Gun Dog Forum

Does anyone know of breeders of the black and white GWP?

Is this what you had in mind?
http://www.bonepointkennels.com/Litters1Pics.htm
Brian

Does anyone know of breeders of the black and white GWP?

Why do you ask? Do you mean breeders that may have black GWPs in their breeding program (as BonePoint has), or specifically breeding to produce only black GWPs? Both can be found. We test in NAVHDA where black is pretty common and, obviouly, black dogs are used in a number of kennels.

If you do have questions regarding black you may enjoy speaking with the owner of Bonepoint. Although he does test through NAVHDA, he's also a participant & very strong supporter field trialing

Deb

Thanks for the info. I am interested in purchasing a black and white female pup that has the qualities to run in NSTRA or UFTA trials. I have never had a black and white GWP and I want one to breed back to my Wilson dog. I will contact Kelly Jobe.

Are you just looking to produce black puppies? Why?

I will answer that question with this WHY NOT???????

My answer to that would be we shouldn't be breeding color for color sake only.

We should be looking at the dog, the entire dog, not the color. Now, if you happened to find a great black and chose to breed to it, because it was a great dog, I have no problem. But to breed to a black, simply because it was black, or only to produce black puppies.... what does this bring to our breed? Other than black puppies. Or to go searching for a black just so you can produce black....

Ron clearly stated "that has the qualities to run NSTRA or UFTA Trials" I think that IS looking for a quality dog. I think Ron would know breeding quality if he saw it, and if he would like to have black to cross with his NAT'l CH then I am not sure what would be the problem.

wilsonwires wrote:Thanks for the info. I am interested in purchasing a black and white female pup that has the qualities to run in NSTRA or UFTA trials. I have never had a black and white GWP and I want one to breed back to my Wilson dog. I will contact Kelly Jobe.

I may be interested in a pup. What is Wilson's record in the NSTRA and UFTA trials?

Wilson is a NFC

Wilson has produced the 2007 GWPCA National Amateur Champion(Wilsons Famous Amos owned by Brenda Roe) and the 2007 UFTA National Amateur Champion (Wilsons Mad Max owned by Joey Preston).Max is a 2x open champion and 1x doubles champion in UFTA.I own the brother to Amos and I have run him 8 times in UFTA amateur and as of today he has won 1 first,2 seconds and 1 third and will be running in the UFTA Nationals in Feb.

So he hasn't won any NSTRA or UFTA trials?

BTW, the 2007 GWPCA NAFC was won by NFC/3xNAFC/DC/AFC Rudolph's Blitzen Von Duffin

Ron goofed, he meant Nat'l Open Derby winner, not Amateur..

Ron's website might help for Wilson's credentials.
http://wilsonwires.wetpaint.com/page/Stud+Dogs
He is producing some outstanding pups.
Bri

SORRY-I did make a mistake Brenda Roes dog Amos won the National Open Derby Championship-I thank you for correcting me-If any dog wins one of these championships they need to be highly recognized because it is a great accomplishment-I apologize for the mistake

When did the GWPCA start running a Derby Championship?

You might check with the GWPCA on that, results are posted on the front of their website.

It's actually the Derby Classic, not a Championship. Amos did a fine job in it!
Fuzz

Thanks...We sure had fun!

Hi Ron
For what it is worth I have been researching Bone Point kennels for the past 2-3 years and believe they have some very good females, regardless of color.
Jason

I have the male in those bonepoint pics. He turns 1 year next week. I actually thought you (Chris) and Kelly had talked about breeding to his Sadie last year. I do know he is planning a repeat of the breeding in those pics. Here is Chester now.

<a href="http://s158.photobucket.com/albums/t83/ ... int003.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t83/ ... int003.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

<a href="http://s158.photobucket.com/albums/t83/ ... cks005.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t83/ ... cks005.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

Kelly and I talked last year about breeding his female to Wilson, but at the time I was dealing with the loss of my dad and his business and my mother, and dogs where on the back burner. I am glad to say that I do have a deposit on a female out of his Sadie bitch and Slick Nickle. Now all I have to do is wait and hope she has enough black female so I can get one.

Ron
I am going to play devils advocate here, because I believe there are a lot of new dog owners and future breeders on here that are watching and listening.

You have put a deposit on a litter which may produce a black bitch. Lets say it does, but the black females are not the nicest puppies in the bunch. How will you decide which black if any will come home, or will any black in that litter work?

This is a very nice breeding, but if it does not produce any black bitches, will you take a liver? Or, is color alone a deal maker or breaker?

By choosing color as the main reason to purchase this puppy do you not run the risk of not getting the best of this litter?

Just questions
Fuzz

Well, I have been into breeding for about 30 yrs and have always been partial to liver dogs. If I am interested in keeping a liver from a certain cross I evaluate the dogs and keep the best liver (or what appears to be the best liver) I see. This goes with the "how to pick a pup thread" I go with the best bloodlines and basically grab what is pleasing to my eye. They may or may not have the stuff I want to breed later, at that point I decide. Certainly there is no way of knowing if the ticked are better or liver, until they grow up.

Fuzznut
As you well know I have been in the Wirehairs for almost twenty years. I have probably produced less pups but more quality pups than most of the breeders in GWPCA with less years. I do not look at just any one aspect of the dog that I want to breed. I look at the overall picture and I base my decision on the qualities of each individual. If you read Backwoods Kennels intro you will see that Greg Dixon got the idea of his cross that produced Wilson ,Marley and that whole line from a breeding that I did. I bred a bitch that I had to Jim Pratts( Bushman) when no one else in the GWPCA would even breed to him. I saw qualities in him that I liked and I did not care if every other breeder in GWPCA had a problem with the dog or the owner. If I do get the black pup and when she gets older and if she does not have the traits that I am looking for then I will make the decision of breeding or not breeding. The only reason that I am being questioned on this subject is the fact that GWPCA show does not recognize the black without penalty. As far as I am concerned black and white should be recognized because they where part of the original german blood line.

By choosing color as the main reason to purchase this puppy do you not run the risk of not getting the best of this litter?

Zuzznut,

You are right. You run that risk. But since there is no other way to pick the best pup that has proven to work I would think it would be smart to pick the one you like or want by whatever method turns you on. The last pup I got I wanted and got a female. Not sure I got the best though since there were some nice males also.

Eye appeal is very important especially when you have to look at the dog every time you feed it. And good looking dogs don't eat anymore than ugly ones.

I hope this helps the newer dog owners. There just isn't any proven method of picking the best dog when they are 8 weeks old.

Ezzy