How do you teach the gun?

Double Shot Banks · Post by **Double Shot Banks** » Thu Dec 20, 2012 8:00 pm

Hello,
I was wondering how you guys teach your dog to ignore the gun, a while back i threw a few bumpers and shot a pistol (.22) and he still got the bumper, but he was a little nervous so i didnt do this much, what do you suggest?

birddog1968 · Post by **birddog1968** » Thu Dec 20, 2012 8:18 pm

How old was the dog?

I use birds and blank crimps when the pup appears ready and when he's in full chase of a bird. 22 rifles and pistols have too much crack to them, I believe.

4dabirds · Post by **4dabirds** » Thu Dec 20, 2012 9:01 pm

Intro to the gun if done properly is a subliminal message to the dog. As the dog catches a bird a blank is fired at a distance far enough so the dog does not acknowledge it. While the dog does not acknowledge it he hears it and associates the sound with catching his prey. This association is important . It is what keeps the dog from becoming gun shy. Without the gun bird association gun shots that startle the dog later in life are subject to give the dog a negative association with birds. http://www.georgehickox.com/about_georg ... x_dvd.html The pointing dog video collection has an easy to follow representation of how to do this.

Wildweeds · Post by **Wildweeds** » Fri Dec 21, 2012 1:25 am

I myself use clipwing pigeons a helper positioned 50 yards away and a .410 shotgun using live rounds,don't shoot over the dog but rather the muzzle aimed 180 degrees away from the travel of the bird and the dog.Use multiple presentations and move gun closer and closer.I've always ended up with bird crazy nuts at the sight of a gun.

Post by **ezzy333** » Fri Dec 21, 2012 9:05 am

I start them young when out in a field and hey are chasing "bleep" birds or whaqtever and are 40 yds or so away, I shoot my 20 or 12 guage in the opposite direction from where they are. Do this a couple of times and when there is no reaction then start shooting when they are closer. I can usually have a pup comfortable with the gun in a couple of trips and then I start shooting birds so they can see the bird fall and go to retrieve. I have never had a pup that didn't respond well doing it this way. It doesn't take but a few trips till they are excited everytime they hear a gun shot and it is often hard to keep them from going to where they heard it.

Ezzy

DonF · Post by **DonF** » Fri Dec 21, 2012 9:49 am

I use a 22 rifle. I hold the muzzle a couple inches off the ground. While we are out happy timing, when the pup is engrossed in something, anything, I shoot a round in to the ground. If I do it again that day depends on the pups reaction. It bothers him, I just keep on walking like nothing happened. It doesn't I'll do a couple more about 15 min apart. Once I get thru that, then I'll do it on a bird. Most dogs are made gun shy by owners. If I happen to get one that's timid to a fault, I might not get it there. So I sure don't want the pup to associate the shot with the bird. I've only ever had one dog like that, lab a long time ago. Gave her away and got another.

Anyway told here will work so long as you don't scare the poo out of the pup. When Squirt and Bodie were about 8 wks old, I was picking up Bodie, there were some people shooting clay pigeons a couple hundred yds off. I had both on a 10' check cord and walked slowly toward the noise keeping a close eye on them along the way. When a shot was fired I stopped and watched their reaction. Any negative reaction at all and I would have walked away. Didn't take long to figure out they had no fear at all!

Duke was a different story. He came a bit shy but I used the 22 rifle as above and he got over it. You hold the 22 muzzle a couple inches off the ground and it muffles the shot. As you progress start lifting the muzzle farther.

Post by **jcbuttry8** » Fri Dec 21, 2012 10:18 am

birddog1968 wrote:How old was the dog?

I use birds and blank crimps when the pup appears ready and when he's in full chase of a bird. 22 rifles and pistols have too much crack to them, I believe.

+1.

I use the blank pistol when in full chase. Haven't had one yet give it a second thought. After a few trips, when the gun is fired the pup stops and looks around for the bird. I think it's all about association. I have seen a few dogs that were shot around a few times but regressed on hunts due to other hunters shooting a lot at birds that the dog didn't see and seemed to shy up a bit. I would make sure the pup is well acclimated before to many shooters around the dog.

Joe

vartz04 · Post by **vartz04** » Fri Dec 21, 2012 10:24 am

jcbuttry8 wrote:
I use the blank pistol when in full chase. Haven't had one yet give it a second thought. After a few trips, when the gun is fired the pup stops and looks around for the bird. I think it's all about association. I have seen a few dogs that were shot around a few times but regressed on hunts due to other hunters shooting a lot at birds that the dog didn't see and seemed to shy up a bit. I would make sure the pup is well acclimated before to many shooters around the dog.

Joe

I started to get a little worried about this the last time I was out. There are a lot of hunters that need to spend some time shooting clays or quit taking multiple pot shots on a bird that is too far away. If more than 2 shots go off when a bird is flushed the hunters are doing something wrong.

sdsujacks · Post by **sdsujacks** » Fri Dec 21, 2012 10:34 am

I bought a .22 blank off of Gun Dog Supply for somewhere around $30, and $20 for 200 rounds. The gun works great, especially for its price, def. worth the investment to try to avoid gunshyness. I started off throwing the dummy and a partner at 50 yards out shooting the quieter blanks when I threw. Moved in 10 yards at a time, saw nothing out of the ordinary from the dog. Stopped there, waited a day, then repeated the process with the louder blanks. Stopped there, waited a day, then repeated the process with a 12 gauge. As long as they don't act weird at any point then keep progressing, if they notice the sound, stop, look scared, etc., then take a break and repeat at step 1. Eventually I got to the point that during our trips out to "explore for birds" I would throw the dummy every now and then and shoot, sometimes I would take multiple shots. The .22 blank worked great, I was able to shoot over him about 150+ times for a relatively cheap price and safe environment.

4dabirds · Post by **4dabirds** » Fri Dec 21, 2012 6:02 pm

sdsujacks wrote:I bought a .22 blank off of Gun Dog Supply for somewhere around $30, and $20 for 200 rounds. The gun works great, especially for its price, def. worth the investment to try to avoid gunshyness. I started off throwing the dummy and a partner at 50 yards out shooting the quieter blanks when I threw. Moved in 10 yards at a time, saw nothing out of the ordinary from the dog. Stopped there, waited a day, then repeated the process with the louder blanks. Stopped there, waited a day, then repeated the process with a 12 gauge. As long as they don't act weird at any point then keep progressing, if they notice the sound, stop, look scared, etc., then take a break and repeat at step 1. Eventually I got to the point that during our trips out to "explore for birds" I would throw the dummy every now and then and shoot, sometimes I would take multiple shots. The .22 blank worked great, I was able to shoot over him about 150+ times for a relatively cheap price and safe environment.

By not tying the the shot to the bird in a positive way you are risking the dog making a negative association with birds in the future.

Hattrick · Post by **Hattrick** » Fri Dec 21, 2012 7:27 pm

4dabirds
ur making this more complicated than it is. Its simple fire at a distance when there are distracted chasing birds or playing grab "bleep". Start with a plank, then up it to a shot gun. I perfer my guys not to catch birds at any age if i can help it. You can have a well breed pup gun broke to a blank pistol as early as 10-12wks old if you do right. 16 wks 12 gauge. We condition are pups from the start with lond banging of food bowls at feeding time an roll right in too blanks as early as 6-8 wks

Brazosvalleyvizslas · Post by **Brazosvalleyvizslas** » Fri Dec 21, 2012 7:56 pm

I use any and all positive rewards while teaching the gun. Nothing wrong with throwing bumpers if the dog has strong desire to retrieve or firing while placing food down for food oriented dogs. One of my favorite tools is my hand held dummy launcher that uses blanks. I can start a dog at distance and gradually move in closer. I get the noise of the shot and the bird falls. The dogs distraction is flight and his reward is the retrieve.

4dabirds · Post by **4dabirds** » Fri Dec 21, 2012 8:01 pm

Hattrick wrote:4dabirds
ur making this more complicated than it is. Its simple fire at a distance when there are distracted chasing birds or playing grab "bleep". Start with a plank, then up it to a shot gun. I perfer my guys not to catch birds at any age if i can help it. You can have a well breed pup gun broke to a blank pistol as early as 10-12wks old if you do right. 16 wks 12 gauge. We condition are pups from the start with lond banging of food bowls at feeding time an roll right in too blanks as early as 6-8 wks

If they are distracted chasing birds you are making the bird gun assciation in a positive way . See it is so simple you never knew you were doing it!

As for the previous post he was not.

RyanGSP · Post by **RyanGSP** » Fri Dec 21, 2012 10:51 pm

we just shoot over them.

Usually our pups come home in the late spring early summer so we start running them on wild birds 3-4 times a week.

Hunting season comes around and we turn them loose with one or 2 of our seasoned dogs. After a couple coveys of huns when they re all jacked up we turn them loose with one seasoned dog and wait until pup is on full chase of a bird. This is when we drop one right infront of him. 9/10 he doesnt even hear the gun just sees the bird drop. If he does spin around and wonder what the was the old dog is already hot on his heels and retrieves the bird. younger dog doesnt want any of that and we never have that problem again.

After a few birds we eliminate the older dog and just fire over puppy.

Only ever one person shoots, only 1 shot is taken, make "bleep" sure a bird drops, and dont fire when standing over the young dog.

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