Brittany pup wants to flush . . . help!

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conradr
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Brittany pup wants to flush . . . help!

Post by conradr » Wed Aug 05, 2009 2:05 pm

I'm totally new to the pointing dog scene, so I don't know what's common with a pup and what's not. Here's my situation: I have a 7 month old female Brittany. From an early age, she would sight-point nearly anything that moved - birds, flies, bugs, etc. Now she points them, then pounces. I started her on pigeons about a month and a half ago. It took a few times out before she figured out how to use her nose, but now she seems to understand that part of the game. I run her on a check-cord so I have control of her, but it seems to me that she should scent the birds before she does. Rarely does she seem to strike scent more than 10 feet from the bird (is this normal, or should she be striking scent from farther away?) - I always bring her in from down wind. When she strikes scent, she doesn't really "lock-up" as I've read on this forum; she wants to bolt right in and attack the bird. Of course I stop her with the check-cord and hold her steady while my kids go in and flush the bird, but I don't know if I should be doing something different. I'm spending a good deal of time trying to do right by the dog, but I'm wondering if I'm doing more harm than good. I've talked to several guys who say they didn't do much training at all with their pointing dogs, and they just picked it up naturally. Any suggestions are appreciated!

Also, I live in eastern Wisconsin (between Green Bay and Milwaukee), and I'm wondering if anyone knows of a source for pigeons for training and if there are any good professional trainers I might contact for some help. Any good training videos to recommnend?

Thanks for your time!

Rick

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hpvizslas
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Re: Brittany pup wants to flush . . . help!

Post by hpvizslas » Wed Aug 05, 2009 2:50 pm

Rick,

I don't know any trainers in your area but here are a few suggestions.

You might try and find a local breed club or pointing dog club that would be able to help you. Google Pointing dog training clubs and your area and see what you can find.

Are you dizzying the pigeons? You don't want the pup to catch the birds.

You may try and find a place with wild birds and run the pup in that area. This will help her to figure out that she cannot pounce on the bird. The pounce is a natural instinct for the dogs. This is why when a dog is pointing they will sometimes have different legs in the air. They stop in that pre-pounce stage.

What you are doing with the checkcord does sound correct, but one of the things that you did not describe is what you do while the kids flush.
Here is what I would do. Once you see any inclination that the dog smells the birds, stop her. With pressure on the cord (pulling it towards you), walk to the pup and kneel down beside pup. Continue to praise her with a good whoa good. Pet her and style her up however you would like. I pet them down the back and then raise up the tail. Once you get to the rear of the dog, put a little pressure on her hind end and push her forward, while continuing to keep her from lunging forward. Then have someone walk in and flush the bird.

This may not make sense as I have written it but I would be glad to explain or show you if you are ever in Nebraska. Let me know if you have any questions and good luck with the pup.

Jeff

Aggie007
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Re: Brittany pup wants to flush . . . help!

Post by Aggie007 » Wed Aug 05, 2009 3:22 pm

Couple of lessons I have picked up from my Brittany.

Like mine seems she isn't confident with her nose yet, that just takes time but she is picking up the bird's scent.

As soon as you think the has scent, stop her and get her to stay put without any pressure on the check cord. You can praise her by petting her. I learned to pet from the tail forward, which forces them to resist and stay pointing, and not break. If she does break, pick her up by the collar and under the belly and give her a good shake and reset her back in the same spot, she will understand she did something wrong.

Continue above till you can start walking in front of the pup her staying on point. You should get to the point where you can start flushing the birds yourself.

I would NOT use whoa unless you know the dog absolutely knows what it means. If you use it and the dog breaks it just means to chase or break point and not Stop and Stay Put.

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gonehuntin'
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Re: Brittany pup wants to flush . . . help!

Post by gonehuntin' » Wed Aug 05, 2009 3:52 pm

First, you said you're bringing her in downwind of the birds. This is incorrect. Bring her in crosswind so she smacks the scent instantly, not a little at a time. You will find that with a pup when you bring them in downwind, the scent gradually becomes stronger as the pup gets closer and they have the tendency to follow their nose and grab the bird.

A pointing dog trainer needs launchers. If you had a couple of launchers, you would bring the dog in crosswind on a cc and the instant you saw the dog hit the scent cone and not stop, pop the bird. Without launchers you can't get that instant response.

Try crosswind and see what happens bringing her in about 30' off the birds.
LIFE WITHOUT BIRD DOGS AND FLY RODS REALLY ISN'T LIFE AT ALL.

conradr
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Re: Brittany pup wants to flush . . . help!

Post by conradr » Wed Aug 05, 2009 9:17 pm

Thanks for the help offered thus far. In response to the question about what I do when the kids go in to flush, I approach the dog and kneel by her side, holding her collar to keep her from busting while the bird is released. Once she scents the bird and I stop her with the checkcord, I can actually walk around to the front of her without her lunging forward toward the bird. It's when the bird is released that she wants to chase. And if I didn't have the checkcord, she'd rush right in after the bird. Is this natural? Does it take them a while to stop at the scent, or should she be stopping on her own? She looks just like my lab did when he'd get birdy - nose to the ground, balls to the wall (pardon the expression), going after the bird.

Bringing the dog in from cross-wind seems to make some sense, too. I'll give that a try tomorrow.

The truth is, I'm running on a very limited supply of pigeons. This is sure to draw some laughs, but I've been tying a piece of garden hose to their legs so they can't fly far and I can recover them and use them again. This isn't my own idea - I got it from a training book I'm using.

Rick

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birddogger
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Re: Brittany pup wants to flush . . . help!

Post by birddogger » Wed Aug 05, 2009 9:23 pm

gonehuntin' wrote:First, you said you're bringing her in downwind of the birds. This is incorrect. Bring her in crosswind so she smacks the scent instantly, not a little at a time. You will find that with a pup when you bring them in downwind, the scent gradually becomes stronger as the pup gets closer and they have the tendency to follow their nose and grab the bird.

A pointing dog trainer needs launchers. If you had a couple of launchers, you would bring the dog in crosswind on a cc and the instant you saw the dog hit the scent cone and not stop, pop the bird. Without launchers you can't get that instant response.

Try crosswind and see what happens bringing her in about 30' off the birds.
Perfect advise. I can't add anything to this except to checkout any NAVHDA chapters that may be near you and join one. You will find members eager to help.

Charlie
If you think you can or if you think you can't, you are right either way

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gonehuntin'
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Re: Brittany pup wants to flush . . . help!

Post by gonehuntin' » Thu Aug 06, 2009 6:01 am

Chasing is natural for a dog. I do the same thing you're doing with the garden hose when pigeon supplies are tight. I think there is a HUGE advantage in doing it, in that when you release the dog, you make it quarter in another direction from the birds, not chase them. I like doing that rather than letting the bird fly away, then releasing the dog.

When I had multiple dogs I'd use the pigeons like that for the pup, then get an older dog to help me find the bird and pick it up.
LIFE WITHOUT BIRD DOGS AND FLY RODS REALLY ISN'T LIFE AT ALL.

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