Is a project gun cost effective

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Is a project gun cost effective

Post by Pheasanttracker » Sun Dec 25, 2016 7:17 pm

I have been looking for sometime acquiring a traditional american s/'s, likely in 20g. Most interested in a Parker, Ithaca, Fox or Lewis but consider others. I have found a few at local gun shows but they all need some level of work by a gunsmith. Most have flattend barrels to some degree, and various cosmetic imperfections. All safe to shoot but not the degree of shape I would live with. I am not sure I am interested in buying a showroom gun if ultimately it is a gun I would like to shoot at bird's occasionally. Do I just keep looking for the right deal or buy a solid project gun that I can shoot along the Way? I have done a few rifle projects but never for an old shotgun. That said I saw a lightweight Ithaca 20g recently that falls under that project gun criteria that was being sold for $750 but I could have gotten it for $650. Based on prices I have seen elsewhere I didn't think it was a bad price. I wouldn't be doing any of the work myself

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Re: Is a project gun cost effective

Post by Mountaineer » Sun Dec 25, 2016 7:34 pm

Depends.

Not sure what a "flattend" barrel is but....if the barrels are good then that is a large part of any project cost and so decision to go ahead. Bad barrels?....pass.
Any old gun would find wisdom in having it vetted by a gunsmith who knows doubles..."safe to shoot" takes a gunsmith on an old double, to me. Barrel thickness, chamber, on face all need checked.
The "lewis" would seem an odd choice to choose...parts and pressure limit issues there. "Danger, will robinson!"

A Fox of lower grade is often chosen for a project....I recently found a 1916 Fox Sterlingworth and after Turnbull vetted it and pronounced all good...I shot it in the U.P......waited on bluing and refinish based upon how well it worked...for me.
She worked fine.
Often the older models do not have stock dimensions that fit well today.....one has to decide if the restocking cost can be reckoned into the project...another large cost if wood is reasonable.
Some guns are also a bit harder to stock..ie the Elsie so....choose wisely.

Basically, more is involved than low purchase price or a gun tarted up to sell to a gullible buyer.
Vet well.
Hire good mechanics.
Then ...enjoy.
Did I say....vet the scattergun well by someone who knows those scatterguns!!!? :idea:

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Re: Is a project gun cost effective

Post by Pheasanttracker » Mon Dec 26, 2016 10:14 pm

Thanks for the advice mountaineer.

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Carolina Gundogs
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Re: Is a project gun cost effective

Post by Carolina Gundogs » Tue Dec 27, 2016 8:16 am

I like the old classic side by sides and routinely look over the sites to see what is out there.What I have seen is that if the gun needs gunsmith work done on it that I cannot do it myself, the cost of the needed repair work exceeds the cost of finding a gun in better shape.

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Re: Is a project gun cost effective

Post by Gordon Guy » Tue Dec 27, 2016 12:11 pm

I just bought a sears Ranger model 104.3 16 ga., 1938 to 1940 vintage. It was for sale for several months (Maybe because of the 2 9/16" chambers) and I had been handling it every time I went into the store. I couldn't get it out of my head. Every time I shouldered it it pointed where I looked.... carried well and just felt right in my hands.... Hard to explain..... After a couple months of thinking about it I traded in a much nicer gun that I lost confidence in and bought the Ranger. I got money back in the deal. The gun was in fairly good shape as compared to other utilitarian guns I have seen from the 30's. I spent 400 on it and then took it to the gunsmith, spent another 350 there. I had the gunsmith take out a barrel dent, open the chokes to Improved Cylinder in the left and left the right barrel at Improved Mod. I had him fix both sear springs, switch over the double triggers for a left handed shooter (A small nuance) and open the forcing cones as I'm recoil sensitive. I bought 2.5" inch shells from RST 1oz copper plated 6's. I went 3 for 4 on Huns and chukar the first time out and the second time out I went 2 for 3 on valley quail yesterday. I shoot it well, therefore It was money well spent.

If you shoot it well you won't look back with regret.
Tom

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Is a project gun cost effective

Post by Pheasanttracker » Tue Dec 27, 2016 3:16 pm

Gordon Guy wrote:I just bought a sears Ranger model 104.3 16 ga., 1938 to 1940 vintage. It was for sale for several months (Maybe because of the 2 9/16" chambers) and I had been handling it every time I went into the store. I couldn't get it out of my head. Every time I shouldered it it pointed where I looked.... carried well and just felt right in my hands.... Hard to explain..... After a couple months of thinking about it I traded in a much nicer gun that I lost confidence in and bought the Ranger. I got money back in the deal. The gun was in fairly good shape as compared to other utilitarian guns I have seen from the 30's. I spent 400 on it and then took it to the gunsmith, spent another 350 there. I had the gunsmith take out a barrel dent, open the chokes to Improved Cylinder in the left and left the right barrel at Improved Mod. I had him fix both sear springs, switch over the double triggers for a left handed shooter (A small nuance) and open the forcing cones as I'm recoil sensitive. I bought 2.5" inch shells from RST 1oz copper plated 6's. I went 3 for 4 on Huns and chukar the first time out and the second time out I went 2 for 3 on valley quail yesterday. I shoot it well, therefore It was money well spent.

If you shoot it well you won't look back with regret.
All good advice. I just really like some of these old guns and although I am happy with a beretta o/u I regularly shoot, I just want a old sxs America gun. I shoot a 28g sxs for grouse and really like it but not enough gun for me and pheasant.


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Re: Is a project gun cost effective

Post by AAA Gundogs » Tue Dec 27, 2016 4:06 pm

I've had several restored. Purdy, Lebeau, H&H, Parker, etc.

My preference is for high grade field guns that need extensive work (machining of parts, new furniture, etc) because I have access to CNC, a stockpile of walnut that I've collected for the last 25 years, and have a good friend, who is a fantastic smith, that takes care of me.

If enough people know that you'll pay fair prices and healthy finder's fee, you can find ideal candidates for your needs.

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Re: Is a project gun cost effective

Post by jetjockey » Wed Dec 28, 2016 6:36 am

AAA Gundogs wrote:I've had several restored. Purdy, Lebeau, H&H, Parker, etc.

My preference is for high grade field guns that need extensive work (machining of parts, new furniture, etc) because I have access to CNC, a stockpile of walnut that I've collected for the last 25 years, and have a good friend, who is a fantastic smith, that takes care of me.

If enough people know that you'll pay fair prices and healthy finder's fee, you can find ideal candidates for your needs.
Like the others have said, yes and no. With the right gun, absolutely. It's not easy however. I have an LC Smith Trap Grade that I bought for a screaming price. I had it restored by Bill Schwarz in Elijay GA. The gun is worth a lot more than i have into it. Had it been a LC Smith Field Grade gun, I'd be upside down in the gun. However, I get attached to guns, so I'm not too worried about getting my money out of the guns, since my hope is they will be handed down and not sold.

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Re: Is a project gun cost effective

Post by Gordon Guy » Wed Dec 28, 2016 1:29 pm

jetjockey said "Like the others have said, yes and no. With the right gun, absolutely. It's not easy however."

I agree it's not that easy...One can't go shopping for the "right gun". The "right gun" has to find you/me. If you've picked up enough guns you know what I'm talking about. :wink:
Tom

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Re: Is a project gun cost effective

Post by Urban_Redneck » Thu Dec 29, 2016 3:55 am

IMHO, it's about how much "project" you can stand and afford. Cast and length can be added, but, drop is the drop. Barrels are the killer, anything remotely suspect should be checked by someone with the right tools before you buy.

- a guy with a "project"on year 15 :lol:

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Re: Is a project gun cost effective

Post by AAA Gundogs » Thu Dec 29, 2016 9:52 am

jetjockey wrote:
AAA Gundogs wrote:I've had several restored. Purdy, Lebeau, H&H, Parker, etc.

My preference is for high grade field guns that need extensive work (machining of parts, new furniture, etc) because I have access to CNC, a stockpile of walnut that I've collected for the last 25 years, and have a good friend, who is a fantastic smith, that takes care of me.

If enough people know that you'll pay fair prices and healthy finder's fee, you can find ideal candidates for your needs.
Like the others have said, yes and no. With the right gun, absolutely. It's not easy however. I have an LC Smith Trap Grade that I bought for a screaming price. I had it restored by Bill Schwarz in Elijay GA. The gun is worth a lot more than i have into it. Had it been a LC Smith Field Grade gun, I'd be upside down in the gun. However, I get attached to guns, so I'm not too worried about getting my money out of the guns, since my hope is they will be handed down and not sold.
Purdy and H&H non-field grades start at $50k and go up to $250k.

The H&H field grades start at roughly $7k.

Agree, you need to have a grade that 70% of excellent grade will cover the purchase and restoration to excellent condition.

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Re: Is a project gun cost effective

Post by jetjockey » Sat Dec 31, 2016 10:04 am

That's why I don't own any Purdeys, H&H's, Boss's, etc. Theres a REALLY nice Jeffery for sale right now in 16 bird that I'd love to have. My wife cut me off for new guns however. I put one more in the safe before she cut me off though! Haha

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