Possible ACL injury

Post Reply
redman25
Rank: Senior Hunter
Posts: 197
Joined: Fri Jun 11, 2010 12:58 pm
Location: Charleston, SC

Possible ACL injury

Post by redman25 » Mon Feb 14, 2011 6:19 pm

Well my pup did really well in his first season, but unfortunately came up a little lame at the end of a hunt about a month ago. Limp worsened by the time I got him home so I took him to the vet the next morning. X rays were negative and the drawer sign test didn't show immediate signs of a torn ligament, but the vet said without an ultrasound($400)there was no way to know for sure. Hips are good. I rested him for a few weeks, as much as is possible with a 6 month old GSP, but he's still having issues. He runs like little is wrong when I exercise him, but he exhibits stiffness in that leg afterward and after he gets up from a nap. I'm upset about it to say the least, because he's so young and was showing tons of promise. The operation is very expensive, so it's going to be a while until I can pull it off. I'm sick..... Anyone have any experience with this type of injury?

User avatar
snips
GDF Junkie
Posts: 5542
Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2004 7:26 am
Location: n.ga.

Re: Possible ACL injury

Post by snips » Mon Feb 14, 2011 7:50 pm

I would keep him as quiet as possible for next few weeks. See what hapens, very young for ACL issue.
brenda

User avatar
wems2371
GDF Junkie
Posts: 2430
Joined: Sat Dec 08, 2007 6:55 pm
Location: Eastern Iowa

Re: Possible ACL injury

Post by wems2371 » Mon Feb 14, 2011 7:54 pm

Did your vet mention anything about panosteitis? (Growing pains) You might research that.

User avatar
snips
GDF Junkie
Posts: 5542
Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2004 7:26 am
Location: n.ga.

Re: Possible ACL injury

Post by snips » Mon Feb 14, 2011 10:08 pm

Good call Denise....
brenda

redman25
Rank: Senior Hunter
Posts: 197
Joined: Fri Jun 11, 2010 12:58 pm
Location: Charleston, SC

Re: Possible ACL injury

Post by redman25 » Tue Feb 15, 2011 9:57 am

Brenda, it was a freak occurrence. He was making a retrieve on a woodcock on a steep embankment in a ditch. One of his hind legs spun out from under him and he was never the same after that retrieve. The vet said he had seen it happen often when a dog "spins out" and puts a ton of pressure on the opposite leg. He brought that specific situation up even before I mentioned it. It was at the end of about 2 hours of hunting so he was probably a little tired too....ofcourse I blame myself for a lot of this. He's way better than he was, but he's definitely not 100%.

Denise, as far as the growing pains affliction, he never really mentioned it other than to say that there was still a good bit of room between growth plates and that there was no sign of epiphyseal "growth plate" fracture, which would be a disaster. Although, he did mention how large Logan was for his age, 50 lbs, and that sometimes fast growth can contribute to these types of issues. I had him on a high protien diet and immediately put him on an adult maintenance formula.

I'm just praying for the best. Keeping this pup quiet is relative, so I'm doing my best under the circumstances.....

User avatar
wems2371
GDF Junkie
Posts: 2430
Joined: Sat Dec 08, 2007 6:55 pm
Location: Eastern Iowa

Re: Possible ACL injury

Post by wems2371 » Tue Feb 15, 2011 10:57 am

I mention panosteitis, because it is something that affected my gsp Roxi. She first was lame after running through a barbed-wire fence, during a puppy test. It was immediate, holding up the front paw lame, which my vet diagnosed as a sprain after doing an exam and xrays. A couple weeks of rest and rimadyl and she was good for about a week, and then limping again. That happened on and off for a lot of 2008, but after watching it switch legs, the vet was confident it was pano. But the oddball coincidence of a witnessed injury and then the timing of the pano, made for some confusion. Roxi was a lot like you describe, in that she could run and play fine, but if she was walking slow or standing around--she wouldn't put full pressure on it. Anyway, it sounds like you are in capable veterinary hands, but I'll still hope that it is something as simple as pano.

redman25
Rank: Senior Hunter
Posts: 197
Joined: Fri Jun 11, 2010 12:58 pm
Location: Charleston, SC

Re: Possible ACL injury

Post by redman25 » Tue Feb 15, 2011 12:09 pm

Thanks a ton for that description, because now that you clarified it makes a ton more sense. I have noticed that he occasionally shows some discomfort in one of his front legs on occasion also, but only around the house and only recently. He runs like a gazelle in the open though. Gives me some hope. Thanks for the input.

Brad6260
Rank: Just A Pup
Posts: 20
Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2011 11:31 am
Location: Louisville, Ky

Re: Possible ACL injury

Post by Brad6260 » Tue Feb 15, 2011 12:47 pm

Redman,
Take heart. My now 6 year old Lab Tessa who's sitting right next me hoping for a morsel drop as usual had the same thing happen when she was about six months old. My vet who's sharp as a tack sent me to a top gun surgeon who took film and said she had about a 60% ACL tear. He recommended waiting about 8 months with no rough housing to see what healing might occur.

She never missed a bird season or had any lingering effect at all.. The regenerative abilities of these young strong dogs is substantial if we can resist the temptation to push them to do what both dog and owner intended them to do. Give both of you a time out for a few months and see what happens.

Obviously you do not know exactly what's going on with him but error on the side of conservative.

Best of luck and positive vibes to you and your pal.

Brad and Tessa

redman25
Rank: Senior Hunter
Posts: 197
Joined: Fri Jun 11, 2010 12:58 pm
Location: Charleston, SC

Re: Possible ACL injury

Post by redman25 » Wed Feb 16, 2011 11:13 am

Thanks Brad. It's just so hard to keep such a high energy dog reigned in. If I don't let him run a little, at least once every 3 days he comes unhinged, so I let him run on a road by the house occasionally just to get the edge off. He seems to be doing better every week, but it's tough not having a true diagnosis. It's going to be warming up down here pretty soon, so he'll quiet down when the heat hits and it will be easier. Hopefully all will be well by the fall.

User avatar
RoostersMom
GDF Junkie
Posts: 1755
Joined: Wed Feb 09, 2011 2:42 pm
Location: North Central Missouri

Re: Possible ACL injury

Post by RoostersMom » Wed Feb 16, 2011 2:01 pm

Redman,

Instead of a run - which won't help him out in the long run and might even cause more injury, why don't you do short burst of obedience training with him? There are a lot of things you can do on lead that will keep him exercised and mentally working but that will also keep him from re-injuring himself. You'll exercise his mind and that might help keep him sane while you're trying to rest him as much as possible.

redman25
Rank: Senior Hunter
Posts: 197
Joined: Fri Jun 11, 2010 12:58 pm
Location: Charleston, SC

Re: Possible ACL injury

Post by redman25 » Wed Feb 16, 2011 5:00 pm

I understand where you're coming from, but it's tough to keep his attention with all that built up energy and anxiety. I did that for the first 3 weeks after the initial incident, but it was a rough 3 weeks. A little freedom to move is the only thing that gets the job done. I understand the risk, but I think the benefits outweigh having him bouncing off the walls in the house or turning restlessly in his kennel. It is good advice though, and I appreciate all I can get.

User avatar
mcbosco
GDF Junkie
Posts: 3577
Joined: Wed Jun 10, 2009 6:22 pm
Location: Monmouth County NJ

Re: Possible ACL injury

Post by mcbosco » Wed Feb 16, 2011 7:10 pm

You live in Charleston, take him to the beach and swim him hard on a check cord.

User avatar
snips
GDF Junkie
Posts: 5542
Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2004 7:26 am
Location: n.ga.

Re: Possible ACL injury

Post by snips » Wed Feb 16, 2011 10:52 pm

I would call that vet and ask them to revisit your xray and look for any sign of Pano...Sometimes hard to detect....As Denise said....But anti-inflammatories would help...
brenda

redman25
Rank: Senior Hunter
Posts: 197
Joined: Fri Jun 11, 2010 12:58 pm
Location: Charleston, SC

Re: Possible ACL injury

Post by redman25 » Thu Feb 17, 2011 8:53 am

I put a call in to the vet yesterday, Just waiting on a call back.

MATT4126
Rank: Junior Hunter
Posts: 96
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2010 4:54 pm
Location: Powhatan, VA

Re: Possible ACL injury

Post by MATT4126 » Thu Feb 17, 2011 8:56 am

This is exactly what happened to my GSP and after waiting and hoping she would get better it was evident she needed the surgery. Our vet said that she had significant signs of osteo-arthritis as a result of us waiting for as long as we did. $3k later and almost 8 full weeks since surgery she isn't perfect, but did her first off leash walk yesterday...she is still lame and we are still doing rehab with her, and I guess I am resigned to the fact that she will never be 100%, but she will still be able to hunt and chase a ball. We are hoping that her other side doesn't go out. Good luck.

redman25
Rank: Senior Hunter
Posts: 197
Joined: Fri Jun 11, 2010 12:58 pm
Location: Charleston, SC

Re: Possible ACL injury

Post by redman25 » Thu Feb 17, 2011 9:40 am

Matt,

Was there swelling with your pup? That was the real oddity with this. No warmth in the knee area, no swelling, no fluid on the knee.

Adam

User avatar
jlp8cornell
Rank: 4X Champion
Posts: 664
Joined: Tue Feb 16, 2010 2:29 pm
Location: Ithaca,NY

Re: Possible ACL injury

Post by jlp8cornell » Thu Feb 17, 2011 10:09 am

My old dog tore her CCL when she was 9. No swelling, no heat, etc in that knee. Off and on lameness that did not resolve she I brought her in. Diagnosed with a CCL tear, did surgery 2 days later and she is still going strong at 12, with no lameness.

My young dog injured himself when he was 8m old. Was playing in my yard with his sister and fell hard on a big patch of ice on is left knee. He was sore but I assumed it would resolve. After a week it had not so I brought him in. Xrays showed nothing except a tiny area on his femur that looked to be injured (less opaque then the rest of the bone). But...no real diagnosis so I was told to restrict activity as much as possible (which was darn hard) and recheck in 6-8 weeks unless things became worse. Nothing changed, brought him back in and over the area of injured bone he has developed an OCD lesion. (The cartilage cracks because underlying bone is damaged and not receiving an adequate supply of blood). So, we did surgery and lots of rehab.He is 2.5 now and still has a very slight lameness but nothing that keeps him from any activities and most people do not even see it.

I guess my advice would be to find the best orthopedic specialist in your area. Also...if you get a diagnosis, do surgery/rest/whatever ASAP. Ongoing injuries can often lead to degenerative joint disease much more quickly and that can cause lots of problems down the road. In the meantime, as suggested, try to tire his brain. I did lots of obedience when Max was down. Also, knuckle bones, nylabones, Kongs filled with food and frozen can be helpful with a bored dog.

Good luck. I know how frustrating this wait game can be. Jen

MATT4126
Rank: Junior Hunter
Posts: 96
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2010 4:54 pm
Location: Powhatan, VA

Re: Possible ACL injury

Post by MATT4126 » Thu Feb 17, 2011 1:56 pm

No swelling, heat...we couldn't even get her to flinch or show any signs of pain...just lameness and favoring her left side.

User avatar
1vizsla
Rank: Champion
Posts: 303
Joined: Mon Dec 17, 2007 3:30 pm
Location: Leavenworth KS

Re: Possible ACL injury

Post by 1vizsla » Tue Feb 22, 2011 11:42 am

Mine had no swelling or heat either but tore her CCL just the same. I evidently did just the same too, no swelling, no heat but torn ACL and scheduled for surgery soon (no more shampooing carpets for me). I have also had many friends with dogs that tore CCL's and all had the surgery and are still competing. Definitely have it checked out.

carla

redman25
Rank: Senior Hunter
Posts: 197
Joined: Fri Jun 11, 2010 12:58 pm
Location: Charleston, SC

Re: Possible ACL injury

Post by redman25 » Wed Feb 23, 2011 8:33 am

He's been checked out as thoroughly as I can afford at this point. A specialist looked at the x rays and saw no sign of anything either. He's hasn't shown any signs of a limp in the past week or so, even after overnight in his crate, so I'm getting more hopeful.

Post Reply