Whoa post

[wine9555]

I have a 14 week old GSP that sits, stays, heels and comes to whistle. At what age is the best time to use a whoa post to train whoa or is there a better way.

[birddogger]

There are different methods that people use to whoa break, but at 14 weeks, I wouldn't do anything that required much pressure. What I do when they are that young is to start whoaing before they are allowed to come out the door of the kennel, crate, house or whatever. Just bump their nose with the door while using the whoa command. I then whoa them at the food bowl. I make them stand still until I give them a release command. You will be surprised at how fast they learn this.

I don't do any formal whoa training until they are older. I am talking nine, ten months or, depending on the individual dog, maybe a little older. When I do start formal whoa training, I find it goes much faster after using the methods I previously mentioned.

Other people on here that are more knowledgeable than I may have a different opinion, but this is what has worked for me.
Charlie

[bwjohn]

I believe that 14 weeks is way to early to start they whoa post, if that is your chosen method. I think, not for sure, but in that train of thought they like to wait until at least a year to do that kind of training.


My recommendations is to wait for a while to "brake" your dog. In the mean time enjoy him and do research. I would try to find a pro in the area that you can get good recommendations on and that you get a good connection with and learn his/her style. That way you always have someone to consult and show you how to correct problems when you hit snags.


Bottom line there is No "one way" or "best" way to train or brake a dog. Find a method and a mentor that you are confident with and have at it.

Brandon

[AZ Brittany Guy]

IMHO that is too young. Let him free run on wild birds or pigeons that can get away from him. (no talking or corrections) When he starts to point the wild birds or planted pigeons (launcher homers) then you can start the "whoa" yard training. Get experienced help on the whoa post. Someone with experience on the whoa post can read the dog and know when the dog submitted to the point of contact. Spend your yard work time right now, on come (here), kennel, and maybe some quartering drills (no birds). His time in the field right now should be happy time and building prey drive.

[Saltriver]

everybodies advice about waiting is right. i would only be concerned with "here" right now and with a pup that young that really should not be a big issue anyway. let him run, find and chase (not catch) birds for a while and when you have trouble getting him back get more serious about your recall command. wait for everything else until the pup has matured and developed its drive and purpose! in another month or 2 you can start introducing the gun in certian situations but be very carefull with this! as far as the whoa post is concerned, i am not a fan of posts, boards, barrels ect. teach whoa from heel as the lab guys have done with sit. much easier and fewer transitions to confuse the dog.

justin

[birddogger]

everybodies advice about waiting is right. i would only be concerned with "here" right now and with a pup that young that really should not be a big issue anyway. let him run, find and chase (not catch) birds for a while and when you have trouble getting him back get more serious about your recall command. wait for everything else until the pup has matured and developed its drive and purpose! in another month or 2 you can start introducing the gun in certian situations but be very carefull with this! as far as the whoa post is concerned, i am not a fan of posts, boards, barrels ect. teach whoa from heel as the lab guys have done with sit. much easier and fewer transitions to confuse the dog.

justin

This is also the way I whoa train when the dog is older, but I still whoa them before they come out the door, crate or whatever and then begin whoaing at the food bowl. These are very simple, low pressure obedience commands that can be done at any age. IMO, it helps speed up the whoa breaking process when they are old enough for more formal training.

Charlie

[twofeathers]

I like the "Perfect Start, Perfect finish" video. They go over how they incorperate whoa with first learning heel, seems like a winner. I think this is how I will be trying this off season. Right now he's gonna have fun on his first hunting season. Good luck with new pup.

[RayGubernat]

I agree that 14 wks is waaay too young for a whoa post. What you can do to both introduce the concept(and help awaken the response) as well as get the dog to come running to you is to take every opportunity you can to style the dog up and stroke it up, be that on your lap on a bench. on top of its doghouse, on the ground(hard with a puppy)...wherever. Making a dog wait at a door for release and/or wait for its food is also a minimal pressure intro to the concept.

Paul Long describes a heel/whoa drill in his book that I have used on very young dogs with success. He uses a looped checkcord. I susbstituted a Smith wonderlead(actually a pigging string) for the checkcord and am able to do heel/whoa drills on very young dogs with minimal pressure. The learn very, very quickly that if they pull, the noose tightens but if they stay by my side anhd do not pull, there is no pressure at all.

I would not put a dog on a whoa post before 9 mos. of age and then ONLY if it had significant exposure to birds AND was showing me during that exposure, that it wanted to be steadied. The way a dog shows it is ready for steadying is by stopping, hesitating at scent and/or by stopping and standing at flight. after an initial, short chase.

You have lots to do before you get there. There is no time like now to bond with the dog, get it to come to you, want to be with you and want to do what you ask it to do. The dog has got to like you and trust you before you can proceed.

The breaking proces puts pressure on the dog and its relationship with you. If it likes and trusts you, it will take that pressure and direction willingly and (usually) quickly. if not, you are both in for a rough ride.

Take the time to build that trust and affection. It will pay huge dividends in the future...for the rest of that dog's life usually.

Patience, persistence and, with a puppy, a well developed sense of humor.

RayG



RayG