Mistakes made w/ 1st bird dog?

[shootist]

I love this forum. One of the things I like most is that there is such a wealth of information.

As you all know Cash (a WPG), is my forst bird dog. I am apprehensive about training him. I feel like it will be my fault if he doesn't turn out to be a great bird dog. I have spoken to several people that have told me they learned a lot about training bird dogs from their first one.

Will any of you share the mistakes you made with your first dog? What did you do that you wouldn't do now? What would you do now that you didn't do then?

[Yawallac]

I'll jump in.

My first birddog was a GSP. She was a great dog. At that time I joined a local NAVHDA chapter in MD and began training her with the assistance of some fine people. She was an outstanding natural retriever and I never had a problem with her. The senior members of the chapter insisted that she be "force broke" to retrieve. They explained that even though she retrieved perfectly that she would one day let me down if she wasn't "force-broke".

Looking back, the mistake that I made was not understanding what "force-broke" actually meant. From the sound of it, I felt that "force broke" meant something negative and I think that message was conveyed to my dog during her training. She didn't respond well and ultimately stopped retrieving all together for a time. It was clearly my misunderstanding of how to properly teach her what I wanted and I clearly didn't understand that "force breaking" a dog didn't have to be negative at all. It is simply communicating effectively to the specific dog that you are working with.

I have "force broke" many dogs since Kelly, some easier than others, but the bottom line is that you have to adjust to each dog. Some dogs require very little "force" and some require more. The point is, take your time, be patient and ask questions. From the short time I have been on this site it is obvious that there is a lot of knowledge here. It is a great resource. I wish that the Internet was around when I got started.

[tailcrackin]

Excellent post...patience will always be a virtue. The ff if you start the dog as a pup, and encourage it threw growing up.....it will never lay down, what the cause of the lay down, is usually when you brag to your buddies and you go to show it off, and we will get in a hurry , calling it here, or whatever, bang, booger arises. Dogs are a creature of habit, you will always be able to teach a dog more with a soft or no voice, and a soft pet on the side. Just like house breaking, as soon as the dog gets up, get it outside, and as soon as it does 1 or 2, man that dog needs that is the greatest thing it has done....ever. by your voice and the excitement, the dog will associate that with a good thing, man looking to please ya dad!! Just like in the house retrieving, get a hall way shut off all escapes, take a sock, tie knot in the center, get at the start of the hallway, toss it to the end, dog has no where to go but there and back. so look you teach the retrieve, the here command, and you are making a natural retriever. Don't over do it in one sesion, 1 -3 is plenty. once the socks in the mouth biggest thing in the world, once it comes here...biggest thing in the world. Let him hold it for a little bit just pet and praise. watch the dogs eyes, it will look at you like check it out dad, look what I got ....like its showing off, praise it for that, before long retrievers in the house, whach goes to the yard. Thanks Jonesy

[markj]

I often helped out my Dad with his dogs, he had Springers.When I got my first dog it was a GSP, Dad said trin him to come, sit and fetch, he will know what to do with the birds.

He was right. I learned more about phesants from the first year hunting with him, he was hege-haus line and a free dog given to me as a gift.

I still train this way, very little bird work, mostly just playing around (they think so anyway) I get them to whoa, come, stop, fetch and play the hide and seek game with the object. Once in awhile I will buy some quail and let em play with them in the kennel.

When it is closer to hunting time, we walk over to our CRP field and work live wild pheasants and quail, no shooting tho.


Good luck, just do what feels natural, if the dog isnt interested make it a game for him. Time is what you need to give him.

[snips]

Well, my advice is simple. The most common thing people do is overdo. Let the pup be a pup, take him for walks, socialize him well, and let him find some birds and have fun. I dont go heavy on obedience until older, I usually work on Come at 5-7 months, whenever they it the age that they go the other way when called.

[Wagonmaster]

I made one mistake. I spent so much time hunting with him, and had so much fun, I did not take any pictures. I learned many lessons though. Number one of which is always always listen to your dog and do what they say.

[original mngsp]

Yup, let them be a pup! There is always time down the road for formal training, provide a few simple ground rules that the dog must learn early and then have fun with them, give em lots of attention, experiences, and love.

[Birdhunter1]

The best thign I can tell you is to carry lots of hot dogs. Everytime Rocket retreived a bird the first year he got a piece of a hot dog. He sees the retreive as one of those things of great honor and when he picks up a bird he struts his stuff right back. And then he gets a hot dog.

The biggest mistake i made with him when he was younger was not putting a shock collar on him. He'd range out so far in a dead run and keep going and come back when he wanted too. The first time out with a shocker I almost lost my heart in the dog and it hurt me more than it did him the first time I used it. He started getting the idea very quickly that he was suppposed to hunt with me not me hunt for him kind of game. That made the difference in that dog instantly. Ever since I have refferred to the shock collars as the "hearing aids."

Biggest mistake I ever made was not having the dogs on Interceptor. I lost one awesome dog to whip worms, I say awesome--she was the most cussed at bu loved Brittany there ever was, more like the class clown and duntz but she was a great hunter and retreiver.

Take that pup everywhere you can, around people, kids, other dogs etc. It will be your best bud for life if you do!

[Ayres]

Maturity brings a lot to a dog. Everyone's heard stories about a pup finishing a MH at 8 weeks old and all (exaggeration, of course), but there are just some aspects of training that will come more naturally to a dog, and with less stress, if you let it grow up first. This applies even if the dog is excelling and the next logical step is to continue training. Do yourself the favor and take the break in training to allow the dog to be a pup and grow up a little more.

If you've only got one dog, this will be the most aggrevating thing you'll have to confront if you're naturally impatient.

[Birdhunter1]

That last line from Ayres is the most truth I have heard in a long time, it is aggrevating.

Another good tip, always end your training session on a good note, make the dog think he has done something good.

Even if it is the command of "sit."

[billy]

I still hunt over first bird dog that I made every mistake in the book of poor handling skills. He is a 4 1/2 year old GSP. He grew up hunting on concrete sidewalks in a residential neighborhood. The dog was almost a year old when I realized he needed to be properly socialized & taken for runs in the fields, streams, and mountains that we would plan to hunt. After he was steady on his birds, I made the mistake of harvesting to many birds for him at a very early age. I call him my preserve dog. Since he grew up having about 40 opportunities to retreive per visit to a preserve. I should have been a bird trainer since I focused more on the bird than the staunchness of the dog. He is a good retreiver but a dog that has been trained to retreive is an excellent retreiver. All the dogs since have been on a table taught to retreive. Do you think he backs? reliably? No Were still working on his backing and when were done I plan to run him through Senior Hunt tests.
I have had a few offers recently to sell the dog, but he has contributed so much to training me! I am of the opinion that a professional trainer can steady up a bird dog in 3-5 months. The owner writting the checks may take 10 years to be trained.

Have fun with your new bird dog!

[Casper]

I have made most mistakes. I continue to make mistakes until I have made everyone out there and I know how to prevent it and correct it should it happen again. I will continue to learn from my mistakes and others.

[Maurice]

I have made them all, some of them twice LOL.. Learn from the mistakes and move forward..

Billy you are doing just fine with your dogs.


Brenda I like your advice on starting the pups.. I do the samething with my pups. I love to watch them discover birds.

Mo

[shootist]

Thanks for sharing your experiences guys.

[12 Volt Man]

Heck, I am still in the process of making mistakes. Luckily my dogs are smart and forgiving. They have still turned out to be pretty nice bird dogs.
Don't be afraid to make mistakes, it is the best way to learn.

[goddog]

I would say the two most common mistakes that I encounter are, one, pups are taught to sit and Two, pups are restrain from ranging out. .... these may not be problems for others as much as they are to me

[ViniferaVizslas]

I should have bought an ugly puppy. First dog stolen by the wife.

[ohiogsp]

The biggest mistake I make too much pressure way to early. My first dog hunting and shooting pheasants and STW&S at 6 months. The thing about it is at some point with alot of pressure it will all come apart. It is so hard to pick up the pieces.

[Wagonmaster]

ohiogsp-

that is about the most insightful thing i have heard anyone say on the "boards" in quite awhile.

[ohiogsp]

Thank you wagonmaster. That means alot coming from someone as knowledgeable as you.