O/U VS SXS

eastwash · Post by **eastwash** » Thu Dec 17, 2009 6:12 pm

Going to buy a 20 ga for upland birds. I hunt quail, pheasant, huns. Will either be a over and under or side by side. What are the pro's and cons of either of these(without comments on price). Now i shoot a 12 ga pump so have no experience withe the double barrels

lightonthebay · Post by **lightonthebay** » Thu Dec 17, 2009 8:54 pm

I don't think there is much practical difference between the two. The sighting planes are different and that bothers some users but they both have the same advantages over receiver style guns. I don't believe I have ever seen screw in chokes on a SxS but I may be wrong about that. I do love the option of screw in chokes and an immediate choice between the two in the field.

I think its mostly aesthetics which of course is a personal assesment. I prefer O/U.

mcbosco · Post by **mcbosco** » Fri Dec 18, 2009 7:39 am

A good SXS is a lot more money than a GREAT pump, semi or O/U. Even the cheapest AYA is a $3,500 gun, compared to say $1,700 for a Berreta White ONYX, $1,000 for Ithaca's new Model 37 (which is sweet) or any number of top drawer semi's that run from $900 to $1,500. There are cheaper SXS's but I don't think you would get near the build quality compared to other actions at that price level. A CZ Ringneck runs about $1,000, a decent gun (I have a CZ Redhead) but for another $200 you can get a Citori Lightening. Which will still be shooting in 20 years?

So while not apples to apples, build quality seems to be better for the same money out of pocket in the other actions.

But SXS's are the gunmaker's art and they hold value, the better ones that is. Check the prices of Ithaca NID's that were made in 1920's, sweet investment. If I were to get one, I would poke around for a used SKB SXS or a new one that is still in stock somewhere. SKB discontinued them.

MillerClemsonHD · Post by **MillerClemsonHD** » Fri Dec 18, 2009 8:13 am

Go shoot some of both and figure out what you like before you buy anything. Some people don't like the sight picture on a SxS if they are used to shooting a pump or semi. It is all personal preference. Find a club or range and shot any gun you can get your hands on and figure out what you like. If you have a price limit avoiding shooting anything over it bc the one the feels the best and the one you really like shooting is going to be that one you pick up and give a try but is out of your range.

I have 2 semi's, an O/U and a SxS and all 4 of them get used frequently. I am also far from done when it comes to buying shotguns there are more in my future.

Post by **Greg Jennings** » Fri Dec 18, 2009 9:20 am

I love the tradition of the SxS, like to tote them.

If you ever want to shot targets, the O/U is the better choice. Once you learn to shoot, you'll hit more with the O/U.

Greg J.

tdhusker · Post by **tdhusker** » Fri Dec 18, 2009 9:39 am

I don't care for the sight plane and reduced visibility, and I really dislike the width of the forearm/barrells of a SxS. I grew up shooting them and SxS's were my only shotgun until I bought my own so I've spent quite a bit of time with them. It's a personal preference thing. Advantage of a SxS, load and unload with ease, very quick and much quicker than an O/U.

Anymore, I hunt and shoot O/U's for the most part and prefer the trimmer lines of the low profile receiver O/U's.

Post by **Greg Jennings** » Fri Dec 18, 2009 1:00 pm

tdhusker wrote:Anymore, I hunt and shoot O/U's for the most part and prefer the trimmer lines of the low profile receiver O/U's.

I love my Beretta O/Us for that reason...

mcbosco · Post by **mcbosco** » Fri Dec 18, 2009 4:44 pm

I got all excited to buy that SKB clays gun until I shouldered a Silver Pigeon today at the Beretta Gallery in NY. They must put drugs on those guns because I couldn't help myself. Hopefully they get it next week.

Post by **Greg Jennings** » Sat Dec 19, 2009 3:27 pm

The only shotgun that feels better in my hands and points better than my Beretta target guns are Winchester M-12 trap and skeet models. Holy smokes, they feel good. Right behind that is the pedestrian Remington 1100 skeet.

mcbosco · Post by **mcbosco** » Sun Dec 20, 2009 12:39 pm

lion country imports a good spanish SXS i am told, its worth checking out

A/C Guy · Post by **A/C Guy** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 9:08 pm

eastwash wrote:Going to buy a 20 ga for upland birds. I hunt quail, pheasant, huns. Will either be a over and under or side by side. What are the pro's and cons of either of these(without comments on price). Now i shoot a 12 ga pump so have no experience withe the double barrels

I have both SxS and O/U's. I have a Beretta Silver Pigeon, A CZ O/U, but I like the feel of the Fausti SxS in the filed. I like the SxS for upland birds. The SxS does have screw in chokes (contrary to what someone else posted). The SxS has 2 triggers, so I can choose which barrel to fire based upon the distance to the birds. The SxS is lighter than the O/U. O/U are popular on the clay fields because the shooter can fire the lower barrel first which results in less muzzle rise and than fire the second shot more quickly at the second clay. A heavier gun is also an advantage for the clays in that the extra weight assists the shooter by smoothing the swing. In the field, the extra weight is a negative after a couple miles of walking.

Post by **Greg Jennings** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 11:07 pm

The bigger reason that everyone shoots an O/U in competition is the less complicated sight plane.

Dave Quindt · Post by **Dave Quindt** » Sat Jan 02, 2010 9:23 pm

Greg Jennings wrote:The bigger reason that everyone shoots an O/U in competition is the less complicated sight plane.

But why is a "less complicated" sight plane (not sure I agree with that phrase, but ok) of value? It's because in shotgun shooting competitions, the shotgun is aimed like a rifle far more than live game bird shooting. In every venue, the target is shown to the shooter before he must shoot. Shooters define a precise kill zone they plan on shooting the target in. Some venues, skeet for example, take it even further and regulate the flight of the target to ensure consistency from range to range. Many allow the gun to be shouldered before the target is flown.

As a result, the target shotgun takes on some of the same attributes that make a rifle easy to precisely aim; deep pistol grip, big forearm, thick buttstock. Most importantly, the mass of the gun is centered on the centerline of the bore; it's easier to aim a o/u than a sxs as the weight of the gun is centered on the same axis. In a target gun, quick choke selection is irrelevant as choke and shell can be preselected for the precise target presentation.

But many of the attributes of a great target gun actually can work against you in the field. Weight, barrel length, stock design, balance, for example. It's why a precisely built "game gun" is a different animal than a target gun. For a lot of reasons, a double can be built into a suitable game gun format easier than a target gun.

Ironically, the one shotgun competition where the sxs still sees a fair amount of use is the one format that best mimics the shooting performed in the field; live pigeon shoots.

JMO,
Dave

Post by **Greg Jennings** » Sat Jan 02, 2010 9:40 pm

I've shot hundreds of thousands of skeet targets and haven't aimed a one like a rifle yet. I've shot almost as much trap. Sure, I do things that cut down on movement in trap; isolate my legs from the swight, but I do not aim the shotgun. Yes, it's a more precise thing, but not the degree you seem to be saying. I've also shot a fair number of live birds. Among top shooters when I was shooting, the single trigger O/U dominated.

The quickest shotgun game out there is international skeet. The targets are about twice as fast as american skeet targets. Doubles are also shot at 3 and 5 in a regular round. It's also shot from a low gun. The O/U dominates and, further, the trend is to *longer* barrels with some shooters shooting 32" barrels.

I love SxSs. I love the tradition. I love how the feel in my hands. On the other hand, I shoot better with a single, precise, sight plane. I feel pretty strongly about it. When I was teaching shooting, I wouldn't take a student shooting a SxS. Neither would I accept a skeet student shooting a pump.

Greg J.

donnie_19 · Post by **donnie_19** » Mon Jan 04, 2010 11:29 pm

If you live close to Academy sporting goods look at the Yildiz line. You can get into a pretty inexpensive o/u or sxs. These have the screw in chokes and for a cheap gun have great wood. I have a couple and so far they shoot great. You could get one of each for less than a grand.

natetnc · Post by **natetnc** » Tue Jan 05, 2010 8:36 am

i would suggest you shoot a SxS before spending the money on one. they are different and if you can't shoot one.... well, you will have paid for the most expensive walking stick in your life. i have known a couple people who like the classic appeal of the SxS and tried their darndest to get used to it shooting rounds and rounds of clays but it never worked out for them. just saying, shoot before you spend.

Post by **Greg Jennings** » Tue Jan 05, 2010 11:46 am

I can teach just about anyone to shoot one well. The problem that a lot of people have is that they muscle the gun around with their upper body. That's a mistake. It's exacerbated by just about any light, "quick" shotgun.

The way to swing a shotgun depends somewhat on the target presentation, but is never done with the arms and hands. On narrow angles and/or at long range, the gun is swung in the lower back only. On wider angles, one swings with the lower body. There are some more rules of thumb that I won't get into, but that's the 80% solution.

Some people that are somewhat nearsighted do have a problem of eye dominance swapping that creates problems. Especially in lower light conditions. This is exacerbated by a complicated (sorry for the term, folks) sight plane. Some people also have facial features (and maybe other traits) that the typically thin combs on SxSs (and some other types) with a lot of drop will whack in the face more than fuller stocks.

Don't get me wrong. I love carrying a SxS. I like that they are typically light and I dig the tradition of it. I love shooting a SxS (except with heavy loads). I just want to shoot something else when there is a guy standing behind me with a score sheet saying "Lost" in a bored voice when I miss.

mcbosco · Post by **mcbosco** » Tue Jan 05, 2010 12:45 pm

SXS's in the smaller gauges are very appealing, as is the fact the used market for SXS is so vast and interesting.

JKP · Post by **JKP** » Tue Jan 05, 2010 7:45 pm

I shoot S x S only...I like the sight plane...nice flat surface that I can put birds on or pass over them before I slap the trigger. I like double triggers...instant barrel selection...I like shopping little out of the way gunshops for interesting old S x S's that I can bring back to life. For me S x S's enjoy a heritage that just isn't there with O/U's. Never found a 5 1/2 lb 20 ga O/U...got two of them in S x S. I like Simsons (I'm selling one on this site)....Merkel action and barrels for a fraction of the price. For the same money you could buy a good O/U or you can have a piece of handmade, game scene engraved craftsmanship.

Guess you now by now ... I'm predjudiced....choose what fits you, what you have confidence in...but S x S's are better

mcbosco · Post by **mcbosco** » Wed Jan 06, 2010 7:06 am

http://www.doubleshotguns.com/ugarUC1.htm

these look interesting, I wouldn't think Lion Country would offer these unless they were reliable.

Post by **Greg Jennings** » Wed Jan 06, 2010 9:47 am

JKP wrote: Never found a 5 1/2 lb 20 ga O/U...got two of them in S x S.

Franchi Veloce, Citori Featherweight and some models of Winchester 101 Featherweight, right off the top of my head.

As I said, I really like to carry SxSs. OTOH, I like correct facts even better.

JKP · Post by **JKP** » Wed Jan 06, 2010 3:09 pm

Franchi Veloce, Citori Featherweight and some models of Winchester 101 Featherweight, right off the top of my head.

As I said, I really like to carry SxSs. OTOH, I like correct facts even better.

Whoa there big fella...said I never found one..didn't say they don't exist....back off the coffee a bit

BigBoyTank · Post by **BigBoyTank** » Mon Jan 11, 2010 3:50 pm

Re: O/U VS SXS
by lightonthebay » Thu Dec 17, 2009 9:54 pm

I don't think there is much practical difference between the two. The sighting planes are different and that bothers some users but they both have the same advantages over receiver style guns. I don't believe I have ever seen screw in chokes on a SxS but I may be wrong about that. I do love the option of screw in chokes and an immediate choice between the two in the field.

I think its mostly aesthetics which of course is a personal assesment. I prefer O/U.

The Franchi Highlander has screw in chokes but they they are specific to the Highlander line. Just an FYI.

I personally love carrying a SxS, but I've never carried anything else so I can't say anything against an O/U. I am a traditionalist in a young guys body however so I dont really get down with the auto or pump for bird hunting. Ultimately it personal preference but you for my money you can't beat a 20 SxS with a 7-1/2 Polywad Spdr