Help my Brit is Gun Shy???

[seuss79]

My Brittany, Louie, is gun shy.

He is now 5 months old. I haven't shot a gun with him around but he runs for the hills with a kids cap gun.
I have done the clapping with him eating and banging on pots and pans, that doesn't bother him. So with his first season coming up I figured that now is the time to introduce the cap gun. Tail between the legs and away he goes.

He isn't the greatest eater so I when I mix a little table scraps with his food that's when I am practicing. If the table scraps are in the food I can pop the gun a couple of times and he continues to eat without flinching but when he gets his fill he hides under the table for a few seconds until he knows I put it up.

Should I continue to work at this this way or do any of you have any different methods to try.

I want to do this right. I'd love to take him out with my new shotgun this fall and not have him scared.

[Maurice]

Quit banging on stuff.. Get him on some birds and build his drive.. When he is on fire about birds then introduce the gun while he is chasing. It might take 2 or 3 months before he is ready for the gun, take your time, do not get in a hurry. If you have a experienced dog trainer close by, pro or amateur seek thier help.

Mo

[Triple R]

I use the George Hickox method, get the pup excitied about birds and then throw a bird out and when the pup chases after it fire your cap gun. It worked well for me.

[kninebirddog]

yep stop banging and banging trick to that is make a noise and then leave it alone

then it becomes nothing but if you keep banging your pushing it to failure

as maurice stated ... get the pup real excited about birds and until the pup is totally excited about birds and is in full chase on a bird do not intro the gun in the shooting in the reverse direction ONE SHOT if no reaction great stop there if there is a reaction do not acknowledge the dog with any coddling walk on like nothing happened and get some pro help

[bobman]

I sincerely would like to choke the daylights out of the person who came up with that "shoot or bang pots while they eat" nonsense. Thats frightened more pups than its ever helped.

Forget the pot banging ect. Its unreliable some dogs it works some it doesn’t.

Never ever ever shoot a gun around any dog especially a pup unless the pup is intent on a bird after having a lot of exposure to birds. Or if a retriever it should be crazy about retrieveing dummies before the gun is introduced.

I've posted this before, its something I sent a kid awhile back.

Heres how to proceed there are still pockets of pheasants in Ill. good places to find them are near city limits where hunting is not allowed near corn fields or find some landowner that has some birds are necessary. If you can locate roosts by watching big corn fields at dusk thats where you should get the dog into birds. Lots of birds.

Now you need to start over

1)First put the gun away, then work the dog for a while on birds at least a couple weeks, get her birdy really talk her up after the flush with no gun shots, just work her on birds until she really shows she knows whats a bird is and is really birdy with great excitement. If she chases flushed birds thats good let her, in fact encourage it, let her know that finding and chasing birds is really a good thing.

2)then do the same thing for a week or two ( a lot of bird contacts and points )with the gun and no shells, let her get used to the sight of the gun until she ignores it and focuses completely on the birds.


3) then with a 22 rifle and the weakest blanks available, start shooting after the flush when shes chasing and really keyed up, shoot just once use a single shot bolt action 22 rifle,not a pistol, point the muzzle away from her and shoot only when shes really focused and chasing the flushed bird.

4) Shoot only once every two or three birds for the first week, until she pays no attention to it at all.

5) If she shows any fear or uncertainty go back to just bird work until she is focused on the birds again.

6)after she shows no sign of hearing the 22 with the light blanks shoot a pheasant use only one shot use a light load and make that shot count this part is important because she has to see the bird fall at the instant the shot occcurs, if you have her drive up that will overcome any residual fear she may have.

7) this fall only hunt her by yourself and try to never shoot more than once, do not hunt with multiple people
After a season she should be OK but I would be cautious even second season

You owe it to her, shes just confused and you made her that way, so please try to fix her.

Good luck take it slow birdiness is everything,


I don't allow gunshots around my dogs without birds present, even my older well broke dogs, not ever.

[RayGubernat]

Seusss -

I agree with putting the gun away nd building drive and desire. That is the only thing that can overcome the fear.

You have indeed dug yourself a hole. Now it is up to you to do what you need to do to climb out of that hole. Many years ago I made my dog gunshy through my own stupidity. It took me almost and entire season to get the dog over it, but I made the mess and I was determined to fix it. She went on to become an excellent gundog. Yours can too.

One thing you can do is get a bag of pigeons and go for a walk or ride on a quad. Toss a pigeon and let the dog chase it. When the dog gets tired of chasing that one, it will come back. Call it in, give it a drink of water start out again and toss another pigeon. Chasing pigeons can do a lot of good things for a youngster,and calling it back in and giving it a drink is a great way to get the dog used to coming back for you when you call, so you can kill a bunch of birds, so to speak, with a single stone. When you are done you just might have a dog that stands there and watches the bird fly off.

If you do this for three or four weeks, as welll as other bird contacts, you should have a dog that is pretty hyped up about birds and pretty hyped up about going out, in general.

Once you have that, then, when the dog is in full chase and paying absolutely no attention to you, shoot the gun as descrbed above, in the opposite direction from which the dog is running.

If the dog tucks and runs away...get professional help. If not...proceed cautiously. You goal is to convert that fear of gunfire into something that the dog not only does not fear, but actually will run toward because it is a signal that there are birds there.


RayG

[gar-dog]

I followed the methods above and had zero problem with my Brit so far in the gun department. We are at the stage where I fire a blank pistol when I flush the bird and there is zero reaction from her. I ran her on birds occassionally for a month or two. The very first time with the pistol I had someone hold her about 40 yards away, I threw a quail in the air and popped the gun as she chased. I can fire right beside her now with no effect on her, but I never do it unless a bird flushes. We have not graduated to a shotgun yet, but when I do I will probably do it 40 or more yards away like the first time I did the blank pistol.

So just back off a bit, get on birds, and go back to square one.

Good luck,
G

[gar-dog]

We should have one of the pros do an INTRO to GUNFIRE thread and sticky it right here.

[ezzy333]

We should have one of the pros do an INTRO to GUNFIRE thread and sticky it right here.

It wouldnt be a bad idea however it seems so simple to me. I have always just taken the pup out to the field and waited for it to be busy chasing or hunting at a distance and shot the 20 guage in the opposite direction. Pointing it away from the pup takes most of the loudness away and normally the most reaction you can expect is a stop and look from the pup. Some don't even hear it. Next day I do it closer and normally by the third day can shoot a pigeon over the pup with no reaction other than going to where the pigeon fell. From that time on the pup looks forward to the gun and knows a shot means a chance to get the bird.

For anyone in doubt about the pups reaction the first day you might want to progress slower through the whole routine. And I am not fond of using blank pistols or rifles with a new puppy. Those sounds are much higher pitched and I think causes the pup more distress than a low pitched shotgun ever would. But rather than just make noise I try to move to actually killing a bird fairly quickly so the pup knows the gun is a pleasant experience rather than just a loud noise.

Ezzy

[seuss79]

Thanks for the help.

Just to clarify though, he has not been around any real gun fire. Just the cap gun for the past three or four days. Only 1-4 pops each of those nights. Even on the 4th of July we kept him in the house because I figured the big bangs would scare him. He was still scared in the house.

At the moment getting him on live birds is a bit of a problem. I don't have any and am not for sure where to get some right now. I know plenty of farmers and am sad to say that here in northeastern illinois pheasants are few and far unless you are on public ground where they stock them. After sept 1st I can get out on some public ground.

This is my first hunting dog and I don't want to screw it up so I guess I'll scrap the cap gun. It's funny how nothing seems to phase "Louie" except for loud pops.

I appreciate the knowledge you all share but am curious as to if you think there are any other ways I can try to add to get rid of his gunshyness.

Louie get's extremely birdy around the birds I have been fortunate enough to get him around but like I said, city ordinances made me get rid of the few quail I had in my back yard and keeping them at my dad's in the country didn't work out so well this summer.

[bullseyebill]

I understand your dilemma, I too am in NE Illinois (Libertyville). There are no wild birds here!!!!!! or anywhere close that a person has access to!!!! Where are you at? I know there is a gunfire tape that the professional trainer we took our dog to in Iowa used that seemed to help. It's very soft gunfire to music and then gets more and more. Our dog wasn't keen on loud noises especially fireworks. And I know some people say there is no relationship between fireworks and gunfire and dogs afraid of one don't necessarily mean they are afraid of the other however, our dog was unbelievably afraid of fireworks, loud noise, gun fire and after the tape, she is not afraid of fireworks (fell asleep during the firworks on the 4th, not afraid of loud noises, and not afraid of gun fire). However every dog is different.

Anyway, here's the url for the tape: http://www.gundogsupply.com/gunshycure.html

[seuss79]

Bullseybill,

I'm from the Kankakee area. You might be more familiar with Wilmington that is close by. As far as the tape I am very doubtful about that. Movies with surround sound with gun shots don't scare him. I like my weekend movies loud too. The only sound or anything that seems to scare him is the crack of the cap gun.

I just figure that if I take out the 20ga. and fire off a shot with a bird nearby he will relate the two in a bad way. But.... The consensus here seems to say that is the way to do it.

As far as a trainer, well this year hasn't been the greatest year in the building trades for an electrician. Funny how that economy works.

I know this will take time and work on my part. Maybe I'm just jumping the gun and most all pups are scared at first or for a couple of days when they here that crack.????

[ezzy333]

One thing I think you are conbfused on. Your pup isn't gunshy but just shy of loud or sharp noises. I would forget the tape or you might add to your problem if you really have one.

If you want some pigeons I have some homers I need to get rid of and Im not far from you. Let me know as I am going to move them soon. Also if you want bring your pup out and we can work with it a little and see what is going on.

Ezzy

[bobman]

One thing I think you are conbfused on. Your pup isn't gunshy but just shy of loud or sharp noises. I would forget the tape or you might add to your problem if you really have one.

If you want some pigeons I have some homers I need to get rid of and Im not far from you. Let me know as I am going to move them soon. Also if you want bring your pup out and we can work with it a little and see what is going on.

Ezzy

Thats a generous offer you should take.

[gar-dog]

If you want some pigeons I have some homers I need to get rid of and Im not far from you. Let me know as I am going to move them soon. Also if you want bring your pup out and we can work with it a little and see what is going on.

Do this!

[romeo212000]

I would take the offer. I was going to respond with a lengthy post but seems everyone else covered it. Main thing is get the dog focused on birds then from a long distance fire the gun or cap gun or whatever. I bet when the dog starts to associate gun fire with birds he will start to enjoy the sight of the shotgun.

[nj gsp]

Bill Tarrant said it best: There is no problem that can't be fixed with birds.

[kninebirddog]

if you do that with the birds besure the dog is in full chase gaet where the dog has chased a few birds for a few days before you intro a ONE SHOT AND ONE SHOT ONLY in the opposite direction and if there is ANY signs of nervousness walk on and act like nothing happened when the dog is freely checking things out then your done if the dog has no reaction your done fore the day

DO NOT PUSH TO FAILURE

also at home ...one noise banging away and making a deal about it your causing a huge problem

even with fire works petting a dog is rewarding a scared behavior coddling only rewards getting upset will only further


but fire works and gunshots are not the same

[Lab Man]

I did not read every post. At our kennel was specialize in breaking gun shy dogs. As I saw in someone else's post its all about the birds. If a dog has good desire for birds in most cases I can break them from gun shyness. If you would like some tips and advise you can call me at (712) 830-8525. I would be glad to help you through this process. With the right advise you can easily cure your dog. Good luck

[seuss79]

I've pm'd ezzy and plan to get some pigeons.

But now I fear I have a bigger problem. When I started this post I took advice and stopped immediately with the cap gun. "Louie" has been completely fine up until last night. So the 17th was the last day for the cap gun.

Last night I get home from work and guess what. Louie is acting himself comes up and greets me like normal. But about an hour later I figured I'd play fetch with him and he wouldn't fetch. No big deal but I noticed he'd tuck his tail and put his head down when he came to me.

Very puzzleing, he is acting like he is scared of me. I have never hit my dog. I have raised my voice when telling him no in the past but nothing to make such a sudden change.

Today I come home from work and he comes and greets me with tail tucked and head down. again no fetch. So just a few minutes ago I tell him "come" and again he comes head down and tail tucked but this time pees on the floor. If that doesn't spell scared I don't know what does.

Does this mean he relates the cap gun to me. He didn't do this until a couple of days after I stopped with the cap gun.

How do I go about fixing this.
I hope I didn't screw this up.

[seuss79]

Never mind he snapped out of it and is back to himself. He had me going for a while. It's the weirdest thing though. I wonder if it has anything to do with that for the last week I've been working 16 hour days and he has only been seeing me for about 2hours a night before I go to bed.

Or I wonder since he has been getting his adult teeth maybe he hurt himself playing fetch with me, anyways I am relieved.

Now to get rid of his shyness to loud noises.

[romeo212000]

It could be anything. Your dog could have just been going through a weird day. Some days dogs will act as though you wonder if someon replaced your dog with an identical dog programmed to nothing you tell it to and the next day they are as sharp as a tack. I have given up trying to figure out dogs and just do my best to work with what they give me.