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Bacon grease

Bacon grease

Postby fishvik » Mon Apr 05, 2010 7:47 am

A buddy of mine was told by his vet to never feed his dog any bacon grease. Has anybody else heard of this and why? Is it something used in bacon preparation that isn't good for a dog?
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Re: Bacon grease

Postby Ayres » Mon Apr 05, 2010 12:16 pm

I've never heard that, but then again I've never fed grease to my dogs. I've added in some olive oil before, but I've found that if you're feeding a good quality kibble the dog gets everything they need from it.

Now if you're going for a raw food diet, maybe some of the local experts can chime in about that...
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Re: Bacon grease

Postby MikeB » Mon Apr 05, 2010 12:19 pm

I have never heard it was bad. It is just pork fat. I used to feed it to my dogs daily when we had it in the house. Dogs had great looking coats. For my health I don't eat bacon very often and don't cook it at home. I do know that chicken fat is easier the dogs and cats to digest and use for better skin and coat.
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Re: Bacon grease

Postby mcbosco » Mon Apr 05, 2010 12:48 pm

If you looked around most Vet's offices you will see nutrition is not a strength, :wink:

That said, since you have the choice of trimming the fat off first and feeding it raw, that would be better. We only use uncured bacon at my house similar to pancetta, and "Spinner" as Ezzy calls him gets his fill.
Cooked bacon fat has nasty compounds that are carcinogenic.

Trim the fat first and give it raw.

check this out:

http://redpawfeed.com/index.php?option= ... &Itemid=37
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Re: Bacon grease

Postby shags » Mon Apr 05, 2010 1:37 pm

Pancreatitis can be a problem with too much fatty stuff. It can be a serious problem, not good at all.
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Re: Bacon grease

Postby ezzy333 » Mon Apr 05, 2010 1:43 pm

I think they have backed off of the carcinogenic claims in the past few years. They were concerned about the nitrites if I remember right. But like so many things they change their minds every couple of years so I don't pay much attention to all of the latest fads. But one of the big problems is the high salt content. Like everything else though a little shouldn't be a problem. I would just rather feed fresh beef or pork trimmings. Or even buy lard if you like. I do give one of my dogs a little canola oil since he is a real light eater and I can increase the calories a little for him in the winter. But when it starts warming up I try to stay with cooler type treats if I give anything at all. I am of the same school as Steve and have found that a good dog food supplies everything a dog needs and I don't like to upset the balance that is formulated into the feeds.

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Re: Bacon grease

Postby mcbosco » Mon Apr 05, 2010 1:54 pm

Yeah nitrites aren't as bad as thought but I was referrring to heterocyclic amines & polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons. Bacon is cooked at high enough temps to create those.

Al, I like the cold food/hot food concept, roots in Chinese medicine, oats seems to be the "hottest" of the grains, have you ever noticed this or is it just theory?
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Re: Bacon grease

Postby fishvik » Mon Apr 05, 2010 2:45 pm

Thanks guys for the info.
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Re: Bacon grease

Postby ezzy333 » Mon Apr 05, 2010 6:16 pm

mcbosco wrote:Yeah nitrites aren't as bad as thought but I was referrring to heterocyclic amines & polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons. Bacon is cooked at high enough temps to create those.

Al, I like the cold food/hot food concept, roots in Chinese medicine, oats seems to be the "hottest" of the grains, have you ever noticed this or is it just theory?

Corn and wheat are the hottest I believe, milo a little less, oats and barley less yet, and many variety of peas may be the coolest of the grains. It is directly correlated to the amount of calories which means the percent of carbs and fats. Less calories and more fiber is cooler. Some animals are very senitive to this. The pigeons that will eat almost straight corn in the winter time start refusing it when the temps get around 60 to 70. Rabbits will go into a full blown molt in hot weather when fed there regular diet or grain but switch to fresh fruits and vegatables and you may be able to ward off the molt for a few weeks. Oats are one of the grains that the rabbit can still eat during that time better than most of the others. But the oat has a hull that is almost all fiber and that is the difference. Beet pulp is the best thing to feed for cooling.

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Re: Bacon grease

Postby mcbosco » Mon Apr 05, 2010 6:44 pm

This is the partial Chinese list, interesting topic:


Cooling Foods

apples
bananas
tomatoes
citrus fruits
watermelon
all leafy greens
broccoli and cauliflower
zuccini
soy milk, tofu and other soy products
mung beans
amaranth
wheat
seaweed
yogurt
peppermint
cilantro
lemon balm

Neutral Foods

rice
rye
corn
peas
lentils
large beans

Warming Foods

ginger root
oats
spelt
quinoa
sesame
nuts
fennel
anise
carob
cumin
all root vegetables
onions
garlic
spicy leafy greens, like jale and mustard greens
eggs
meats
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Grains hot or cold

Postby MikeB » Mon Apr 05, 2010 9:37 pm

Nice List... So where does Ground Whole Grain Sorghum fall in the mix. I didn't find it on your list. Iams and Eukanuba went to that grain when they dropped whole ground corn. Maybe it's cooler the corn.
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Re: Bacon grease

Postby ezzy333 » Mon Apr 05, 2010 10:07 pm

It was what I called Milo. That is grain sorghum and has almost the same feed value as corn when it is ground. Because of the hard shell it passes through many animals when fed whole. It does seem to be a cooler type feed though.

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Re: Bacon grease

Postby Rich Heaton » Tue Apr 06, 2010 12:22 am

So when worse comes to worse,,,, ya cut 6 months off his life,,,,, but then again maybe you gained him 2 years by feeling good enough to get away from neighbors car. :D
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Re: Bacon grease

Postby Qwernt » Mon Apr 12, 2010 4:41 pm

I find this an interesting conversation, as my father swears by bacon grease and raw eggs - not as food, but as medicine. Growing up, our mutt dog ate a poisoned gopher, got sick. Mom spend $30 on the vet. Dad was not too happy. The next time the dog ate a poisoned gopher (yeah, not a smart dog), dad whipped up a batch of bacon grease and raw eggs. Fixed the dog faster than the vet could.

Dad claims the bacon grease and eggs keeps the dog from digesting, if so, it doesn't seem like something you want to feed too often... of course that part is all folk lore.
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Re: Bacon grease

Postby DAISYISMYDOG » Tue Apr 13, 2010 10:56 am

what is meant by warm and cool foods??
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Re: Bacon grease

Postby ezzy333 » Tue Apr 13, 2010 11:11 am

DAISYISMYDOG wrote:what is meant by warm and cool foods??

It is based on how much body heat they produce. And that is determined by the amount of fat and carbs in the food. Cooling type food that we eat are the salads and other light food such as tuna and other fish, vegetables and fruits, and other high fiber foods. Same goes for our dogs.

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Re: Bacon grease

Postby MikeB » Tue Apr 13, 2010 12:10 pm

I have heard that the "chicken fat" used in most top foods is better than other fats or oils as it is absorbed easier than other animal fats etc.

Anyone heard this?
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Re: Bacon grease

Postby mcbosco » Tue Apr 13, 2010 12:21 pm

ezzy333 wrote:
DAISYISMYDOG wrote:what is meant by warm and cool foods??

It is based on how much body heat they produce. And that is determined by the amount of fat and carbs in the food. Cooling type food that we eat are the salads and other light food such as tuna and other fish, vegetables and fruits, and other high fiber foods. Same goes for our dogs.

Ezzy



Chinese medicine also extends it to how food affects someone's mood. It is certainly factual biochemically but moods, I dunno broadly speaking. Some foods like chocolate and herbs like St. John's Wort do cheer people up but I doubt celery which is a "cool" food has much impact on mood.
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Re: Bacon grease

Postby ezzy333 » Tue Apr 13, 2010 12:53 pm

MikeB wrote:I have heard that the "chicken fat" used in most top foods is better than other fats or oils as it is absorbed easier than other animal fats etc.

Anyone heard this?

I have heard that but have never seen anyhting that backs it up and I have a strong feeling it is another of the stories that get started and no one knows how to get them stopped.

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Re: Bacon grease

Postby mcbosco » Tue Apr 13, 2010 1:01 pm

Many things in pet foods are there because of scale, availability & location. The chicken industry is huge, broad and commercially efficient in the US so it works. Even if the nutritionists and accountants at the big companies agreed on say, brown rice, the issue would be supply. I suspect that getting chicken fat is relatively easy in mass quantities.
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Re: Bacon grease

Postby ezzy333 » Tue Apr 13, 2010 1:28 pm

mcbosco wrote:Many things in pet foods are there because of scale, availability & location. The chicken industry is huge, broad and commercially efficient in the US so it works. Even if the nutritionists and accountants at the big companies agreed on say, brown rice, the issue would be supply. I suspect that getting chicken fat is relatively easy in mass quantities.


It's available but not near as available as beef or hog fat that are normally just sold as animal fat and is cheaper due to the larger supply. Poultry fat tends to be regional due to fewer processing plants and much less fat on those carcasses. I never heard of an accountant being involved in any way in formulating a feed as cost and availability is part of the manufacturing process. But if you are just trying to say cost enters into the picture you would be absolutely right. If we couldn't support the higher cost with better performance it didn't get used. That's what keeps our feeds somewhat reasonable in price while maintaining the quality.

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Re: Bacon grease

Postby tommyboy72 » Fri Apr 16, 2010 8:33 am

Cooked bacon fat carcinogenic? Blasphemy! Not eating it. Unheard of in my house. East coast, tender foot, tree huggers. You guys live in smog infested cities and are worried about a little bacon fat. Ridiculous. That is like the prepostorous myth that the char on barbeque is carcinogenic. Ludicrous I tell you. I eat chicken fried bacon, love the sweet, delectable char on barbeque and I smoke. Guess I am just a big ball of cancer waiting to happen. :D

Some of you guys amaze me. You are worried about a little bit of bacon fat when your dogs have had dead animals in their mouths that have been living in the wild. Eating and drinking from God knows what kind of sources. Do you think birds ,and for you versatile guys, furred animals only drink from chlorinated, natural, clean, fresh running mountain streams or eat from food sources that are organic, unfertilized, unsprayed sources. No the animals you let your dog put in his mouth and sometimes eat have been drinking from mudholes, dirty ponds, or wherever they can get water and have been eating from sources that have been sprayed with fertilizer, bug spray, weed killer, etc. I don't think a bit of bacon fat is going to kill them. Heck I would eat the rear end out of a dead rhino if I were hungry enough. Bacon grease carcinogenic. Bet you believe in Santa Clause and the Easter Bunny too. :P
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Re: Bacon grease

Postby ezzy333 » Fri Apr 16, 2010 11:34 am

tommyboy72 wrote:Cooked bacon fat carcinogenic? Blasphemy! Not eating it. Unheard of in my house. East coast, tender foot, tree huggers. You guys live in smog infested cities and are worried about a little bacon fat. Ridiculous. That is like the prepostorous myth that the char on barbeque is carcinogenic. Ludicrous I tell you. I eat chicken fried bacon, love the sweet, delectable char on barbeque and I smoke. Guess I am just a big ball of cancer waiting to happen. :D

Some of you guys amaze me. You are worried about a little bit of bacon fat when your dogs have had dead animals in their mouths that have been living in the wild. Eating and drinking from God knows what kind of sources. Do you think birds ,and for you versatile guys, furred animals only drink from chlorinated, natural, clean, fresh running mountain streams or eat from food sources that are organic, unfertilized, unsprayed sources. No the animals you let your dog put in his mouth and sometimes eat have been drinking from mudholes, dirty ponds, or wherever they can get water and have been eating from sources that have been sprayed with fertilizer, bug spray, weed killer, etc. I don't think a bit of bacon fat is going to kill them. Heck I would eat the rear end out of a dead rhino if I were hungry enough. Bacon grease carcinogenic. Bet you believe in Santa Clause and the Easter Bunny too. :P



Tommy,

Much of what you have to say I can agree with but I don't understand what it has to do with feeding bacon grease. We do have many people with pets spending way too much time worrying about their pets diet. I don't think there is another animal on the planet that has so many wild ideas of what they should eat including man as there is about dog food. But that doesn't have much to do with this question since bacon is not a natural form of meat but has been processed with many chemicals to preserve it, salt being the principle one. And salt is not good for a dog in higher levels. And yes, bacon was reported as being carcinogenic because of the nitrites but I believe they have backed off of that a great deal. But it still makes sense to use a natural form of fat rather than one that has been treated with large amounts of salt or other chemicals that were used to alter it.

I will fight forever to allow all of us to decide what we want to do with our own lives but it probably doesn't make a lot of sense to brag about all of the things we can do that we know are not particularly healthful while making fun of the people who are probably over concerned. They just might outlive us if they don't worry themselves to death.

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Re: Bacon grease

Postby tommyboy72 » Fri Apr 16, 2010 5:17 pm

Sorry about that Ezzy. Seems like everyday I read or hear about something else that is harmful to our health or will cause cancer. Just had a moment I guess.

I agree bacon grease probably is not good for dogs that tend to gain weight easily especially dogs like labs or WPG's, larger bodied dogs. Dogs like my pointers that seem to be on the lean side even when free feeding would probably be ok with bacon grease on a regular basis.

I was just trying to make a point about people being so concerned with their dogs diets while no one really seems tothink about what the birds we let our dogs retrieve to us have eaten and drank. Probably one has nothing to do with the other and I went about it incorrectly. Sorry about that.
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Re: Bacon grease

Postby ezzy333 » Fri Apr 16, 2010 10:29 pm

tommyboy72 wrote:Sorry about that Ezzy. Seems like everyday I read or hear about something else that is harmful to our health or will cause cancer. Just had a moment I guess.

I agree bacon grease probably is not good for dogs that tend to gain weight easily especially dogs like labs or WPG's, larger bodied dogs. Dogs like my pointers that seem to be on the lean side even when free feeding would probably be ok with bacon grease on a regular basis.

I was just trying to make a point about people being so concerned with their dogs diets while no one really seems tothink about what the birds we let our dogs retrieve to us have eaten and drank. Probably one has nothing to do with the other and I went about it incorrectly. Sorry about that.

Not a problem. I agree with you but just didn't think it fit well on this topic. Worse part of the bacon grease is the high salt content.

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Re: Bacon grease

Postby fishvik » Mon Apr 19, 2010 7:49 am

Tommyboy and Ezzy,

Boy did this post take some wild turns! I just wanted to find out what anybody else had heard about bacon grease and its effect on dog health.
I have fed it to all of my birddogs and they have all lived well past ten years of age so I guess it didn't do them much harm.

As for being a "East coast, tender foot, tree hugger". I did live on the east coast for a while, I'm not sure I fit the rest of the description. I work for a resource management agency and have for the last 40 years. And while I don't get into the field as much as I used to, or as much as I would still like to, I definitely can take care of myself out there so I wouldn't consider myself a tenderfoot. I am a conservationist, but I do believe in use of resources. When my anti-hunting and fishing colleages give me grief about being a biologist that still hunts and fishes, I just tell them that I want to be a part of the ecosystem not just an observer of it. I have often said that you can't trust a wildlife or fisheries biologist that doesn't hunt or fish.
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Re: Bacon grease

Postby tommyboy72 » Mon Apr 19, 2010 5:31 pm

Yes I am very sorry about that. That was my fault. :oops:

I just found it a bit ironic that we were discussing carcinogenic bacon fat and high salt content relating to dogs when we ask them to put dead animals in their mouths and want them to retrieve them to us. :D

I worry more about keeping weight on my pointers than their triglyceride count or the amount of cholesterol in their diets. :lol:
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Re: Bacon grease

Postby Duane M » Mon Apr 19, 2010 7:42 pm

Been watching dogs be fed bacon drippings for as long as I can remember, we call it a skillet meal around our house which includes a couple of eggs and some wheat bread. Average age the dogs lived to is 14 by my best recollection and the oldest was 17. Bacon, it does a body good. :D
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Re: Bacon grease

Postby tommyboy72 » Mon Apr 19, 2010 9:09 pm

Only thing better than bacon is chicken fried bacon. :D
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Re: Bacon grease

Postby Duane M » Tue Apr 20, 2010 2:33 pm

tommyboy72 wrote:Only thing better than bacon is chicken fried bacon. :D

Just saw that on Food Network, talk about overkill. Fat dunked in fat and fried, bet it tastes gooooood though. :D
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Re: Bacon grease

Postby glk7243 » Tue Apr 20, 2010 4:01 pm

My Grandpa ate a lot, I mean a lot, of bacon grease every day. He called it hog honey. He ate bacon, eggs, and pancakes everyday for breakfast. He poured all the grease from that days friend bacon on his pancakes. He ate potatoes and vegetables, and some kind of meat every day at supper. He ate all the fat and grissle from his meat and anyone at the table that did not eat there fat, he ate that too. He was a big guy but not everweight, he worked hard, outdoors on oil rigs.
I'm sure all the excess fat did shorten his life though. He died at 97. 8)
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Re: Bacon grease

Postby birddogger » Tue Apr 20, 2010 5:38 pm

glk7243 wrote:My Grandpa ate a lot, I mean a lot, of bacon grease every day. He called it hog honey. He ate bacon, eggs, and pancakes everyday for breakfast. He poured all the grease from that days friend bacon on his pancakes. He ate potatoes and vegetables, and some kind of meat every day at supper. He ate all the fat and grissle from his meat and anyone at the table that did not eat there fat, he ate that too. He was a big guy but not everweight, he worked hard, outdoors on oil rigs.
I'm sure all the excess fat did shorten his life though. He died at 97. 8)

I don't know how it affects dogs, but with people I have always believed and probebly always will believe that it has more to do with genetics than anything. Personally, I eat and drink anything I want, hopefully in moderation.

I was wondering if you were going to bring up the chicken fried bacon Tom. Now that is chicken soup for the soul!!! :D

My Grandpa ate the same way, but it was mostly fresh side meat and not bacon. He lived to be 86 and I doubt that what he ate would have changed anything. That being said, I would not give my dogs bacon grease on a regular basis. There are two reasons for that. One is to be on the safe side and the other is, I want it for myself. :lol: :lol:

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Re: Bacon grease

Postby tommyboy72 » Tue Apr 20, 2010 7:59 pm

Duane, I love bacon and never thought it could get better but I was wrong. Once I tried it chicken fried I am hooked. It is like legal "crack". :lol:
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Re: Bacon grease

Postby fishvik » Wed Apr 21, 2010 7:04 am

glk7243 wrote:My Grandpa ate a lot, I mean a lot, of bacon grease every day. He called it hog honey. He ate bacon, eggs, and pancakes everyday for breakfast. He poured all the grease from that days friend bacon on his pancakes. He ate potatoes and vegetables, and some kind of meat every day at supper. He ate all the fat and grissle from his meat and anyone at the table that did not eat there fat, he ate that too. He was a big guy but not everweight, he worked hard, outdoors on oil rigs.
I'm sure all the excess fat did shorten his life though. He died at 97. 8)


I think the key phrase here was he was a big man and he had a job that was physical in nature so he was always burning off the calories. The jacks that worked the log drives on the Clearwater River in northern Idaho were eating 10,000 or more calories a day and often losing weight during the drives. Extreme physical labor and being on the edge of hypopthermia all day tends to burn calories. I imagine this transfers to dogs too. A dog running and swimming in cold weather all day probably can't get enough fat.
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Re: Bacon grease

Postby birddogger » Wed Apr 21, 2010 9:22 pm

fishvik wrote:
glk7243 wrote:My Grandpa ate a lot, I mean a lot, of bacon grease every day. He called it hog honey. He ate bacon, eggs, and pancakes everyday for breakfast. He poured all the grease from that days friend bacon on his pancakes. He ate potatoes and vegetables, and some kind of meat every day at supper. He ate all the fat and grissle from his meat and anyone at the table that did not eat there fat, he ate that too. He was a big guy but not everweight, he worked hard, outdoors on oil rigs.
I'm sure all the excess fat did shorten his life though. He died at 97. 8)


I think the key phrase here was he was a big man and he had a job that was physical in nature so he was always burning off the calories. The jacks that worked the log drives on the Clearwater River in northern Idaho were eating 10,000 or more calories a day and often losing weight during the drives. Extreme physical labor and being on the edge of hypopthermia all day tends to burn calories. I imagine this transfers to dogs too. A dog running and swimming in cold weather all day probably can't get enough fat.

The fat is not the issue. As Ezzy had posted earlier, it is the processing and high salt content of bacon that may not be good for dogs. I wouldn't be afraid to give bacon grease from time to time, but if I felt I needed to add some fat, I would use lard.

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Re: Bacon grease

Postby ezzy333 » Wed Apr 21, 2010 9:26 pm

birddogger wrote:
fishvik wrote:
glk7243 wrote:My Grandpa ate a lot, I mean a lot, of bacon grease every day. He called it hog honey. He ate bacon, eggs, and pancakes everyday for breakfast. He poured all the grease from that days friend bacon on his pancakes. He ate potatoes and vegetables, and some kind of meat every day at supper. He ate all the fat and grissle from his meat and anyone at the table that did not eat there fat, he ate that too. He was a big guy but not everweight, he worked hard, outdoors on oil rigs.
I'm sure all the excess fat did shorten his life though. He died at 97. 8)


I think the key phrase here was he was a big man and he had a job that was physical in nature so he was always burning off the calories. The jacks that worked the log drives on the Clearwater River in northern Idaho were eating 10,000 or more calories a day and often losing weight during the drives. Extreme physical labor and being on the edge of hypopthermia all day tends to burn calories. I imagine this transfers to dogs too. A dog running and swimming in cold weather all day probably can't get enough fat.

The fat is not the issue. As Ezzy had posted earlier, it is the processing and high salt content of bacon that may not be good for dogs. I wouldn't be afraid to give bacon grease from time to time, but if I felt I needed to add some fat, I would use lard.

Charlie

Right on!!!!
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Re: Bacon grease

Postby Grange » Wed Apr 28, 2010 8:45 am

ezzy333 wrote:bacon is not a natural form of meat but has been processed with many chemicals to preserve it, salt being the principle one. Ezy


Bacon is a gift from God to man. I believe God created the pig so it could be made into bacon. It can't get any more natural than that. I try to thank God by eating his gift as often as I can. :D
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Re: Bacon grease

Postby big steve46 » Wed Apr 28, 2010 11:06 am

[Bacon is a gift from God to man. I believe God created the pig so it could be made into bacon. It cant get any more natural than that. I try to thank God by eating his gift as often as I can. :D[/quote]


I find your statement acceptable, and I won't "squeal" on you. :D
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