Leaving one at home

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isonychia
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Leaving one at home

Post by isonychia » Wed Nov 08, 2017 6:43 pm

I'll admit, I am blowing up the forum a little but as my dog was diagnosed with heart disease, a lot is going through my mind. I am doing research on Brittany lines as many have seen (still taking suggestions for breeders who aren't huge FC guys) but have one burning question.

If I get a new pup and my current dog (first dog ever) gets to the point of not being able to hunt (technically, I shouldn't hunt with him starting now for the longest, most boring life possible), do you think I would be able to go hunting and leave him at home, taking the new dog? I mean, I know this is a question I must ask myself but what are your experiences?
Last edited by isonychia on Wed Nov 08, 2017 8:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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gonehuntin'
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Re: Leaving one at home

Post by gonehuntin' » Wed Nov 08, 2017 7:49 pm

I'm in SD right now with an 18 month DD and a nearly 13 year old DD. The 13 year old is in congestive heart failure and her back end is going. As long as she wants to go I will NEVER deny her that.

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isonychia
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Re: Leaving one at home

Post by isonychia » Wed Nov 08, 2017 8:16 pm

That is my plan, I just have never been through this and I know that with congestive heart failure in Fiddles future that there may be a point were just the drive to 9-10' will make him turn blue. The altitude paired with the hunting might be a limiter, though with any luck he will die having a blast hunting before this happens...

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Featherfinder
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Re: Leaving one at home

Post by Featherfinder » Thu Nov 09, 2017 6:19 am

First of all, I'm so sorry to hear about your dog's heart ailment. If diagnosed as a heart murmur, I myself would hunt the dog but that's just me. If he has something more severe.....it's your call. Leaving this dog at home is going to be somewhat abusive (I know it's not your intentions) but they know the protocols, the scent of your boots/gun/vest/shells, etc. Some dogs will lay there, whine & pine, while others could become absolutely destructive. Even worse, he could develop an issue EVERY time you go somewhere without him, "Is she going hunting without me again?!?!?"! One thing is for sure. There is no way he won't know where you and the other dog are going, if it's hunting. If he has any doubt, that doubt will be erased by the scents (of birds, etc.) you bring home.
Looking broad spectrum at your options, this comes to mind:
- return the dog to the breeder (Yes...he has become a family member already however let me take you back to how this dog will feel every time you leave him home to go hunting.)
- place him in a non-hunting home. Need I reiterate the aforementioned statement? Theses decisions are not always just about "us".
- take him hunting so that he can enjoy what days he has left doing what he loves. I might hunt him in certain venues where he is not stressed as much or for shorter stints, etc. Are there meds you can give him just before a hunt perhaps?
- keep him at home OR relocate him temporarily when you go hunting (take him to family or friends until you have returned, put all your gear away, cleaned and stored your birds, etc.).
It's a difficult situation and I feel for you but nowhere is it written that life is fair. Once again, so sorry........

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isonychia
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Re: Leaving one at home

Post by isonychia » Thu Nov 09, 2017 7:51 am

Those are some brutal options you give out there feather. I would think not getting a new dog would be easier than most all of those. Maybe that is a best route or me. At least for now.

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Re: Leaving one at home

Post by RayGubernat » Thu Nov 09, 2017 1:19 pm

ISO -

I have to come down with Gonehuntin' on this one.

These dogs are born and bred to hunt and find birds. It is much more than a "job" for them...it is what they live and breathe for. They live for the moment and IN the moment. They would be perfectly OK with hunting until their heart burst. WE are the ones who think about "what if". We are the ones that worry.

I would hunt the dog as long as it was able. If it could not handle the country it used to, I would take it to easier places to hunt. If it could only go for a half hour, that is how long I would have it down. Been there...did that...more than once.

If the dog was physically unable to hunt and was psychologically OK with hanging out at home when I left to hunt, That would be fine. However, if the dog was miserable because it physically could not go... I would be forced to do something about that.

Whatever you do, whatever you decide, your dog will still love you unconditionally because that is also the way they are. Your first dog is special and will always be with you. There is often a bond there that transcends time and place.

I still get tears in my eyes when I think of my first dog...and that was a very long time ago.

Do your best...that is all they ask of us, even though they deserve so much more.

RayG

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isonychia
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Re: Leaving one at home

Post by isonychia » Thu Nov 09, 2017 1:52 pm

Thanks for that. My plan since the first minute of hearing not to hunt with him was screw that. I can think of no better outcome than for him to drop dead hunting. I just wonder if I should wait until he passes, which may hopefully be a while yet, before getting a new pup. I feel like I owe him that, but I don't know.

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Re: Leaving one at home

Post by Sharon » Thu Nov 09, 2017 3:37 pm

isonychia wrote:I'll admit, I am blowing up the forum a little but as my dog was diagnosed with heart disease, a lot is going through my mind. I am doing research on Brittany lines as many have seen (still taking suggestions for breeders who aren't huge FC guys) but have one burning question.

If I get a new pup and my current dog (first dog ever) gets to the point of not being able to hunt (technically, I shouldn't hunt with him starting now for the longest, most boring life possible), do you think I would be able to go hunting and leave him at home, taking the new dog? I mean, I know this is a question I must ask myself but what are your experiences?
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
As long as the dog's pain was under control I took her. Fortunately , she had her killing seizure on the couch and not in the field. If she had had that seizure in the field, I think I would have felt terrible - far from a vet. What I'm saying is we all hope the dog will have a heart attack and die quietly in the field - not always the case I have learned. Now I'm still running her daughter at age 12 and hoping she doesn't have that kind of traumatic non stop seizure in the field.

What I'm trying to say is that , that is a decision only you can make.

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Re: Leaving one at home

Post by deseeker » Thu Nov 09, 2017 3:39 pm

RayGubernat wrote:ISO -

I have to come down with Gonehuntin' on this one.

These dogs are born and bred to hunt and find birds. It is much more than a "job" for them...it is what they live and breathe for. They live for the moment and IN the moment. They would be perfectly OK with hunting until their heart burst. WE are the ones who think about "what if". We are the ones that worry.

I would hunt the dog as long as it was able. If it could not handle the country it used to, I would take it to easier places to hunt. If it could only go for a half hour, that is how long I would have it down. Been there...did that...more than once.

If the dog was physically unable to hunt and was psychologically OK with hanging out at home when I left to hunt, That would be fine. However, if the dog was miserable because it physically could not go... I would be forced to do something about that.

Whatever you do, whatever you decide, your dog will still love you unconditionally because that is also the way they are. Your first dog is special and will always be with you. There is often a bond there that transcends time and place.

I still get tears in my eyes when I think of my first dog...and that was a very long time ago.

Do your best...that is all they ask of us, even though they deserve so much more.

RayG
Good Post & I agree :D

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Featherfinder
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Re: Leaving one at home

Post by Featherfinder » Sat Nov 11, 2017 7:20 am

The spectrum of brutal options were placed before you for a reason. You have single-handedly made the right choice, or should I say, I would do what you suggested. Keep this dog front and center, let him hunt as much as possible then let the chips fall where they may. At least you have done the right thing by this dog. All he wants to do is hunt and make you happy. Find a way.....

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Re: Leaving one at home

Post by Steve007 » Sat Nov 11, 2017 12:38 pm

Dogs are a little weak at measuring time. A five-minute 'hunt' is likely as emotionally satisfying as a two-hour run. If you can find a preserve (or hunt on one), buy a quail and plant it (use gloves) for your dog. I would never risk my dog's life out of a misplaced feeling that she should be in the field when she shouldn't be. But if possible,take her and give a few minutes.

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Re: Leaving one at home

Post by polmaise » Sat Nov 11, 2017 2:32 pm

'Pip' my Springer passed away this year at age 11.
She was retired from wild fowling 3 years ago and Beating on a Grouse Moor 2 years ago and retired from beating on a Driven pheasant or partridge shoot last year.
She wasn't retired from sitting in a pigeon hide in the summer and she wasn't retired from a walk up day with me and my gun,and she wasn't retired from attending Training classes.
The often 'Romantic notion' , of 'They love it ,and they would rather be out doing what they love,rather in the house when you go out' is a load of 'poppycock' ! Yes they would rather do it!! , because they do love it ! .
But as custodians of this best friend we have other obligations and status of care .
If the dog requires 'Metacalm' then one should look at their Morals more closely.
Pip collapsed and just died on a sunny day in the garden,she had not been at any shoot or training day or pigeon hide or walk up with me for a while before that day.
Some folk do work their dog far beyond the years of the dog and some don't ,and tales of some dogs working well in to their teens!
It depends on how many miles are on the clock and 'Pip' had many.
It takes a Good man/woman to service their Individual dog and know when and where any retirement is required .
It shouldn't be a sudden 'sit by the fire' and do nothing ! No Gun Dog deserves that

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Re: Leaving one at home

Post by MNTonester » Mon Nov 13, 2017 7:07 pm

my arthritic black lab will be 12 YO January 4. Once he's on his feet, he seems to find the fountain of youth. I just got back from a SW MN phez hunt on Saturday. He didn't hunt every field but he hunted with gusto and did a great job in the fields he hunted. I would hate to deny him the pleasure of the hunt.

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isonychia
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Re: Leaving one at home

Post by isonychia » Mon Nov 13, 2017 9:13 pm

I guess my question was with the context of the hunting we do. That is, hunting grouse and ptarmigan above 10,000 feet with low oxygen levels, I was told that driving above 7k could kill a dog in congestive heart failure. I live at 7.5k

Anyways, that time hasnt come. I was mostly wondering about new puppy timing, now or later.

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Re: Leaving one at home

Post by RayGubernat » Tue Nov 14, 2017 8:42 am

ISO -

Here's my take on the puppy thing.

If your current dog is physically able to interact with a puppy and, as it grows, a young dog, there are things your dog can help the youngster to learn. Not perhaps so much about hunting, but more about being a good canine citizen and family member. The interaction may well be stressful for your dog, but it might keep him moving a bit also. A playmate might be a good thing, in small doses.

If I were in your shoes and I thought my current dog could handle the addition...I would go for it. This way, when your current dog is unable to go with you, you won't be tempted to push the situation, which could(and probably would) be bad for the dog.

RayG

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Re: Leaving one at home

Post by Robbw » Wed Nov 15, 2017 9:24 am

I'll chime in. I have a 12 year old American Britt and just got a 3 and a half year old French Britt. The American Britt is hunted very hard during our 6 week season and last year I started dialing her back. That was because one day we happened to hit what must have been a freshly stocked area and for 2 and a half hours it was a bird nuthouse. She wanted to hunt some more but we were limited out and headed home. She did not move from the couch for 2 days, would not eat and wouldn't get out except for a minute to go to the bathroom. Even though it was a fairly short hunt, it was intense and it was to much for her.

This year, I am alternating dogs. The new dog needs some training and the older dog needs rest. When the old dog goes out, I won't let her go more than 45 minutes during the week and maybe an hour and a half on Saturday. And she is in excellent shape because I run my dogs almost every day in the woods for exercise. The point is that these dogs will hunt till they drop and that's not something we should allow them to do. If your dog can hunt a little bit, monitor and control it but give your hunting dog some time in the field. And if you get a new dog, the old dog won't like staying home on off days but it's like kids not wanting to go to bed. We are in charge and we do what's best for them.

Good luck.

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Re: Leaving one at home

Post by naperdog » Wed Mar 07, 2018 2:43 pm

Good conversation everyone. I haven’t been on the forum in many years but came back to read posts like this. I have a 10 year old lab that just had a great season. That being said, I’ve decided to get a new pup and am on-line trying to figure out how to manage any aging dog (who is my first and it tears me up that I have to be thinking about this) along with a pup.

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Re: Leaving one at home

Post by fishvik » Wed Mar 07, 2018 6:04 pm

Iso, I'm with the take the dog with you. When it is tired work back to the truck and kennel it. My experience is once your out of sight it will just lay down and rest. Good luck with whatever you do.

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