White/Black Shorthairs

[highcotton]

You guys fill me in on these white and black shorthairs. Do they come from certain bloodlines or do they show up from time to time along with the liver? I saw on run this past winter and he was a bird finding machine and he looked good doing it.

[ezzy333]

The German's have bred b/w and some have been imported. Somw onw needs to correct me if I'm wrong but I think one of the parents has to be b/w before you get them in a litter.

Ezzy

[AHGSP]

You have it right Ezzy. Black, like Solid, is a Dominant gene and requires one parent to be Black to be expressed. Breed a Liver pup out of a Black parent to another Liver and no Black genes will be expressed. There are quite a few lines that have Black dogs behind them, somewhere back in the pedigree. If you have specific questions with regard to the Black, shoot me a PM or email.

I see your from Alabama, if the dog you saw was down south, there is a good chance it may have been one of Todd Knouff's dogs, NEIROL GSP'S. Todd is out of Florida.

[tfbirddog2]

I breed my white and Liver to a Black with White tick and momma has dominate white genes, and the combo threw some beautiful white/black and white/liver pups pics are in my photo album 4 b/ws and 3 L/ws. Planning to breed her again next spring.And AH is right, black is very dominate that all the litters I have seen the black out number the liver pups every time of the 5 litters I have seen.

[WildRose]

White is always recessive in GSP's, that is why it expresses itself so easily and frequently. You can breed even solid livers together for generation after generation and have suddenly some liver and white patched dogs pop out.

Solid is dominant, that means it requires at least one solid parent to produce solid offspring.

Black is donimant, you cannot have a true black without it. You can get dogs however that are such a dark liver that it appears black.

In genetics "dominant" does not mean that a trait will dominate or always appear. Just like "recessive" doesn't mean a train is unwanted nor unlikely to appear.

If you don't have the lingo right it's confusing as heck. Even when you do, it can be very difficult to understand unless you have a full understanding of the subject.

What you've been told so far about black GSP's is correct. The black dogs were split off from the mainstream shortly after the breed was developed due to politics between breeders. The breeders that didnt' favor blacks became more popular. Eventually they were split off into a separate registry for a long time as the "prussian shorthair".

As the name implies they were primarily in eastern Germany and Eastern Europe. The main influx of GSP's into this country was post WWII which is why the blacks were not seen in any numbers in the US until the last ten or fifteen years.

Once Germany was unified, the wall came down, and the Soviet Union collapsed the black GSP's began moving west and hit this country as a fad for about ten years with breeders charging ridiculous sums for the "rare and special black GSP".

I've seen some black GSP' that were decent dogs, but unfortunately there was a lot of willy nilly breeding of them to cash in on the fad so many were at best below average.

Common sense has won out though and the fad has faded, Good breeders breed the best they have to the best they have or can find without regard to color or marking patter.

I wouldn't let a good dog pass by just because it was black, but you have to look at the total package when selecting dogs not just something as trivial as color or marking pattern. CR

[mountaindogs]

Many of you have seen thi before, but it's a nice easy way to grasp the color variations of GSP's

http://www.dogstuff.info/mating_outcomes_gsp_byrne.html

[highcotton]

Thanks for the interesting responses.

[hjackson]

our boy Homer is a hot ticked dog (white with a few patches and some ticking) and both his parents are solid liver. I found that interesting