When to Force retrieve
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When to Force retrieve
Any advice on when to train my Brittany to force retrieve?
- birddog1968
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Re: When to Force retrieve
At least after the first full season, is MHO....
The second kick from a mule is of very little educational value - from Wing and Shot.
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Hunters Branch Jalapeno
Hunters Pale Rider
Hunters Branch Jalapeno
- bumper52
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Re: When to Force retrieve
For retrievers, such as I have, it's when they have their adult teeth in and have completed basic obedience. I personally collar condition to "here", as well, before beginning ff. Generally, at 7-9 months is a general time frame.
Re: When to Force retrieve
Not trying to high jack thread thought I would just add to the topic. thanks!I have a 4 mo. old I'm going to FF... eventually... & I was just messing with the ear pinch to see where & how sensitive he was. Well he must have a high pain tolerance or I'm doing it wrong because it don't bother/hurt him one bit... Any advice?
More Geese Please...
- birddog1968
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Re: When to Force retrieve
I wouldn't mess with the ear pinch too much as a test. There is the whole hold process to go thru,
Take some time and do as much research as you can on the subject.
The pinch shouldn't be like inflicting pain for the sake of seeing the dog hurt, better to think of it as applying
pressure to get the reaction your looking for after the dog knows hold and your holding this bumper in front of my face 2+2=4.......
If the dog is squalling, jumping around or ducking his head showing pain , and you haven't done the front end leg work, whats the dog to think?
The test to see pain could bite ya when you go to do the real FF.....I had one recently who's toe and ear had been worn out by someone trying to
FORCE the dog.....had to use the e collar on that dog and got him done and he never so much as squeeked or whined....best to have a calm patient hand
and be as educated on the process and how you need to hold yourself (temperment wise) and you may enjoy the process. I do.
Another Delmarizim- if the dog is jumping around squallin or dodging and ducking pain, you missed your chance to make the proper association. (or something like that)
Take some time and do as much research as you can on the subject.
The pinch shouldn't be like inflicting pain for the sake of seeing the dog hurt, better to think of it as applying
pressure to get the reaction your looking for after the dog knows hold and your holding this bumper in front of my face 2+2=4.......
If the dog is squalling, jumping around or ducking his head showing pain , and you haven't done the front end leg work, whats the dog to think?
The test to see pain could bite ya when you go to do the real FF.....I had one recently who's toe and ear had been worn out by someone trying to
FORCE the dog.....had to use the e collar on that dog and got him done and he never so much as squeeked or whined....best to have a calm patient hand
and be as educated on the process and how you need to hold yourself (temperment wise) and you may enjoy the process. I do.
Another Delmarizim- if the dog is jumping around squallin or dodging and ducking pain, you missed your chance to make the proper association. (or something like that)
The second kick from a mule is of very little educational value - from Wing and Shot.
Hunters Pale Rider
Hunters Branch Jalapeno
Hunters Pale Rider
Hunters Branch Jalapeno
When to Force retrieve
Birddog, is there a specific method you use for hold training? I'm in the process of studying up. Thanks
- birddog1968
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Re: When to Force retrieve
I like to use a table personally, gets the dog up eye level with me and i think the dog focuses a little better (for me) up off the ground.
this isn't the most professional video but this is how i start....once they will hold your hand its a quick transition to holding a buck. Some like to use paint rollers.
I've always used hardwood bucks. I also make sure the dogs lips aren't between the buck/hand and teeth. Nice calm praise is good too, you want the dog to be calm
and believe your on his side.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nRyoEnmfhx0
This one he kinda speeds thru hold, but you get the idea, it may take two days to get a nice clean hold could take a week. I have also worked on hold sitting on the couch in the evenings, but I like to finish hold on the table or wherever im going to force the dog.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=agls4vkU ... re=related
this isn't the most professional video but this is how i start....once they will hold your hand its a quick transition to holding a buck. Some like to use paint rollers.
I've always used hardwood bucks. I also make sure the dogs lips aren't between the buck/hand and teeth. Nice calm praise is good too, you want the dog to be calm
and believe your on his side.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nRyoEnmfhx0
This one he kinda speeds thru hold, but you get the idea, it may take two days to get a nice clean hold could take a week. I have also worked on hold sitting on the couch in the evenings, but I like to finish hold on the table or wherever im going to force the dog.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=agls4vkU ... re=related
The second kick from a mule is of very little educational value - from Wing and Shot.
Hunters Pale Rider
Hunters Branch Jalapeno
Hunters Pale Rider
Hunters Branch Jalapeno
Re: When to Force retrieve
I personally wouldn"t waste my time unless I was confident the dog had the "other right tools" to make the grade. I would take em hunting for the first year.
Re: When to Force retrieve
Good idea myerstenn. I always wait till the dog is about three years old. This allows the dog to go through the breaking process and have a couple of good seasons under its belt. FF is the last thing I do with the dog.myerstenn wrote:I personally wouldn"t waste my time unless I was confident the dog had the "other right tools" to make the grade. I would take em hunting for the first year.
Chris E. Kroll
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CEK Kennels
http://www.cekkennels.com
785-288-0461
Governments govern best when governments governs least
-Thomas Paine
- birddog1968
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Re: When to Force retrieve
Agreed ! among the last things to teach on a pointing dog for me......
Retrievers are another story .....
Retrievers are another story .....
The second kick from a mule is of very little educational value - from Wing and Shot.
Hunters Pale Rider
Hunters Branch Jalapeno
Hunters Pale Rider
Hunters Branch Jalapeno
Re: When to Force retrieve
Yes, STOP! It's far too soon to pinch that little pup's ear, or really to use much pressure at all. There are solid puppy programs available to follow, and that is what I recommend doing - starting right now.FOWLMAN wrote:Not trying to high jack thread thought I would just add to the topic. thanks!I have a 4 mo. old I'm going to FF... eventually... & I was just messing with the ear pinch to see where & how sensitive he was. Well he must have a high pain tolerance or I'm doing it wrong because it don't bother/hurt him one bit... Any advice?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bywrx4O9FeY&feature=plcp
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yVbFKGrS5DE&feature=plcp
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vtFGWtp-hPs&feature=plcp
And much, much more!
THE SMARTWORK PUPPY PROGRAM DVD
EvanG
“Not all of us can do great things. But we can do small things with great love.”
― Mother Teresa
There is little reason to expect a dog to be more precise than you are.-- Rex Carr
The Smartwork System for Retriever Training (link)
Official Evan Graham Retriever Training Forum
― Mother Teresa
There is little reason to expect a dog to be more precise than you are.-- Rex Carr
The Smartwork System for Retriever Training (link)
Official Evan Graham Retriever Training Forum
Re: When to Force retrieve
Thanks for all the input & Video links that helped fill in a lot blanks...For the Record... the last thing I want to do is mistreat my dog in any way shape or form. I guess what I was trying to do is to see if I could get any reaction out of him, which I did not & yes I admit that was a Rookie mistake. I do have the Dokken Retriever book so I'm following that program and so far it's going very smooth. Thanks again!
More Geese Please...
Re: When to Force retrieve
When the time comes to force fetch, especially the 'fetch' portion, which comes after 'hold', remember the point of force is not to make the dog cry out in pain, or to overwhelm him with pressure. It is to condition him to pressure, and that usually requires very little actual pressure.FOWLMAN wrote:I guess what I was trying to do is to see if I could get any reaction out of him, which I did not & yes I admit that was a Rookie mistake. Thanks again!
EvanG
“Not all of us can do great things. But we can do small things with great love.”
― Mother Teresa
There is little reason to expect a dog to be more precise than you are.-- Rex Carr
The Smartwork System for Retriever Training (link)
Official Evan Graham Retriever Training Forum
― Mother Teresa
There is little reason to expect a dog to be more precise than you are.-- Rex Carr
The Smartwork System for Retriever Training (link)
Official Evan Graham Retriever Training Forum