Gun Dog Forum

Dr. Tim,
Interesting differences! I heard and is this really true?...some sled dog breeders have recently mixed in english pointers and gsp's to their husky sled dog strains? I have seen some recent pics and of sled dogs in Alaska and...dude...they don't look like the normal picture postcard husky! When I was a kid my dad gave me his copy of Bob Wehle's Wing & Shot(I still have his original 1964 edition and always keep it on my nightstand!) On page 117 there is a pic and following story about an Elhew pointer sled dog team winning the Harrisville Dog Sled Race. Interested to hear any feedback from you! -Mark

Georgia Boy wrote:I for one think you could be of great "service" to all the members here and am glad you joined. What you have to realize is that some of the people here work or have worked for other dog food companies and get all twisted when it comes to dog food discussions. I visit SDC every once and a while, do you post there? Before you decide to leave or get forced out let us know where we can find you.

Ain't that the truth

northUpland wrote:Dr. Tim,
Interesting differences! I heard and is this really true?...some sled dog breeders have recently mixed in english pointers and gsp's to their husky sled dog strains? I have seen some recent pics and of sled dogs in Alaska and...dude...they don't look like the normal picture postcard husky! When I was a kid my dad gave me his copy of Bob Wehle's Wing & Shot(I still have his original 1964 edition and always keep it on my nightstand!) On page 117 there is a pic and following story about an Elhew pointer sled dog team winning the Harrisville Dog Sled Race. Interested to hear any feedback from you! -Mark

I saw a team in PA that is a Husky/Norwegian Pointer cross.

Looking at the ingredients it looks like a food I'd be interested in trying but availability is a big factor as well as price. Did sign up for a sample, with 7 dogs it's not enough to tell me anything.

stlgsp wrote:Looking at the ingredients it looks like a food I'd be interested in trying but availability is a big factor as well as price. Did sign up for a sample, with 7 dogs it's not enough to tell me anything.

Become a dealer. That is one way to get the food for yourself at wholesale and make a little extra money. There are a few in New England and upstate NY. They are all breeders or racing teams.

My local supplier of Annamaet is a Husky breeder and racer. She uses it and sells a lot of it.

Ditto from me on Georgia Boy's comment. I visit this forum to learn and share. The more viewpoints, opinions, experience, education, insight, knowledge from a variety of member base...the merrier!

The muscle type information is something I really appreciate learning. My observations were supported and now I know why.

Georgia Boy wrote:I for one think you could be of great "service" to all the members here and am glad you joined. What you have to realize is that some of the people here work or have worked for other dog food companies and get all twisted when it comes to dog food discussions. I visit SDC every once and a while, do you post there? Before you decide to leave or get forced out let us know where we can find you.

WELL SAID +1 FOR ME...Dr.tim there are so many people with new pups, or dogs with health concerns, dog food questions, surgery questions, vaccine questions and the list goes on..most of us would love for you to be a part of those discussions and give your EXPERT advice..some people think if you have a difference of opinion on subjects such as dogfood you are unknowledgeable, unexperienced or unwilling to learn..dont let that influence your decision to participate and help those who want the help..i noticed the food is offered here in canada actually in ontario where i live so i will be looking into it and recommending it for others to simply look into as well....thanks...ruth

I am not sure what you were saying but we found that the long type muscle use the fat and the twitch type that are used for quick movements need the carbs. For our hard charging type hunting dogs it is imperative to keep the carb levels quite high to allow for the quick turns and stops associated with finding a bird while running at full speed and having to turn and or stop quickly. And it is almost impossible to keep the weight on the dogs without a high quality carb and corn was the one that performed the best. And it is why practically all of our trial dogs are fed a feed with corn although there are other sources.

I am glad you did notice the civil manner you were treated with here on our forum as that is something we insist on. We still have a few that need some reminders but we are a great place for the newcomers that want to learn to get the information they need to compete,whether in a trial or just in the fields finding birds. But the trialers are the ones that have shown a real need for the higher carb type feeds and to be able to buy it at a reasonable price.

I also have always put the amount of waste the dog produces rather low on list of things we need to worry about. I know some of the owners are concerned when they have to clean the yard. But I always felt the health of the dog was much more important than the amount of waste. I was happy to see that after you made the statement about keeping waste to the minimum you then listed 4 or 5 fiber sources you use to increase the amount and keep the dogs complete digestive system healthy. On another thread going now some are suggesting feeding green beans to bulk up the feed they are using. It has always seemed odd that so many want to keep increasing the digestibility of the feed but then feeding supplements to do just the opposite. Anyway I still want to put the health of our dogs ahead of all the vast array of what people think a good food is without looking at the condition of their dogs to determine whats good.

Ezzy


PS Oh by the way I am one of those awful people on here that made there living over the past 60 years in the feed industry that a few of our members get upset with if I question or challenge them about the ideas they have about dog food. But thankfully it only a very few and getting fewer..

Am I the only one who is tiring of Ruth and Ezzy's petty back-and-forth routine. I haven't been on here very long, but in my brief experience, the constant conflict between the two just undercuts the point either is making. Both have probably forgotten more than I will ever know, but I'll take my ignorance over their petulance.

Cajun Casey wrote:Dr. Tim makes a great food, but he must work on distribution. There is virtually no place to buy it here. He just won a big race in Minnesota I believe.

SubMariner wrote:This is the 2nd forum I've seen Dr Tim join basically so he can flog his food. Haven't heard anything of him before now...

Cajun Casey wrote:How about those who only post when they have yet another litter to peddle or "started" dog to unload at an internet inflated price?

The fact that you keep track of others' internet participation speaks volumes.

Call me cynical, but I am suspicious of people who you never see contributing to an online community UNTIL they have a product or service to sell. And yes, that applies to people selling ANYTHING.

ezzy333 wrote:I also have always put the amount of waste the dog produces rather low on list of things we need to worry about. I know some of the owners are concerned when they have to clean the yard. But I always felt the health of the dog was much more important than the amount of waste.

We actually agree on something dog food related!!!

It seems that most foods these days advertise this as a great quality (including the one I currently feed), but it is not even something I consider.....it's all about the dog's activity level, coat quality, and general health.

SubMariner wrote:

Cajun Casey wrote:Dr. Tim makes a great food, but he must work on distribution. There is virtually no place to buy it here. He just won a big race in Minnesota I believe.

SubMariner wrote:This is the 2nd forum I've seen Dr Tim join basically so he can flog his food. Haven't heard anything of him before now...

Cajun Casey wrote:How about those who only post when they have yet another litter to peddle or "started" dog to unload at an internet inflated price?

The fact that you keep track of others' internet participation speaks volumes.

Call me cynical, but I am suspicious of people who you never see contributing to an online community UNTIL they have a product or service to sell. And yes, that applies to people selling ANYTHING.

You need to work on your quoting skills, too. I did not make that first post you attributed to me and I would appreciate it if you fixed it.

KDgococks wrote:Am I the only one who is tiring of Ruth and Ezzy's petty back-and-forth routine. I haven't been on here very long, but in my brief experience, the constant conflict between the two just undercuts the point either is making. Both have probably forgotten more than I will ever know, but I'll take my ignorance over their petulance.

If there was ever any positive contribution or fresh information, it would be different, but there never is.

The muscle type/energy source material absolutely intrigues me and I know the mushing community has made a lot of progress in formulating for endurance. I would really like to learn more, but the topic will probably be beaten to a useless, corn filled pulp.

KDgococks wrote:Am I the only one who is tiring of Ruth and Ezzy's petty back-and-forth routine. I haven't been on here very long, but in my brief experience, the constant conflict between the two just undercuts the point either is making. Both have probably forgotten more than I will ever know, but I'll take my ignorance over their petulance.

You just need to take both with a grain of salt, and mainly pay strict attention to what I and Cajun say!

big steve46 wrote:

KDgococks wrote:Am I the only one who is tiring of Ruth and Ezzy's petty back-and-forth routine. I haven't been on here very long, but in my brief experience, the constant conflict between the two just undercuts the point either is making. Both have probably forgotten more than I will ever know, but I'll take my ignorance over their petulance.

You just need to take both with a grain of salt, and mainly pay strict attention to what I and Cajun say!

Yes, Big Steve is always correct. Plus, due to the fact he has a setter, his participation is of a higher class and caliber.

Thank you. I don't care what food a dog is on as long as he/she is healthy. If you have questions, ask away or send me an email directly. My emphasis is on healthy dogs. I just got frustrated by foods on the market and decided to make my own.
I did the same with my house.

KDgococks wrote:Am I the only one who is tiring of Ruth and Ezzy's petty back-and-forth routine. I haven't been on here very long, but in my brief experience, the constant conflict between the two just undercuts the point either is making. Both have probably forgotten more than I will ever know, but I'll take my ignorance over their petulance.

KDgococks, there are many differences of opinions on this forum due to differences in age, gender, education, locations, backgrounds, personalities, experience, dog breed preference, hunting/trialing background and so on therefore there is conflict be it petty or not to some..theres sarcasim as well, some of it is funny and some of it is not..i do know that from my point of view and i can only speak for myself, that no matter what these differences are between ezzy and myself that i do respect him and his information, dont necessarily agree with it all, but he is knowledgeable, experienced and is from my personal experience a kind person who believe it or not i consider a friend on this forum..we do not only disagree, we have agreed on things as well and we have both had plenty of other disagreements with other people..anyone who actively participates in posts on here at some point will find themselves in a disagreement but i think its safe to say we all are here for the same reason and thats to learn, share info and experiences, and of course just talk about hunting and the dogs we all love....ruth

KDgococks wrote:Am I the only one who is tiring of Ruth and Ezzy's petty back-and-forth routine. I haven't been on here very long, but in my brief experience, the constant conflict between the two just undercuts the point either is making. Both have probably forgotten more than I will ever know, but I'll take my ignorance over their petulance.

You probably haven't been on the board long enough to realize you don't have to read anything you don't want to but most of the others have. This type of complaint is always recognized and taken under consideration but in reality it says more about th complainer than the people being complained about. We have a title on every topic and it would probably help everyone to just read the ones they want to learn from or enjoy and skip the ones you get tired of. And do not post on a topic and then complain about other posters. That indicates a whole different motive for your complaints which everyone gets to see. There is a reason that serious complaints are handled by PM and not on the board and those are taken seriously as there purpose appears, at least, to be genuine.

Ezzy

SubMariner wrote:This is the 2nd forum I've seen Dr Tim join basically so he can flog his food. Haven't heard anything of him before now...

Hmmm...

Ezzy wrote:You bring up a very good point. We pride ourselves as a place dedicated to the new gundog owner and not a commercial advertising site. This point has been under discussion here in the backroom and the outcome is still undecided. Part of the problem is do we let commercial enities compete with our members as far as advertising and then on the other hand It is a subject that some of the new owners have as potential new customers. Another down side is that what you read in any form of advertising is seldom impartial truth but instead the points that have been decided would sell their product. I think you can see that in Dr. Tim's post. With his very first post he did not come on and introduce him self but just asked our opinion of his dog food. That wasn't what you call straightforword as far as really being one of our members but a backhanded method of geting opinions and then using them to pattern your responses. It sure seems anyone really wanting to help people would be able to be standup and ask what we all need or what he has to offer and be able to show the results through the feed test that prove it is a better product.

We have asked others to provide a link to our site if they are going to use ours to advertise. And we do want to provide as much good info to the new owners as possible. It is always a challenge to decide who is really interested in doing that and not just using us as a place to promote themselves and their products. Lets just say the jury is still out.

Ezzy

Thank you for elaborating, Ezzy. I have no problem with someone posting ads for their product in an appropriate section for that express purpose. In fact, most Boards have a specific area just for commercial posts so that there is no confusion on this subject. Likewise, I have no issue with a member including a link to their website in their signature.

However, what I do take issue with is a person whose first post is not so much an "introduction" as it is an ad for their product/service. This walks a fine line between "hi, I'm new & this is what I do for a living while I [run gun dogs/scuba dive/ride mountain bikes/whatever] and "Hi, I'm [name] and here is my product that I think you should buy because this is a place for me to sell it, but I'm not going to participate here other than that." And then they proceed to never contribute to the Board except when a subject comes up that is related to their enterprise.

JMHO,

What is the problem, the guy appears to manufacture a great feed and is proud of it, he openly says if you have questions to ask and is polite. I am glad we have people with his backround willing to answer questions. This is Health and Nutrition

JERRY

Start a new thread on something or if there was one before and there is controversy, I can read through it and give my opinion on it. I will contribute to this site as it seems amicable and I want to learn a lot more about the field trial dogs. Ihave some that come through my hospital and they compete in Georgia, truly sporting dogs.

As to the hound/husky crosses, go to Egil Ellis' website and look at his eurohounds. egilellis.com , I believe.

I guess I should have started out with something different than a direct ask of what you thought on the food. Again, hard to judge a food with out trying it but all of you have run a lot of food through dogs over the years. So have I. I have 40 huskies right now and have had huskies for over 15 years. Let me tell you about dog poop and how I want it to be small.

If you want to email me directly, you are always welcome.

dr tim wrote:Start a new thread on something or if there was one before and there is controversy, I can read through it and give my opinion on it. I will contribute to this site as it seems amicable and I want to learn a lot more about the field trial dogs. Ihave some that come through my hospital and they compete in Georgia, truly sporting dogs.

As to the hound/husky crosses, go to Egil Ellis' website and look at his eurohounds. egilellis.com , I believe.

I guess I should have started out with something different than a direct ask of what you thought on the food. Again, hard to judge a food with out trying it but all of you have run a lot of food through dogs over the years. So have I. I have 40 huskies right now and have had huskies for over 15 years. Let me tell you about dog poop and how I want it to be small.

If you want to email me directly, you are always welcome.

Do you regularly use your company Facebook page? I would love to learn more about muscle and endurance, but I feel nutrition professionals face a hurdle here, unlike the pro trainers that regularly promote their philosophies and services.

Ruth and ezzy,

Thanks for the info on the dynamics of a message board/forum, I am enlightened. When I referred to my ignorance, it was in respect to Gun Dog training, et al, but thanks for the forum crash course As far as what it says about me, I don't know, mostly that it is a bit frustrating when a topic spirals into a 1 v 1 battle of wits, for the sake of one-upmanship. Not sure about the grammer in that but you get the point. To say anymore would be the pot calling the kettle black, so I'll leave it at that. I probably do need to get better at taking it w/ a grain of salt, but as has been noted, I get to put my two-cents in also, so there you go.

Dr.tim, PM sent....ruth

I use DrTims Momentum Dog Food the best dog food i have ever used , As a K-9 handler we need a food that does not make the poop around every corner , my dogs look great .

I also run NSTRA & NAVHDA

2 Police K-9 (GWP AND A LAB)
5 bird finding Machines (4 GWP AND A GSP) ONE OF THE GWP IS A NAVHDA VC

2 CUPS 1X A DAY so cost it not that hi if u look on what u put in or dog and what u get out of them, plus my dogs are my kids , what do u feed ur kids , I want the best and natural, DrTim's Dog Food is the best i've found , i've have feed a lot of dog food

I'm not Paid or Sponsored by them

dr tim wrote: Rob Downey makes Annamaet, a very good line of dog foods. .

I thought he is IRON MAN.

K-9 GWP wrote:I use DrTims Momentum Dog Food the best dog food i have ever used , As a K-9 handler we need a food that does not make the poop around every corner , my dogs look great .

I also run NSTRA & NAVHDA

2 Police K-9 (GWP AND A LAB)
5 bird finding Machines (4 GWP AND A GSP) ONE OF THE GWP IS A NAVHDA VC

2 CUPS 1X A DAY so cost it not that hi if u look on what u put in or dog and what u get out of them, plus my dogs are my kids , what do u feed ur kids , I want the best and natural, DrTim's Dog Food is the best i've found , i've have feed a lot of dog food

I'm not Paid or Sponsored by them

K-9, where you running?

I switched to Dr. Tim's food almost a year ago. The dogs love it and look great. One nice perk is that I feed about 25% less. My GSP had a hard time holding weight on other foods and also had loose stools. His stools are normal now and I actually had to drop his food even more because he put on 3-4 # too many. I am very happy feeding this food and like the fact that it is produced from high quality ingredients by someone who is more than willing to speak with pet owners about any nutrition or veterinary concern.

Dr, Tim, do you offer direct shipping by the pallet like Inukshuk does or maybe a Kennel program? . I'm ordering a bag from Petflow but if I like it, i don't wanna keep paying $1.60 per Lund.

Yes, we ship direct by the pallet all the time. Please email me direct at drtim@drtims.com and we can give pricing, etc. Thanks. If this listing of my email is inappropriate, PM me.

Dr. Tim,

Have you ever looked into getting your dog food shipped by "Do It Best"? Other brands like National use "Do It Best" and I can get it delivered here in Utah with paying shipping costs. I would love to have it available here but it's too expensive to ship and don't have enough dogs to afford a pallet.

Steve

wait a minute, i think this is what makes this forum special, the quality of people that visit this site is unbelievable from pro trainers to vets to dog food makers. do i think that dr tim stop by to get is name out there, yep. do i care, no, he asked us what we though of is food! where else today can you get info straght from the horses mouth, we all can have our opinion of is food good or bad its your opinion, why try to chase a guy away with alot knowledge if he will let us pick his brain, just my two cents

ibbowhunting wrote:wait a minute, i think this is what makes this forum special, the quality of people that visit this site is unbelievable from pro trainers to vets to dog food makers. do i think that dr tim stop by to get is name out there, yep. do i care, no, he asked us what we though of is food! where else today can you get info straght from the horses mouth, we all can have our opinion of is food good or bad its your opinion, why try to chase a guy away with alot knowledge if he will let us pick his brain, just my two cents

And who did you think was chasing anyone away?

Ezzy

ibbowhunting wrote:wait a minute, i think this is what makes this forum special, the quality of people that visit this site is unbelievable from pro trainers to vets to dog food makers. do i think that dr tim stop by to get is name out there, yep. do i care, no, he asked us what we though of is food! where else today can you get info straght from the horses mouth, we all can have our opinion of is food good or bad its your opinion, why try to chase a guy away with alot knowledge if he will let us pick his brain, just my two cents

I agree, especially in this case. Tim has been the Official Race Vet of the Iditarod 3 or 4 times and has top teams using the food. Even if they get it free or a discount, who cares, they could get it free or at a discount from anyone. Is Scott Townsend from CrossWind a GDF Member? He posted on Facebook about his success with the food at this year's Purina Endurance.

It's cool to see this thread pop back up. Over the past year I have run a ton Dr. Tim's thru various breeds of gun dogs. I'm not talking haphazard spot tests for a month or so. These are dogs that have been on Momentum formula for 6+ months, fully acclimated, and worked hard. I now understand why professional mushers realize the benefits of a high quality feed! Those sled geeks are smarter than us rednecks.

P.S. Yes, I am on Dr. Tim's Team Momentum. No, I do not receive payment or ANY discount compensation from him.

Any plans on a food without Chicken Meal or Poultry of any kind? I have a dog with a poultry sensitivity that took a year or so to track down. I've been feeding a Bison based food around the same Price Point as the Dr. Tim feeds.

Yes, actually have the formulas done. Looking at later this year but a rich uncle would be helpful.

I would love to try this food if I could get it at a reasonable price here. Do you have distributors, and if so any in GA or TN?

GB, did you look at Petflow to see if that is what you consider reasonable?
I will say this. I have been emailing several companies asking about pallet pricing, kennel programs and dealerships. Dr. Tim responded on the same day saying that someone would send me a quote the next day. Sure enough I got an email from Wendy with an extremely detailed quote including several shipping options with exact pricing. I sent an email thanking Wendy for her quick response thinking that was the conclusion. Nope, within minutes she responded thanking me for the opportunity. None of the other half dozen companies has even responded and some of them go as far back as 4 months. Dr. Tim, I hope you treat Wendy well. She seems like a good asset.

I think I did at one time and it still seemed a little high, but I will go back and look again.I am feeding what I consider to be a great food now and paying $1.25 per lb. I also buy feed for some of my other animals there and drive by the store everyday to and from work.

GB, we ship down that way in the pallet fashion. We have found that 1/2 pallet or better is cost effective with the trucking costs, you can mix formulas and the distributor is not in the mix as to a final cost so there are good savings. LTL trucing can be tough,period, but when you feed multiple dogs (I have 35) you lok for whatever can save you some dough. A more digestable food does that as well as better shipping rates.

Yes, we try to hard to have excellent customer service and Wendy is on top of it. I agree, will pass this compliment onto her and thanks.

dr tim wrote:Yes, actually have the formulas done. Looking at later this year but a rich uncle would be helpful.

Fantastic. Do you have any samples that I could try out?

As a small business owner I've been looking for a Rich Uncle for a while. I've yet to find one. May you have better luck than I in finding one and getting those feeds to the market soon.

Nice looking food. But at $70.. for 44 pounds X 3 dogs, I would be out a home and husband.

Munster wrote:Nice looking food. But at $70.. for 44 pounds X 3 dogs, I would be out a home and husband.

The formula like Pro Plan Performance, Dr. Tim's Pursuit, 30/20, is about the same price when you factor in there is no sales tax.

MonsterDad wrote:

Munster wrote:Nice looking food. But at $70.. for 44 pounds X 3 dogs, I would be out a home and husband.

The formula like Pro Plan Performance, Dr. Tim's Pursuit, 30/20, is about the same price when you factor in there is no sales tax.

Dr. Tim's is a good food but did nothing the Diamond HE didn't do and it is 3X the price to feed a dog. There is a point where the dogs would have to go and these high priced feeds are about there..

Ezzy

Diamond HE just went up $3 per bag putting it at $44 per back. That's after a 10% discount for buying it in bulk. I don't think Dr. Tims is anywhere near 3 times as much. In fact, the quote I received from them for buying the same quantity and having it shipped to me was only a few dollars per bag higher. It's nowhere even close to 2X as much let one 3X.

MonsterDad wrote:

Munster wrote:Nice looking food. But at $70.. for 44 pounds X 3 dogs, I would be out a home and husband.

The formula like Pro Plan Performance, Dr. Tim's Pursuit, 30/20, is about the same price when you factor in there is no sales tax.

No, not really. out the door I pay maybe 47.00.

Brazosvalleyvizslas wrote:Diamond HE just went up $3 per bag putting it at $44 per back. That's after a 10% discount for buying it in bulk. I don't think Dr. Tims is anywhere near 3 times as much. In fact, the quote I received from them for buying the same quantity and having it shipped to me was only a few dollars per bag higher. It's nowhere even close to 2X as much let one 3X.

How about I not telling everybody what they cost in your area and you not telling them what they cost here? I just got feed a week ago and still paid 29 and change for perbag with no volume or other discounts. &0 for a 35 pound bag is 2 a pound I think. 30 for 50 pounds is .60 a pound. Let me see, 2 divided by .6 is believe it or not 3 and a third times as much. You got me, I was wrong.

Ezzy

I was comparing it to a comparable product which would be Diamond EA not HE. Sorry if that wasn't clear but you can't compare foods based just on price without considering the energy level of the food. Heck I could feed Ol Roy if i didnt believe that higher energy foods didn't provide more energy.