Gun Dog Forum

I’m on the wrong ridge every day we hunt. How in the heck can this be. Two guys hunted with me today one got 5 birds and the other got 4. Ringo and I never made contact. I have hunted 13 days and killed 4 birds. I’m fricking frustrated!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Probably need a Britt. Things like that always make you wonder. Not too bad for just one day but why 3 or 4 in a row?

Ezzy

Dont feel too bad, I train regularly in 100acres of CRP, 90% of the time I can make contact with 1-2 coveys of birds. I decided to hunt it this fall, hunted it 3 seperate times and never saw a bird. I took two pups up there the other day with a blank pistol and busted 2 coveys of birds...... Could be worse.... You coulda been at work.

JIm

Murphy's Law buddy. Thank goodness I have not had a dry spell like that.

gsp3333 wrote:Murphy's Law buddy. Thank goodness I have not had a dry spell like that.

ll ive hunted mo public ground 6 different days and one covey lol and hunted hard

Sounds a little like my season so far, all others have been shooting the few pheasant we have seen. Have had 19 points in 3.5 days of pheasant hunting, not one has been a rooster, good experience for the pup though. He has had to get his retrieving in at the duck marsh.

Send the dog off on one side of the ridge while you cover the other. Keep track of it on the garmin. If it goes on point head over. If you get into a covey then call the dog over (nick or page) , and have it pick up the singles....

Willie Hunter wrote:I’m on the wrong ridge every day we hunt. How in the heck can this be...I’m fricking frustrated!

Willie, my ENTIRE fall has been like that...bird hunting in ND, bow hunting, rifle hunting, field trialing. I told my wife I am going to have to re-think this entire hunting/trialing hobby! For me that means do it MORE, for her it means "give it up"!

Don't give up the fight, one day the sun will shine on us.

Gentlemen,
It sounds like you need to take up Grouse hunting, and find out what a challenge really is. Its not how many birds you take, its how you take the birds. When you Grouse hunt all day and the dogs point birds but the human can not get in gun range, you might be a Grouse hunter, when you don't see a Grouse all day and you come back to the truck and start home, and a Grouse walks out infront of the truck and will not get off the road, you might be a Grouse hunter, when your firing pin breaks at 6 degrees below zero on a perfect true double set up, you might be a Grouse hunter, when you miss the 1st Grouse up and kill the second, and 6 more birds flush from all around you as you hold your empty double gun, you are definitely a young Grouse, when you finally shoot a scotch double over your Small Munsterlander dog and he retrieves both to hand, you know he is the real Grouse hunter.
RGD/Dave

Ryman come slog up a wet snowy 45 degree slope chasing a bird that wants to run to the top for 2000 vertical feet! When it takes 1.5 hours just to get to where you "think" the birds might be, just to find nothing. Then side hill through shale and lava rock to the next ridge to do it all over again! Then to watch a young pup bust the one covey you find and see em glide to the bottom! Try that for 9 hours in a day and you wont walk for 2 days after... Then you will know what challenging is all about!

Willie I tried to send Doc where I thought no birds would be, I took the "good looking" ridge and saw nada. Worse was hearing Doc's gun serenade me from across the ridge as he was in the birds! Luck of the draw! "bleep" chukars anyway.

I would like grouse hunting, at least you get to see or hear them. Flat land, shade over your head, no lava rock, no shake, just some moist dirt under your boots and some sticks to worry about. Then to see the bird land on the tree above the dog...

Come on. Chukar? Do those things exist? I saw a feather once, a pile of poop or two, maybe a track, one elusive sighting before it was absorbed into the sand faster than the water pouring off my forehead in 30 degree temps with a 40 mph wind. To be a grouse hunter, shot of scotch, sxs, maybe a feather in my hat. Sounds like vacation.

Well, at least your healthy enough to be out enjoying the great outdoors.

Ultra and Elk, I think what Ryman is trying to say is ruff grouse hunting in the Northeast and chukar hunting in the Intermountain west are probably the toughest hunting for birds in North America. Chukar hunting is a physical endurance sport. You hunt them the first time for fun and from then on for revenge. Ruffs on the other hand are the finesse bird, It is a mental game and you hunt them because they keep you thinking all the time. It is hard to believe that a bird with that small of a brain knows that if it can get a fir or poplar between you and him you'll miss where as a chukar takes off in plain sight, laughs at you and dares you to try to hit him while he's flying downhill like a fighter jet out of Mtn. Home. They are two entirely different games.

Hunt 'em once for fun, and everytime after for revenge. At least your hunting season is still going, so take solice in that. I'm listening the quail in my back yard this second, taunting me. Actually has anyone noticed the quail call sounds very similar to F.U.?

ultracarry wrote:I would like grouse hunting, at least you get to see or hear them. Flat land, shade over your head, no lava rock, no shake, just some moist dirt under your boots and some sticks to worry about. Then to see the bird land on the tree above the dog...

Come on up!

Although the sticks are a little bigger here, and the moist dirt stays with your boots

Season down here has been over for more than a week.

1 more week here!

ultracarry wrote:I would like grouse hunting, at least you get to see or hear them. Flat land, shade over your head, no lava rock, no shake, just some moist dirt under your boots and some sticks to worry about. Then to see the bird land on the tree above the dog...

To be a grouse hunter, shot of scotch, sxs, maybe a feather in my hat. Sounds like vacation.

PA. Flatland??? This way Ultra ,,got a covey marked 1500yds ahead....Lots of shade

Schmeider - i know that spot, i got em all out of there this season... Dutch

Gentlemen,
I have always let the dog do the hunting, I do not chase Chukar or Grouse for a mile and and half up a mountain, if the dog bumps a group of birds into flight, we hunt a different covert of Grouse, not follow the bumped birds. This is the way we sport hunt here in our mounatins. We have a traditional way of Grouse hunting, handed down thru generations of our family. We learn a lot more than just hunting thru these traditions, it a way of life, with ethics and respect for Gods creatures and his mountains. I am thankful for the way I grew up, to us its a lot more than just hunting. Even our double guns, Ryman & Gordon dogs are part of this tradition.
RGD/Dave

That has nothing to do with thread ryman. I've grouse hunted enuf to no that it doesn't compare to chukar, quail, huns, or pheasant in difficulty.. grouse are the dumest of all gamebirds by far. They flush 20 yards land in a tree and sit there like u can't see them. But of course we weren't brought up in YOUR moutains. That's why grouse hunting attracts a older generation of hunters, its easier walking, closer working dogs, and more about comrodery. Not because its such a challenge.

ST8 UPPOINTERS wrote:That has nothing to do with thread ryman. I've grouse hunted enuf to no that it doesn't compare to chukar, quail, huns, or pheasant in difficulty.. grouse are the dumest of all gamebirds by far. They flush 20 yards land in a tree and sit there like u can't see them. But of course we weren't brought up in YOUR moutains. That's why grouse hunting attracts a older generation of hunters, its easier walking, closer working dogs, and more about comrodery. Not because its such a challenge.

Indeed is off the thread but....ruffed grouse attracted me at 12 years old as I watched grouse feathers appear to fall forever....the appeal has held for 47 years and counting.
There is no doubt tho that the hunting is easier compared to many other gamebirds....tho tougher in the Apps...it is as easy as pie in the U.P., comparably.
I have found pheasants in Iowa and Kansas tougher as well than Ol' Bonasa U.
My guess is that chukars are tougher still in most areas and especially so on the dogs, whether they take a spill or not.
The "dumbness" of the ruffed grouse tho is often based upon locale and pressure... and the use of that term suggests as much dumbness on the poster as is implied to the bird.
Some birdhunters love to rate all involved...guns, dogs, birds, whatever to gain some notch up on another.
That's seems a shame.
Ruffed grouse hunting is not about accepting a challenge of a superior creature...it is about the enjoyment of the process of grouse hunting and a respect for the bird and all that surrounds it.
Not surprising that "best" arises and is so poorly placed but, sadly, it happens often.
While I think RGD/Dave/Beans/whatever is often full of bilgewater with his talk of tradition and God's mountains and LCs and all ad nauseum as well as being a serial exxaggerator.....his concern and care for the ruffed grouse is borne in a good place.
The ruffed grosue is not best or better...the ruffed grouse is simply a fine choice.

To the OP and his comment...frustration, et al makes for some of the best memories and allows other days to shine by comparison.
No need to "get it"....grin more and fret less.

The Hunting always seems to be more challenging for someone who is a legend in their own mind.

Mountaineer, very nicely written!

Well now that does it!.. Now I'ma gonna hafta go an' find a way to hunt every doggone pickin' game bird there is so's I kin know fer meeself which one is the BEST... I hunt WHAT I can, WHEN I can, WHERE I can... so... I hunt grouse here in Pa... ain't complainin'... but I don't feel a need to insult someone elses local game bird as being inferrior to mine... to each his own... I think there is a fine challenge in all of them... I've seen pheasant's that earned their nickname as a ditch chicken, stand there and look stupid while a truck load of flatlanders (no offense) realoaded... I've also heard them snickering at me and my confounded dog at the edge of the cornfield... I've had grouse stupid and slow enough that I've shot with my long bow and I've had 'em out wit me and my dog on a quiet snow covered morning... It's ALL good to me... and I really DO plan to hunt 'em all before I check out!

Very well said!

+1 shortfat....http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... JsYwv9zGa8 I see nothing more different than i got cover..Ruffs use thick clear cuts to survive...Predator Birds can't fly thew the clear cuts and we have more Hawks than grouse..Most Ruffs flush out of the back side of cover makes challenging shooting....Here in the App/Great lake range the birds flush 50 to 70 yards to the front of the dogs...Some dogs never figure it out ...Days they run 100yds+ before they flushes out or range.

Chukars have to see you coming.?..Grouse around here get up in trees/ridges scouting for predators...when you get to close the whole covert flies away in late season

If you release chukars around here, they're dead by morning and you might find a wing or feathers :roll:

I know a guy who hunts pheasant with his dog about 30 days a sesason. Hunts sharptail about 15. He has a very good dog that is mature and experienced, can cover a good deal of ground, is in shape, can run like the wind, knows how to work a field for the hunter. What's more important is the hunter himself knows what the dog is doing and why he is doing it at all times. He knows when there's birds, where they're gooing, where he will likely stop them to get a shot. He knows through experience how to hunt the fields when he looks at them. He has been hunting for 40 years, grew up on a farm with a dog and a gun and still lives in pheasant country. He doesn't always shoot the most birds when hunting but darned close to it. The other hunters think he is really lucky...

you need to take up Grouse hunting

How do you make them taste good? them ruffs taste like crap, huns even worse, prairie chickens make me puke. Quail and Pheasants are about the only ones taste good same day I shot em.

Grouse sit right there till you walk up and kick em over the next hill. I got vids....

markj wrote:Grouse sit right there till you walk up and kick em over the next hill. I got vids....

markj, I'm glad you have the moron sub-species where you hunt... I would like to find some here... but Honestly, why do people feel the need to insult someone elses choice of game bird or location? That might be the case for the grouse in Iowa, but it's not here in Pa... and no... I'm not on some high horse about grouse here being the hardest bird to hunt on the face of the earth... but I've found them very, VERY challenging! They flush at a fart in the wind in very thick cover and it takes most dogs several years to get the hang of pinning them down... Now I don't know anything about "walking points" or "spookie Pa Grouse" or anything like that... what I do know is that hunting pheasant or grouse in the Dakota's or Iowa, or Kansas is different than hunting where I live. Just like it's different in Main, and Michigan, and Minnesota, and Wisconsin, and Ohio, and Hobokin NJ, and Catmandoo, Blah Blah :roll: Ect... And I bet it's a blast there too... I'm sure I would love to make a trip and hunt in all those places. But why do we have to say "mine is better than yours" and Grouse are dumb or spookier here ect... it's all apples and oranges. I love hunting birds, and I love watching dogs work. I'd like to hunt in every single different type of terrain, and hunt every single type of bird behind every single type of dog! When I have finnished all that... THEN I will offer an expert opinion on which I THINK is best... and according to my own tastes... Most of us hunt what we have available to hunt. Willie Hunter... I have the same problems you do... that and I guess I just suck at bird hunting... but I'll suck at it with a smile on my face 'till the day that I day! But I don't need to bash someone elses favorite.

Sorry for the rant folks...

Here you go MarkJ .... See if you can get a kick on this Ruff ... This bird flushes at the end , after the Setter is released off point...I wish i could slow this down, but you can do some replay ...This is how all App. grouse flush...........http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zpYZNMeFgbA

This Setter is from PA cover dog stock...

Here is a DK... Wasserschling,Hega-haus,and Rothenufein...Soon to be PA stock .http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ecug4s34wn8
The two can tear up a grouse woods...Really awesome to see...slamming honors and points..

Markj this does not happen every flush we mostly never get up this close ..they where roosted ,as the day warmed up we seen more tracks than birds.
Enjoy

Gentlemen,
Having some inexperienced member of the forum like Mountaineer actually agree with me on something, gives me pause no doubt about it. Further we have had several of these Great Chukar dogs visit our big woods to hunt our Pa Grouse, we always tell the owners that we are not out to look for dogs as we Grouse hunt, most times however we take pity on their owners, and help find their dogs.
A man finds out how well his dog is trained here in our big woods, these mountains are not high and clean, the are old and thick, instinctive talent and bidability go hand in hand here. We like to Grouse hunt not look for dogs here.
Got to admit in my era until a man had 30 years Grouse hunting, he was wise enough to know he was inexperienced, not true of the modern bird hunters, their like little girls, just ask them they know everything, they read it in a book, or on the internet.

RSchmeider,
Nice video's however I doubt you could have taken either Grouse off the Grouse points in either video, I do believe if you look close
at your 1st video with your Setter, you will get a glimps of the Grouse your Setter set up for your gunning, as it busts out of the back of the cover behind the big downed tree, the mature Grouse heard you approaching, the bird you got close to was from your Setters relocation, I believe it was a much younger Grouse. Great videos sir, I fully understand why you put them up. After hunting Pa Grouse here for over 50 years now, its hard for me to not believe, they are some of the most challenging bird hunting on earth, and I am not afraid to say it.

RGD/Dave

October in the Pa Grouse Mountains, now this is real tough Grouse gunning. 16 Gauge gun time with 6's in the 2nd BBl,
if you think you had a hard time seeing the Grouse in Schmeiders video, try downing our spooky Grouse thru this October cover some time.