Hunting Dog Training & More    

Popular Searches: Garmin Astro | Dog Collars | Tri-Tronics | SPORTdog

exercising my dog

exercising my dog

Postby BuckeyeSteve » Wed Jun 06, 2018 10:34 pm

I run my Brittany a couple fast miles off my quad every day and he stays right with me, or I'll stop and let him roam around (with his bell on), as soon as I whistle and move the quad he comes running back to me. I put his bell on him so I can tell where he's at, and occasionally he'll chase trash or wander off further than I'm comfortable with. He does come back eventually....but he doesn't sprint to me every time I whistle or call.

I have a couple questions tied to this:
1. We run fast (I'm doing it to wear him out). If he's sprinting around on the quad trails or through the fields in front of me, am I teaching him anything bad (like not stopping to smell the roses...or birds)?
2. Is it bad to keep his bell on him? I've had people tell me to save the bell so he associates it with hunting, but right now (until I have a gps) it's my only way of keeping tabs.
3. When we're out exercising and I let him roam the farm, I whistle with no commands so he knows where I am. He normally comes back in his own time to my whistle or comes running when he hears the quad rev up. When he doesn't come, I'll call him once. I don't repeat....but when he doesn't come I have no way of enforcing my command. Should I never call him (even if I'm worried he's getting too far out or I can't hear him) because of my inability to enforce the command?
4. Depending on the answer to # 3....If I do call him once and he doesn't immediately come, but 5 minutes later he comes.... do I punish in some way (he'll have no idea why he's being punished...so I know that's a no)...or do I give him a treat and tell him "good come" b/c he did eventually come....or ignore and move forward (letting him see that there is no reason to obey my commands)?

I don't know how to handle these things. Any advice would be great.
User avatar
BuckeyeSteve
Rank: Senior Hunter
 
Posts: 112
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2017 10:09 am
Location: Valencia, PA (north of Pgh)

Re: exercising my dog

Postby averageguy » Thu Jun 07, 2018 5:08 am

1. Not a problem. The dog will learn the difference between you walking and hunting vs. running alongside while you are riding a 4 wheeler. I would include outings where are you are on foot and the dog has an opportunity to hunt vs run along side the 4 wheeler.
2. Wearing the bell is not a problem.
3. I am believer in not issuing a command to young dog when I am not in a position to re-enforce when/if needed. I train the Here/Come command in the yard with a check cord and then overlay an ecollar. The Perfect Start DVD provides excellent instruction in this area and other critical subjects. If you want to use a whistle to que the dog to return to you I would only be using it when you are issuing a command and can enforce it. Otherwise you are training the dog to ignore the whistle.
4. No never the punish the dog for returning to you as it will train the dog to not come to you.
averageguy
Rank: Master Hunter
 
Posts: 246
Joined: Mon Dec 04, 2017 8:07 am
Location: Please ADD LOCATION

Re: exercising my dog

Postby gonehuntin' » Thu Jun 07, 2018 5:49 am

Exactly what AG said. When running him on your atv though, don't let him follow you. You follow him so he gets used to always staying to the front.
User avatar
gonehuntin'
GDF Junkie
 
Posts: 4434
Joined: Tue Dec 12, 2006 5:38 pm
Location: NE WI.

Re: exercising my dog

Postby BuckeyeSteve » Thu Jun 07, 2018 5:59 am

AG & GH.... thanks. That was helpful.
User avatar
BuckeyeSteve
Rank: Senior Hunter
 
Posts: 112
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2017 10:09 am
Location: Valencia, PA (north of Pgh)

Re: exercising my dog

Postby DonF » Thu Jun 07, 2018 9:32 am

When conditioning, don't let the dog free wheel, have him pull something. I had a sled dog harness years ago and conditioned the dog's having them pull a car tire! Want to know the difference? Go out and run say 500 yds on the flat. next go run the same 500yds up hill! You'll get the idea very quickly!

You might trade the bell for a tracking collar. If the dog is 30 yds away but you can't see it, hope you can hear the bell at that distance, I can't! But if it's got out a couple hundred yds and out of sight, can you still hear the bell? After losing my Bodie for little reason other than I couldn't find him, about 50 yds from the back door and took 11 days to find him. My Squirt and Stormy do not go out without a tracking collar on, I always know where they are even if i can't see them!

Delmar Smith is my god! He say's never give a command you can't enforce. I think we all manage to do that! In that case run a training collar and then never give a command if you can't see your dog. Call and if it doesn't come in right away, nic it!
User avatar
DonF
GDF Junkie
 
Posts: 3659
Joined: Tue Sep 20, 2011 6:09 pm
Location: Antelope, Ore

Re: exercising my dog

Postby BuckeyeSteve » Fri Jun 08, 2018 10:56 pm

DonF wrote:When conditioning, don't let the dog free wheel, have him pull something. I had a sled dog harness years ago and conditioned the dog's having them pull a car tire! Want to know the difference? Go out and run say 500 yds on the flat. next go run the same 500yds up hill! You'll get the idea very quickly!

You might trade the bell for a tracking collar. If the dog is 30 yds away but you can't see it, hope you can hear the bell at that distance, I can't! But if it's got out a couple hundred yds and out of sight, can you still hear the bell? After losing my Bodie for little reason other than I couldn't find him, about 50 yds from the back door and took 11 days to find him. My Squirt and Stormy do not go out without a tracking collar on, I always know where they are even if i can't see them!

Delmar Smith is my god! He say's never give a command you can't enforce. I think we all manage to do that! In that case run a training collar and then never give a command if you can't see your dog. Call and if it doesn't come in right away, nic it!


What is the downside to freewheeling? I definitely understand the resistance concept....but is it bad to let him run distance? Is pulling a sled on dry ground okay on their joints? If so, in making the dog pull a sled, do I just keep him tied to the quad so he doesn't try to pull it though the wood?
I'm 100% with you on the tracking collar.... and definitely need a training collar. I do love the bell, too. I have the Northwoods Long Range Bell from Lion Country. It's awesome. If it's good weather, I can hear it for a couple hundred yards. I love listening to the sound of the bell ringing through the woods...though I do fear it will damage the dogs ears. I know I need the tracking/training collar....but I'm stuck on which to get between the Alpha 100 / TT15 and the Dogtra Pathfinder. I need to pick one and pull the trigger....I know my training would go 10x better with the help of a training collar.
User avatar
BuckeyeSteve
Rank: Senior Hunter
 
Posts: 112
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2017 10:09 am
Location: Valencia, PA (north of Pgh)

Re: exercising my dog

Postby shags » Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:09 am

Sorry, I can't see that dogs would happily run around acreage pulling a tire. My dogs would pull it just to move spot to spot but it sure wouldn't be any sustained effort :D

You might consider a roading rig for your quad though. It's an efficient way to exercise. You set the time, distance, amd pace. The dog gets a little extra from pulling. It works pretty well alternated with free running.

A disadvantage to free running, as I interpret from your comments ( aware that I may be mistaken so take it FWIW) is that your dog may be learning to self hunt, and is blowing you off. IMO you'd be farther ahead by turning the runs into training sessions vis a vis handling. The dog should go where you send him, turn when you turn, and recall when you want him to. Free running under direction keeps him moving and increases stamina, whereas simply turning him loose to do his own thing allows him to stop and lollygag whenever he feels like it, instead of pushing.

In my experience just turning a dog loose to do whatever he wants can be dangerous. Bells, trackers, and training collars don't make a lick of difference to coyotes, protectives does with fawns, or random people who assume a loose dog is a stray.
Better to keep the dog where you want him and going with you, all the while getting the exercise he needs.
shags
GDF Junkie
 
Posts: 2220
Joined: Wed Jan 02, 2008 4:57 pm
Location: Please ADD LOCATION

Re: exercising my dog

Postby averageguy » Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:34 am

Another great way to exercise a dog, (particularly in the summer), is long distance marked water retrieves. I use a Lucky Launcher 2 on a shoulder stock with medium loads and can get 200 yard round trip swimming retrieves. Great conditioning for the dog and a safe alternative in the heat.
averageguy
Rank: Master Hunter
 
Posts: 246
Joined: Mon Dec 04, 2017 8:07 am
Location: Please ADD LOCATION

Re: exercising my dog

Postby BuckeyeSteve » Sat Jun 09, 2018 8:16 am

shags wrote:Sorry, I can't see that dogs would happily run around acreage pulling a tire. My dogs would pull it just to move spot to spot but it sure wouldn't be any sustained effort :D

You might consider a roading rig for your quad though. It's an efficient way to exercise. You set the time, distance, amd pace. The dog gets a little extra from pulling. It works pretty well alternated with free running.

A disadvantage to free running, as I interpret from your comments ( aware that I may be mistaken so take it FWIW) is that your dog may be learning to self hunt, and is blowing you off. IMO you'd be farther ahead by turning the runs into training sessions vis a vis handling. The dog should go where you send him, turn when you turn, and recall when you want him to. Free running under direction keeps him moving and increases stamina, whereas simply turning him loose to do his own thing allows him to stop and lollygag whenever he feels like it, instead of pushing.

In my experience just turning a dog loose to do whatever he wants can be dangerous. Bells, trackers, and training collars don't make a lick of difference to coyotes, protectives does with fawns, or random people who assume a loose dog is a stray.
Better to keep the dog where you want him and going with you, all the while getting the exercise he needs.


I agree with all of this Shags... I am looking at the walkydog to road from my bike, and I can build a good home made one for my quad. I do generally keep him close to me when we go running on the quad -- I'm not just letting him (intentionally) take off...but he's done it a couple times. Once at least after a deer, but he did come back. He got just out of bell range (200 yards) and I was pretty worried. Normally, he stays within 50-100 yards of me on the quad. I'll give him a whistle and start driving another direction and he turns right back to me. The runs are pretty controlled (normally), my main concern is that I run him so fast that he learns he's out to play, and it will make him not hunt when he needs to. A previous reply to this gave me a pretty good direction to make sure I walk him and let him hunt separately so he keeps the clear idea of exercise/play running with the quad vs hunting when we're walking.

I've been battling around the alpha 100 vs the pathfinder for a few weeks now, and haven't come to a decision. They both have benefits, and from the million reviews I read also sound like neither is perfect. I think I'm about to change my direction and just order a good e-collar instead for training, and scratch the tracking. I'm in western pa, and hunt from foot mainly for grouse, so I don't really want him to be a mile away from me. My hope is to teach him (however I accomplish this??) to hunt within a couple hundred yards of me. My worry is that the one time he gets too far away I have no way of knowing where he is without the GPS, especially when I'm out on public game lands. Am I accurate in thinking (keep in mind I'm new to hunting over a dog....never done it even once yet) if I just go to an e-collar without GPS I can just give him a tone, vibration, or nick when he gets near the end of audible bell range to turn him back to me? Can I use the e-collar to keep from ever needing the GPS if I'm not looking to let my dog hunt 2 miles out?

I look at all these collars that go 5 and 9 miles.....and don't really understand how that applies to me. If my dog is ever 3 or 4 miles away from me, I assume even if I give him a "come" tone or vibration, he'd have no idea where to come to?? I also assume if I go to an e-collar and scratch the GPS, I can also combo that with whistle training to teach him to turn and/or come (again, something I know nothing about).

As a side note.... in the end I'll do what is best for my dog regardless of cost of the collar.... but if I can spend 250 instead of 800 it would certainly be helpful.
User avatar
BuckeyeSteve
Rank: Senior Hunter
 
Posts: 112
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2017 10:09 am
Location: Valencia, PA (north of Pgh)

Re: exercising my dog

Postby shags » Sat Jun 09, 2018 3:44 pm

I run two collars on my dogs, a garmin and an ecollar. Sometimes depending, just one or the other. Most of the time neither is used, but it sure is good to have whichever I need, if I need it.

Cost is a consideration, but it's probably a once and done. Cheaper than replacing a dog.

What are you going to do if your dog is out of sighr, and not seeming to respond to you? Nick him? Vibrate? What if he's on a bird? What if he's on a grand deer chase? Do you think a nick or vibrate will stop him?

Those huge ranges advertised are based on line of sight, and might be used more by coon dog or foxhound guys, so don't let yourself get intimidated by it. IME, in gentle rolling terrain with woods, I'm lucky to get a mile. Which is not out of the question for a dog on a deer, or just on an adventure.

I can't begin to say what reassurance a gps collar can be. It's not like we have to go around with eyes glued to the receiver screen, but it's great to look down when we get a little nervous or concerned about where the dang dog is, and see he's over there in the cattails, or going parallel with us thru the woods, or headed home. It saves a ton of worry and frustration.

Keep your eyes peeled on the for sale section here, over on the coverdog site, and the Collar Clinic for bargain collars of both types.
shags
GDF Junkie
 
Posts: 2220
Joined: Wed Jan 02, 2008 4:57 pm
Location: Please ADD LOCATION

Re: exercising my dog

Postby averageguy » Sat Jun 09, 2018 4:03 pm

Steve, you will be a much better dog handler with a GPS as you can relax and let your dog hunt out of sight in cover without feeling the need to call or tone your dog in just because you have not seen it awhile. I used Bells then Beepers and now an Alpha. Best thing that ever happened to my hunting and my ability to let a young dog work in heavy cover with minimal interference from me while doing it. And when and if he went on a deer race, the Alpha told me that and I was able to stop it. Great tool.
averageguy
Rank: Master Hunter
 
Posts: 246
Joined: Mon Dec 04, 2017 8:07 am
Location: Please ADD LOCATION

Re: exercising my dog

Postby BuckeyeSteve » Sat Jun 09, 2018 4:04 pm

shags wrote:I run two collars on my dogs, a garmin and an ecollar. Sometimes depending, just one or the other. Most of the time neither is used, but it sure is good to have whichever I need, if I need it.

Cost is a consideration, but it's probably a once and done. Cheaper than replacing a dog.

What are you going to do if your dog is out of sighr, and not seeming to respond to you? Nick him? Vibrate? What if he's on a bird? What if he's on a grand deer chase? Do you think a nick or vibrate will stop him?
I don't know the answer to any of these....my plan is to watch any training materials that come with the collar or watch you tube videos and read these threads to see how to implement the collar.
I honestly don't know what to do when he's out of sight and doesn't seem to be listening, and it is certainly a concern because I know it's a very bad thing to correct incorrectly. The deer chase....I assume my answer is to nick him with a moderately higher strength than normal.....

Those huge ranges advertised are based on line of sight, and might be used more by coon dog or foxhound guys, so don't let yourself get intimidated by it. IME, in gentle rolling terrain with woods, I'm lucky to get a mile. Which is not out of the question for a dog on a deer, or just on an adventure. I'm in heavy western pa hills and trees. I'm really hoping that i'm successful in keeping him close...is whistle training generally done alongside gps and e-collars?

I can't begin to say what reassurance a gps collar can be. It's not like we have to go around with eyes glued to the receiver screen, but it's great to look down when we get a little nervous or concerned about where the dang dog is, and see he's over there in the cattails, or going parallel with us thru the woods, or headed home. It saves a ton of worry and frustration.

Keep your eyes peeled on the for sale section here, over on the coverdog site, and the Collar Clinic for bargain collars of both types.
Are there any combo collars worth getting other than alpha 100 or pathfinder? Or are you saying I should get both like you do? If I'm going to have both....I'd rather (I think) do the combo to begin with.
User avatar
BuckeyeSteve
Rank: Senior Hunter
 
Posts: 112
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2017 10:09 am
Location: Valencia, PA (north of Pgh)

Re: exercising my dog

Postby shags » Sat Jun 09, 2018 5:13 pm

Some of the combos are awkward to operate in that you have to look at the handheld to be sure your thumb is on the correct button. I like having my ecollar transmitter set so I don't have to even think about anything but the correction.

I don't like that if one part of a combo needs repair, both parts have to be sent in. Then you have nothing for however long it takes to get your unit back.

But when it's all said and done, it's totally personal preference, no more or less.

You don't want to zap your dog unless you can see what he's doing. You might be unknowlingly punishing him for doing something good, like standing a bird or even coming back to you. Don't correct what you can't see. When the time comes there will plenty of help for you from the good folks here.

To trashbreak, most set their collars waaay up so the dog thinks the deer he's chasing has fired thunderbolts from its butt. One great big correction, maybe two for a bonehead dog, and most likely you're done for a good long while. Nagging with ever increasing nicks is a waste of time. IDK if you know or not, but it owrks well to set the dog up by taking him to an area that holds deer. If or when he jumps one, you say nothing...let him get into the chase for a few seconds, then zap him from here to Tuesday. He'll most likely yelp and do a airborne double twist about face and you'll feel horrible...but then he'll stop and look for you, or come back to you. You say nothing but a happy Hey Bud, let's go! as if nothing happened. No babying, no sympathy, just life as usual.

It's very easy to overlay verbal command or whistle commands with the ecollar. Start in the yard or other controlled-situation area. Give the command, and if the dog doesn't obey, nick. Just keep in mind that the nick is to reinforce a *known* command.
shags
GDF Junkie
 
Posts: 2220
Joined: Wed Jan 02, 2008 4:57 pm
Location: Please ADD LOCATION

Re: exercising my dog

Postby BuckeyeSteve » Sat Jun 09, 2018 10:02 pm

shags wrote:Some of the combos are awkward to operate in that you have to look at the handheld to be sure your thumb is on the correct button. I like having my ecollar transmitter set so I don't have to even think about anything but the correction.

I don't like that if one part of a combo needs repair, both parts have to be sent in. Then you have nothing for however long it takes to get your unit back.

But when it's all said and done, it's totally personal preference, no more or less.

You don't want to zap your dog unless you can see what he's doing. You might be unknowlingly punishing him for doing something good, like standing a bird or even coming back to you. Don't correct what you can't see. When the time comes there will plenty of help for you from the good folks here.

To trashbreak, most set their collars waaay up so the dog thinks the deer he's chasing has fired thunderbolts from its butt. One great big correction, maybe two for a bonehead dog, and most likely you're done for a good long while. Nagging with ever increasing nicks is a waste of time. IDK if you know or not, but it owrks well to set the dog up by taking him to an area that holds deer. If or when he jumps one, you say nothing...let him get into the chase for a few seconds, then zap him from here to Tuesday. He'll most likely yelp and do a airborne double twist about face and you'll feel horrible...but then he'll stop and look for you, or come back to you. You say nothing but a happy Hey Bud, let's go! as if nothing happened. No babying, no sympathy, just life as usual.

It's very easy to overlay verbal command or whistle commands with the ecollar. Start in the yard or other controlled-situation area. Give the command, and if the dog doesn't obey, nick. Just keep in mind that the nick is to reinforce a *known* command.



Alright, one more (I think) question on this subject.... from this discussion so far I've started looking at the Delta Sport XC (220.00) and Garmin Sport Pro (250.00). They seem to be almost identical except the XC has more stim levels and the Sport Pro has beacon lights. If I get one of these, then add a GPS in later.... I'm looking at having a ID collar, a flea & tick collar, an e-collar, and a GPS collar all on the dog at once. Being that I've never done any of this before....it seems a little much to have four things on the dogs neck at once. Is this a valid concern or no?
User avatar
BuckeyeSteve
Rank: Senior Hunter
 
Posts: 112
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2017 10:09 am
Location: Valencia, PA (north of Pgh)

Re: exercising my dog

Postby shags » Sun Jun 10, 2018 5:08 am

I'm not familiar with either of those collars, but for me, having a gazllion intensity settings isn't necessay. My TT collar has nick or continuous then 1-6 on each of those, and that's plenty.

You can add ID plates to the electronic collars and skip the regular collar for training/conditioning sessions. Or just have all on, with the ecollar up tight and close to the ears, then the regular collar, then the gps. the flea collar can come off for the time being or find its own spot .

IDK if they still offer it, but TT had a little ecollar for small dogs that paired with their pro series handheld. Range is 1/2 mile IIRC ( have one for my 20# terrier and often use it on the smaller setter).
shags
GDF Junkie
 
Posts: 2220
Joined: Wed Jan 02, 2008 4:57 pm
Location: Please ADD LOCATION

Re: exercising my dog

Postby Thinblueline » Wed Jun 13, 2018 9:23 am

BuckeyeSteve wrote:
shags wrote:Some of the combos are awkward to operate in that you have to look at the handheld to be sure your thumb is on the correct button. I like having my ecollar transmitter set so I don't have to even think about anything but the correction.

I don't like that if one part of a combo needs repair, both parts have to be sent in. Then you have nothing for however long it takes to get your unit back.

But when it's all said and done, it's totally personal preference, no more or less.

You don't want to zap your dog unless you can see what he's doing. You might be unknowlingly punishing him for doing something good, like standing a bird or even coming back to you. Don't correct what you can't see. When the time comes there will plenty of help for you from the good folks here.

To trashbreak, most set their collars waaay up so the dog thinks the deer he's chasing has fired thunderbolts from its butt. One great big correction, maybe two for a bonehead dog, and most likely you're done for a good long while. Nagging with ever increasing nicks is a waste of time. IDK if you know or not, but it owrks well to set the dog up by taking him to an area that holds deer. If or when he jumps one, you say nothing...let him get into the chase for a few seconds, then zap him from here to Tuesday. He'll most likely yelp and do a airborne double twist about face and you'll feel horrible...but then he'll stop and look for you, or come back to you. You say nothing but a happy Hey Bud, let's go! as if nothing happened. No babying, no sympathy, just life as usual.

It's very easy to overlay verbal command or whistle commands with the ecollar. Start in the yard or other controlled-situation area. Give the command, and if the dog doesn't obey, nick. Just keep in mind that the nick is to reinforce a *known* command.



Alright, one more (I think) question on this subject.... from this discussion so far I've started looking at the Delta Sport XC (220.00) and Garmin Sport Pro (250.00). They seem to be almost identical except the XC has more stim levels and the Sport Pro has beacon lights. If I get one of these, then add a GPS in later.... I'm looking at having a ID collar, a flea & tick collar, an e-collar, and a GPS collar all on the dog at once. Being that I've never done any of this before....it seems a little much to have four things on the dogs neck at once. Is this a valid concern or no?


Yes, you would have four collars in that situation. I have a small French Brittany with a little pencil neck. I opted for one of the Dogtra e-collars with low to medium stimulation and a 1/2 mile range. It was about the smallest e-collars I could find. It got great reviews and I am very pleased with it. I now have the money saved for a Garmin Astro 430 T5 Mini tracking collar which I’ll buy in a couple months. It also has a small collar, allowing me to use both the e-collar and tracking collar without the dog having to drag his head through the dirt. Right now I use K9 Advantix II topical tick preventative, but I am thinking of switching to a Serestro tick collar. And of course I will also have his ID collar that has his name, my name, town and phone number. The key is going with the smaller training and tracking collar and it shouldn’t be too much of a burden for him. Next thing I have to decide is if I’m going to shed his bell or not. I want to know where he is, generally, without always having to look at the screen, and yet I’d like to preserve his hearing while giving me a little more stealth in the grouse woods.
Thinblueline
Rank: Junior Hunter
 
Posts: 37
Joined: Sat May 13, 2017 7:30 pm
Location: Please ADD LOCATION

Re: exercising my dog

Postby BuckeyeSteve » Thu Jun 14, 2018 4:24 am

"Yes, you would have four collars in that situation. I have a small French Brittany with a little pencil neck. I opted for one of the Dogtra e-collars with low to medium stimulation and a 1/2 mile range. It was about the smallest e-collars I could find. It got great reviews and I am very pleased with it. I now have the money saved for a Garmin Astro 430 T5 Mini tracking collar which I’ll buy in a couple months. It also has a small collar, allowing me to use both the e-collar and tracking collar without the dog having to drag his head through the dirt. Right now I use K9 Advantix II topical tick preventative, but I am thinking of switching to a Serestro tick collar. And of course I will also have his ID collar that has his name, my name, town and phone number. The key is going with the smaller training and tracking collar and it shouldn’t be too much of a burden for him. Next thing I have to decide is if I’m going to shed his bell or not. I want to know where he is, generally, without always having to look at the screen, and yet I’d like to preserve his hearing while giving me a little more stealth in the grouse woods."
[/quote] Thinblueline

,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

That's a question I've brought up but haven't heard any kind of answer on....do the bells hurt a dog's hearing over time? I have a LCS Long Range bell, and it's loud. I worry ringing in his ears all the time will do damage. It would certainly damage mine, I'd think.
We just switched from a topical that worked really well for ticks to the soresto, and I hate it. Maybe it's just that my wife clipped it too short, but it doesn't quite go through the second collar loop. It's difficult to put on b/c my dog twists and chews and tries to play the whole time I'm trying to get it on (it doesn't go on a moving dog easily), and I end up being an a**hole to my dog...pinning him down....to get the thing on. Then, once it's on, every time i reach down to grab him by the collar to move him someplace it pulls right off easily, which is super frustrating.
User avatar
BuckeyeSteve
Rank: Senior Hunter
 
Posts: 112
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2017 10:09 am
Location: Valencia, PA (north of Pgh)

Re: exercising my dog

Postby Trekmoor » Thu Jun 14, 2018 5:15 am

BuckeyeSteve wrote:
.
3. When we're out exercising and I let him roam the farm, I whistle with no commands so he knows where I am.
.


I have nothing at all to add to any advice about collars etc. because I don't use collars or bells. The above did make me wonder though.
I do something I call "anxiety training" while pups are still pretty young. I go into quite thick woodlands with a pup and then let the pup find out that it is it's job to find me and to keep contact with me and not the other way around.

This involves deliberately "losing" the pup . I take the opposite fork through the woods to whichever one the pup has gone up or I hide behind a tree or bush where I can see the pup but it cannot see me. Then I whistle recall the pup. It searches for me and I let it find me or help it to find me.

If I were to almost constantly whistle to the pup or call to the pup then it would know my whereabouts .....and have no good reason to find me or recall to me.

My pointing dogs, including the brittanies I've owned, have all hunted out to several hundreds of yards on suitable ground ....but they kept close watch on my whereabouts as they hunted. I did not have to go to look for them .


I realise this is not what many American hunters might want, you have taken a more technical route towards knowing where your dogs are but I thought it might be worth mentioning a more "ancient" method because it does still work.

By whistling almost constantly or by calling out to your dog you are telling it where you are ....thus diminishing any desire on the dogs part to keep in touch with you or to find you. Call the dog when you want it back but otherwise keep pretty quiet.

Bill T.
Trekmoor
GDF Junkie
 
Posts: 1706
Joined: Fri Dec 28, 2007 5:09 pm
Location: Scotland

Re: exercising my dog

Postby shags » Thu Jun 14, 2018 6:15 am

Steve, try snugging up the Seresto collar and using a strip of Gorilla Tape around the first loop and however much excess collar you have extending to the second loop.

Worked for me last year when one dog kept pulling another dog's collar off.
shags
GDF Junkie
 
Posts: 2220
Joined: Wed Jan 02, 2008 4:57 pm
Location: Please ADD LOCATION

Re: exercising my dog

Postby birddogger2 » Fri Jun 15, 2018 2:44 pm

Trekmoor wrote:
BuckeyeSteve wrote:
.
3. When we're out exercising and I let him roam the farm, I whistle with no commands so he knows where I am.
.


I have nothing at all to add to any advice about collars etc. because I don't use collars or bells. The above did make me wonder though.
I do something I call "anxiety training" while pups are still pretty young. I go into quite thick woodlands with a pup and then let the pup find out that it is it's job to find me and to keep contact with me and not the other way around.

This involves deliberately "losing" the pup . I take the opposite fork through the woods to whichever one the pup has gone up or I hide behind a tree or bush where I can see the pup but it cannot see me. Then I whistle recall the pup. It searches for me and I let it find me or help it to find me.

If I were to almost constantly whistle to the pup or call to the pup then it would know my whereabouts .....and have no good reason to find me or recall to me.

My pointing dogs, including the brittanies I've owned, have all hunted out to several hundreds of yards on suitable ground ....but they kept close watch on my whereabouts as they hunted. I did not have to go to look for them .


I realise this is not what many American hunters might want, you have taken a more technical route towards knowing where your dogs are but I thought it might be worth mentioning a more "ancient" method because it does still work.

By whistling almost constantly or by calling out to your dog you are telling it where you are ....thus diminishing any desire on the dogs part to keep in touch with you or to find you. Call the dog when you want it back but otherwise keep pretty quiet.

Bill T.



\I guess I am pretty ancient as well, because I do the "Hide and seek" with my youngsters as well. The only thing is, I do not call or whistle. I just stop and hide. It is amazing how fast they figure out that they are "alone" in those big woods and how fast they figure out where I am. He is 100% on the dog having to keep one eye and one ear glued on YOU...and not the other way 'round.

Field trailers are typically singing to their dogs...it is true. But Trekmoor has it right. The singing is(or should be) to let the dog know where the HANDLER is, so the dog does not need to come back and check in, but can stay out front and keep hunting.

When I WANT to see my dog...I shut up and...lo and behold...in a couple of minutes the dog shows up looking for me. If it does not...it is more than likely on point somewhere.

It has happened that way far too many times for it to be accidental and most of my dogs can and will reel off big chunks of real estate, especially when in front of a horse.

FWIW, a big running dog HAS to have comeback or you got zilch. The bigger the dog can run, the more independence the dog is allowed...the more desire to stay with you it HAS to have. I know this may sound counter intuitive, but it really is the way it is. That dog that is a half mile away, running free... has got to really want to stay in touch...or it will be gone...goodbye. If it is a half mile away..it already IS gone, in reality. It really IS out of the handler's sphere of control. The only thing that keeps the dog...is its desire to stay with you, to hunt with you and for you. That is why I do whatever, I can...whatever it takes to make friends with the lunatic dogs I hunt with. If they like you... they come back for you. If they don't like you...not so much.

The good ones, the ones that win...know where you are, where you are headed and they stay to the front and stay in touch. Truth.

RayG
birddogger2
Rank: Senior Hunter
 
Posts: 157
Joined: Wed Apr 19, 2017 6:15 am
Location: Lower slower Delaware

Re: exercising my dog

Postby averageguy » Fri Jun 15, 2018 3:46 pm

Guess I am old school as well. Have been using the silent treatment to condition my puppies to keep track of me for a long while now. I start taking them on daily walks at 8-9 weeks of age and as they become bolder and start reaching out, I will hide and let them look for me. They learn to loop around and cut my boot track and run it on into me. The less I blow a whistle or give a voice command the better I like it.
averageguy
Rank: Master Hunter
 
Posts: 246
Joined: Mon Dec 04, 2017 8:07 am
Location: Please ADD LOCATION

Re: exercising my dog

Postby Featherfinder » Fri Jun 15, 2018 8:04 pm

This hiding from a dog thing works....if the dog has any interest in finding you.
With other dogs/pups, you may sneak a peak just in time to find you ain't got a dog anymore!?!
:cry:
User avatar
Featherfinder
Rank: Champion
 
Posts: 395
Joined: Wed Dec 16, 2015 3:15 pm
Location: Please ADD LOCATION

Re: exercising my dog

Postby Meller » Sat Jun 16, 2018 4:53 am

[quote="Featherfinder"]This hiding from a dog thing works....if the dog has any interest in finding you.
With other dogs/pups, you may sneak a peak just in time to find you ain't got a dog anymore!?!
:cry:[

If hiding isn't working for you, seems to me you may be starting to late in the dogs life; I like to start this at 8to10 weeks, just when their starting to explore!
Works for me! :)
Meller
Rank: 5X Champion
 
Posts: 1031
Joined: Sat Mar 29, 2008 10:28 am
Location: Missouri

Re: exercising my dog

Postby Jetrain » Sun Jun 17, 2018 9:16 pm

If you want a good training book, get the Burnt Creek Method of Dog Training from Burnt Creek Press. It will answer your questions.
Jetrain
Rank: Just A Pup
 
Posts: 3
Joined: Fri Mar 30, 2018 11:05 pm
Location: Please ADD LOCATION

Re: exercising my dog

Postby birddogger2 » Wed Jun 20, 2018 6:48 am

Featherfinder wrote:This hiding from a dog thing works....if the dog has any interest in finding you.
With other dogs/pups, you may sneak a peak just in time to find you ain't got a dog anymore!?!
:cry:


And that is when the name and phone # on the collar may come in to play. But seriously... I have never seen the hiding thing fail when done with a puppy. If one waits to instill that lesson until the dog is over six months of age... I suspect you may have a problem with a truly independent dog.

However...the harsh reality is that if a dog does not want to be with you....

On the multiple collar thing, I remember seeing a "removable" identification nameplate in a catalog. As I recall, it was a brass nameplate with a keeper on each end and you slid the collar through the two keepers before snugging the collar up to the dog's neck.

RayG
birddogger2
Rank: Senior Hunter
 
Posts: 157
Joined: Wed Apr 19, 2017 6:15 am
Location: Lower slower Delaware

Re: exercising my dog

Postby polmaise » Wed Jun 20, 2018 5:07 pm

Yea, well if a dog don't wanna be with you ,then that's nothing to do with a collar . maybe you just ain't ...
I Trust dogs . lol
polmaise
GDF Junkie
 
Posts: 2054
Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2012 2:08 pm
Location: Scotland

Re: exercising my dog

Postby birddogger2 » Thu Jun 21, 2018 6:57 am

polmaise wrote:Yea, well if a dog don't wanna be with you ,then that's nothing to do with a collar . maybe you just ain't ...
I Trust dogs . lol



I agree completely. The bonding process whereby a dog decides to be a part of YOUR pack is easiest( I think) to get done when the pup is quite young. If you wait until the dog has its legs and is full of itself, it might be more challenging of a task.

Interestingly, I have also observed that a dog that has been raised in a purely kennel environment can be very easy to bond with an individual hunter. Over the years I obtained dogs that were field trial washouts as hunting dogs and family pets. Even though they were still in an outside kennel, they got messed with and played with every day, sometimes several times a day, by different family members especially my young son. They seemed to understand that they kinda hit the lottery as far as a life situation is concerned and responded accordingly.

I have said it many times....If a pointer likes you and wants to be with you, it will come back for you, from wherever it may roam. It will find a way. If it don't...it won't. A pointer that does not want to be with you will find a way to get off from you.

RayG
birddogger2
Rank: Senior Hunter
 
Posts: 157
Joined: Wed Apr 19, 2017 6:15 am
Location: Lower slower Delaware


Return to Training

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests

| Pedigrees

THIS POST : exercising my dog brought to you by Gun Dog Supply: Dog Training Collars & Hunting Dog Supplies

Click here to tweet this post

  • NOT logged in
  • exercising my dog
  • ./viewtopic.php?f=89&t=53052&start=0&sid=571576c67ddaf591c28bcd7685e47967