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GSP Behavior problems..please help

GSP Behavior problems..please help

Postby technomaniac » Fri Oct 24, 2008 9:30 pm

Hello All,

This is my first post but i have been and avid reader for a long time. I just have some questions that maybe some of you can help me with.

My GSP is 18months and i am having major issues with him. Here's a little background...Hunting is not his issue. He is an absolute machine in the field...but EVERYTHING ELSE is his problem. He is a male short hair that is wired for sound 24/7. To the point i think that he may be schitzofranic..lol. He is so jacked up that its just unbearable sometimes and i dont know what to do. I have had him to trainer twice. He has been fully whistle trained whoa broke the works. But he just doesnt listen. Its like he forgets what he has learned. We'll be in the back yard and i will give him the command to "come" and he will just stand there and look at me. But if he has a collar on he will obey and i wont correct him. He knows when the collar is on that he has to obey but when its not on he doesnt have to. So frustrating. When i got him i wanted a hunting companion and a best buddy. He's in the kennel during the day and in the house at night and house traing him has been a real chore. Because he gets so excited that when he comes in side he runs a 100 miles an hour and just wrecks everything. God bless my wife she has put up with alot..lol Dont get me wrong i have corrected him his whole life when he acts like this but it hasnt seemed to work. I just dont know what to do. I must be doing something wrong

Back to the field...he is a champion hunter( with the bloodlines to boot)...i mean he tears it up. But everything else is where the issue lies. He doesnt listen to me at all. He is sooooo jacked up its like he goes deaf. And because of this he gets out way to far and just causes all kinds of problems. The thing that bothers me the most is that i always here guys talking about how GSP's are so loyal and go out of there way to hunt for YOU. I wish i felt that way. Mine could absolutly care less where i am at and what im doing.. He does his own thing. Could care less what im doing. I just dont know what to do. I tried for a month just to teach him to lay down...and he lays down....for a milisecond and then he's bouncing off the walls again...lol...its overthetop

Has Any one else experienced this type of behavior? Any help would be greatly appreciated. Im at my whits end.

Thanks in advance to everyone

Jeff whiteley

To see him (he's beautiful Black GSP) goto

www.myspace.com/whiteazz11
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Re: GSP Behavior problems..please help

Postby rockllews » Fri Oct 24, 2008 10:56 pm

Some dogs are just more wired than others. We've got one pup right now who's more of a handful than whole litters of pups- really, but I still like him :wink:

As to yours' activity level: The first thing that comes to my mind is how much real exercise a day does he get? Any free-running in a large field? Walks/runs? How long? Any play with other dogs?

Have you guys ever crate trained him? If not, I would start or limit his free-rein in the house to one blocked off room. Or tether him in the house. Kenneling all day and then bringing him into the house, for some high energy dogs, sort of spells disaster... as you've experienced.

It sounds like he's become collar wise. You said he seems to forget his training after he's been to two pros. Questions- how long was he with them and did you work with the trainer to learn how he was taught, reinforced, corrected etc? How often are you working with him now? Just some more info is needed to get the real trainers on here started. I'll leave it to them. But good luck!
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Re: GSP Behavior problems..please help

Postby technomaniac » Sat Oct 25, 2008 6:12 am

I am a guide at a hunting resort so from about oct through march he gets hunted every weekend. He gets quite a bit of excerise. My yard is about 30 yards long by about 40 yards wide and he has plenty of room to run. I also road him about twice a week for about 3-4 miles. Mostly because he is so jacked up thats one of the only ways that i can make him manageable in the house. He is not in his kennel all day and the into the house. Kennel from 730-430....outside until about 8pm then in the house but while he is outsie if he knows i'm home he just site by the back door. Its annoying. He sleeps in his dog box in the house which he goes to bed about 1130pm. Yes he is crate trained. We also have a a dog park that is about 50 acres that he goes to also. He's with other dogs when he hunts. He is usually one of 2 or 3 dogs and has no issues (well he plays pretty ruff with them ..only a select few stick around to play with him but he is in no way mean to any dogs).

He has been to to trainers that had him for a month each. The first trainer kind of started him in everything. Whistle, birds, collar, ect. The other trainer was suppposed to whoa him...which he did but not on birds...longs story there but i will be send him again to get that retaught. The trainers showed me what they were did with him but not much to correct him ect. ect. I hope this answers you questions...i'll be watching frequently...anymore questions please let me know. I love this dog and he has great potential so its important to me to get that situation addressed.
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Re: GSP Behavior problems..please help

Postby bobman » Sat Oct 25, 2008 6:40 am

Its a common complaint and why you see many very good GSPs and Eps in rescue.

Jeff what you have is a perfectly normal young GSP from high powered lines, he is what he is and thats because of how he was bred not anything you did.

You need to learn to cope with it or make the very hard decision to find him a home with someone that wants that type of dog IMO.

My FT shorthairs are full of heck as well, the only thing that settles them down is exercise and lots of it. You cannot hold breeding against the dog we did it to him.

One thing never let him out without the collar on, hes collar wise as you know so use that to your advantage that wont change either.

I have several dogs( 5 ) like that they slowed down around 6 years of age but were just like yours until then, they are 13 years old now and still active but in decline if they pass away in the next year and you need a home for the dog I would look at him.

I have a EP like him now, I like him, my wife gets a little rattled by him though. I have one room in my house that my TV is in and is dog proofed with a gate preventing entrance to the rest of the house I sit in their with my crazy dogs and rescues I work with in the evenings, it helps some, they calm down a little over a month or so, but it takes very little to trigger the same activity you are describing.

Good luck

Bob
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Re: GSP Behavior problems..please help

Postby snips » Sat Oct 25, 2008 9:59 am

A month, IMO, is not enough to train the dog steady on birds.
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Re: GSP Behavior problems..please help

Postby Ricky Ticky Shorthairs » Sat Oct 25, 2008 10:31 am

snips wrote:A month, IMO, is not enough to train the dog steady on birds.


I agree with Brenda 100%. When you send him back to the trainer, you need to send him for at least 2 months, preferably 3. Sending him to a summer camp in the Sandhills would be great experience for him. You need to work with your trainer as much as possible so you can see what he does and how he does it. You may end up doing some chores, but that is what it's all about. A lot of trainers will let you "practice" with their own dogs so you can get the experience of working with different dogs. Learning to read a dog's body language is 90% of training, the other 10% is going through the motions.

Every GSP that I have is from FT lines, and yes, they are all just as hyper as yours, but what I get in the field is well worth the trade off. IMO They start to chill after 4 or 5 years. You need to make him your buddy first and foremost. Let ride in the front seat of the truck with you. You'd be amazed how much that does for bonding. ie. getting him to listen to you.

Does your trainer train trial dogs or hunting dogs only? I can recomend some trainers that specialize in FT dogs, which is probably what your dog needs.

PM me, and we can discuss who you use and what you may need to change. (If anything) Just remember 1 1/2 years is still pretty young for a GSP that is wound as tight as yours.

What lines is he out of?

Doug
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Re: GSP Behavior problems..please help

Postby technomaniac » Sat Oct 25, 2008 5:32 pm

I dont want to be misunderstood....I WOULD NEVER GET RID OF HIM!! I love him to much and thats is why i want to take care of this problem.... I just want some help handeling him. I the sire side of his bloodline is full of trial champions and the female is of great german decent. Female is from Vom Hesser Kennels and the male is from Premier Gundogs of Halam Nebraska www.premiergundogs.com.

You say send him to a professional trainer for 3 months....and in that 3 months what is he supposed to do?
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Re: GSP Behavior problems..please help

Postby technomaniac » Sat Oct 25, 2008 5:33 pm

Premier Gundogs will be doing all my training also
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Re: GSP Behavior problems..please help

Postby muddycreek » Sat Oct 25, 2008 8:13 pm

I was in your same predicament a year or so ago. My 4 yr old Gsp was the most hyper dog I had ever seen. I seriously thought about selling her and getting a calmer dog a year or so ago. Not only was she hyper at home but all she seemed to want to do in the field was feel the wind in her ears while she was chasing the sun. I broke down and sent her to a trainer last summer, 3.5 months, and she found a purpose in life. Was it a "Super trainer" ? He tells me NO, she was just smarter and more stubborn than most and needed to learn her role. That and she matured and naturally settled down some. HE even said that if I ever needed to sell her to call him, he would take her in a minute.

I also have adjusted my routine, running with her every day, working on yard work, and I bought a new puppy. I have become much more fit and her less spaztic, a better relationship between the two of us, and the realization that a 20 week old pup makes her seem gereatric :lol: !

All in all, give him some more time and seriously consider a trainer for more than a month. Just my 2 cents.

Sounds like a great one in the making!
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Re: GSP Behavior problems..please help

Postby Sharon » Sat Oct 25, 2008 8:59 pm

I remember my 18 month old GSP. Loved that dog!
EXERCISE!! I let him run full out for an hour+ every day.Kept him quite manageable in the house. If your dog is in the kennel all day, this would explain his behaviour.

I'm not a mind reader but you sound like a kind gentle man.
This is great but an 18 month old GSP needs FIRM management - I'm not talking about an e-collar or any kind of abuse of course. He doesn't get away with anything.

Image ... (10 months ? ) See that big hook on his collar? It was there for a reason. :) .....pedigree goes back to Blue Dawn Kennels ( spitfire/wild child) He did great at Region 13 AFTCA trials.
Last edited by Sharon on Mon Oct 27, 2008 3:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: GSP Behavior problems..please help

Postby Firstdog » Mon Oct 27, 2008 1:46 pm

My dog is always full of it also. I bought a treadmill. after a few days, she loved that thing. she will go lay on it until i turn it on. she is on it everyday we don't go hunting.
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Re: GSP Behavior problems..please help

Postby Reech » Mon Oct 27, 2008 5:09 pm

Sharon wrote:I'm not a mind reader but you sound like a kind gentle man.
This is great but an 18 month old GSP needs FIRM management - I'm not talking about an e-collar or any kind of abuse of course. He doesn't get away with anything.


I Have to agree with the above.

My first and so far only GSP liked to "Blow me off" in the field, especially in hunt tests, in her first year and loved doing things for herself - which I found to be perfectly acceptable because she was very very young and still developing. At around a year we decided to "TRY" and see if we could Break her, how she would react to the process of breaking her. My training partner and I tried breaking her to Wing and shot. We ended up breaking her to Wing, shot, fall and release. It came very easy for her. She almost broke herself. She Knew what the WHOA Command meant. Some of her manners were still a little rough around the edges, which again was very acceptable for such a young dog.

Have you tried "Force Fetching" the dog? My dog no longer hunts for herself anymore. She Was FF at 15 mos old and has been a different dog ever since. We had one "Come to Jesus" meeting Where she was introduced to me - her handler in the field.

Reech
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Re: GSP Behavior problems..please help

Postby Margaret » Mon Oct 27, 2008 10:05 pm

GSP's with exercise just get fitter and fitter, and like an athlete they get very jumpy if the high level of
exercise isn't kept up.
It could be your dog is in fact over fit, you may have to work out just how much exercise he really needs
to keep him happy and healthy but less hyped up around the home.
I also suggest doing basic obedience drills on a long leash or check cord without the e-collar to cement his training, and it wouldn't hurt to give him a food treat with voice praise so he is coming to be rewarded (enjoyment).
It also sounds like he needs to be on leash in the house for a while, and to receive daily short obedience lessons so he
settles down and starts listening to you.
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Re: GSP Behavior problems..please help

Postby webbgundogs » Fri Oct 31, 2008 6:19 pm

Jeff
Check your PM
Thanks

Robert
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Re: GSP Behavior problems..please help

Postby MikeB » Fri Oct 31, 2008 10:14 pm

I agree with the others that you have a great young working field dog, not always suited as a house pet. I also agree with Margaret 100% and would like to add, Don't let him in the house directly out of his kennel. Work him on a lead in your yard for a while first.

I have a high end working German Shepherd that was much like yours when she was under two years old. heck on wheels and went thru 3 pet homes in 20 months of her life that couldn't handle her energy or inteligence level.

When I adopted her, she was an emotional and physical mess. Couldn't slow down enough to think straight. This dog needed a JOB where she had to slow down and think. When I got her I started her in basic obed. skill work every day when I got home. Like yours she was in a kennel from 5:30am to 4pm M-F. Ball play out of the kennel then taught the basic skills a little at a time. Food motivatoin worked wonders with her while teaching. Never use them now, don't need to.

I kept her on a lead and prong collar in the house too until I had good verbal control, never raising my voice to her. Plenty of chew toys in the house to keep her buys too. It didn't take long, couple of months maybe and she knew what was expected of her when in the house. She is the dream house dog now and would love to do real work if I had the time and energy. I run her on the bicycle, work her in my local park always on a 40 ft. line. Can't do off leash in the public areas here in town.

Teaching him basic obed. skills with leash and prong collar if needed. Old fashioned adult dog obedience training for pet dogs. Heel, Sit, Auto sit if you want, Down using voice and hand signal along your side when you stop heeling. Teach Down from the sit position. Teach Come on lead then on a long line at 10, 20, 30 ft. STAY in the Sit and Down position would be last.

When the hunting season is over and your don't need him in your guide work, enroll both of you in Pet dog group obedience classes in a park or parking lot wiht other dogs in your local area. If you want him to act like a Pet dog in the house then you have to teach him how to act like a Pet dog in the house. Now if his field training has included teaching him these basic skills then work them in the yard until he is very proficient on lead then slowly on the long line.

No matter what kind of working dogs we all own, they all need to know the 5 basic obedience skills. Heel, Sit, Stay, Down, and Come. Anything more than that is up to you and your dog. Start at ground zero and I am sure you can have a great house dog too. Just my opinion from a long time pet dog trainer.
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Re: GSP Behavior problems..please help

Postby bobman » Sat Nov 01, 2008 6:36 am

all my dogs are very obedient they still jump around the house when they are young, IMO its just part of it. My kids jumped around the house when they were little too I just enjoyed them knowing it would pass. Time solves amost everything with kids and dogs.
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Re: GSP Behavior problems..please help

Postby subatomicstang » Fri Dec 12, 2008 9:23 am

my pup is 4.5 months old, and at times he can tear it up we have 3 acres fenced in he is hyper in spurts and then he has his certain times of everyday he likes to lay with you and chew his bone and nap. Hes on a pretty good schedule. He is in the Kennel outside from 7 to 5 pm some days when wifes at work and i am gone on the tugboat, but his pappy comes over takes him out for an our around 12. Then at about 530 its balls to the walls for some playtime and pond hopping lol. i then work with him on heeling and comeing o nthe check cord. then afterwards we pla ysome more. By 1100 pm he is tuckered and ready for bed. up at 7am on the dot whimpering to go pottie! At times i thin kmy dog is pretty hyper, he gets real excited and he is real mouthy im trying t oget him to stop being so mouthy with these sharper than needles baby teeth! I l ove my pup and i wouldnt get rid of him either even if he did run through the house like a tornado which he does at times but usually trying to play with the cat. He quickly redirects when i say no!

-Randy
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Re: GSP Behavior problems..please help

Postby kninebirddog » Fri Dec 12, 2008 9:44 am

As for biting get that under control http://www.gundogforum.com/index.php?page=gdfarticle19

When one gives a puppy attention when they are hyper excited stae of mind it only rewards they behavior and they will not grow out of it.... wht you allow a dog to do you teach a dog to do puppys even more so

When i frst walk in as hard as it is I will not pay attention to my pups until they ahve 4 on th floor and are showing me the desired behaviors then i will reach down and say hi to them then

a 3 monh old jumping excid pup that gets acknowledge will grow up to be a full grown dog that jumps up on you

So Hyper spurts yes pups will go through them...
i don't say or do anything when the pup goes through them
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