said, I think you should target breeds that fit your other requirements, such as size, and then decide based on the dog or the line.

P.S. Long hair (like a springer) isn't that big of an issue in the heat. Their fur is meant to insulate both the hot and the cold, plus protect against sunburn. I trim any excess length (mostly on her ears and feet) to help with burrs and snow clumps, but I don't shave her down. I think the biggest issue my springer has in the heat is the fact that her back is mostly black.

[ghideon]

I don't think you have the time. If you want both a good bird dog and a good family dog, you've got to put a lot of time into both, and you have to do it early. Garbage in/garbage out.

I can only speak to GSPs as that's all my family has had. When I was three years old we had a GSP pup that my father had to give away to another hunter because he had orders to transfer to Germany for the USAF.

We spent nine years in Germany and were dog-less. My father still hunted birds whenever he could. My sister and I (who is two years younger than me) had faint memories of being bird dog people (actually dog people in general).

We returned to California nine years later when I was 12. We bought two female litter mates that I spent middle school and high school hunting with (quail, doves and pheasants). Unfortunately one was gun-shy, and the other was epileptic.

The gun-shy one we had bred when I was in high school. We kept the runt of the litter who was actually a very good bird dog. When she got older, my parents got their first male when my parents were empty-nesting. He was a big guy at nearly 100lbs, who would wear his pads down hunting pheasant. He was however, the best family dog of the lot, but only lived for about seven years.

Fast forward to now. My parents have a 5 year old female, my sister and her brother in law have a 4 year female, and I now have a 9mo male.

Before he got all of his shots (~4mo) he was an absolute handful. You could not leave him alone for more than 5 seconds. I have a 2000sq foot house on a 3000sq foot lot. We would play fetch in my little back yard for an hour, play tug of war until he got 'cranky.' It took us nearly a month to figure out that when he got cranky (bity, jumpy, barky) he was just tired. We'd crate him and he'd be sleep within two minutes.

At the five month mark I was running him in the park for 2-3 hours a day. I have two parks nearby (one about a football field sized one, and the other is about 3x) where he could chase bugs. Bugs then became birds. Birds then became squirrels. Squirrels became cats (which is a no-no, I don't want the vet bills and I don't need him to kill any cats). He does all of this off leash with an e-collar. There's also a daily 'doggy meeting' where he gets to rough house with a bunch of other pups his age.

I do this in suburban San Jose, CA. He'll hunt soon (or at least try to). However all of this time we spend with him helps. My parents and my sister already mention how great he is, and all three of the current generation of dogs we have came from the same breeder. However I really believe this is because the amount of time we spend with him. During the day he gets crated for 3-5 hrs depending on our schedules. My wife runs her own business, and I have a really flexible schedule (I may work 10hrs a day, but I try to fit my life in the in between hours).

I'm 38 years old and outside of the GSPs we've owned I've only seen other GSPs twice. Once when I was about 13 (another hunter my dad knew) and then again about 10 years ago at work (she was a bomb sniffing dog).

In the 7 months I've had the pup I've had eight people identify the breed correctly. The first two were previous GSP owners whos dogs had passed within the last year. One had remarked on the energy level (her husband used to roller blade daily with his) and the second had a friend who got divorced from his wife, and the wife got the dog in the settlement. She wasn't prepared for it, and the dog suffered. He ended up taking the dog at 5yrs old and remarked it was the best dog he'd ever have. He actually approached me and asked me to pet my pup and I think he had tears in his eyes.

The next two were college aged kids who had both grown up with GSPs. The next was a Vizla owner in the neighborhood (the only Vizla I've ever seen in the flesh). The last was a couple who remarked they had a brother who had one, and was adept at killing cats, but other than that it was a great dog. The last one was a gentleman who was my age who asked me how old he was (8 months) and how much excerise did I give him (2-3hrs off leash, everyday). He actually thanked me for doing a good job.

[crackerd]

Mnaj, all else being equal, first sentence here sort of marries "Lowcountry" to his breed:
http://larleyboykinspaniels.com/index.p ... 2&Itemid=3

MG

[JONOV]

I got a wirehair puppy in a 750 sf apartment. In some ways it was easier because I didn't have as much to corral the dog out of. It was fine. My dog is very relaxed in the house. You are used to the energy level. If you get a puppy, it will get raised socialized to the small dog and not try and make a meal out of it. Make sure your sister is on board for it and you should be ok.

[bonasa]

I am an advocate for newbies to get a broke or well started dog. I'm sure you can find a 5-7 year old broke dog that a plantation, trialer or breeder would let go for next to nothing. Definetly get some books, DVd's, go to a seminar and join an organization specific to your desires. Next dog get a puppy and everything you learned in a few years will be much easier on the dog and yourself.

As far as breed and bloodline, find a breed you like the looks of and actions in the field. Begin with a bloodline that meets those criteria to the ideals you have (small vs big, close working vs far) and then Look at individuals that meet those requirements for a disposition and physical features you desire.

Good luck

[AtTheMurph]

My first bird dog was a Weim. Terrific dog, super smart and very high energy. Could also be destructive if she got bored and I wasn't around. She ate a 10 ft couch one afternoon as we were eating dinner. She was also extremely jealous and would go into the clothes hamper, sift through all the stuff and pull out one of my wife's articles (shoes, bras, underwear, etc) chew them up a little and then place them on top of the pile she made. Was a great learning experience.

Next dog was a Vizsla. think weim but with more adrenaline.

The latest dog had to be a compromise. Wife thought the energy of a bird dog in the house was too much but my rule is no dog that doesn't hunt.

After doing much the same search as the OP I decided on a Braque Francais. Supposedly a good bird dog and calm when they get indoors. I have been thrilled. 50lbs, quiet as a church mouse except for the UPS guy. Calm inside but will hunt with any of the dogs we go with (GSPs mostly). Seems to have a better nose than all of them, including my now departed Vizsla.

He's also mostly white which seems to help him in the heat over the other dogs that are darker but as an inside dog even the little he does shed shows up more. Cool little dog and if I get another I would stick with this breed for my lifestyle.

[Sharon]

I have a tendency to be long winded but I'll do my best not to ramble too much. However, I do believe it best to give a good background so that any answers provided are based on specific information versus a random shot in the dark. My childhood and youth was spent hunting with dogs. My father throughly enjoyed watching dogs work and as such, we ran deer, rabbits, squirrels, and coon. I worked on a plantation in my mid-20s and got the pleasure of seeing bird dogs work a few times. Besides the guide, I think I might have been the only one who paid more attention to the dogs than the birds. I was soon married and moved to the foothills of South Carolina. My wife and I rescued a Weimaraner, and I'll be the first to admit that the energy level was something I'd never experienced. Luckily, obedience training helped greatly and after that I had no problem handling his energy. Because of my lack of knowledge concerning pointers, I had always planned on sending him to school but life always seemed to get in the way. Currently, our Weimaraner lives with my wife and I have moved to the other end of the state. Some things were happening in my marriage that I didn't agree with nor supported and am currently going through a divorce. I'm staying with family for the time being in the lower part of South Carolina near the Georgia state line.

Being a novice, I'd like advice on which breed would best suit my needs.

My preference on size would be a breed that is on average 60 lbs or smaller.

My sister has a Yorkie mix so I'd also need a breed that is tolerant if not acceptive of small dogs.

I plan to hunt by foot and would prefer a dog that doesn't leave the country. I'm okay having one that reaches out a ways but I'd rather it stay in sight the vast majority of time. With that said, I'd rather have a dog that hunts hard and reaches out a little than a dog that stays close but doesn't put in the work.

I don't necessarily like the idea of long hair considering heat and burrs but wouldn't turn a long haired dog down for those reasons alone. My in-laws have German Shepards and while I understand that all dogs shed, I'd rather not have something that sheds like they do.

Energy levels are a concern but after adjusting to that of a Weimaraner, I'm confident that I can handle it and provide a dog with the necessary outlets. That isn't to say I'd prefer the energizer bunny, just that I'm aware of the energy of bird dogs in general.

The dog would live indoors as I'm seeking a companion just as much as a bird dog. Everyone seems to like the idea of getting a puppy but I have no problem getting a young started dog and would probably prefer it. The last bit of information could quite possibly the biggest problem. I'm currently living in an apartment, it's about 1000 square feet and on the ground level but an apartment nonetheless. Luckily, the dog would spend little time alone as my sister is a nurse who works night shift. That being said, some breeds are known for their anxiety when left alone and I'd like to avoid that disposition. I don't mind and actually welcome a dog that barks when hearing a knock on the door but out of respect for my neighbors, I don't want a breed that is traditionally loud.

I think that about covers it all. I'm fully aware that even within the same litter, dogs can have vastly different personalities. However, breeds and bloodlines as a whole have specific qualities and an accepted temperament. I have no problem being told that I'm asking too much and I probably am but I'd rather get something that suits the majority of my wishes over getting a dog just for the sake of getting a dog. I'll never get to see my Weimaraner lock up on a bird, but now I have the time to fix that with another dog.

field setter would meet your needs