Vet said no to heart worm prevention?

djswizz · Post by **djswizz** » Fri Jun 16, 2006 9:12 am

I have been giving Guinness his heart worm prevention (HWP) every month (usually the first day of the month). I have not given him his HWP this month yet as he is at the trainers. I called my vet today to order some and they indicated that they will not give me HWP until he is tested. I told them that he is at the trainers and is unable to get tested before he is given any treatment. They still said no. I told them that because they said no, Guinness will NOW be at risk to get heart worm... and that the test will obviously be too late. I could not believe this... My vet told me to shop around. I like this vet, but I'm now reconsidering at different one. What options do I have?

Wagonmaster · Post by **Wagonmaster** » Fri Jun 16, 2006 9:20 am

understand that the reason the vet does not want to give you HWP until you have the test done, is that the HWP kills HW's. And if, however small the chance may be, your dog has HW, then HWP would kill adult worms which would then be sloshing around inside the circulatory system. they are quite large, mostly long. now, other people on this site have told me that does not necessarily cause harm. however, the vets i have talked to say the risk of stroke or cardiac event is very high. in other words, there is a risk, however small, that the HWP will lead to the death of your dog.

that is why your vet wants to test first. it is not to make a little money on a blood test.

djswizz · Post by **djswizz** » Fri Jun 16, 2006 9:31 am

He has been tested around 4 or 5 months. He is now 1 year 2 mos. old. How frequent do they need to be tested? I heard 2-3 years if they are given HWP on a monthly basis with no missed months.

Wagonmaster · Post by **Wagonmaster** » Fri Jun 16, 2006 9:47 am

am not a vet, but as i understand it, that depends on the area of the country you are in. in some areas, HWP is given year round, so some vets go to 2 years for testing. I am in MN, and here, we do not give HWP from Dec. 1 to May. Since there is a hiatus, and the possibility however slim for the dog to be reinfected, we test every year before HWP is started again.

it is my understanding that the microfilaria that occur in a particular dog, do not grow into adult HW in that dog, but have to be "transplanted" by a mosquito. however, clusters of infection occur, and if you happen to be in one, the chances of your dog getting "transplanted" microfilaria are quite high. it is even possible for a mosquito to bite a dog, acquire microfilaria, then go back and bite the same dog again, thus infesting that dog with the microfilaria that the dog originally hosted. these transplanted microfilaria then grow into adults in the dog.

it aint something to mess with. can't the pro just have a test done or a blood sample pulled for you?

i think there is a catalog source where you can buy without going through a vet. i might have it at home. you are running a risk though. i would just get the pooch tested.

djswizz · Post by **djswizz** » Fri Jun 16, 2006 9:59 am

Talked with the trainer today and he said I can pick him up for the weekend (I was going to go there tomorrow anyway to work with him). He'll be getting tested on Monday and given his HWP.

Thanks for the adivce wagonmaster.

GSP4619 · Post by **GSP4619** » Fri Jun 16, 2006 11:15 am

I was just reading an article in Dog World Magazine this morning on the train to work. In reference to a new protocol for fighting heartworm. I know it's not what you where saying but thought it was interesting. Their is also information on www.heartwormsociety.org.

I hope maybe the trainer can somehow get you a bloodtest for him. Keep us posted please.

GSP4619 · Post by **GSP4619** » Fri Jun 16, 2006 11:30 am

Do you need a prescription for heartworm medication? If so, why?

Heartworm preventives are “legend” drugs, which by federal law require a prescription. A doctor-patient relationship must be established before a prescription can be written. The veterinarian should assess the heartworm status of the dog before prescribing these medications. Giving heartworm preventives to dogs having heartworms can lead to severe reactions that could be harmful or even fatal to the dog.

Why do dogs need to be blood tested before starting heartworm medication?

Before starting a preventive program, all dogs that could possibly be infected with mature heartworms should be tested. Giving heartworm preventives to dogs having heartworms can lead to severe reactions that could be harmful or even fatal to the dog. Puppies under seven months of age can be started on heartworm preventives without first testing. That is because it can take up to six and one half months after being bitten by infected mosquitoes before the dog will test positive. The puppy should be tested four to seven months after starting heartworm preventive to detect any infection acquired during the first few months of life.

Just some more info

mountaindogs · Post by **mountaindogs** » Fri Jun 16, 2006 12:29 pm

GSP4619 wrote:.........
Puppies under seven months of age can be started on heartworm preventives without first testing. That is because it can take up to six and one half months after being bitten by infected mosquitoes before the dog will test positive. .........
Just some more info

I was going to bring this up...
cutting this statement out use common sense here. If you have been giving prevetative every month and missed one month or less, your heart worm test will likely be negative anyway. So your vet will test, you will get a negative test and your vet will give the med you would have given anyway. Most vets I know will allow heartgaard if only 1-3 months have been missed as the life cycle is longer than that and Ivermectin only kills the microfilaria not the adults. USUALLY it is the adult worms dying and passing through the cirulatory system that cause "stroke-like" symtoms as the will clog the arteries and block the blood flow. If the infestation is severe enough then microfillaria can cause problems too. However, I still feel that a test after 1 missed month is ridiculous! Many require this wether or not you have missed a month, because they want the proof that you have been giving the meds and don't want to take the gamble that you are lying. Frankly I feel if my vet doesn't trust me on this, then I need a vet with whom I have a better relationship. MY opinion.....

GSP4619 · Post by **GSP4619** » Fri Jun 16, 2006 12:51 pm

Here is a question what if your dog has never been on heartworm meds at all preventive or current treatment. Does the owner inquire with their vet?

Post by **kninebirddog** » Fri Jun 16, 2006 12:56 pm

Well then why don't they test a dog for heartworm before adminstering Ivermectin for mange...

It is the same stuff in heartguard..and treating mange the dog will get about a 6 month dose in a month for mange treatment...just curious

as for a cheper method of heartworm Prevention out side of some of the other things mentioned on this site..I skip the back talk and he does have cost effective methods for dealing with heartworms and other parasites ailments for a kennel full of animals...Still need to be sure what you are treating for and have some vets guidance BUT you don't always have to pay the top prices that you get charged for lots of the meds out there

http://www.beaglesunlimited.com/beagleh ... tworms.htm

mountaindogs · Post by **mountaindogs** » Fri Jun 16, 2006 1:21 pm

GSP4619 wrote:Here is a question what if your dog has never been on heartworm meds at all preventive or current treatment. Does the owner inquire with their vet?

yes, yes! If your dog is over six months, have a test done by the vet, and start the meds he reccomends. I agree with testing when it's needed, and this is one of the several instances it is. Also a side benefit to heartworm preventative is it keeps roundworms and hookworms under control to, so you don't have the additional wormings unless you have whipworms, (which are becoming pretty prevelant in our area, in which case ivermectin (hartgaard) won't do it. You'll need Interceptor or Sentinal.

mountaindogs · Post by **mountaindogs** » Fri Jun 16, 2006 1:27 pm

kninebirddog wrote:Well then why don't they test a dog for heartworm before adminstering Ivermectin for mange...

It is the same stuff in heartguard..and treating mange the dog will get about a 6 month dose in a month for mange treatment...just curious

m

They should. Probaly they didn't think of it.

Missed out on that money opportunity. If the dog has not been on heartworm prefention and is treated with ivermectin for mange (orally not topically) and the dog happenned to have a serious infestation of heart worms, it could cause problems. I would imagine, based on what I have seen our local vets do, they would treat anyway, but keep the dog in the clinic for monitoring. Often times they use ivermectin to treat, but that is an older SLOW method and complications can occcur.

dog dr · Post by **dog dr** » Fri Jun 16, 2006 4:13 pm

if a dog has just missed a month or two then I dont require a test to sell them heartworm preventitive- that is ridiculous. and yes, i always either test or make sure the dog has been on preventitive before i treat for mange. i think you need to find a vet that will work with you a little.

Post by **ezzy333** » Fri Jun 16, 2006 5:45 pm

Welcome aboard. I am sure you can add a lot of info to our little group. Also good to see another face from IL. The Utahans were about to over run us.

Ezzy

QCBirddogs · Post by **QCBirddogs** » Fri Jun 16, 2006 6:00 pm

Why didnt the trainer just give the dog a dose of Ivomec?

When I used to take in alot of trial dogs, I wouldn't take the owners pills. The dogs would be put on our Ivomec. One less thing to worry about, who gets what and when!

Phil

mountaindogs · Post by **mountaindogs** » Fri Jun 16, 2006 7:18 pm

Dog dr,

Yes welcome. Hope you help us all learn something and enjoy the forum!!

Laurie

snips · Post by **snips** » Fri Jun 16, 2006 9:25 pm

We do the same thing here Phil. It`s too cheap not to.