Hyper dog help

DogNewbie · Post by **DogNewbie** » Thu Dec 08, 2011 3:28 pm

Hello,

So, I don't think this is related to Briar's pink eye issue, but this week, he has peed the kennel every single day. I don't think he has a UT because he doesn't pee irregularly at any other time of the day, but his kennel behavior has changed dramatically since Thanksgiving and I'm getting really frustrated. I'll start at the beginning. Pre Thanksgiving, Briar and I go for a morning exercise, I go to work and come home at noon or two (depending on if my roommate ate lunch at home or not) to let him out and he's always really sleepy and tired and just kinda wants to lounge around. He goes back in the kennel still sleepy. I get home from work and he's awake, but not hyper. Just excited to be hanging out. Over Thanksgiving, Briar spent zero time in the kennel during the day for an entire week. Since that week, Briar's behavior is all out of whack. He still gets the same morning run and still goes into the kennel sleepy, but by the time I'm home at noon he's more than awake. He's down right hyper. He tears around the house and is really upset about having to go back into his kennel. Then he started doing this whole peeing in the kennel, and I feel like a crazy person thinking this, but it almost feels like he's so hyper that he can't hold his pee in and instead of learning to mellow out and hold it, I feel like he's learned to pee on his bedding and shove it to the back of the kennel so he isn't bothered by it. The only other possible thing I can figure is maybe my roommate, when he goes home before me, is letting Briar drink a ton of water while he's in hyper mode and then he gets put back in the kennel only to discover he can't hold all that water. I'm going to ask him about that tonight, but until then, has anyone ever had a similar situation? Any advice or red flags? Thanks,

Tim

DogNewbie · Post by **DogNewbie** » Thu Dec 08, 2011 4:21 pm

Ok, so the roommate isn't giving him an excessive amount of water to drink....can anyone crack the case? Is he just being naughty or is there something wrong? He doesn't seem sick at all. No temp, acting normal, has that eye infection but it's not slowing him down. Just super hyper. I can't figure it out!

Tim

RoostersMom · Post by **RoostersMom** » Thu Dec 08, 2011 4:41 pm

Tim,

How much exercise do you give him at noon? Maybe you need to up that drastically. Also, I wouldn't rule out a UTI unless the vet rules it out for you - they can be tricky.

Can you give him a big kong with frozen stuff in it when you leave after the noon exercise session? Sounds like he's growing to me, and they can get much more active when they hit the rapidly growing stage.

GUNDOGS · Post by **GUNDOGS** » Thu Dec 08, 2011 5:06 pm

DogNewbie wrote:Hello,

So, I don't think this is related to Briar's pink eye issue, but this week, he has peed the kennel every single day. I don't think he has a UT because he doesn't pee irregularly at any other time of the day, but his kennel behavior has changed dramatically since Thanksgiving and I'm getting really frustrated. I'll start at the beginning. Pre Thanksgiving, Briar and I go for a morning exercise, I go to work and come home at noon or two (depending on if my roommate ate lunch at home or not) to let him out and he's always really sleepy and tired and just kinda wants to lounge around. He goes back in the kennel still sleepy. I get home from work and he's awake, but not hyper. Just excited to be hanging out. Over Thanksgiving, Briar spent zero time in the kennel during the day for an entire week. Since that week, Briar's behavior is all out of whack. He still gets the same morning run and still goes into the kennel sleepy, but by the time I'm home at noon he's more than awake. He's down right hyper. He tears around the house and is really upset about having to go back into his kennel. Then he started doing this whole peeing in the kennel, and I feel like a crazy person thinking this, but it almost feels like he's so hyper that he can't hold his pee in and instead of learning to mellow out and hold it, I feel like he's learned to pee on his bedding and shove it to the back of the kennel so he isn't bothered by it. The only other possible thing I can figure is maybe my roommate, when he goes home before me, is letting Briar drink a ton of water while he's in hyper mode and then he gets put back in the kennel only to discover he can't hold all that water. I'm going to ask him about that tonight, but until then, has anyone ever had a similar situation? Any advice or red flags? Thanks,

Tim

i noticed in your post you said he pees in his KENNEL..is he in a crate or kennel..if hes in a kennel then hes most likely peeing due to having too much space/room so he has no need to hold it until hes let out because he has a small area to sleep and has made an area to go pee in..what size is this KENNEL or crate??....ruth

DogNewbie · Post by **DogNewbie** » Thu Dec 08, 2011 5:10 pm

RoostersMom wrote:Tim,

How much exercise do you give him at noon? Maybe you need to up that drastically. Also, I wouldn't rule out a UTI unless the vet rules it out for you - they can be tricky.

Can you give him a big kong with frozen stuff in it when you leave after the noon exercise session? Sounds like he's growing to me, and they can get much more active when they hit the rapidly growing stage.

Well before, I couldn't even get him to play fetch...he'd just go get the ball and lay down, so I was mostly focused on just giving him as much physical attention as possible. Love him up a bunch. Usually that was for about 15mins and worked great. Now I'm still doing the 15min deal, but I'm running around taking care of his bedding that he peed on or something like that and he doesn't get as much attention as before. Maybe he need exercise more than attention right now huh?

I was just at the vet yesterday. Would they be able to find a UT fairly easily without me asking them to check for it? I'd love to not have to spend another $65 for another check up when I could have had then do it yesterday

I was giving him a Kong filled with food, but that keeps him busy for only so long. I was thinking of getting him an antler or something like that to chew on and have it only be a kennel treat. What kinda frozen things do you put in it?

Thanks for the input!

Tim

DogNewbie · Post by **DogNewbie** » Thu Dec 08, 2011 5:12 pm

GUNDOGS wrote:
DogNewbie wrote:Hello,

So, I don't think this is related to Briar's pink eye issue, but this week, he has peed the kennel every single day. I don't think he has a UT because he doesn't pee irregularly at any other time of the day, but his kennel behavior has changed dramatically since Thanksgiving and I'm getting really frustrated. I'll start at the beginning. Pre Thanksgiving, Briar and I go for a morning exercise, I go to work and come home at noon or two (depending on if my roommate ate lunch at home or not) to let him out and he's always really sleepy and tired and just kinda wants to lounge around. He goes back in the kennel still sleepy. I get home from work and he's awake, but not hyper. Just excited to be hanging out. Over Thanksgiving, Briar spent zero time in the kennel during the day for an entire week. Since that week, Briar's behavior is all out of whack. He still gets the same morning run and still goes into the kennel sleepy, but by the time I'm home at noon he's more than awake. He's down right hyper. He tears around the house and is really upset about having to go back into his kennel. Then he started doing this whole peeing in the kennel, and I feel like a crazy person thinking this, but it almost feels like he's so hyper that he can't hold his pee in and instead of learning to mellow out and hold it, I feel like he's learned to pee on his bedding and shove it to the back of the kennel so he isn't bothered by it. The only other possible thing I can figure is maybe my roommate, when he goes home before me, is letting Briar drink a ton of water while he's in hyper mode and then he gets put back in the kennel only to discover he can't hold all that water. I'm going to ask him about that tonight, but until then, has anyone ever had a similar situation? Any advice or red flags? Thanks,

Tim
i noticed in your post you said he pees in his KENNEL..is he in a crate or kennel..if hes in a kennel then hes most likely peeing due to having too much space/room so he has no need to hold it until hes let out because he has a small area to sleep and has made an area to go pee in..what size is this KENNEL or crate??....ruth

Yup sorry....Crate...he's in a correctly sized crate....if he didn't pee on the bedding and push it aside, he's be sitting in his own pee...

ultracarry · Post by **ultracarry** » Thu Dec 08, 2011 5:38 pm

How old is the dog?

Over a year old and I would have choked him out a long time ago. Put a stake out in the hard and leave him out if he wants to pee in the crate. Also when you run him are you doing it off a quad or bike. I know if mine doesnt run off a quad she doesn't get exercise. I try hard to run her into the ground when we go out and she will sleep for the entire day. When I get home shell sleep on the couch until I put her in the crate and sleep all night.

Your other choice is to take him hunting .... seriously sounds like he needs more of an outlet.

Post by **Sharon** » Thu Dec 08, 2011 6:54 pm

DogNewbie wrote: Hello,

So, I don't think this is related to Briar's pink eye issue, but this week, he has peed the kennel every single day. I don't think he has a UT because he doesn't pee irregularly at any other time of the day, but his kennel behavior has changed dramatically since Thanksgiving and I'm getting really frustrated. I'll start at the beginning. Pre Thanksgiving, Briar and I go for a morning exercise, I go to work and come home at noon or two (depending on if my roommate ate lunch at home or not) to let him out and he's always really sleepy and tired and just kinda wants to lounge around. He goes back in the kennel still sleepy. I get home from work and he's awake, but not hyper. Just excited to be hanging out. Over Thanksgiving, Briar spent zero time in the kennel during the day for an entire week. Since that week, Briar's behavior is all out of whack. He still gets the same morning run and still goes into the kennel sleepy, but by the time I'm home at noon he's more than awake. He's down right hyper. He tears around the house and is really upset about having to go back into his kennel. Then he started doing this whole peeing in the kennel, and I feel like a crazy person thinking this, but it almost feels like he's so hyper that he can't hold his pee in and instead of learning to mellow out and hold it, I feel like he's learned to pee on his bedding and shove it to the back of the kennel so he isn't bothered by it. The only other possible thing I can figure is maybe my roommate, when he goes home before me, is letting Briar drink a ton of water while he's in hyper mode and then he gets put back in the kennel only to discover he can't hold all that water. I'm going to ask him about that tonight, but until then, has anyone ever had a similar situation? Any advice or red flags? Thanks,Tim

You have a young active sporting breed.The older he gets , the more exercise he needs up to maybe 5 years of age and then it mellows some.
I've had 2 GSPs and at a point I also thought they were too hyper.

They do get hyped and want to go. He needs a 30 -45 minute run , off leash , when you get home.
Make sure the crate is not too big. Pup should only be able to stand up and turn around, otherwise, he will use the rest of the crate as a bathroom.
I never limit the water my dog can have.

The key is to tire pup out in the morning and at 2. Set the alarm to get up earlier so you can tire him out before you go to work.

birddog1968 · Post by **birddog1968** » Thu Dec 08, 2011 7:31 pm

ultracarry wrote:How old is the dog?

Over a year old and I would have choked him out a long time ago. Put a stake out in the hard and leave him out if he wants to pee in the crate.

Your other choice is to take him hunting .... seriously sounds like he needs more of an outlet.

The latest pup played the I'm going to pee my crate on purpose routine....tough love. +1 on the stake out.

wems2371 · Post by **wems2371** » Thu Dec 08, 2011 9:50 pm

DogNewbie wrote:I was just at the vet yesterday. Would they be able to find a UT fairly easily without me asking them to check for it? I'd love to not have to spend another $65 for another check up when I could have had then do it yesterday

I don't know that there's a way to know if a dog has a UTI without a pee sample. My vet has me collect it myself and just bring it in. That means following your dog around with a ladle, tupperware, or specimen cup if you can get one...to collect an ounce or two.

I think my vet charges $18 to test the sample.

RoostersMom · Post by **RoostersMom** » Thu Dec 08, 2011 9:51 pm

For the UTI, you can just bring a ziplock baggy with his pee in it, avoiding another office visit charge!

As for frozen stuff, I use low sodium chicken broth (sometimes I freeze that in a plastic container and just pop it out and give it to them), cottage cheese or a mix of yogurt and water or broth. You can freeze peanut butter in there too. Might keep him busy for a while. Do you feed him in the crate? If not, I would start doing that. More exercise sure won't hurt anything!

MikeB · Post by **MikeB** » Thu Dec 08, 2011 10:18 pm

I think this is more a scheduling problem than anything else. You and your roommate need to get on a better schedule for letting him out and his water breaks along with food. He can't tank up of water and the be put back into his crate. The size of the crate is not an issue. I have always raised my pups in a #500 model crate 40" long from 7 weeks old. None of the pups I raised ever peed in the crate because I kept changing the times they need go out to pee/poop as they grow.

I would buy anything that is sturdy for him to chew on. Black Kongs, bog heavy duty Nylabones, white sterilized bones, alter are all good for him. NO pig ears, cow hooves, rawhides, and other parts of cows or pigs.

DogNewbie · Post by **DogNewbie** » Fri Dec 09, 2011 9:17 am

Thank you all for the replies. The pup is 6 months old so he's still a little guy, but he hasn't peed in the kennel in a looong time so it seemed odd. Staking him out in the yard isn't really an option in December in Minnesota either. Last night I took him out to the yard to play and get some energy out and he ran around a bit but he was being a real drama queen about the snow and ended up just wanting to go inside...after that he pretty much slept all evening. The more I think about it, the more I feel like this is a crate issue and not an energy issue. He's normal in the mornings and evenings, it's just in the afternoon in the crate that he gets hyper. Could this be a separation anxiety? Our morning exercise consists of a 3 mile jog, no bike, but I'm sure he would have no problem keeping up with one. I live in the city so the opportunities for daily off leash runs are limited to dog parks and for some reason I really have a negative out look towards them, but if that's what he needs I'm willing to give them a try. I'd love to just hunt him everyday, but this time of year, I have about an hour of daylight before work, and I'm going home in the dark. I try to get him out on the weekends, but if it's an energy issue that will only help for one day. He recovers really fast. I think for now I'm going to try to address the issue as restlessness associated with being alone in the crate (please let me know if you really don't think this is the issue.) He usually has a kong, and nylabone and a couple squeaky toys in with him so I was thinking I need something that is more of a natural treat. Chicken broth seems like it would work well, but why is giving him a real bone or raw hide a bad idea in the crate?

GUNDOGS · Post by **GUNDOGS** » Fri Dec 09, 2011 10:54 am

DogNewbie wrote:Thank you all for the replies. The pup is 6 months old so he's still a little guy, but he hasn't peed in the kennel in a looong time so it seemed odd. Staking him out in the yard isn't really an option in December in Minnesota either. Last night I took him out to the yard to play and get some energy out and he ran around a bit but he was being a real drama queen about the snow and ended up just wanting to go inside...after that he pretty much slept all evening. The more I think about it, the more I feel like this is a crate issue and not an energy issue. He's normal in the mornings and evenings, it's just in the afternoon in the crate that he gets hyper. Could this be a separation anxiety? Our morning exercise consists of a 3 mile jog, no bike, but I'm sure he would have no problem keeping up with one. I live in the city so the opportunities for daily off leash runs are limited to dog parks and for some reason I really have a negative out look towards them, but if that's what he needs I'm willing to give them a try. I'd love to just hunt him everyday, but this time of year, I have about an hour of daylight before work, and I'm going home in the dark. I try to get him out on the weekends, but if it's an energy issue that will only help for one day. He recovers really fast. I think for now I'm going to try to address the issue as restlessness associated with being alone in the crate (please let me know if you really don't think this is the issue.) He usually has a kong, and nylabone and a couple squeaky toys in with him so I was thinking I need something that is more of a natural treat. Chicken broth seems like it would work well, but why is giving him a real bone or raw hide a bad idea in the crate?

is it you or your roommate that lets him out at lunch each day, from what i gather it varies between the 2 of you right? do you and your roommate let him out ASAP when you come home for lunch? the reason i ask is because if you arent then i would IMMEDIATELY upon coming home get him outside, maybe he hears you rattle your keys, maybe he hears your car pull up or even when you come in gets excited and as a result of holding it for a long time he pees..also if hes peeing and still smells it in the crate, on the blanket AND is not corrected by being taken outside and praised when he goes in the crate (which obviously is impossible if nobody is home) then he doesnt see what is wrong with doing it..the reason why pups learn to go outside and not in the house is because we usually are there to take them out often and if there is an accident then we are there to see it, stop it and show them the correct behavior immediatley by taking them outside and rewarding..hes not getting that so hes repeating the behavior..just to be sure theres no UTI i would have him tested for it, yes it costs but it will cost alot more if it becomes a kidney issue also if you begin to get frustrated with him and correct him when you come home after the fact and he doesnt know why you are correcting him you may end up with even more issues and definitely some confusion..as far as rawhides and bones in the crate people dont usually give them unsupervised incase they chew a piece off and choke on it....ruth

DogNewbie · Post by **DogNewbie** » Fri Dec 09, 2011 11:14 am

GUNDOGS wrote:
DogNewbie wrote:Thank you all for the replies. The pup is 6 months old so he's still a little guy, but he hasn't peed in the kennel in a looong time so it seemed odd. Staking him out in the yard isn't really an option in December in Minnesota either. Last night I took him out to the yard to play and get some energy out and he ran around a bit but he was being a real drama queen about the snow and ended up just wanting to go inside...after that he pretty much slept all evening. The more I think about it, the more I feel like this is a crate issue and not an energy issue. He's normal in the mornings and evenings, it's just in the afternoon in the crate that he gets hyper. Could this be a separation anxiety? Our morning exercise consists of a 3 mile jog, no bike, but I'm sure he would have no problem keeping up with one. I live in the city so the opportunities for daily off leash runs are limited to dog parks and for some reason I really have a negative out look towards them, but if that's what he needs I'm willing to give them a try. I'd love to just hunt him everyday, but this time of year, I have about an hour of daylight before work, and I'm going home in the dark. I try to get him out on the weekends, but if it's an energy issue that will only help for one day. He recovers really fast. I think for now I'm going to try to address the issue as restlessness associated with being alone in the crate (please let me know if you really don't think this is the issue.) He usually has a kong, and nylabone and a couple squeaky toys in with him so I was thinking I need something that is more of a natural treat. Chicken broth seems like it would work well, but why is giving him a real bone or raw hide a bad idea in the crate?

is it you or your roommate that lets him out at lunch each day, from what i gather it varies between the 2 of you right? do you and your roommate let him out ASAP when you come home for lunch? the reason i ask is because if you arent then i would IMMEDIATELY upon coming home get him outside, maybe he hears you rattle your keys, maybe he hears your car pull up or even when you come in gets excited and as a result of holding it for a long time he pees..also if hes peeing and still smells it in the crate, on the blanket AND is not corrected by being taken outside and praised when he goes in the crate (which obviously is impossible if nobody is home) then he doesnt see what is wrong with doing it..the reason why pups learn to go outside and not in the house is because we usually are there to take them out often and if there is an accident then we are there to see it, stop it and show them the correct behavior immediatley by taking them outside and rewarding..hes not getting that so hes repeating the behavior..just to be sure theres no UTI i would have him tested for it, yes it costs but it will cost alot more if it becomes a kidney issue also if you begin to get frustrated with him and correct him when you come home after the fact and he doesnt know why you are correcting him you may end up with even more issues and definitely some confusion..as far as rawhides and bones in the crate people dont usually give them unsupervised incase they chew a piece off and choke on it....ruth

On the days that my roommate eats lunch at home, he lets the pup out at noon and then I come home later in the day so that he can have two breaks. If the roommate doesn't eat at home, I come home at noon and he only gets one break. Both times he gets let out immediately, however, he is up stairs so maybe he is getting excited and peeing when he hears us coming in the house and up the stairs. I don't correct him for the issue when I get home, but I am usually frustrated and I'm sure he can sense that and is probably confused by it, but I'm not exactly directing it at him, I'm more just stomping around mad that I'm doing his laundry again and he's following behind me trying to figure out why I'm not playing with him.....I'm over it by the time I get his bedding in the wash and out of my work clothes. :roll:

GUNDOGS · Post by **GUNDOGS** » Fri Dec 09, 2011 12:08 pm

well, if it were me i would change some things to see if it helps, i would move the crate downstairs so you are closer to getting him out as soon as you get home, and he is closer to the door to go out as well, i would ask the roommate to be sure to let him out asap when he comes home as well before anything else..i remember a member on here having a similar issue and i believe it was happening due to the wife coming home really late from working and not letting the dog out to pee right away, the dog had been sleeping obviously for hours, was woken up and got excited when she came home and peed in the crate maybe this is your problem as well, im not sure if it is im just trying to help by process of elimination on what the issue may be

if moving the crate and attending to him right away dont work i would get the urine tested for peace of mind and go from there..keep posting your results and what youve changed i hope we can all help you out

..ruth

Gertie · Post by **Gertie** » Fri Dec 09, 2011 2:20 pm

Another thing you may want to think about (and maybe you have already) is how you approach the crate. If you approach the crate with that high pitched fun tone of voice and get the dog all wound up that may be part of the problem. He may be getting over stimulated and even the anticipation of all that fun is just too much. Be silent and calm when you approach, teach the dog to wait until asked to get out and then calmly walk him to where you would like him to eliminate. After that you can play and enjoy each other for a while. It takes some time to get this down but I am doing exactly what you are as far as letting the pup out to potty at noon and I've had really good luck. I also take her on field walks every chance I get in the evening and let her run off leash or at least to the park to chase a ball or something. She's a little over 4 months now and I think our system is working well. Good luck!

Post by **Sharon** » Fri Dec 09, 2011 4:11 pm

birddog1968 wrote:
ultracarry wrote:How old is the dog?

Over a year old and I would have choked him out a long time ago. Put a stake out in the hard and leave him out if he wants to pee in the crate.

Your other choice is to take him hunting .... seriously sounds like he needs more of an outlet.
The latest pup played the I'm going to pee my crate on purpose routine....tough love. +1 on the stake out.

A pup/baby has no idea what he did wrong after about 20 seconds. Unless you can correct in the moment, one is wasting their time.

Pup has no idea why he is on the stake out. He looks sad becuase he is reading your body language which looks mad. He isn't saying , " Oh , I wish I hadn't done that. I wonder how long i am going to be punished?"
They don't "pee on purpose". They don't have a human brain that can say "I'm going to get this guy."

brad27 · Post by **brad27** » Fri Dec 09, 2011 5:14 pm

They don't "pee on purpose". They don't have a human brain that can say "I'm going to get this guy."

I know a dog that does.

northUpland · Post by **northUpland** » Fri Dec 09, 2011 7:06 pm

Dog Newbie(Tim) I don't mean to offend you...but just my 2 cents....maybe you should spend WAY LESS time on this chat room asking why or why nots about Briar's hyperness and WAY MORE time running the freakin begeezes out of your great looking wirehair pup every free moment you have and getting to know how to read his true personality morning, noon, and night. Every chance you can, put that boy on birds, let him do what he was born to do. Allow him to become a natural born killer. I think you might see a difference from him to you. Then you can start training him.

birddog1968 · Post by **birddog1968** » Fri Dec 09, 2011 9:39 pm

From my dogs reactions she knows exactly what she was doing, especially when her nose went in it.

From what I can tell, she would just get herself all worked up and stay worked up until i let her out or she pee'd, she only did it when/if she was fussing in the crate. Then judging by the lack of pee in the crate I'd say whatever i did , or didn't do worked cause she don't pee her crate anymore.

Alot of times she would pee within minutes of being put in the crate, and I could hear it (whine whine stomp around then quiet) and I was there on the spot....she knew exactly what she did. I did rule out a UTI before i used any discipline.

And without actually knowing what the dog is thinking, it sure seemed like she was doing it on purpose.....it got her out of the crate right or wrong because i had to clean it.......

DonF · Post by **DonF** » Sat Dec 10, 2011 9:42 am

First of all, it sounds to me like the pup spends way to much time in the crate. Sounds like when you get home, you take him out and bring him back in to the crate. Do either of you actually see him releving himself? He might not be doing that. An mty bladder don't hold a lot of watter. Then of course you may just have a dirty dog has he messed in there yet? I had a dirty dog years ago. Long as she was out on her chain, she was fine, as in didn't mess in her house. Put her in a crate and she'd dump on you. Strange thing about it was the last couple years of her life she lived in the house and never had a problem. But, put her in a crate and she'd dump.

Be nice to know when your pup pee's. If it's just before you go to let it out, I would then guess it's just beside itself. Take it out of the crate in the house and make sure it get's out at proper times. After waking up, after eating, any time it get's resless.

ultracarry · Post by **ultracarry** » Sat Dec 10, 2011 10:29 am

brad27 wrote:
They don't "pee on purpose". They don't have a human brain that can say "I'm going to get this guy."
I know a dog that does.

I know the same dog lol. Personally the dog would be at the pearly dog gates if I owned him.

weather or not the dog knows what it did was wrong it sure will find out if I come home and find it. Just like barking. If I wake up and have to walk out, even if the dog isn't barking it will know I don't like it... don't need a human brain to figure it out they just do when you put a size 11 on their backside.

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