Hard Mouth

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nebraskabirdman
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Hard Mouth

Post by nebraskabirdman » Tue Sep 11, 2012 9:25 am

I have a 1 year old English Field Cocker that I recently took dove hunting with me. She has retreived before and didnt have any issues with hard mouth, but as soon as she retreived the dove, she went crazy and started chomping down on it. I tried to get her to Drop it, but she ran from me!!!! I finally was able to get the bird from her mouth, but by then it was to late and ruied. I dont have a e-collar, but have been considering it since this inncident. Any suggestions? :cry:
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DogNewbie
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Re: Hard Mouth

Post by DogNewbie » Tue Sep 11, 2012 9:54 am

I've heard stories of dogs having issues with doves because the feathers fall out easily and poke them in the mouth...or something like that. I'd stop dove hunting with the dog for now and see how he does with retrieving other birds. If the issue carried over to other birds you may have to force fetch the dog to break this issue.

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Re: Hard Mouth

Post by Trekmoor » Tue Sep 11, 2012 11:42 am

This sometimes happens when pups or young dogs are sent for freshly shot woodpigeons here. The feathers on the fresh shot birds are very loose and the pup gets a mouthfull or even a throatfull. The pup begins to mess about with the bird instead of doing a clean retrieve. Perhaps your doves give a pup the same problem ?

I usually start the pups on cold pigeons or warm pigeons enclosed in a section of ladies tights or nylons. This .... so far ..... has had the desired effect , the pup gets used to the size and weight and smell of the bird without getting so many feathers. Then I give retrieves on fresh shot wood pigeons again.

Bill T.
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Sierra Wirehair
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Re: Hard Mouth

Post by Sierra Wirehair » Tue Sep 11, 2012 1:06 pm

I used a frozen chukar and my dogs have have fairly soft mouths. Not a guarantee.

Mic

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RoostersMom
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Re: Hard Mouth

Post by RoostersMom » Tue Sep 11, 2012 7:14 pm

So Bill.....do you buy the tights yourself, or are you a married guy and you make your wife buy them? Just funnin' with you. Good idea on the pantyhose! I hate taking a young dog on doves, they are so small and the feathers fall out like crazy.

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Francois P vd Walt
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Re: Hard Mouth

Post by Francois P vd Walt » Thu Sep 13, 2012 12:02 pm

Sierra Wirehair wrote:I used a frozen chukar and my dogs have have fairly soft mouths. Not a guarantee.

Mic
+1 and leave dove hunting untill dog is more mature and retrieving strong.

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gonehuntin'
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Re: Hard Mouth

Post by gonehuntin' » Thu Sep 13, 2012 12:21 pm

First thing to do is to obedience train the dog so it comes directly in when called. If the problem persists, force break the dog.

I don't use and ecollar for this....usually.....the ecollar can and will in many instances, make the problem worse.
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crackerd
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Re: Hard Mouth

Post by crackerd » Thu Sep 13, 2012 12:41 pm

gonehuntin' wrote:First thing to do is to obedience train the dog so it comes directly in when called. If the problem persists, force break the dog.

I don't use an ecollar for this....usually.....the ecollar can and will in many instances, make the problem worse.
Bless you for that advice, GH - all of it. Doves are the most tailor-made of all game for a spaniel's mouth -

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and spaniel mouths are soft too. But doves are also the bird most prone to being mouthed and masticated - doesn't mean you've got hardmouth, mis-mouthing is more like it. Do as GH says and you'll get your dog through dove shoots with a clean bill of teeth.

MG

Cptmorgan177
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Re: Hard Mouth

Post by Cptmorgan177 » Thu Sep 13, 2012 7:54 pm

I have had sucess with a "Soft Mouth Trainer" (a dummy with grooves in it, got it at Bass Pro). My dog was starting to play a little rough, but she is very soft now. Any opinoins on these are appreciated as well.

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Doc E
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Re: Hard Mouth

Post by Doc E » Thu Sep 13, 2012 7:56 pm

nebraskabirdman wrote:. Any suggestions? :cry:

Yup --- Force Fetch and don't hunt your dog (at least on doves) until ff is complete.



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crackerd
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Re: Hard Mouth

Post by crackerd » Fri Sep 14, 2012 3:11 am

Cptmorgan177 wrote:I have had sucess with a "Soft Mouth Trainer" (a dummy with grooves in it, got it at Bass Pro). My dog was starting to play a little rough, but she is very soft now. Any opinoins on these are appreciated as well.
Yes, DT Systems Soft Mouth Trainer is the best bumper out there for mouth habits - any gundog breed,

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any age or stage.

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Also, forgive poor Doc, got that myopia thing going with force fetch - or is astigmatism? :roll:

MG

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Doc E
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Re: Hard Mouth

Post by Doc E » Fri Sep 14, 2012 7:54 am

crackerd wrote:
Also, forgive poor Doc, got that myopia thing going with force fetch - or is astigmatism? :roll:

MG
Hey, you know us Lab Folks are control freaks :lol:

BTW, a good friend from OR is running his Boykin (Earl) in the Fall HRC Grand.
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Re: Hard Mouth

Post by Trekmoor » Sat Sep 15, 2012 4:07 am

RoostersMom wrote:So Bill.....do you buy the tights yourself, or are you a married guy and you make your wife buy them? Just funnin' with you. Good idea on the pantyhose! I hate taking a young dog on doves, they are so small and the feathers fall out like crazy.
Sorry Rooster, I should have replied to this earlier but I've been busy arguing/discussing a few things on British fora.
I use sections of ladies tights quite a lot when training pups their first retrieves on game. I even take a section or two with me when a young dog or pup goes to it's first shoot. I watch for an "easy" bird falling nearby then leave the pup at the sit .....or tied to a tree.... while I go the the bird and put the tights section on it.
This not only prevents the pup getting a mouthfull of loose feathers it gives the pup something to pick up that has my scent (and that of my wife's :lol: ) on it. I think the familiar scent helps bridge the gap between cold game and fresh shot game in a pups mind.

This is a vizzy pup I'm training to retrieve her first cold pheasant inside my postage stamp sized garden. The bird is encased in tights.

Image

Then outdoors without the tights
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The same bitch yesterday retrieving her first ever hare , a cold one but by now she doesn't need the tights any more.

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Sorry about the quality of the pics I am rotten with anything remotely " techie" including cameras.

Bill T.
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marysburg
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Re: Hard Mouth

Post by marysburg » Sat Sep 15, 2012 6:56 am

Brillant tip about using tights. I think it would have helped my youngest Brittany a lot to have been started that way. She will mouth small birds (quail size), but does better on larger birds. I think the loose feathers and small bird got her started, and tights would have prevented the issue. I will definitely try tights in the future.

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twofeathers
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Re: Hard Mouth

Post by twofeathers » Sat Sep 15, 2012 9:49 am

Just let the dog eat the first few it will get full eventually............ :D :D kidding. I actually found my dog wants to chomp the first dove or two also. I'm working on the same issue now.

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