Training collars
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Training collars
Bought a GSP that was trained by a pro. Does everything just right and I love the dog. I do have one question. Without a shock collar on, he absolutely will not respond to any commands. With a shock collar on, he is a perfectly behaved dog and I very rarely, if ever, have to use the collar. I know that dogs can become collar trained, but I wonder if this was a stubborn, hard headed dog, or was it the methods of the trainer? I haven't asked the trainer this question. Just wanted to get some input from the folks here. He is 6 yrs old and has some field trial success under his belt.
Re: Training collars
He's collar-wise. But if he has done well in trials, you know he is capable of behaving without a collar.
When my dog gets a little too big for his britches and decides he can do whatever he wants when he doesn't wear a collar, I chase him down and let him know that I can still reach out and touch him. You might start with a check cord and some yardwork. Keep him close and make him mind the first command, don't cut him any slack with ignoring a command the first time you say it.
Expand his range depending on how well he minds you.
Good luck, have fun Backing up a few steps now and then isn't a big deal.
When my dog gets a little too big for his britches and decides he can do whatever he wants when he doesn't wear a collar, I chase him down and let him know that I can still reach out and touch him. You might start with a check cord and some yardwork. Keep him close and make him mind the first command, don't cut him any slack with ignoring a command the first time you say it.
Expand his range depending on how well he minds you.
Good luck, have fun Backing up a few steps now and then isn't a big deal.
- roaniecowpony
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Re: Training collars
My ol lab will lag on commands sometimes when not wearing an e-collar. She cleans up when the e-collar is on her neck. Like stated above, she needs a correction or two when she is not wearing the collar to get her attention. A loosely rolled newspaper smacked on the haunches works or the "bonker". A "bonker" is a tightly rolled hand towel with rubber bands holding it rolled. It is thrown at the dog to hit it hard enough to get its attention. It doesn't hurt the dog but they sure comply after a bonker comes their way.
Re: Training collars
I had a similar problem with hounds, but found no one wants to hear bout it. Cool when you get them through it with no collar though. PEACE.
Re: Training collars
You've hopefully learned a valuable lesson. Now you have a fine hunting dog. Keep the collar on, hunt and have fun, uphold your standards, and forget trials...perhaps forever with this dog. But wait at least a year before considering running one again.muleskinner wrote:Bought a GSP that was trained by a pro. Does everything just right and I love the dog. I do have one question. Without a shock collar on, he absolutely will not respond to any commands. With a shock collar on, he is a perfectly behaved dog and I very rarely, if ever, have to use the collar. I know that dogs can become collar trained, but I wonder if this was a stubborn, hard headed dog, or was it the methods of the trainer? I haven't asked the trainer this question. Just wanted to get some input from the folks here. He is 6 yrs old and has some field trial success under his belt.
My greatest hope is that you figure out what you did to train him to be collar wise because they don't do it themselves.
EvanG
“Not all of us can do great things. But we can do small things with great love.”
― Mother Teresa
There is little reason to expect a dog to be more precise than you are.-- Rex Carr
The Smartwork System for Retriever Training (link)
Official Evan Graham Retriever Training Forum
― Mother Teresa
There is little reason to expect a dog to be more precise than you are.-- Rex Carr
The Smartwork System for Retriever Training (link)
Official Evan Graham Retriever Training Forum
Re: Training collars
It would a very low IQ dog not to figure out when he has a collar on. They ALL figure it out if they aren't brain dead. The difference between collarwise or not is that they were allowed to blow off a command(s) without the collar at some time, or he wasn't solid on commands before the collar was added, and they collar was used to 'train' him instead to reinforce known commands.
If he's not a bonehead some steps back will help; if he is a bonehead lots of retraining in his future unless you choose to run with a collar all the time.
If he's not a bonehead some steps back will help; if he is a bonehead lots of retraining in his future unless you choose to run with a collar all the time.
Re: Training collars
One of my JRTs wears a bark collar during the day as he will drive the neighbours crazy otherwise. I haven't put a battery in it in years. Shhh Don't tell him.
" We are more than our gender, skin color, class, sexuality or age; we are unlimited potential, and can not be defined by one label." quote A. Bartlett
- roaniecowpony
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Re: Training collars
My young pointer would sometimes go to barking when left in the truck. Sometimes I'd be caught without a barking collar and I'd take her ID collar, slide it up high and tighten it like the bark collar. She'd stop barking thinking i put the barking collar on her.
Re: Training collars
What dogs are is "situation-wise". They are born that way to a tiny extent, but become increasingly more so as they mature. In each identifiable situation are what behaviorist B.F. Skinner calls "triggers"; sights, sounds, objects, activities, smells, and other things that combine to tell us and them that in a certain situation we can consistently expect certain things to happen, and for certain conditions to exist. This would be so whether or not we trained our dogs. They would still come to expect certain things of each distinct situation (Being safe, loved, and fed in our homes for example). But understanding that facilitates our ability to train our dogs more effectively, and to higher levels. It also calls upon us to see past our noses. Not everything is as it appears on the surface.shags wrote:It would a very low IQ dog not to figure out when he has a collar on. They ALL figure it out if they aren't brain dead. The difference between collarwise or not is that they were allowed to blow off a command(s) without the collar at some time, or he wasn't solid on commands before the collar was added, and they collar was used to 'train' him instead to reinforce known commands.
If he's not a bonehead some steps back will help; if he is a bonehead lots of retraining in his future unless you choose to run with a collar all the time.
"Collar-wise" is an example of being situation-wise relative to an object combined with expectations created by its use - nearly always its inconsistent or incorrect use. Dogs are not born with an e-collar around their necks. We put those there, and by our use or misuse we create a set of expectations associated with them. A prime example of misuse is to run a young developing dog with an e-collar on sometimes, but not others. When we do that we mix expectations in a similar environment so that when the object (the collar) is on the dog, there is one standard, and when it's off there is a different, contrasting standard: Two sets of expectations. Trainers do it all the time. What they create is a dog that is now aware of the distinct expectations of a situation where the human has less control over them anytime that object is not present in the environment. Presto! He's collar-wise. There are, of course, other ways for a human to create this issue. But nature did not provide an e-collar for them to become wise to.
Shall we talk more?
EvanG
“Not all of us can do great things. But we can do small things with great love.”
― Mother Teresa
There is little reason to expect a dog to be more precise than you are.-- Rex Carr
The Smartwork System for Retriever Training (link)
Official Evan Graham Retriever Training Forum
― Mother Teresa
There is little reason to expect a dog to be more precise than you are.-- Rex Carr
The Smartwork System for Retriever Training (link)
Official Evan Graham Retriever Training Forum
Re: Training collars
No need to...I think you just repeated what I said
Only in more edumacated language
Only in more edumacated language
Re: Training collars
Evan, all well and good but first let's acknowledge that muleskinner bought a field trial dog that had been run in trials and trained by someone other than himself.
I'm recollecting a Chessie that had been trained with some haphazard semblance of direct pressure - the old Zap!-command sequence - and the epigrammatic words spoken about the dog when it wasn't wearing an e-collar while waterfowling:
Chessie owner's father, proudly: "That dog's sho' nuff got a lot of go."
Chessie owner, sheepishly: "But she sho' nuff ain't got a lot of come back..."
MG
That established, what disdain he's encountering from the dog doesn't strike me as anything out of the ordinary for a birddog trained (and trained by somebody else) with good ol' (fashioned) direct pressure. Button pushed - Here boy, here! Button pushed again - Here boy, here! Wait a minute, there ain't no button...and ain't no collar on the dog...muleskinner wrote:Bought a GSP that was trained by a pro... He is 6 yrs old and has some field trial success under his belt.
I'm recollecting a Chessie that had been trained with some haphazard semblance of direct pressure - the old Zap!-command sequence - and the epigrammatic words spoken about the dog when it wasn't wearing an e-collar while waterfowling:
Chessie owner's father, proudly: "That dog's sho' nuff got a lot of go."
Chessie owner, sheepishly: "But she sho' nuff ain't got a lot of come back..."
MG
Re: Training collars
I would be more 'learn-ed' If you did speak to the one who 'Trained it' and told us what they said ,than any-one on heremuleskinner wrote:Bought a GSP that was trained by a pro. Does everything just right and I love the dog. I do have one question. Without a shock collar on, he absolutely will not respond to any commands. With a shock collar on, he is a perfectly behaved dog and I very rarely, if ever, have to use the collar. I know that dogs can become collar trained, but I wonder if this was a stubborn, hard headed dog, or was it the methods of the trainer? I haven't asked the trainer this question. Just wanted to get some input from the folks here. He is 6 yrs old and has some field trial success under his belt.
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Re: Training collars
At this point its really doesn't matter how the trainer handled the 6 yr old dog. I'm happy with his performance and have a blast hunting with him. Part of my motive in asking for insights into his tendencies is the fact that I am going to train my own pup now. I am going to use the book recommended on this forum, "Training the Sporting Dog". Just looking thru the book, they don't seem to be fans of the shock collar. Anyway, when i'm not hunting with my dog, I enjoy talking about hunting with my dog. Appreciate everyones response.
- birddogger
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Re: Training collars
muleskinner, by calling it a shock collar leads me to believe you are making a wise choice by not using one.muleskinner wrote:At this point its really doesn't matter how the trainer handled the 6 yr old dog. I'm happy with his performance and have a blast hunting with him. Part of my motive in asking for insights into his tendencies is the fact that I am going to train my own pup now. I am going to use the book recommended on this forum, "Training the Sporting Dog". Just looking thru the book, they don't seem to be fans of the shock collar. Anyway, when i'm not hunting with my dog, I enjoy talking about hunting with my dog. Appreciate everyones response.
Charle
If you think you can or if you think you can't, you are right either way
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Re: Training collars
Birddogger...lots of things have been said about those who,"assume". You might want to take a refesher course on the subject. I know full well what the purpose of a "training collar" is. If "shock collar" is offensive to your sensibilities, please accept my politically correct apology. I have used training collars for years on big game hounds. Both tone and stimulation modes. I trained a GSP in 1985 before training collars were even an item of discussion. He turned out just fine. So, don't worry about my tendencies with a collar. Trying to read between the lines and make judgements about someones intentions or abilities is probably not the best use of your time.
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Re: Training collars
muleskinner, I hope you will accept my apology if you took it that I was trying to belittle or offend you.... It was not my intent. I just never use mine as a shock collar except for trash breaking. There was a time when they were nothing but shock collars and were a tool for trash breaking hounds. Times, products and training methods have changed immensely since those days, as I am sure you know. Heck, a very long time ago, I broke a hard headed pointer STWS with a load of small bird shot and she was a finished dog from that point on. She already knew what she was supposed to do before I resorted to it and she was no worse for the wear. There are much more humane ways now I.e. the e-collar.
Charlie
Charlie
If you think you can or if you think you can't, you are right either way
Re: Training collars
I don't think you need to read between the lines when someone calls an e-collar a shock collar. I always shake my head and hope they just mis-spoke rather than not knowing how to use one. Sounds like you do, so alls well, but it sure is a head turner when ever I hear that term. Don't think you can blame the person who read it since it is what you posted.
Ezzy
Ezzy
http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=144
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It's not how many breaths you have taken but how many times it has been taken away!
Has anyone noticed common sense isn't very common anymore.
http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=207
It's not how many breaths you have taken but how many times it has been taken away!
Has anyone noticed common sense isn't very common anymore.
Re: Training collars
I don't "blame the person " at all , but generally speaking , I do think words concerning training collars are very important., considering the calls for the banning of them in England and Scotland etc..
Even meeting the general public on a dog trail, I call it a locator collar- it does have a beeper.
Not illegal to drive around with your pick - up truck full of dead geese/coyotes etc either , but in this day and age , we have to be wise / circumspect.
https://www.google.ca/search?sourceid=n ... n+Edngland
Even meeting the general public on a dog trail, I call it a locator collar- it does have a beeper.
Not illegal to drive around with your pick - up truck full of dead geese/coyotes etc either , but in this day and age , we have to be wise / circumspect.
https://www.google.ca/search?sourceid=n ... n+Edngland
" We are more than our gender, skin color, class, sexuality or age; we are unlimited potential, and can not be defined by one label." quote A. Bartlett
- birddogger
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Re: Training collars
Sharon, you make some good points. Sadly, I am thinking that a couple of people on here who supposedly share the same interests as we do would be in favor of making e-collars illegal on this side of the pond too. I hope I am wrong but from their tone, that would be my guess. If this is the case, why stop at ecollars? We may as well include CC, leashes, prong collars and any other training tool that could be misused. Oh, and don' forget the choke collar. BTW, I hate the term "choke collar" because I am pretty sure that the people who use them are not choking dogs with them. I could go on but you get my point.
Charlie
Charlie
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Re: Training collars
birddogger, no harm no foul. when it comes to trash breaking hounds, the term "shock collar" is correct. Fortunately I haven't had to use one in a long time for that purpose. Certainly don't expect to have to use a training collar on my GSP puppy. She seems to have the kind of temperament that will respond to positive input. Lots of love and patience should go a long ways with her.
- roaniecowpony
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Re: Training collars
Its a term promoted by PETA types. So, there's an association of the term "shock collar" to anti-hunting people by many hunting dog people.Sharon wrote:I don't "blame the person " at all , but generally speaking , I do think words concerning training collars are very important., considering the calls for the banning of them in England and Scotland etc..
Even meeting the general public on a dog trail, I call it a locator collar- it does have a beeper.
Not illegal to drive around with your pick - up truck full of dead geese/coyotes etc either , but in this day and age , we have to be wise / circumspect.
https://www.google.ca/search?sourceid=n ... n+Edngland
- birddogger
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Re: Training collars
Also, just so there is no misunderstanding, in my post above where I said a couple of people, you were not one who I was talking about.muleskinner wrote:birddogger, no harm no foul. when it comes to trash breaking hounds, the term "shock collar" is correct. Fortunately I haven't had to use one in a long time for that purpose. Certainly don't expect to have to use a training collar on my GSP puppy. She seems to have the kind of temperament that will respond to positive input. Lots of love and patience should go a long ways with her.
Charlie
If you think you can or if you think you can't, you are right either way
Re: Training collars
newsflash:
e collars /prong collars banned in Quebec 2 days ago
http://dogingtonpost.com/quebec-bans-sh ... wVnmWeYYY8
e collars /prong collars banned in Quebec 2 days ago
http://dogingtonpost.com/quebec-bans-sh ... wVnmWeYYY8
" We are more than our gender, skin color, class, sexuality or age; we are unlimited potential, and can not be defined by one label." quote A. Bartlett
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Re: Training collars
Unbelievable! Save us from the "good people"!! :roll:
Charlie
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Re: Training collars
Not surprised Quebec would be responsible for a dumb idea like that
Cass
"If you train a young dog for momentum, precision will arrive. If you train for precision, demanding perfection, momentum will depart." - Rex Carr
"If you train a young dog for momentum, precision will arrive. If you train for precision, demanding perfection, momentum will depart." - Rex Carr
Re: Training collars
I am not anti e-collar, but when I push the button my dog gets a shock. Does something different happen when I am sitting on my High horse? Call it what it is without being so sensitive.
Mike
Mike
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Re: Training collars
The problem is this Mike; we are surrounded by the sensitive. http://www.banshockcollars.ca/comments This is just a small sampling of misinformed voices.MJB64 wrote:I am not anti e-collar, but when I push the button my dog gets a shock. Does something different happen when I am sitting on my High horse? Call it what it is without being so sensitive.
Mike
Nate
Beware of false knowledge; it is far more dangerous than ignorance. George Bernard Shaw
Re: Training collars
Tail docking is next !Sharon wrote:newsflash:
e collars /prong collars banned in Quebec 2 days ago
http://dogingtonpost.com/quebec-bans-sh ... wVnmWeYYY8
You were all given the Heads up !
Re: Training collars
These crazy laws just seem to be imposed on us whether we like it or not and if there is "scientific evidence" about tail docking or e-collars or prong collars the powers that be only seem to listen to the evidence that points towards them being harmful. Contrary evidence gets ignored .
Tail docking is banned in Scotland despite the evidence submitted in writing and in photographs showing the damage done to undocked dogs tails.... I've seen spaniels at shoots with tail ends so bloodied that the dogs flanks are covered in blood from it wagging it's tail.
E-collars are banned in Wales and the rest of Britain will probably follow.
I thought prong collars looked like instruments of torture but many of the dogs competing in pointer/setter trials wear them while waiting to compete. I asked about this and was told prong collars actually helped prevent damage to the dogs necks since the dogs did not pull so hard while wearing them. I doubted the truth of this so I made further enquiries and found a veterinary report ( from the U.S.A. ?) A number of dogs had been x-rayed and the x-rays revealed considerably more little neck injuries to the dogs that had been trained and walked using normal slip leads or choke chains than was evident on the dogs that had worn prong collars.
I now hardly turn a hair if I see a dog wearing a prong-collar.
Bill T.
Tail docking is banned in Scotland despite the evidence submitted in writing and in photographs showing the damage done to undocked dogs tails.... I've seen spaniels at shoots with tail ends so bloodied that the dogs flanks are covered in blood from it wagging it's tail.
E-collars are banned in Wales and the rest of Britain will probably follow.
I thought prong collars looked like instruments of torture but many of the dogs competing in pointer/setter trials wear them while waiting to compete. I asked about this and was told prong collars actually helped prevent damage to the dogs necks since the dogs did not pull so hard while wearing them. I doubted the truth of this so I made further enquiries and found a veterinary report ( from the U.S.A. ?) A number of dogs had been x-rayed and the x-rays revealed considerably more little neck injuries to the dogs that had been trained and walked using normal slip leads or choke chains than was evident on the dogs that had worn prong collars.
I now hardly turn a hair if I see a dog wearing a prong-collar.
Bill T.
The older I get, the better I was !
Re: Training collars
I understand what Sharon and Roanie are saying. Thanks for saying what you guys did say, because it does clear some things up for me. I think saying that when someone refers to the collar as something The other side may not like, is probably better than making assumptions about ones training ability. I sat down at lunch with a Sportsmans Alliance Board Member yesterday for lunch and the other side is coming after us for a lot more than just what we call the collars. I try and support them "SA" the best I can because I feel they best represent me and my hunting affairs.
Re: Training collars
You are just as wrong as you can be. I go to rehab a couple of times a week and they hook me up to a machine wired like an e-collar and call it electrical stimulation. Doesn't feel bad but it does get your attention. When I try my e-collar I get the same stimulation and there is no shock to it. As I sit here I have the same impulses going through my foot and they are caused by the normal electrical impulses that makes your heart beat and your muscles move but instead of wires they travel on nerves.MJB64 wrote:I am not anti e-collar, but when I push the button my dog gets a shock. Does something different happen when I am sitting on my High horse? Call it what it is without being so sensitive.
Mike
Sounds like people need to use their collars on their own arms or where ever and see what it really feels like. A electrical shock is a whole lot different than low settings on a collar. I have to turn mine up a couple of settings before Rush will even feel it. and I can't feel it either on the lowest setting. Properly used there is no shock to it. but I know 99% of you already know this.
Ezzy
http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=144
http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=207
It's not how many breaths you have taken but how many times it has been taken away!
Has anyone noticed common sense isn't very common anymore.
http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=207
It's not how many breaths you have taken but how many times it has been taken away!
Has anyone noticed common sense isn't very common anymore.
Re: Training collars
I agree with MJB64, my collars were always used with the threat of or actually electricity. Put it to myself a dozen times for sure. Not terribly painful but electricity for sure. I haven't bought one for at least 8 years and maybe they have come along way since then like someone suggested. I heard Garmin was coming out with one that deposits a cookie when you push the button though. Think their teaming up with Keebler. check it out at Youhavegottobekidding.com.
Re: Training collars
Tell me the exact number on your collar when it changes from "stimulation" to "shock".
Mike
Mike
"Endeavor to perservere."
Re: Training collars
Are you serious?MJB64 wrote:Tell me the exact number on your collar when it changes from "stimulation" to "shock".
Mike
EvanG
“Not all of us can do great things. But we can do small things with great love.”
― Mother Teresa
There is little reason to expect a dog to be more precise than you are.-- Rex Carr
The Smartwork System for Retriever Training (link)
Official Evan Graham Retriever Training Forum
― Mother Teresa
There is little reason to expect a dog to be more precise than you are.-- Rex Carr
The Smartwork System for Retriever Training (link)
Official Evan Graham Retriever Training Forum
Re: Training collars
Ezzy when you put yourself in the 99% and a forum guest in the 1% it kind of brings on that Us against Them you so loath.
Re: Training collars
Evan, you just made my point. There is no level where it changes. At level 1 my dog is getting a shock, and yes I have tried it on myself.
Mike
Mike
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Re: Training collars
I'm curious to know what system of training you have used with the e-collar or if you used the instructions that came with the unit.MJB64 wrote:Evan, you just made my point. There is no level where it changes. At level 1 my dog is getting a shock, and yes I have tried it on myself.
Mike
Nate
Re: Training collars
No, Ezzy's right as rain on this one - 'fraid you and the "guest" are going semantic on us. And yes, I love me e-stim too - whether it's a "shock" to my system or an e-massage, it's good for you.Frankug wrote:Ezzy when you put yourself in the 99% and a forum guest in the 1% it kind of brings on that Us against Them you so loath.
MG
Re: Training collars
Mike...you ran a lot? Then you had to make too many corrections because you were too late to be as effective as you should have been.
Re: Training collars
Wow. Unseen and unsolicited diagnosis all the way from California. Feel Pretty good now? How could you possibly know how effective I was? As I stated before, I am not anti collar. I just don't like it when someone on this forum refers to it as a shock collar and all of the high and mighty types jump on them and assume that they don't know what they are doing.Mike...you ran a lot? Then you had to make too many corrections because you were too late to be as effective as you should have been.
"Endeavor to perservere."
Re: Training collars
Unseen...yes. However, unless your comment was tongue in cheek or a misrepresentation mine cannot be anything but accurate. Any and all disciplines in dog training whether they be bird dogs or otherwise have established that enhancing or correcting behavior has a diminishing effectiveness as seconds tick by. Because I am patient, I will give you an example; our well meaning kind hearted dog trainer uses a check cord or a rope to get his or her dog standing birds, they go through dozens or hundreds of reps until they are confident...they remove the training aid and as most dogs will, their dog decides to test the rules and disciplines it has learned. Running free Fido breaks point and rips up a bird, he gleefully chases and maybe even runs the bird down, to either retrieve or chomp on. Either way Fido has enjoyed the experience...how does our tool less trainer react? We have agreed...they run the dog down, what happens thereafter depends on how engrained it is, who the human is and how much dog you are dealing with....it usually isn't pretty. As opposed, to a trainer that has used a check cord and overplayed an e collar and makes a correction in real time and stops a dog because it has prepared to stop on the stimulation applied...when you are good it happens before the dog moves, even the brand new get to do it the second it happens and they prevent the dog from being rewarded for its transgression....in the dog world that is a double deterrent they get no reward and they are corrected immediately for violating a learned discipline. Because I have done both A LOT through the years I know which is more effective and humane....because of that, I respond to your other proclamation this way....
Unsolicited no: this is a forum to help the less experienced train their dogs and or to shoot the bull...in the latter experience and knowledge hold little weight and one persons opinion is no better or worse than the next...in the former it matters a great deal if for no other reason than the sake of the dogs.
Unsolicited no: this is a forum to help the less experienced train their dogs and or to shoot the bull...in the latter experience and knowledge hold little weight and one persons opinion is no better or worse than the next...in the former it matters a great deal if for no other reason than the sake of the dogs.
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Re: Training collars
I only wish I could articulate it as well!
Charlie
Charlie
If you think you can or if you think you can't, you are right either way
Re: Training collars
Chukar12 wrote:Unseen...yes. However, unless your comment was tongue in cheek or a misrepresentation mine cannot be anything but accurate. Any and all disciplines in dog training whether they be bird dogs or otherwise have established that enhancing or correcting behavior has a diminishing effectiveness as seconds tick by. Because I am patient, I will give you an example; our well meaning kind hearted dog trainer uses a check cord or a rope to get his or her dog standing birds, they go through dozens or hundreds of reps until they are confident...they remove the training aid and as most dogs will, their dog decides to test the rules and disciplines it has learned. Running free Fido breaks point and rips up a bird, he gleefully chases and maybe even runs the bird down, to either retrieve or chomp on. Either way Fido has enjoyed the experience...how does our tool less trainer react? We have agreed...they run the dog down, what happens thereafter depends on how engrained it is, who the human is and how much dog you are dealing with....it usually isn't pretty. As opposed, to a trainer that has used a check cord and overplayed an e collar and makes a correction in real time and stops a dog because it has prepared to stop on the stimulation applied...when you are good it happens before the dog moves, even the brand new get to do it the second it happens and they prevent the dog from being rewarded for its transgression....in the dog world that is a double deterrent they get no reward and they are corrected immediately for violating a learned discipline. Because I have done both A LOT through the years I know which is more effective and humane....because of that, I respond to your other proclamation this way....
Unsolicited no: this is a forum to help the less experienced train their dogs and or to shoot the bull...in the latter experience and knowledge hold little weight and one persons opinion is no better or worse than the next...in the former it matters a great deal if for no other reason than the sake of the dogs.
Re: Training collars
I cannot imagine "running" down my dog to correct behavior....
I would never catch him.
I would never catch him.
Re: Training collars
Purely for this thread and comment !Elkhunter wrote:I cannot imagine "running" down my dog to correct behavior....
I would never catch him.
Here is one that had a history of 'Doing it's own thing with It's owner' ..and It's owner would never catch them
You don't need running shoes !!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bL_aYyCiwDQ
Can You Imagine Elkhunter?
Re: Training collars
My dog is usually 400-500+ yards away, not gonna catch him.
Re: Training collars
Nope!....Elkhunter wrote:My dog is usually 400-500+ yards away, not gonna catch him.
Neither am I .
Hope you catch him soon. :roll:
Re: Training collars
Dont need to, thats why I have a shock collar!polmaise wrote:Nope!....Elkhunter wrote:My dog is usually 400-500+ yards away, not gonna catch him.
Neither am I .
Hope you catch him soon. :roll:
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Re: Training collars
I think running a dog down depends on the type of dog you are training. A far ranging pointy dog it may not be reasonable, but those of us with spaniels and labs (or other close ranging gun dogs), chasing them down is a very real part of training in the early stages. I remember trying to teach my pup the remote sit... I must have ran a marathon trying to catch him on the way back in to put him back in place. He always wanted to run back to me and sit beside or in front of me LOL. I will say, an e-collar is MUCH more EFFICIENT at enforcing that lesson LOL.
Cass
"If you train a young dog for momentum, precision will arrive. If you train for precision, demanding perfection, momentum will depart." - Rex Carr
"If you train a young dog for momentum, precision will arrive. If you train for precision, demanding perfection, momentum will depart." - Rex Carr