Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

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gundogguy
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Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by gundogguy » Sun Feb 17, 2019 8:01 am


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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by Settertude » Sun Feb 17, 2019 8:56 am

I can see no benefit, but one, to anyone.
Increments.
Be careful, this could be political.
LOL

Sorry--couldn't resist.

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by mask » Sun Feb 17, 2019 11:12 am

This would not just effect Oregon but the Pacific northwest and beyond.

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by averageguy » Sun Feb 17, 2019 1:24 pm

I posted the same link in the Legislation section yesterday. The language of the bill will also outlaw Birddog Trials and competitions. Hardly an accident or oversight.

This is the latest perceived low hanging fruit from an Anti-Hunting organization which hopes to pick it off and move to their next target. Yes there are PR challenges and some segments of our Sport add to those challenges, but throwing legal Sportsman under the bus is exactly the reaction the anti-hunters hope to see. Reactions such as that are how the bans on using dogs to hunt mountain lions and bears were successful in the past and then spread to neighboring states.

This link below is the organization behind the legislation. This threat is far larger than Oregon and coyote contests.

http://www.projectcoyote.org

If the criteria of money becomes the deciding factor what becomes of all the Texas Hunting Lease operations and elsewhere across the US and the World, Waterfowl, Upland and Big Game Guides and Outfitters, Bass Tournaments, Bowfishing Tournaments ... Sportsman tempted to think this does not affect their segment of Sport Hunting are not thinking deep enough on the issue.

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by Sharon » Sun Feb 17, 2019 4:35 pm

Wow. That is scary stuff. Alberta (big trialing province) is not that far from Oregon .

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by Trekmoor » Mon Feb 18, 2019 3:26 am

How likely is it that this Bill will be passed ? Wouldn't America's huge gun lobby see the dangers in this and help to vote it down ?

About 35 years ago the Anti's in Britain thought they could get a law passed prohibiting "cruelty" in sports but they had forgotten that our many thousands of keen anglers would also be affected and had to back down.
Since then "divide and conquer" has become the way forward for our anti's . They got foxhunting and otter hunting banned with dogs and are still trying to split the rest of us up into more manageable lumps.


Bill T.

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by cjhills » Mon Feb 18, 2019 6:49 am

It would be fairly likely to pass. The gun lobbys don't care about hunters and the population is going more toward neutral on hunting. It is relatively easy for anti hunters to get the neutrals on their side. It would seem like it would be hard to pass in a state like Oregon.
We give the anti hunters way to much information to use against us on a forum like this, Be careful of the photos you post and the brags about all the limits you kill. Some people are not impressed. What do you think the nonhunter thinks when he sees a pile of dead birds or a deer that is killed for his rack. KIlling animals for sport is on the way out.
I can go to South Dakota pheasant hunting with a few of my kid and grand kids legally bring home 150 or more pheasants. That is nuts. nobody can eat 150 pheasants. The anti hunters use that. Nobody can eat 150 pheasants, If we expect hunting rights to last we need to clean up our act,
I am not in favor of killing contests where the most critters killed wins. For that matter why are fishing contests even legal, Why can they use our resources to
make money.
Thank you..…..Cj

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by averageguy » Mon Feb 18, 2019 7:35 am

cjhills wrote:It would be fairly likely to pass. The gun lobbys don't care about hunters and the population is going more toward neutral on hunting. It is relatively easy for anti hunters to get the neutrals on their side. It would seem like it would be hard to pass in a state like Oregon.
We give the anti hunters way to much information to use against us on a forum like this, Be careful of the photos you post and the brags about all the limits you kill. Some people are not impressed. What do you think the nonhunter thinks when he sees a pile of dead birds or a deer that is killed for his rack. KIlling animals for sport is on the way out.
I can go to South Dakota pheasant hunting with a few of my kid and grand kids legally bring home 150 or more pheasants. That is nuts. nobody can eat 150 pheasants. The anti hunters use that. Nobody can eat 150 pheasants, If we expect hunting rights to last we need to clean up our act,
I am not in favor of killing contests where the most critters killed wins. For that matter why are fishing contests even legal, Why can they use our resources to
make money.
Thank you..…..Cj
This is playing right into the Anti-hunters hands. Attack your fellow hunters for taking a legal limit of birds and commemorating it with a photo. Might as well be on the other side when it comes to that.

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by cjhills » Mon Feb 18, 2019 7:43 am

averageguy wrote:
cjhills wrote:It would be fairly likely to pass. The gun lobbys don't care about hunters and the population is going more toward neutral on hunting. It is relatively easy for anti hunters to get the neutrals on their side. It would seem like it would be hard to pass in a state like Oregon.
We give the anti hunters way to much information to use against us on a forum like this, Be careful of the photos you post and the brags about all the limits you kill. Some people are not impressed. What do you think the nonhunter thinks when he sees a pile of dead birds or a deer that is killed for his rack. KIlling animals for sport is on the way out.
I can go to South Dakota pheasant hunting with a few of my kid and grand kids legally bring home 150 or more pheasants. That is nuts. nobody can eat 150 pheasants. The anti hunters use that. Nobody can eat 150 pheasants, If we expect hunting rights to last we need to clean up our act,
I am not in favor of killing contests where the most critters killed wins. For that matter why are fishing contests even legal, Why can they use our resources to
make money.
Thank you..…..Cj
This is playing right into the Anti-hunters hands. Attack your fellow hunters for taking a legal limit of birds and commemorating it with a photo. Might as well be on the other side when it comes to that.
No attack just pointing out what the people who are neutral see. I doubt that the birds liked it much...…...Cj

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by Settertude » Mon Feb 18, 2019 7:58 am

cjhills wrote:
averageguy wrote:
cjhills wrote:It would be fairly likely to pass. The gun lobbys don't care about hunters and the population is going more toward neutral on hunting. It is relatively easy for anti hunters to get the neutrals on their side. It would seem like it would be hard to pass in a state like Oregon.
We give the anti hunters way to much information to use against us on a forum like this, Be careful of the photos you post and the brags about all the limits you kill. Some people are not impressed. What do you think the nonhunter thinks when he sees a pile of dead birds or a deer that is killed for his rack. KIlling animals for sport is on the way out.
I can go to South Dakota pheasant hunting with a few of my kid and grand kids legally bring home 150 or more pheasants. That is nuts. nobody can eat 150 pheasants. The anti hunters use that. Nobody can eat 150 pheasants, If we expect hunting rights to last we need to clean up our act,
I am not in favor of killing contests where the most critters killed wins. For that matter why are fishing contests even legal, Why can they use our resources to
make money.
Thank you..…..Cj
This is playing right into the Anti-hunters hands. Attack your fellow hunters for taking a legal limit of birds and commemorating it with a photo. Might as well be on the other side when it comes to that.
No attack just pointing out what the people who are neutral see. I doubt that the birds liked it much...…...Cj
I think these two represent two reasonable positions.
Sportsmen need to start thinking in the long term--in a few things. The folks agin us certainly are.
Conversation stoppers are just that.

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by Timewise65 » Mon Feb 18, 2019 11:12 am

I think the 'climate' of the people in Oregon do not represent the majority of the folks in this country! Not that this is not of concern to us all, it is...but you have to consider the source, meaning the state of Oregon...


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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by averageguy » Mon Feb 18, 2019 2:02 pm

https://www.projectcoyote.org/vermont-e ... the-state/

Read this.

https://vtdigger.org/2018/05/24/coyote- ... d-vermont/

Will Spread like Cancer to other states and venues. Already has.
Last edited by averageguy on Mon Feb 18, 2019 2:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by Sharon » Mon Feb 18, 2019 2:07 pm

cjhills wrote:It would be fairly likely to pass. The gun lobbys don't care about hunters and the population is going more toward neutral on hunting. It is relatively easy for anti hunters to get the neutrals on their side. It would seem like it would be hard to pass in a state like Oregon.
We give the anti hunters way to much information to use against us on a forum like this, Be careful of the photos you post and the brags about all the limits you kill. Some people are not impressed. What do you think the nonhunter thinks when he sees a pile of dead birds or a deer that is killed for his rack. KIlling animals for sport is on the way out.
I can go to South Dakota pheasant hunting with a few of my kid and grand kids legally bring home 150 or more pheasants. That is nuts. nobody can eat 150 pheasants. The anti hunters use that. Nobody can eat 150 pheasants, If we expect hunting rights to last we need to clean up our act,
I am not in favor of killing contests where the most critters killed wins. For that matter why are fishing contests even legal, Why can they use our resources to
make money.
Thank you..…..Cj
My position exactly. So glad to see someone say it as I've never had the courage.

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by averageguy » Mon Feb 18, 2019 2:30 pm

cjhills wrote:It would be fairly likely to pass. The gun lobbys don't care about hunters and the population is going more toward neutral on hunting. It is relatively easy for anti hunters to get the neutrals on their side. It would seem like it would be hard to pass in a state like Oregon.
We give the anti hunters way to much information to use against us on a forum like this, Be careful of the photos you post and the brags about all the limits you kill. Some people are not impressed. What do you think the nonhunter thinks when he sees a pile of dead birds or a deer that is killed for his rack. KIlling animals for sport is on the way out.
I can go to South Dakota pheasant hunting with a few of my kid and grand kids legally bring home 150 or more pheasants. That is nuts. nobody can eat 150 pheasants. The anti hunters use that. Nobody can eat 150 pheasants, If we expect hunting rights to last we need to clean up our act,
I am not in favor of killing contests where the most critters killed wins. For that matter why are fishing contests even legal, Why can they use our resources to
make money.
Thank you..…..Cj
The NRA does a great deal in support of Hunters. Writing an erroneous opinion to the contrary does not erase those facts. Whether the NRA is an organization an individual chooses to support is their call, but that is a different matter than what the organization's actions factually are.

Pheasants - The ability to differentiate the roosters from the hens puts them in a unique class of upland bird. If ever there was a bird which can be responsibly hunted, filling daily and possession limits, it is the rooster pheasant. Their survival skills coupled with the ability of one rooster to breed a bunch of hens makes them able to withstand a whole lot of hunting pressure. Bringing home 150 pheasants from a SD hunting trip would require 10 licensed hunters filling their daily limits on each of the 5 days their hunting licenses allow. One hunter can easily utilize 15 pheasants between seasons and a lot more than that.

If pheasant numbers are so high that a group of 10 hunters can fill their limits for 5 days in a row then Happy Hunting is what I say to that!

One additional example before moving on. In Feb 2017 I PAID to hunt a ranch in Texas for wild bobwhite quail. Hunted the last 3 days of the season with a guide using my dog in the mornings and evenings and his dogs in the mid-day. In 50 years of hunting wild bobwhite I have never seen as many quail. We filled our 3 man limits including on the last day of season, moving an average of 8 coveys of quail an hour for 3 straight days of hunting. We hunted the same ranch in Feb 2018 and struggled to move 8 coveys of quail a day. A drought followed by eyeworms had devastated the population. It had nothing to do with hunting pressure. Which is common with upland bird populations.

Which makes attacking Fellow Sportsman for those days where the combination of bird numbers, dog work and shooting are good enough to take a legal limit, all the more wrong headed. This from the very persons who should know best how wrong that is. Beyond disappointing to me.

I watched "The Flush" while working out this morning. They were hunting at the Thunderstick Lodge in SD. Paid hunts, a combination of wild and released birds. Guys celebrating when they made a good shot on a rooster. Anyone who cannot see this anti-hunting organization sponsoring these bills following their efforts into these areas has their head in the sand. NSTRA and BDC competitions are highly related activities as well.

Our Fur Market has crashed and I predict it will never return to a level adequate to provide the incentives it once did. Sport trappers and hunters will be the control necessary on otherwise unchecked boom and bust populations of furbearers. Raccoons are an extremely effective ground nest predator and their numbers in the Midwest are at the highest levels of the 50 year period I have paid attention to such things. These animals need to be hunted and trapped to control their numbers, and it behooves all who live amongst them to support persons doing so within reason.

How we portray ourselves to the general public is critically important. However, notions we can run from or hide the fact we kill animals for sport is fiction and folly.

Throwing legal Sport Hunters under the bus for taking legal limits is one of the most unproductive actions we could ever take and yet it is the first subject one chooses to post and another supports.

We are doomed if this immediate infighting behavior becomes a trend.
Last edited by averageguy on Mon Feb 18, 2019 3:07 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by averageguy » Mon Feb 18, 2019 2:35 pm

Sharon wrote:
cjhills wrote:It would be fairly likely to pass. The gun lobbys don't care about hunters and the population is going more toward neutral on hunting. It is relatively easy for anti hunters to get the neutrals on their side. It would seem like it would be hard to pass in a state like Oregon.
We give the anti hunters way to much information to use against us on a forum like this, Be careful of the photos you post and the brags about all the limits you kill. Some people are not impressed. What do you think the nonhunter thinks when he sees a pile of dead birds or a deer that is killed for his rack. KIlling animals for sport is on the way out.
I can go to South Dakota pheasant hunting with a few of my kid and grand kids legally bring home 150 or more pheasants. That is nuts. nobody can eat 150 pheasants. The anti hunters use that. Nobody can eat 150 pheasants, If we expect hunting rights to last we need to clean up our act,
I am not in favor of killing contests where the most critters killed wins. For that matter why are fishing contests even legal, Why can they use our resources to
make money.
Thank you..…..Cj
My position exactly. So glad to see someone say it as I've never had the courage.
Take note the Rabbit hunting competitions using beagles will come under the same fire. As will NSTRA and BDC ...

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by crackerd » Mon Feb 18, 2019 2:39 pm

Timewise65 wrote:I think the 'climate' of the people in Oregon do not represent the majority of the folks in this country! Not that this is not of concern to us all, it is...but you have to consider the source, meaning the state of Oregon...
Yeah, consider it as one of the top retriever training venues in the country - and several times site of the National Retriever Championships.

Bill T., the "gun lobby" won't take sides as applies to retriever training/trials and "wildlife," the difficulty we face is getting the "liberated birds" as you lot are apt to call them essentially declared as poultry so FTs (and to a far lesser extent HTs) can still offer live fare of ducks and pheasants.

You might be aware from some of our fellow Commonwealthers that O Canada offers NO liberated birds to be shot in retriever trials, but uses only cold game - which makes a huge difference in how the trials are run and of course trained for.

MG

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by ddoyle » Mon Feb 18, 2019 3:33 pm

CJ I think you might want to tread lightly in deciding who should be able to do what... Why should someone have X # of purebred dogs when then shelters are full of them, why should someone have an X square foot home when people are homeless. If they pay their license and obey the law they can do what they want...maybe they bring it back home and they have a game feed for family and friends? I think people should only be able to eat steak once a year anything more is wasteful. See the slope you are on?

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by Timewise65 » Mon Feb 18, 2019 4:18 pm

crackerd wrote:
Timewise65 wrote:I think the 'climate' of the people in Oregon do not represent the majority of the folks in this country! Not that this is not of concern to us all, it is...but you have to consider the source, meaning the state of Oregon...
Yeah, consider it as one of the top retriever training venues in the country - and several times site of the National Retriever Championships.

Bill T., the "gun lobby" won't take sides as applies to retriever training/trials and "wildlife," the difficulty we face is getting the "liberated birds" as you lot are apt to call them essentially declared as poultry so FTs (and to a far lesser extent HTs) can still offer live fare of ducks and pheasants.

You might be aware from some of our fellow Commonwealthers that O Canada offers NO liberated birds to be shot in retriever trials, but uses only cold game - which makes a huge difference in how the trials are run and of course trained for.

MG
When commenting on what is now going on in Oregon speaks to what is coming in the future, not the past! If you are oblivious to this then, I doubt I can say anything to change your mindset! You comment on Canada....does it not predict what is coming in the USA based on States like Oregon and unfortunately, they are not alone...

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by Sharon » Mon Feb 18, 2019 5:08 pm

averageguy wrote:
Sharon wrote:
cjhills wrote:It would be fairly likely to pass. The gun lobbys don't care about hunters and the population is going more toward neutral on hunting. It is relatively easy for anti hunters to get the neutrals on their side. It would seem like it would be hard to pass in a state like Oregon.
We give the anti hunters way to much information to use against us on a forum like this, Be careful of the photos you post and the brags about all the limits you kill. Some people are not impressed. What do you think the nonhunter thinks when he sees a pile of dead birds or a deer that is killed for his rack. KIlling animals for sport is on the way out.
I can go to South Dakota pheasant hunting with a few of my kid and grand kids legally bring home 150 or more pheasants. That is nuts. nobody can eat 150 pheasants. The anti hunters use that. Nobody can eat 150 pheasants, If we expect hunting rights to last we need to clean up our act,
I am not in favor of killing contests where the most critters killed wins. For that matter why are fishing contests even legal, Why can they use our resources to
make money.
Thank you..…..Cj
My position exactly. So glad to see someone say it as I've never had the courage.
Take note the Rabbit hunting competitions using beagles will come under the same fire. As will NSTRA and BDC ...
(Rabbits aren't shot in CKC/AKC beagle trials. Birds aren't shot in American Field pointing breed trials.)

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by averageguy » Mon Feb 18, 2019 5:18 pm

You obviously did not read the link to the article I posted above about this ban already succeeding in Vermont. The Governor discusses his reservations including how Rabbit and Turkey hunting competitions continue to exist in the State. https://www.facebook.com/events/42nd-an ... 066530826/

Here is another. https://community.legendarywhitetails.c ... l-town-wi/

AKC, UKC, NAVHDA Hunt Tests, NSTRA, BDC all shoot birds. One venue with an incomplete (run and point only) test of a birddog hardly dismisses the fact that many others are living in a glass house on this standard.


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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by averageguy » Mon Feb 18, 2019 5:33 pm

Turkey Hunting Competition: http://www.nationalturkeyhuntingchampionship.com

I am sure I can find many more of other types and quarry but I would think the point has been made. Then again while I would be disappointed if it has not, I won't be surprised.

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by cjhills » Mon Feb 18, 2019 5:43 pm

ddoyle wrote:CJ I think you might want to tread lightly in deciding who should be able to do what... Why should someone have X # of purebred dogs when then shelters are full of them, why should someone have an X square foot home when people are homeless. If they pay their license and obey the law they can do what they want...maybe they bring it back home and they have a game feed for family and friends? I think people should only be able to eat steak once a year anything more is wasteful. See the slope you are on?
DD
I realize all that but bragging about killing birds and posting pictures of dead birds is of no value on a forum like this and is feed for antis
Not real sure what I think of property leases that allow a few people exclusive rights to publicly owned game. But that's another story. I hunt public land. I refuse to pay to hunt private land for public birds. I you have every right to think people should only eat steak once a year.
We need to give some thought to the picture we paint for the people who are neutral...…..Cj
PS. One thing you all need to be aware of there is no need to convince me. I know where you are coming from I've been in the kill everything camp, As I get older and respect life more I am not sure who is right.
Last edited by cjhills on Mon Feb 18, 2019 7:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by polmaise » Mon Feb 18, 2019 5:50 pm

Settertude wrote:I can see no benefit, but one, to anyone.
Increments.
Be careful, this could be political.
LOL
:lol:
Sounds like POTUS .
Fuel on Fire is easy for a redneck . Suburbia think its funny . ...Then again ??
....
This side of the pond there is increased pressure from Non Shooting lobbies to ask accountability of what the end product of shooting provides and is catered for .
Driven shoot days are regular 2-300 bird days ,every Saturday .! These are reared birds of course and predominately Pheasant (both Hen and Rooster) and Partridge .
Pigeon Shooting is also well favored and bags of over 100 in a day are a mere trickle for some pictured in magazines and media.
...
Always did say many years ago ...this promotion of the sport you do will come to bite you . :wink:

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by ddoyle » Mon Feb 18, 2019 5:58 pm

CJ I totally disagree this thinking going forward is the same thought process that says don't discuss hunting around antis because it could cause a scene. I am more a fan of NRA defend your right to do what is legal and don't cower... When you cower or stop acknowledging doing what you love it looks to many as if you are trying hide from or are embarrassed by what you are doing. Plus how do you promote hunting if you don't discuss and show photos of a great time!

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by averageguy » Mon Feb 18, 2019 6:07 pm

cjhills wrote:
ddoyle wrote:CJ I think you might want to tread lightly in deciding who should be able to do what... Why should someone have X # of purebred dogs when then shelters are full of them, why should someone have an X square foot home when people are homeless. If they pay their license and obey the law they can do what they want...maybe they bring it back home and they have a game feed for family and friends? I think people should only be able to eat steak once a year anything more is wasteful. See the slope you are on?
DD
I realize all that but bragging about killing birds and posting pictures of dead birds is of no value on a forum like this and is feed for antis
Not real sure what I think of property leases that allow a few people exclusive rights to publicly owned game. But that's another story. I hunt public land. I refuse to pay to hunt private land
We need to give some thought to the picture we paint for the people who are neutral...…..Cj
Is a photo of a dog pointing a bird ok? Is a dog retrieving a bird ok? A dog posing with birds ok? What about all the videos of birds being flushed and shot? What we will do when anti-hunters and or non-hunters attend Hunt Tests and Birddog competitions and see live birds being shot?

Do we tell Outdoor and Sportsman Channels to shut down? The Flush, Bird Dog Challenge, GunDog, The Grind, Banded Nation, Avian-X, Heartland Waterfowl ... programs all must go! No more Primos DVDs! No Drury Brothers! Duck Dynasty you must go!

Guide and Outfitter Websites complete with photos all must go!

No more leasing of Private lands because some hunt Public Lands!

There are untold thousands of photos of dead birds and all other types of animals on Facebook and the cyberspace. Not going to put that genie back in the bottle and if this were to become our strategic response we are doomed.

Wow!!! is the most chartable response I can muster.
Last edited by averageguy on Mon Feb 18, 2019 6:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by ddoyle » Mon Feb 18, 2019 6:29 pm

There are untold thousands of photos of dead birds and all other types of animals on Facebook and the cyberspace. Not going to put that genie back in the bottle and if this were to become our strategic response we are doomed.[/quote]

Amen! If placating these folks worked Ringling Brothers Circus would still be in business. They won't quit to it all we do is outlawed the way to win is to get more people on our side and take pride in hunting. Share with everyone you know the good time you have getting together with friends and working dogs. I have three kids that are now bird hunters and I guarantee that the thing that first got them interested was sitting at the restaurant listening to all us give each other a hard time and laughing at each other. My group even when we were younger referred to ourselves as The Old Men Peeing Hunt Club...because it seemed every time someone stopped to pee a bird would flush. Hunting is the side event but it was what made us all get together!

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by mask » Mon Feb 18, 2019 7:19 pm

A famous man once said, if we don't hang together then we will hang separately.

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by polmaise » Mon Feb 18, 2019 7:27 pm

mask wrote:A famous man once said, if we don't hang together then we will hang separately.
I bet he lived ,to tell the tale :wink: :lol:

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by cjhills » Mon Feb 18, 2019 7:34 pm

polmaise wrote:
Settertude wrote:I can see no benefit, but one, to anyone.
Increments.
Be careful, this could be political.
LOL
:lol:
Sounds like POTUS .
Fuel on Fire is easy for a redneck . Suburbia think its funny . ...Then again ??
....
This side of the pond there is increased pressure from Non Shooting lobbies to ask accountability of what the end product of shooting provides and is catered for .
Driven shoot days are regular 2-300 bird days ,every Saturday .! These are reared birds of course and predominately Pheasant (both Hen and Rooster) and Partridge .
Pigeon Shooting is also well favored and bags of over 100 in a day are a mere trickle for some pictured in magazines and media.
...
Always did say many years ago ...this promotion of the sport you do will come to bite you . :wink:
Polmaise:
Who are the shooters innthe driven shoot. Can any Joe blow shoot......Cj

cjhills
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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by cjhills » Mon Feb 18, 2019 7:38 pm

AGAIN IT ISNOT ME YOU NEED TO CONVINCE.......Cj

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by cjhills » Mon Feb 18, 2019 7:50 pm

I once sent a photo of myself holding a limit of pheasants and three dogs to everybody in my email mail box. I was amazed how offended some people were...….Cj

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by ddoyle » Mon Feb 18, 2019 7:56 pm

cjhills wrote:AGAIN IT ISNOT ME YOU NEED TO CONVINCE.......Cj
No it is you we need to convince to be proud of what you do and not apologize! For those that blasted you about the picture move on and any positive replies you got invite them to go along next time. If we don't vocally and unequivocally defend our rights we will lose them!
cjhills wrote:
Sat Feb 23, 2019 7:10 am
DD.
You. Vociferously and Unequificably" What do these two words mean. To me and most people they would mean loudly and no argument. Or in your face . Not the way to win friends and influence people.

OB. You are right SD has shooting preserve license. Either one day, or 5 days. You are likely Right about NSTRA you have much more experience than I. If that is the case I don't see the reason for judges.….. Cj
CJ I am going with you misunderstood.... Read the whole quote I stated that those who attack you write off and those who replied favorably engage. Then in general vocally and unequivocally defend our rights...meaning no apologies and stating facts. If I had meant loudly and no argument I would have written those words.

I would appreciate you not making assumptions about what my intents are...as I stated above quite clear that if someone is anti probably not gonna change their mind.
Last edited by ddoyle on Sat Feb 23, 2019 1:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by cjhills » Mon Feb 18, 2019 9:09 pm

What a crock !!!!!!!!!!! With that attitude we will lose our hunting rights sooner than I thought. Bully the neutrals into voting our way. It works on the internet. why not in real life. Thank you all for your insight...…….CJ

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by ddoyle » Mon Feb 18, 2019 9:28 pm

cjhills wrote:What a crock !!!!!!!!!!! With that attitude we will lose our hunting rights sooner than I thought. Bully the neutrals into voting our way. It works on the internet. why not in real life. Thank you all for your insight...…….CJ
And thus ends the discussion CJ. NO ONE said to bully anyone. Good try though....

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by averageguy » Tue Feb 19, 2019 7:46 am

cjhills wrote:What a crock !!!!!!!!!!! With that attitude we will lose our hunting rights sooner than I thought. Bully the neutrals into voting our way. It works on the internet. why not in real life. Thank you all for your insight...…….CJ
Yea, the obviously better tactic we need to use is bullying fellow hunters for shooting a legal limit of birds and posting a photo, same for anyone who takes a big mature buck and photographs it, repeatedly call them out as "bragging" on a public GunDog Forum for sharing their joys and adventures with the very persons who should appreciate it the most, attack those who legally hunt differently than we do until they stop, so our segment of Sport Hunting will somehow be more palatable and safe from similar anti-hunting legislative attacks, attack those who legally hunt on private land vs public lands, ... :roll:
Last edited by averageguy on Tue Feb 19, 2019 9:10 am, edited 4 times in total.

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by averageguy » Tue Feb 19, 2019 7:54 am

A productive action we can all choose to take is a membership in this organization. https://www.sportsmensalliance.org

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by dan v » Tue Feb 19, 2019 9:27 am

All I'm going to add to this conversation is this.

Having spent a fair amount of time a the MN Capitol back maybe 10 years ago, what Sportsmen/Sportswomen need to realize is the incredibly LONG vision the anti's have.

The typically sportsman frankly just wants to be left alone and do his/her thing...commendable. But that is NOT what the anti's are doing, they are always pushing the ball down the field.

Sportsmen? They really aren't involved until they loose something....then it's far too late. You hear it from legislators...."We just don't hear ANYTHING from the sportsman....but we have the opposition here EVERY day....EVERY day.

Couple the with the loss of participation in the outdoor blood sports, elected representatives that aren't sportsman....and even people within the state DNR's tat arent hunters/fisherman....and you have the makings for trouble.

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by cjhills » Tue Feb 19, 2019 9:59 am

Add the fact that hunting opportunities are almost nonexistent in some states. Leases have nearly eliminated out of state deer hunting opportunities in Illinois and Kansas is not far behind. Luckily Kansas has some decent public opportunities for quail ....Cj

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by averageguy » Tue Feb 19, 2019 11:02 am

cjhills wrote:Add the fact that hunting opportunities are almost nonexistent in some states. Leases have nearly eliminated out of state deer hunting opportunities in Illinois and Kansas is not far behind. Luckily Kansas has some decent public opportunities for quail ....Cj
Out of State Hunters are actually by far the biggest source of leasing in Missouri presently. Guys from Louisiana have leased up several thousand acres on 3 sides of me presently and that is the representative case.

No matter - Both Mo and Ks have more than enough excellent public lands to hunt deer on for those willing to put out some effort. The Missouri River corridor in Missouri has thousands of acres of excellent river bottom whitetail habitat for those willing to figure out how to access and hunt it. Over the Counter tags, right next door to Illinois. If a guy wants to hunt they find a way.

Ks walk-in program provides a lot of opportunity for all forms of hunting including upland birds and there are numerous excellent public land opportunities to hunt waterfowl. Nearly 100% of my waterfowl hunting in those two states is on public land as well as a great deal of my upland bird hunting.

In the MW however the best hunting for upland birds is on private lands and that is why I work to gain access to them.

On the bigger subject, access to lands to hunt is an issue wherever there are large populations of people and the further east you go. Sportsman funded walk-in programs are working well in some states.

Why people expect to hunt for free is beyond me. Nothing is free. Taxes on land are high going higher. Habitat work is expensive as is the equipment to carry it out.

Over and over I see the best managed private lands are those where the landowners have a financial incentive and reward to not graze the last blade of grass, not farm marginal field edges vs enrolling them buffer strips, leave some crops standing, due to the income streams they receive through some form of fee based hunting on their private lands. The Ranching for Wildlife program in Colorado has been wildly successful, land owner tags in Utah and NM the same. Leasing of private lands for walk-in programs in KS the same.

There are just as many success stories to leasing for Sportsman at large as there are downsides is what I see.
Last edited by averageguy on Tue Feb 19, 2019 11:47 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by ddoyle » Tue Feb 19, 2019 11:17 am

"Yea, the obviously better tactic we need to use is bullying fellow hunters for shooting a legal limit of birds and posting a photo, same for anyone who takes a big mature buck and photographs it, repeatedly call them out as "bragging" on a public GunDog Forum for sharing their joys and adventures with the very persons who should appreciate it the most, attack those who legally hunt differently than we do until they stop, so our segment of Sport Hunting will somehow be more palatable and safe from similar anti-hunting legislative attacks, attack those who legally hunt on private land vs public lands, ... :roll:[/quote] Average guy

............................................................................

Average thank you for those wise words...it reminds me when playing football there were those teams that were all about themselves. Older players told us when just got to get ahead because they will start yelling at each and the game is over! True about soooo much in life.

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by V-John » Tue Feb 19, 2019 12:52 pm

As someone who lives in Kansas, and hunted quite a bit of WIHA this year, I saw a lot of WIHA being pulled from the program, or leased out. Yes it looks good on paper from the outside looking in, but a lot of the ground isn't worth a hoot, getting pulled from the program to be leased out. More and more of the ground in Kansas is getting leased out. Just a fact of life.

CJ wrote some very nice things. I agree with a lot of what CJ had to say. Along with the others. Bottom line - this is getting out of hand. We DO need to stick together.

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by Sharon » Tue Feb 19, 2019 1:56 pm

Exactly. Let's just post our comments without referring to members individually.

reminder: Use the quote button and then you can highlight what you are referring to if you want.Please don't just copy out what you are referring to. ONLY whole quotes permitted.

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by cjhills » Tue Feb 19, 2019 2:15 pm

Sharon:
The quote above attributed to me was not mine...…….Cj

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by averageguy » Tue Feb 19, 2019 2:23 pm

V-John, Glad to hear your support for Hunters sticking together. It is the only way.

Kansas - I have hunted all over the State of Kansas for over 50 years. Owned two farms in Kansas for a couple of decades. It is a Jewel. Incredibly diversified in its habitat. Scaled and Bobwhite Quail. Lesser and Greater Prairie Chickens, Pheasants, Doves, Waterfowl Mecca, Whitetail, Mule Deer, Pronghorns, Elk, Furbearers galore, Rio Grande, Merriams and Eastern Turkeys.

Over a million acres of Walk-in hunting acres with another 300K in publicly owned lands. Corp of Engineer Lakes aplenty. Hunters travel from all over the east to hunt in Kansas and would gladly give their eye teeth for the same opportunities in their home states.

I made 7 hunting trips to Kansas this past season. Doves, Waterfowl and Upland Birds. All of my Waterfowl trips were on public land and every one of my upland bird trips including some time on public walk-in areas where we found birds every time. My Buddy and I found two large coveys of Bobwhites on public land on the last day of the season which based on their numbers and behavior I do not think had ever been hunted this season until that day.

The Whitetail Deer Hunting craze has resulted in a large increase of leasing of lands in the MW. That is a fact.

Sticking with Kansas for the moment, the waterfowl and upland bird seasons extend well past the close of the deer seasons. Rather than condemn my fellow hunters for securing their deer hunting privileges through leasing, I continue to work with them respectfully. Several of my private land upland bird hunts were on lands that are leased for deer hunting (which I am not a party to), which I gained access to in late December and January after the deer seasons were closed.

Where there is a will there is a way. I see so many reasons to conclude the glass is still way more than half full in Kansas.
Last edited by averageguy on Tue Feb 19, 2019 2:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by Sharon » Tue Feb 19, 2019 2:24 pm

Looking into it.

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by ddoyle » Tue Feb 19, 2019 2:30 pm

Average I like your attitude. On an Iowa sports forum I once asked guys what the difference was between volunteering labor to the farmer and paying? I see guys say all the time offer to help on the farm then be upset about someone leasing. I didn’t grow up on a farm and would cost the farmer more in time than the help I can give him. To be clear I have never leased but don’t blame anyone who does!

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by averageguy » Tue Feb 19, 2019 2:31 pm

Sharon wrote:Looking into it.
V-John's quote is my post. If you edit out CJ at the top I think we are fine.

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Re: Whats going on in Oregon Trials and Tests?

Post by Sharon » Tue Feb 19, 2019 2:33 pm

Thank you . I just left V's post alone as it still made sense. Reminder to all to read what I posted above in red.

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