New Weim Pup....How do I get started?
New Weim Pup....How do I get started?
I'm new at this guys....going to attempt to train her myself. I have a 9 week old weim....I know she is very young...I am just trying to get thoughts together on when, where and what to start with to make her a fine working bird dog
Re: New Weim Pup....How do I get started?
Best advice that I can give is let the pup be a pup. Don't worry about trying to do any formal training until she is closer to a year old. Get the pup exposed to as much as possible. If you can get her on wild birds at around 6 months of age, that would be great. Find a training club near you and make some friends with experienced people and try to soak up as much as you can. Weims can mature very slowly and with the different lines they can be a little slower to take to birds. Don't get discouraged, just have fun and let the pup mature at it's own pace.
Good luck and if you have questions this is a good forum to ask, just remember to take everything with a grain of salt. Everybody (myself included) is an internet-based expert that don't have a clue what they are saying
Good luck and if you have questions this is a good forum to ask, just remember to take everything with a grain of salt. Everybody (myself included) is an internet-based expert that don't have a clue what they are saying
Re: New Weim Pup....How do I get started?
Thanks....You mentioned expose at around 6 months of age.....a lot of things i am learning contradict....but what type of exposure...just put her on birds and let whatever happen?
I am going to have wild birds near the beginning of summer....do i just put them out and let her work?
I am going to have wild birds near the beginning of summer....do i just put them out and let her work?
Re: New Weim Pup....How do I get started?
My advice would be to get her exposure on wild birds whenever possible. As long as she can't catch them, only good things can happen. Get your pup in the water as soon as it is warm enough. I'm also in the camp that it is never too early to begin simple obedience; my dogs have been pretty well along on heel, whoa, come, kennel, retrieving (although not necessarily FF) etc by the time they are 8-9 months old, and I've yet to see a down side to that. I'm not advocating that you come down hard on a young dog, but keep in mind that whatever you allow a pup to get away with, you are actually training that pup to do. That applies to jumping, barking, digging, housebreaking, staying on the floor in the truck, loading, waiting for a release command before leaving their kennel or porter, etc. It's never to early to start working those things. Ease into them now and you'll end up with a much more enjoyable, cooperative dog.
I've had a couple of Weims, and they were handfuls as pups. Very needy dogs in terms of attention and time spent with me. Very intelligent, to the point that they seemed to get bored easily, which often led to all sorts of unwanted behaviors. Nice dogs to have around once they got past two or so, but lots of work until then. I found them to be a bit slower than other breeds to develop in the field, particularly with their pointing. On the other hand, retrieving, tracking, and water work came very easy to them. Mine were also pretty intimidating watchdogs, and protective of my kids.
Have fun with your pup, but keep it steered in the right direction.
Good luck!
I've had a couple of Weims, and they were handfuls as pups. Very needy dogs in terms of attention and time spent with me. Very intelligent, to the point that they seemed to get bored easily, which often led to all sorts of unwanted behaviors. Nice dogs to have around once they got past two or so, but lots of work until then. I found them to be a bit slower than other breeds to develop in the field, particularly with their pointing. On the other hand, retrieving, tracking, and water work came very easy to them. Mine were also pretty intimidating watchdogs, and protective of my kids.
Have fun with your pup, but keep it steered in the right direction.
Good luck!
- Ditch__Parrot
- Rank: Champion
- Posts: 345
- Joined: Wed Sep 17, 2008 4:42 pm
- Location: Land Of Ahhs
Re: New Weim Pup....How do I get started?
Welcome... First off I'd say you need to go over to General Chat to say hi and of upmost importance post up a bunch of pics of your pup.
2) I'll say start now working to secure birds for training. Rather that is building a pigeon coop, finding a game-bird supplier or just finding spots with wild birds to train on.
3) This forum is a good place to find a lot of good training advice. The search button is very useful. I've probably learned more by reading other peoples questions and the answers to them than by asking my own questions by far.
Some other good resource materials I might suggest are:
Video:
Puppy Development I & II ; Rick & Ron Smith http://www.huntsmith.com/store.php#Videos
Perfect Start; Jon & Cindy Hann http://www.perfectionkennel.com/video_series.htm
Books
Wing & Shot; Robert Wehle http://www.lcsupply.com/Product/Books-a ... -Shot.html
Best Way to Train Your Gundog: The Delmar Smith Method; Bill Tarrant http://www.lcsupply.com/Product/Books-a ... h-Met.html
____________________________________________________________________________________
All of the following is just my opinions. I make no claims of being any sort of expert. This is more just how I view a few things and how I've worked with my youngest. Which so far she's turned out pretty good. On this forum you can find advice from some of the best pros in the country and much better advice than mine. This is just a little food for thought.
I tend to look at training in 3 categories.
1) Before 6 Months,
2) After 6 months,
3) After first season of hunting
I probably shouldn't put it that way because 6 months is just an arbitrary number. Maybe its 5 or maybe its 9 months but somewhere around there little pup is going to be ready for some of the higher stakes training.
A bit of break down
1)Before 6 Months,
Most important here is socialization, take the pup everywhere you can. Get it around as many other people and dogs as you can. I'm a little leary of having my pup around other dogs that I don't know, So I ammended that to as many other dogs that I know and trust as I can.
I like to take pup on lots of walks and fun runs in areas that are similar to where we will be hunting and training later on. Let pup get used to all the sights sounds and smells. Let them build their confidence in the great outdoors. With Daisy I put a long check-cord on her as soon as she was fast enough that I couldn't run her down. Just let pup drag it. Not wanting to work pup on the check-cord its just there to make it a little easier to run the pup down if they start heading towards trouble. I will note here that when Daisy was at this stage I nearly always ran Sadie (older dog)threw the ground first, clearing out any game birds. I wanted to handle the intro to gamebirds myself, later on, in a controlled manner. Most important here is to keep your mouth shut. Its not about you it about the pup. Just let them go explore and check everything out. Try to keep up. When pup starts to loose track of you lay down in the grass and let pup hunt you.
Take them swimming, get them used to the water early on.
I also like to start a little fun hallway fetch. Not too much don't over do it. Just a couple tosses each time. Using a small bumper would be a fantastic idea but whatever their favorite toy is will work. I like the using the hallway because it limits their choices. Lesson the chance of creating bad habits by things like having them take off with it. Don't take it from them right away. Just pet them up when they come your way with it. Let them hold it till they decide to drop it.
All training is just going to be the simple no pressure kind. House training if a house dog, Crate or Kennel training. I like to use the "IN" command because its multifunctional. "IN" the crate, "IN" the house, "IN" the kennel, "IN" the truck box etc... OFF... off the counter OFF the couch etc... NO... NO don't chew on the wifes shoes.. NO don't stick your head in the cat's litter box.. NO don't jump up etc... I also like to start them whoaing in front of the food dish. If you plan on using a training table later on get them up on it now so that they get used to it, feed them on the table.
2) After 6 months. ( again its just a number, as I've heard many times the dog is ready when its ready)
Here
Turn
Go
e-collar conditioning
intro to birds
intro to gun
pointing
backing
intro the heel ( I put very little emphasis on heel till after the first season, I viewed this as just an intro to it so its not a suprise later on and makes it a little easier later on)
Whoa in the yard ( again not much emphasis, just moving from in front of the food dish to the yard )
Maybe I'm missing something but I'm getting tired of typing and that seems to cover the meat of it.
Hunted her just myself until late in the season and even then it was with people I trusted not to do stupid things like unload the gun on a single bird or covey rise. Shoot bumped birds etc...
3) Afer first season....Now its on to Heel, Whoa, more pointing more backing and steady work.
And yep I plan on saving the trained retrieve until after her second season. (Gotta have something to do next offseason ) I may get impatient and do it over the summer though. Depending on how the rest of the stuff is going
OH ya
GO SLOW, RELAX, HAVE FUN
2) I'll say start now working to secure birds for training. Rather that is building a pigeon coop, finding a game-bird supplier or just finding spots with wild birds to train on.
3) This forum is a good place to find a lot of good training advice. The search button is very useful. I've probably learned more by reading other peoples questions and the answers to them than by asking my own questions by far.
Some other good resource materials I might suggest are:
Video:
Puppy Development I & II ; Rick & Ron Smith http://www.huntsmith.com/store.php#Videos
Perfect Start; Jon & Cindy Hann http://www.perfectionkennel.com/video_series.htm
Books
Wing & Shot; Robert Wehle http://www.lcsupply.com/Product/Books-a ... -Shot.html
Best Way to Train Your Gundog: The Delmar Smith Method; Bill Tarrant http://www.lcsupply.com/Product/Books-a ... h-Met.html
____________________________________________________________________________________
All of the following is just my opinions. I make no claims of being any sort of expert. This is more just how I view a few things and how I've worked with my youngest. Which so far she's turned out pretty good. On this forum you can find advice from some of the best pros in the country and much better advice than mine. This is just a little food for thought.
I tend to look at training in 3 categories.
1) Before 6 Months,
2) After 6 months,
3) After first season of hunting
I probably shouldn't put it that way because 6 months is just an arbitrary number. Maybe its 5 or maybe its 9 months but somewhere around there little pup is going to be ready for some of the higher stakes training.
A bit of break down
1)Before 6 Months,
Most important here is socialization, take the pup everywhere you can. Get it around as many other people and dogs as you can. I'm a little leary of having my pup around other dogs that I don't know, So I ammended that to as many other dogs that I know and trust as I can.
I like to take pup on lots of walks and fun runs in areas that are similar to where we will be hunting and training later on. Let pup get used to all the sights sounds and smells. Let them build their confidence in the great outdoors. With Daisy I put a long check-cord on her as soon as she was fast enough that I couldn't run her down. Just let pup drag it. Not wanting to work pup on the check-cord its just there to make it a little easier to run the pup down if they start heading towards trouble. I will note here that when Daisy was at this stage I nearly always ran Sadie (older dog)threw the ground first, clearing out any game birds. I wanted to handle the intro to gamebirds myself, later on, in a controlled manner. Most important here is to keep your mouth shut. Its not about you it about the pup. Just let them go explore and check everything out. Try to keep up. When pup starts to loose track of you lay down in the grass and let pup hunt you.
Take them swimming, get them used to the water early on.
I also like to start a little fun hallway fetch. Not too much don't over do it. Just a couple tosses each time. Using a small bumper would be a fantastic idea but whatever their favorite toy is will work. I like the using the hallway because it limits their choices. Lesson the chance of creating bad habits by things like having them take off with it. Don't take it from them right away. Just pet them up when they come your way with it. Let them hold it till they decide to drop it.
All training is just going to be the simple no pressure kind. House training if a house dog, Crate or Kennel training. I like to use the "IN" command because its multifunctional. "IN" the crate, "IN" the house, "IN" the kennel, "IN" the truck box etc... OFF... off the counter OFF the couch etc... NO... NO don't chew on the wifes shoes.. NO don't stick your head in the cat's litter box.. NO don't jump up etc... I also like to start them whoaing in front of the food dish. If you plan on using a training table later on get them up on it now so that they get used to it, feed them on the table.
2) After 6 months. ( again its just a number, as I've heard many times the dog is ready when its ready)
Here
Turn
Go
e-collar conditioning
intro to birds
intro to gun
pointing
backing
intro the heel ( I put very little emphasis on heel till after the first season, I viewed this as just an intro to it so its not a suprise later on and makes it a little easier later on)
Whoa in the yard ( again not much emphasis, just moving from in front of the food dish to the yard )
Maybe I'm missing something but I'm getting tired of typing and that seems to cover the meat of it.
Hunted her just myself until late in the season and even then it was with people I trusted not to do stupid things like unload the gun on a single bird or covey rise. Shoot bumped birds etc...
3) Afer first season....Now its on to Heel, Whoa, more pointing more backing and steady work.
And yep I plan on saving the trained retrieve until after her second season. (Gotta have something to do next offseason ) I may get impatient and do it over the summer though. Depending on how the rest of the stuff is going
OH ya
GO SLOW, RELAX, HAVE FUN
Re: New Weim Pup....How do I get started?
Thanks for the info. so far...Let me give a little more info. I am question person and love all sorts of answers. I have owned labs before and still have a 7 yr. old chocolate that loves to hunt. This is my 1st go round with a pointing dog. I chose the Weim b/c my other family members have a gsp and britt. I have always loved their disposition and looks. I knew it would be a challenge with this breed....but look forward to working through that.
She is progressing well....I'll put pics up soon in the general chat. She is now several days without an accident in the house...so potty training is going as good as expected. She loves attention from everyone, including my 2 yr. old son and lab (she's fascinated by her tail). I do have 5 acres of field to work with and let her run. retreiving is coming....she will chase down a thrown toy, not bringing it back yet though, (no biggie)
She is progressing well....I'll put pics up soon in the general chat. She is now several days without an accident in the house...so potty training is going as good as expected. She loves attention from everyone, including my 2 yr. old son and lab (she's fascinated by her tail). I do have 5 acres of field to work with and let her run. retreiving is coming....she will chase down a thrown toy, not bringing it back yet though, (no biggie)
- Ryman Gun Dog
- Rank: 5X Champion
- Posts: 1074
- Joined: Wed Feb 17, 2010 8:19 am
- Location: Endless Mountains of Pa
Re: New Weim Pup....How do I get started?
Titan,
Congrats on your new Weimar pup, I have trained and raised many Weimar dogs, especially in the lat 60's early 70's. In fact I have a new Weimar pup right now that is doing very well in the Grouse woods. I waited 30 years for the pup I wanted, finding good Weimar hunting stock in the USA has become a big problem. In fact my pup is out of Harold Bowmans imported German Dam, and a Champion German Stud, both big time hunting dogs. Depending on which line you picked from, your pup will act in different ways, make sure you understand that your Weimar dog will have a Guard instinct, many people do not understand it. Further the more you get your Weimer pup into the habitat you plan to hunt the better. You want your pup to become bold and hunt for you, not trail along beside you. Unfortunately many of the Weimar breeders are not hunting their dogs any more and they dwell on the AKC show aspects, I hope you did your investigative home work when you picked your pup and watched the Dam and Stud hunt, Weimar genetic imprints are strongly passed down, but without the proper genetic hunting imprint your dog will not hunt correctly. There is a lot to purchasing a Weimar pup especially these days. Drop me some e-mail at pine-creek@live.com if you need help as the pup grows.
RGD/Dave
Pine Creek Gretchen at 5 months, pointing a snow rousting Grouse, in the mountains of Pa.
Gretchen when she was a small pup
Gretchens father in Germany, on Grouse point
Congrats on your new Weimar pup, I have trained and raised many Weimar dogs, especially in the lat 60's early 70's. In fact I have a new Weimar pup right now that is doing very well in the Grouse woods. I waited 30 years for the pup I wanted, finding good Weimar hunting stock in the USA has become a big problem. In fact my pup is out of Harold Bowmans imported German Dam, and a Champion German Stud, both big time hunting dogs. Depending on which line you picked from, your pup will act in different ways, make sure you understand that your Weimar dog will have a Guard instinct, many people do not understand it. Further the more you get your Weimer pup into the habitat you plan to hunt the better. You want your pup to become bold and hunt for you, not trail along beside you. Unfortunately many of the Weimar breeders are not hunting their dogs any more and they dwell on the AKC show aspects, I hope you did your investigative home work when you picked your pup and watched the Dam and Stud hunt, Weimar genetic imprints are strongly passed down, but without the proper genetic hunting imprint your dog will not hunt correctly. There is a lot to purchasing a Weimar pup especially these days. Drop me some e-mail at pine-creek@live.com if you need help as the pup grows.
RGD/Dave
Pine Creek Gretchen at 5 months, pointing a snow rousting Grouse, in the mountains of Pa.
Gretchen when she was a small pup
Gretchens father in Germany, on Grouse point
- CherrystoneWeims
- Rank: 5X Champion
- Posts: 1289
- Joined: Thu Jun 28, 2007 12:22 pm
- Location: S. Carolina
Re: New Weim Pup....How do I get started?
Yout got it right! Weims are very intelligent and do get bored. A crate is a MUST with a Weim or you won't have a house left when you leave them alone.Very intelligent, to the point that they seemed to get bored easily, which often led to all sorts of unwanted behaviors. Nice dogs to have around once they got past two or so, but lots of work until then. I found them to be a bit slower than other breeds to develop in the field, particularly with their pointing. On the other hand, retrieving, tracking, and water work came very easy to them. Mine were also pretty intimidating watchdogs, and protective of my kids.
It depends upon individual dogs and the line that they come from. A line that breeds for hunting will have dogs who point earlier.
I make it a point to get my dogs on birds at 6 weeks. IMHO the earlier the better to develop good bird dogs. No pressure on them just let them get out into the field to find, point, and chase birds. I also make it a point to run my Weims with other breeds. I feel that if you only run Weims with Weims they get stuck in a rut.
I love the protective side of the breed. I travel with my dogs all over and know that they will protect me if necessary.
PM me. I probably know the breeder of your Weim.
Pam
Cherrystone Weimaraners
Breeding for Conformation and Performance
NFC/FC Cherrystone La Reine De Pearl
CH Cherystone Perl of Sagenhaft MH,SDX,NRD,VX,BROM
CH Cherrystone Gone With the Wind JH
Cherrystone Weimaraners
Breeding for Conformation and Performance
NFC/FC Cherrystone La Reine De Pearl
CH Cherystone Perl of Sagenhaft MH,SDX,NRD,VX,BROM
CH Cherrystone Gone With the Wind JH
- Ryman Gun Dog
- Rank: 5X Champion
- Posts: 1074
- Joined: Wed Feb 17, 2010 8:19 am
- Location: Endless Mountains of Pa
Re: New Weim Pup....How do I get started?
Titan,
Cherrystone is giving you good advise about the cage and housing the dog, especially when you are away from home. A fenced yard is the best way to keep your Weimar,
I do have mine trained with the Pet safe invisible fence also, however I started her as a pup to respect the fence, as my other gun dogs do. I agree further with Cheerstone when he says he runs his Weimars with other gun dog breeds, Gretchen runs with our big running Gordon Setters, she really moves. Drop me some private e-mail if you need further advise on training.
One of the reasons we have a Weimar dog is the guard instinct, she protescts the kennel and home, as my wife says its nice again, to go to bed and know the Weimar is in the house. Got to admit I like it also.
Cherrystone
Very nice Avatar picture sir
RGD/Dave
Cherrystone is giving you good advise about the cage and housing the dog, especially when you are away from home. A fenced yard is the best way to keep your Weimar,
I do have mine trained with the Pet safe invisible fence also, however I started her as a pup to respect the fence, as my other gun dogs do. I agree further with Cheerstone when he says he runs his Weimars with other gun dog breeds, Gretchen runs with our big running Gordon Setters, she really moves. Drop me some private e-mail if you need further advise on training.
One of the reasons we have a Weimar dog is the guard instinct, she protescts the kennel and home, as my wife says its nice again, to go to bed and know the Weimar is in the house. Got to admit I like it also.
Cherrystone
Very nice Avatar picture sir
RGD/Dave
Re: New Weim Pup....How do I get started?
Thanks for the info. guys. She is doing wonderful with the Crate now. She was a bear the first week with the crate, but has become very accustomed to it. We walk daily in my 4 acre field. She points random things and checks back with me quite regularly. I haven't had her on any live birds yet; however, I am hunting chukar and pheasant on Monday of next week...I am gonna try to bring some home to work her.
She is quite bold and learns extremely fast...she catches on way faster than my choc. lab did at this age. I guess my next step will be to put her on some birds in the brush...and let her play (hunt)!
She has learned her name and responds to come and sit.
She is quite bold and learns extremely fast...she catches on way faster than my choc. lab did at this age. I guess my next step will be to put her on some birds in the brush...and let her play (hunt)!
She has learned her name and responds to come and sit.
- CherrystoneWeims
- Rank: 5X Champion
- Posts: 1289
- Joined: Thu Jun 28, 2007 12:22 pm
- Location: S. Carolina
Re: New Weim Pup....How do I get started?
LOL I'm a "Ma'am"!Ryman Gun Dog wrote:Titan,
Cherrystone is giving you good advise about the cage and housing the dog, especially when you are away from home. A fenced yard is the best way to keep your Weimar,
I do have mine trained with the Pet safe invisible fence also, however I started her as a pup to respect the fence, as my other gun dogs do. I agree further with Cheerstone when he says he runs his Weimars with other gun dog breeds, Gretchen runs with our big running Gordon Setters, she really moves. Drop me some private e-mail if you need further advise on training.
One of the reasons we have a Weimar dog is the guard instinct, she protescts the kennel and home, as my wife says its nice again, to go to bed and know the Weimar is in the house. Got to admit I like it also.
Cherrystone
Very nice Avatar picture sir
RGD/Dave
My avatar is my Cherrystone Gone With the Wind JH,NSD. She has 4 pts. towards her FC and 9 pts. toward her bench CH. She placed second in the National Derby at Ardmore, OK in 2008. Her sister from the repeat breeding, Cherrystone La Reine de Pearls, followed in her footsteps in 2009 at 14 mos. old. She also will be shown.
Pam
Cherrystone Weimaraners
Breeding for Conformation and Performance
NFC/FC Cherrystone La Reine De Pearl
CH Cherystone Perl of Sagenhaft MH,SDX,NRD,VX,BROM
CH Cherrystone Gone With the Wind JH
Cherrystone Weimaraners
Breeding for Conformation and Performance
NFC/FC Cherrystone La Reine De Pearl
CH Cherystone Perl of Sagenhaft MH,SDX,NRD,VX,BROM
CH Cherrystone Gone With the Wind JH
- Ryman Gun Dog
- Rank: 5X Champion
- Posts: 1074
- Joined: Wed Feb 17, 2010 8:19 am
- Location: Endless Mountains of Pa
Re: New Weim Pup....How do I get started?
Cherrstone,
It was my fault he addressed you as a man, in his post. I sort of led him down the path of distruction, when I did so in mine. Congrats on your achievements with your Weimar dogs, our versatile dogs are exclusively trained for hunting, mostly birds and some other small game. We do not show our dogs, but due breed for conformation and instinctive hunting ability. How does your Girl handle Grouse, have you been able to get her into the woods, shoot a Grouse over her beautiful point, and have her retrieve to hand. Rest assured I will address you as a lady from this point forward.
RGD/Dave
It was my fault he addressed you as a man, in his post. I sort of led him down the path of distruction, when I did so in mine. Congrats on your achievements with your Weimar dogs, our versatile dogs are exclusively trained for hunting, mostly birds and some other small game. We do not show our dogs, but due breed for conformation and instinctive hunting ability. How does your Girl handle Grouse, have you been able to get her into the woods, shoot a Grouse over her beautiful point, and have her retrieve to hand. Rest assured I will address you as a lady from this point forward.
RGD/Dave
- ymepointer
- Rank: 4X Champion
- Posts: 611
- Joined: Sat Jun 07, 2008 1:21 pm
- Location: The Pacific Northwest
Re: New Weim Pup....How do I get started?
Here is a place where a few hunting oriented weim owners discuss hunting weims. There are not many bred to hunt in the US anymore.
http://www.versatileweimforum.touchston ... aners.com/
http://www.versatileweimforum.touchston ... aners.com/
- CherrystoneWeims
- Rank: 5X Champion
- Posts: 1289
- Joined: Thu Jun 28, 2007 12:22 pm
- Location: S. Carolina
Re: New Weim Pup....How do I get started?
Dave, no problem!Cherrstone,
It was my fault he addressed you as a man, in his post. I sort of led him down the path of distruction, when I did so in mine. Congrats on your achievements with your Weimar dogs, our versatile dogs are exclusively trained for hunting, mostly birds and some other small game. We do not show our dogs, but due breed for conformation and instinctive hunting ability. How does your Girl handle Grouse, have you been able to get her into the woods, shoot a Grouse over her beautiful point, and have her retrieve to hand. Rest assured I will address you as a lady from this point forward.
RGD/Dave
Cherrystone Gone With the Wind has been on wild quail, woodcock, and sharptails. I had her running on wild quail and woodcock by 6 mos. of age. Right now she's getting polished for running in broke dogs stakes.
Her sister was started the same way and is also in the process of being steadied.
Both have had lots of wild bird exposure as young bitches. The 13 week old litter that I have right now is getting the same experience. One of the boys is going to stay for a while at a local plantation so that he can run with the pointers who are the same age and get even more wild bird exposure.
Pam
Cherrystone Weimaraners
Breeding for Conformation and Performance
NFC/FC Cherrystone La Reine De Pearl
CH Cherystone Perl of Sagenhaft MH,SDX,NRD,VX,BROM
CH Cherrystone Gone With the Wind JH
Cherrystone Weimaraners
Breeding for Conformation and Performance
NFC/FC Cherrystone La Reine De Pearl
CH Cherystone Perl of Sagenhaft MH,SDX,NRD,VX,BROM
CH Cherrystone Gone With the Wind JH
- Ryman Gun Dog
- Rank: 5X Champion
- Posts: 1074
- Joined: Wed Feb 17, 2010 8:19 am
- Location: Endless Mountains of Pa
Re: New Weim Pup....How do I get started?
Ymepointer,
Thank you sir very much for the Weimar sight, I will check it out.
RGD/Dave
Thank you sir very much for the Weimar sight, I will check it out.
RGD/Dave
- Ryman Gun Dog
- Rank: 5X Champion
- Posts: 1074
- Joined: Wed Feb 17, 2010 8:19 am
- Location: Endless Mountains of Pa
Re: New Weim Pup....How do I get started?
Cherrystone,
Some day you will have to pay us a visit here in Potter/ Tioga, Pa and see what your Weimars do with our spooky Grouse, would love to see your girls work the Grouse woods. Glad you hunt a lot of wild Quail however, when I was in the military my old male Weimar hunted them often on Ft Hood, Texas. Had a fantastic time hunting him on Merns Quail, around Ft Huachuca, Az also. Thanks for all the work you do with your Weimar Breeding program!
RGD/Dave
My Buddy Harold doing a little bonding
Some day you will have to pay us a visit here in Potter/ Tioga, Pa and see what your Weimars do with our spooky Grouse, would love to see your girls work the Grouse woods. Glad you hunt a lot of wild Quail however, when I was in the military my old male Weimar hunted them often on Ft Hood, Texas. Had a fantastic time hunting him on Merns Quail, around Ft Huachuca, Az also. Thanks for all the work you do with your Weimar Breeding program!
RGD/Dave
My Buddy Harold doing a little bonding
- ymepointer
- Rank: 4X Champion
- Posts: 611
- Joined: Sat Jun 07, 2008 1:21 pm
- Location: The Pacific Northwest
Re: New Weim Pup....How do I get started?
Your welcome Ryman,
I hope you find it informative. Tell us a little more about that German weim? I understand that they only breed them to hunt over in Germany and that they are real proficient after the shot on Ducks. How does she point and how is her range? Did you have any trouble with her runnin deer or other fur?
I hope you find it informative. Tell us a little more about that German weim? I understand that they only breed them to hunt over in Germany and that they are real proficient after the shot on Ducks. How does she point and how is her range? Did you have any trouble with her runnin deer or other fur?
- Ryman Gun Dog
- Rank: 5X Champion
- Posts: 1074
- Joined: Wed Feb 17, 2010 8:19 am
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Re: New Weim Pup....How do I get started?
ymepointer,
The Weimar pup we now have is very young, so we don't know exactly her abilities as of this point.
I can however tell you about Samual J. Coop, our old Champion Weimar. He was a German Weimar brought in to the USA thru the old Kennel in south Texas, and he was the very best hunting dog I ever owned, and I have owned quite a few of many different breeds. Sam won several open gun dog shoot to retrieve trails at Ft Hood Texas, in the late 60's early 70's. Was a registered retriever and hunted Grouse on a level few dogs ever achieve. He did not run Deer unless commanded to, he hunted Turkey and retrieved Ducks, no matter where they fell. He was a world class versatile
Weimar dog, with GVP points above 325. He was also my deaf daughters, hearing/guard dog and her constant companion. From what I understand a breeder out west has based his Weimar hunting dog line, on one of Sams Great Grand sons, who is named Mad Man Sam. I understand he gets about $1,200.00 for each of his pups. I believe he uses his Weinar line to hunt mostly wild Pheasant.
So far the Weimar forum adminstartor has not signed me into his forum, I am waiting for him to do so, to see what his forum is all about.
RGD/Dave
Sam & Greta, the Blue Weimar female Sam won as part of his 1st prize in the early 70's at Ft Hoot, Texas.
The Weimar pup we now have is very young, so we don't know exactly her abilities as of this point.
I can however tell you about Samual J. Coop, our old Champion Weimar. He was a German Weimar brought in to the USA thru the old Kennel in south Texas, and he was the very best hunting dog I ever owned, and I have owned quite a few of many different breeds. Sam won several open gun dog shoot to retrieve trails at Ft Hood Texas, in the late 60's early 70's. Was a registered retriever and hunted Grouse on a level few dogs ever achieve. He did not run Deer unless commanded to, he hunted Turkey and retrieved Ducks, no matter where they fell. He was a world class versatile
Weimar dog, with GVP points above 325. He was also my deaf daughters, hearing/guard dog and her constant companion. From what I understand a breeder out west has based his Weimar hunting dog line, on one of Sams Great Grand sons, who is named Mad Man Sam. I understand he gets about $1,200.00 for each of his pups. I believe he uses his Weinar line to hunt mostly wild Pheasant.
So far the Weimar forum adminstartor has not signed me into his forum, I am waiting for him to do so, to see what his forum is all about.
RGD/Dave
Sam & Greta, the Blue Weimar female Sam won as part of his 1st prize in the early 70's at Ft Hoot, Texas.
- ymepointer
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Re: New Weim Pup....How do I get started?
Sounds like a real natural. Wish I could of seen him. I read a book by Michael Seminatore, a famous bird dog trainer years ago(There is an award in his honor given out on the Grouse circuit each year I believe) and he talked about how he trained just over 2500 dogs in his career (IMMSM)and only had a few "Naturals" as he called them dogs that did it right without any real rigerous training. I was suprirsed that he listed a weim as one of those dogs. Hope this new one turns out to be a Natural!
Here is a link to the Seminatore award page....he was the founder of the Chief Setter line.
http://www.setterawards.com/michaelasem ... gaward.htm
Did I read that you also have a red setter on your string? How is that dog on grouse, I have thought about getting a red setter from Roger boser but have not got a space in my kennel for one yet but perhaps my next one will be red.
Here is a link to the Seminatore award page....he was the founder of the Chief Setter line.
http://www.setterawards.com/michaelasem ... gaward.htm
Did I read that you also have a red setter on your string? How is that dog on grouse, I have thought about getting a red setter from Roger boser but have not got a space in my kennel for one yet but perhaps my next one will be red.
- Ryman Gun Dog
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Re: New Weim Pup....How do I get started?
ymepointer,
I do have an Irish/Red Setter from Deb Fazenbaker line in Ohio, his name is Pine Creek Rory, he is just turning 12 months, and is going to be a very good Grouse dog, as far as his filed work is concerned, he has naturally pointed some real spooky Grouse, even at a very young age. However he has some problems, he was nippy with both children and other dogs until I streightened him out, he is very high stung and barks at everything including the wind, he has a testicle that did not drop, and he is not really fitting into my home Grouse dog kennel, bullies my male Gordon all the time when they are together. I can not let him around my Small Munsterlander Stud dog Sampson, Sampson would kill him because Rory constantly wants to be top dog and the SM does not play games, he has the real SM Guard instincts. He is not the dog I was led to believe, he would be, I took a chance and so far it is both good and bad. I demand a lot from my Grouse dogs, and Rory is not the quality dog I thought he would be.
RGD/Dave
Rory pointing a Grouse behind a downed tree at a very young age
On Grouse point in transition cover
I do have an Irish/Red Setter from Deb Fazenbaker line in Ohio, his name is Pine Creek Rory, he is just turning 12 months, and is going to be a very good Grouse dog, as far as his filed work is concerned, he has naturally pointed some real spooky Grouse, even at a very young age. However he has some problems, he was nippy with both children and other dogs until I streightened him out, he is very high stung and barks at everything including the wind, he has a testicle that did not drop, and he is not really fitting into my home Grouse dog kennel, bullies my male Gordon all the time when they are together. I can not let him around my Small Munsterlander Stud dog Sampson, Sampson would kill him because Rory constantly wants to be top dog and the SM does not play games, he has the real SM Guard instincts. He is not the dog I was led to believe, he would be, I took a chance and so far it is both good and bad. I demand a lot from my Grouse dogs, and Rory is not the quality dog I thought he would be.
RGD/Dave
Rory pointing a Grouse behind a downed tree at a very young age
On Grouse point in transition cover
Last edited by Ryman Gun Dog on Thu Mar 18, 2010 12:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
- ymepointer
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Re: New Weim Pup....How do I get started?
I am glad you told me that, I will have to carefully review my thoughts on a red dog. I think Allen and Deb have some Bozer stuff in there line, almost sure of it. I have heard the reds are having some issues with the small genepool. Like those Weimys, finding a good one is pretty tough. I probably will just get another pointer. That Red dog does look good on his birds though!
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Re: New Weim Pup....How do I get started?
I grew up with some irish red setters as a kid, most of them came from the east coast as started grouse dogs. they are beautiful dogs but it seemed like once in a while (more often than most) we would get a dog aggressive irish red (course having some irish blood ive got an aggresive streak myself ), but i will say that there are few things i ilike to see more than a red dog on point. too bad its so hard to find field bred irish setters in my area.
jim
jim
A limit on the strap is nice, but the kill has nothing to do with tradition.
- Ryman Gun Dog
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Re: New Weim Pup....How do I get started?
J&R,
In Rorys defense, he is still very young we will see what happens as he starts to mature, already he shows great promise in the Grouse woods, he may turn into a very good Grouse dog as he matures. I only gave you the negative side, so you would understand, its no bed of roses with him so far.
RGD/Dave
In Rorys defense, he is still very young we will see what happens as he starts to mature, already he shows great promise in the Grouse woods, he may turn into a very good Grouse dog as he matures. I only gave you the negative side, so you would understand, its no bed of roses with him so far.
RGD/Dave
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Re: New Weim Pup....How do I get started?
Ryman Gun Dog,Rory pointing a Grouse behind a downed tree at a very young age
On Grouse point in transition cover
I am curious I have hunted your so called spooky grouse in PA and many other states and have never found grouse in open cover such as the cover shown in the pics above. Let along having a pup handle these so called spooky bireds that close away. Who are you trying to full here? Dog appears to be pointing yes but it surely isn't a grouse.
Miss Bella
- Ryman Gun Dog
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Re: New Weim Pup....How do I get started?
Miss B,
Your are not curious, you are a game player, the cover is thicker than it looks, can't help what you have or have not seen before. Lots of Grouse have been killed in that particular covert, in Westmoreland county.
RGD/Dave
Your are not curious, you are a game player, the cover is thicker than it looks, can't help what you have or have not seen before. Lots of Grouse have been killed in that particular covert, in Westmoreland county.
RGD/Dave
Re: New Weim Pup....How do I get started?
Alright....Charlee saw her first bird at 12 weeks. Put her on a clipped wing Bobwhite in the wide open yard. She stood and watched for a moment, pointed very briefly...then the bird took off, she was very curious for about 2-3 minutes. The quail disappeared into some cover, helped her find it, when she did, she pointed and chased into some more cover.....the quail was way to fast for her at this point.
Keep doing this? Change tactics? Normal response for first bird?
Keep doing this? Change tactics? Normal response for first bird?
- birddogger
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Re: New Weim Pup....How do I get started?
"My advice would be to get her exposure on wild birds whenever possible. As long as she can't catch them, only good things can happen. Get your pup in the water as soon as it is warm enough. I'm also in the camp that it is never too early to begin simple obedience; my dogs have been pretty well along on heel, whoa, come, kennel, retrieving (although not necessarily FF) etc by the time they are 8-9 months old, and I've yet to see a down side to that. I'm not advocating that you come down hard on a young dog, but keep in mind that whatever you allow a pup to get away with, you are actually training that pup to do. That applies to jumping, barking, digging, housebreaking, staying on the floor in the truck, loading, waiting for a release command before leaving their kennel or porter, etc. It's never to early to start working those things. Ease into them now and you'll end up with a much more enjoyable, cooperative dog."
IMO, this is the best advice on this thread, and it goes for any breed.
Charlie
IMO, this is the best advice on this thread, and it goes for any breed.
Charlie
If you think you can or if you think you can't, you are right either way
Re: New Weim Pup....How do I get started?
I don't have access to wild birds....literally no quail in area....she is gonna be hunting birds that we raise and plant 95% of her life....if i put her on grouse we may only get on 1 to 2 birds a day. Here in Shenandoah Valley, VA, if the coyotes and foxes don't get 'em, the hawks and owls do. My best chance for bird exposure is to raise them myself and put her on them.
All of my training is gonna have to be based upon this reality. I agree that it is sound advice.....and I do want to put her on as many birds as possible....she is still young, I just want to foster a development of bird drive and excitement for now.
Charlee is doing well with simple obedience. Whoa has been started with the kennel, food, coming inside. She is doing real well with Come/Here. What has been neat to observe is her actual desire to please. Also, went fishing for trout the other day in a pond, she ran around, in and out of the feeder stream, and was very curious about the fish...she would go front leg deep checking them out.
All of my training is gonna have to be based upon this reality. I agree that it is sound advice.....and I do want to put her on as many birds as possible....she is still young, I just want to foster a development of bird drive and excitement for now.
Charlee is doing well with simple obedience. Whoa has been started with the kennel, food, coming inside. She is doing real well with Come/Here. What has been neat to observe is her actual desire to please. Also, went fishing for trout the other day in a pond, she ran around, in and out of the feeder stream, and was very curious about the fish...she would go front leg deep checking them out.
- Ruffshooter
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Re: New Weim Pup....How do I get started?
Miss Bella:
Grouse will post up most anywhere.
I have even had them on the field with clover.
Ever see them in an apple orchard?
Ever see them drumming, ususally just the type of woods and cover in Dave photo. In fact they will even drum in the fall.
Many times they will sit on the sunny side of a log. I have had a dog go bounding over a blow dow to only go on point in mid air because they went over a grouse. He crashed the bird left and I missed.
The highest density of grouse will be in the thicker younger cover such as cuttings and old orchards, alders, poplars etc. but many of the older grouse that make it will turn to be "old growth grouse," Those areas are tougher to hunt with success. They still have edges and cover.
I like the looks of the German dogs in the photos.
Grouse will post up most anywhere.
I have even had them on the field with clover.
Ever see them in an apple orchard?
Ever see them drumming, ususally just the type of woods and cover in Dave photo. In fact they will even drum in the fall.
Many times they will sit on the sunny side of a log. I have had a dog go bounding over a blow dow to only go on point in mid air because they went over a grouse. He crashed the bird left and I missed.
The highest density of grouse will be in the thicker younger cover such as cuttings and old orchards, alders, poplars etc. but many of the older grouse that make it will turn to be "old growth grouse," Those areas are tougher to hunt with success. They still have edges and cover.
I like the looks of the German dogs in the photos.
The best part of training is seeing the light come on in your little prot'eg'e.
Rick
Rick
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Re: New Weim Pup....How do I get started?
No need for defense man. just stating my past experience. ive got nothing bad to say about any of the irish setters we had when i was a kid or of your beautiful dog. my comments were more tongue in cheek hard to convey through a lap top. I truely hope ur boy turns into a great grouse dog. looks to be off to a good start.Ryman Gun Dog wrote:J&R,
In Rorys defense, he is still very young we will see what happens as he starts to mature, already he shows great promise in the Grouse woods, he may turn into a very good Grouse dog as he matures. I only gave you the negative side, so you would understand, its no bed of roses with him so far.
RGD/Dave
jim
irish setters (red dogs) will always hold a special place in my heart
A limit on the strap is nice, but the kill has nothing to do with tradition.
Re: New Weim Pup....How do I get started?
I couldn't agree more. I've got four weim pups right now, 3 months old. Every morning I kick 'em out of the kennel and let them have run of the farm for the day. They are learning on their own by chasing ducks in the pond, pointing quail (turtles, bugs, wind blown paper, etc). At her age, your puppy will likely want to hang right with you, especially since she doesn't have another pup to explore with. If that's the case, take a chair and a book in the field and plant yourself. Soon, she'll get bored with being ignored and go wandering on her own. Other than that, house breaking and basic manners are all she needs at this age. Good luck with your pup!Ryman Gun Dog wrote:Further the more you get your Weimer pup into the habitat you plan to hunt the better. You want your pup to become bold and hunt for you, not trail along beside you.
Aline
http://zzfarms.com
Georgia Quail Hunting--"Our farm, your dog"