New Weimaraner puppy & pup owner new to gun dogs

[ptrthgr8]

Hi, all!

I've got a nearly 15 week old Weimaraner pup - his name is Remington and we call him Remy for short. Not a terribly original name, I know, but his father's name was Colt, so it seemed rather appropriate. Picked him up from a breeder in Montanta (PM Weimaraners in Carter) who specializes in gun dogs; his parents and their parents are all bird dogs, so I'm hoping Remy will inherit some hunting awesomeness. But I know I also need to get him trained properly.

Here's me and my little guy:



And here's a pic of Remy bringing back his training dummy after we had a bit of snow in the back yard last week:



I've never had a gun dog, much less trained one... so I'm not 100% confident in my ability to not screw up the little guy. I've had several dogs and we currently also have two ~8 1/2 year old Beagles - brother and sister - but I've never trained a dog for use in the field before, so I want to leave it to a professional. The local hunting/kennel club is pretty highly regarded, so I was planning on taking Remy there. I spoke with them this morning and they prefer to begin working with gun dogs when they're closer to a year old so all of the basic obedience training is done ahead of time. I've got no problem with that (have done the basics for several family dogs in the past), but want to make sure I'm not doing anything that might screw him up for any future gun dog work down the road.

I know some of the basics - no tug of war, keep training tools and toys seperate, try to do 15-20 mins of training each day versus a couple hours only on the weekends, heap lots of praise on the pooch when he does something correctly, don't raise your voice when he does something wrong, etc. Are there any other training things I can do to help prepare Remy for Upland training in 8 months or so? My first order with Gun Dog Supply was delivered yeserday - picked up a Tom Dokken training set that includes a solid book and several bits of equipment, so I think I may have everything I need to get started... but I'm always one to gladly accept input from people who've been there and done that.

On Black Friday I'm planning to take Remy out to the range with me so I can see how he handles gun fire. Figured that's probably a good place to start. Or is it too early for something like that?

Thanks in advance!

~ Greg ~

[RoostersMom]

Greg,

I hope you didn't manage to get Remy to the gun range - that is the WORST possible way to introduce a pup to gunfire. It likely causes more gunshyness than any other action an owner could take (well, short of shooting your dog). Get the Perfect Start DVD from Perfection Kennels - they have a very systematic gun introduction that many on this site follow. It's common sense and easy to understand. It'll take your pup up until you're ready to start training at the club when he's a year old. Basic socialization is the key to raising a great dog - keep up with that, get him in the field as much as you can and get him to have positive bird experiences as much as you can as well - without much expectations on your part.

He's a great looking little pup - if he's got the drive, you'll be able to do good things with him. The Perfect Start is a good all-around DVD for pointing breed pups. It'll do gun introduction, pointing, whoa and here. All good things to work a pup on at this age. Also, just a little advice on the retrieving you're doing with him now - don't take the dummy from him right away when he brings it back, pet on him and love him up a bit and then after that, take the dummy. Grabbing it from his mouth as he runs in will make him likely to start avoiding bringing it to you. Also, quit retrieving well before he gets tired. Always end with him wanting more - don't go so long that you let him quit because he's tired.

Good luck with the little guy!

[vartz04]

You want to have the dog doing something involving a bird when it hears the gunshot. It should be so engrossed in what it is doing that the shot is just background noise.

Hanging out where multiple shots are will create a gunshy dog. I messed my parents lab up this way. I planted a bird, took her to it, and then when she flushed it I took too shots at the bird and killed it. She was back at the truck by the time I turned around. Now she hates guns, fireworks, or any loud noises. I was 15 so I didn't know any better.

With my weim I took my .22 with CB Caps (super low volume .22's sounds like a pellet gun). And had my girlfriend throw a bumper for him. When he was good and excited I started shooting the gun at the log pile when the bumper was in mid air from about 50 yards away. I had her slowly move towards me watching for a reaction. when she was about 10 yards away I was shooting right as soon as it left her hand. He had no reaction (3 months old or so at this point). I switched to regular .22's and took a few more shots.

I did one more gun intro with him the same way with a 20 gauge single shot. Shot at a clay every time the bumper was thrown and the thrower moved closer to me only took about 5 shots doing this.

Took him out a week and a half ago and shot the 12 gauge while hunting and no issues.

[ptrthgr8]

Nope, I didn't take him to the range after all. I started reading Dokken's training book (the one that came with the training kit) Wednesday night (before Thanksgiving) and it stated up front that exposing puppies to gun fire so early is a great way to ruin a good dog. So he stayed at home. (Good thing I read the book! ) Remy's already gotten good at bringing the dummy back and if he doesn't drop it right away, he almost always releases it once I put my hand under his mouth. He seems to be a pretty quick learner. I think keeping the training sessions short (less than 15 mins) seems to be working really well, too - he gets excited when I grab the dummy from the top shelf and heads to the door in anticipation; whenever we quit to go inside it's pretty obvious that he'd prefer a few more rounds. So, keeping him interested seems easy enough so far.

On Wednesday I spoke with the local gun dog trainer I'm planning to use and was told they don't normally begin working with dogs until they're closer to a year old. So, for now I should focus on socialization and basic training (stay, come, heel, simple retrieving, etc.) so they can focus on the gun dog training next summer. We've now got snow on the ground and the low temps are starting to dip into the single digits, so in the next few weeks we may be limited in our outdoor training once winter really sets in. Training in sub-zero temps doesn't sound like a good idea. And I'm sure Remy wouldn't like it, either.

Cheers,

~ Greg ~

[Ruffshooter]

Greg: Love that face. Not yours the pups.

Although your trainer says you don't start much before a year, there is a lot that can be done before thatl.

One of the most important things is letting the pup learn how to use its nose. Let it gain confidence in the field.. Let the pup run with a CC on it and let him find stuff on his own.

Intro to birds also. Get that fire set in him early in his life. Get that bird/game desire in him and things will go smoother down the road when the training get harder. (It will be his reward so to speak) Let him find some in a short cut field while he is this young. Don't worry if he does not point right off. He may not for quiet a while.

Also when a field do not talk to him to much, do not try to encourage him to do somehting let it be his idea at this point. The more you talk the more you will confuse him.

Have fun with him.
Rick

[vartz04]

Greg: Love that face. Not yours the pups.

Although your trainer says you don't start much before a year, there is a lot that can be done before thatl.

One of the most important things is letting the pup learn how to use its nose. Let it gain confidence in the field.. Let the pup run with a CC on it and let him find stuff on his own.

Intro to birds also. Get that fire set in him early in his life. Get that bird/game desire in him and things will go smoother down the road when the training get harder. (It will be his reward so to speak) Let him find some in a short cut field while he is this young. Don't worry if he does not point right off. He may not for quiet a while.

Also when a field do not talk to him to much, do not try to encourage him to do somehting let it be his idea at this point. The more you talk the more you will confuse him.

Have fun with him.
Rick

This is what I have been doing with my dog whenever I have the time. The only thing I do when we are out on a bird walk is tell him to come if he is spending too much time sniffing deer turds or runs out too far ahead.

[ptrthgr8]

One of the most important things is letting the pup learn how to use its nose. Let it gain confidence in the field.. Let the pup run with a CC on it and let him find stuff on his own.

We've got a fairly large backyard (6 foot cedar fence all around) that he freely roams. We get all sorts of bunnies, birds, and the occasional kitty running through the yard - no shortage of scents for him to chase anyhow. He seems to be picking up some tracking from the Beagles, too. Just the other day I let all three of them out and the two Beagles ran maybe 10 feet out the door and immediately stopped, put their noses to the ground, and were instantly in tracking mode. Remy ran around them a little bit (he wanted to play) before he, too, stopped to start sniffing what the Beagles were smelling. A few seconds later, the Beagles took off towards the far end of the backyard, zigging ang zagging with their noses still to the ground - Remy was right behind them. It was almost certainly a rabbit - the three of them ended up sniffing under one of the sheds in our backyard where I've seen several bunnies in past couple of weeks. Over the years I've noticed that the Beagles definitely work together when on the hunt for critters - I've done no training with them at all, so it's all instinct on their part. Does working in packs like that help or hurt a bird dog? Or is any exposure to other dogs while their working their noses good for Remy? (Don't want the Beagles to accidentally teach him any bad habits.)

Intro to birds also. Get that fire set in him early in his life. Get that bird/game desire in him and things will go smoother down the road when the training get harder. (It will be his reward so to speak) Let him find some in a short cut field while he is this young. Don't worry if he does not point right off. He may not for quiet a while.

I've been putting a few drops of pheasant scent on his retrieving dummy to help make that association. I've also picked up several pheasant wings that I plan to start him with this weekend. Aside from the birds that land in the backyard I've not exposed him any live birds yet.

Have fun with him.

That part is super easy.

Cheers,

~ Greg ~

[LincolnAlexander]

Greg: Love that face. Not yours the pups.

Although your trainer says you don't start much before a year, there is a lot that can be done before thatl.

One of the most important things is letting the pup learn how to use its nose. Let it gain confidence in the field.. Let the pup run with a CC on it and let him find stuff on his own.

Intro to birds also. Get that fire set in him early in his life. Get that bird/game desire in him and things will go smoother down the road when the training get harder. (It will be his reward so to speak) Let him find some in a short cut field while he is this young. Don't worry if he does not point right off. He may not for quiet a while.

Also when a field do not talk to him to much, do not try to encourage him to do somehting let it be his idea at this point. The more you talk the more you will confuse him.

Have fun with him.
Rick

This is what I have been doing with my dog whenever I have the time. The only thing I do when we are out on a bird walk is tell him to come if he is spending too much time sniffing deer turds or runs out too far ahead.

Same, letting them develop confidence and independance is key.

[4dabirds]

Here is some reading for you to check out. http://www.georgehickox.com/about_georg ... icles.html

[m2244]

Nice looking dog. Good luck.

[ptrthgr8]

Here is some reading for you to check out. http://www.georgehickox.com/about_georg ... icles.html

Lots of good articles there. Thanks for posting - I've bookmarked it.

~ Greg ~

[SpinoneIllinois]

Do not do the wing-on-a-string thing. It teaches sight-pointing, rather than scent-pointing.

Start looking now for a source of pigeons or quail for training.

[ptrthgr8]

Start looking now for a source of pigeons or quail for training.

How does that work? Do you bascially have to keep a bird coop on your property? Not sure that would be feasible living in town like I do - and I don't think having the birds in the house would work out. (And leaving them outside would basically mean a death sentence since the North Dakota winter will be setting in soon.) I think the professional trainer in town uses birds, but they've also got a good sized parcel of land. Maybe I can see about getting some birds from him when I need them.

Cheers,

~ Greg ~

[Sharon]

I keep 5 or 6 at a time in a large dog crate in the garage.They are a very messy bird and smell so "in the house" would be fodder for a reality tv series. You don't need pigeons for ever .

[ptrthgr8]

I keep 5 or 6 at a time in a large dog crate in the garage.They are a very messy bird and smell so "in the house" would be fodder for a reality tv series. You don't need pigeons for ever .

How long do you normally hang on to them? I guess I was just envisioning a year-round bird hatchery getting built in the backyard or something... and the wifey would kill me shortly thereafter.

Keeping a handful of them in a dog crate in the garage seems easy enough. Our garage is attached, but isn't heated or insulated, so it does get pretty darned cold during the winter - any birds kept in there would freeze to death. Since we're getting into winter now, perhaps I'd be better off waiting until closer to spring? Well, unless I can get my hands on a bird or two in the near future for pre-winter training. I don't think Remy would mind at all.

Cheers,

~ Greg ~

[DogNewbie]

can only speak for pigeons, but they can handle the cold fine....just need to be out of the wind. You've got all winter to convince the wife that birds in the garage won't be a big deal. If I were you, I'd try to train on pigeons this spring and then once the young phez chicks start flying I'd start training on wild birds.

[magspa]

I agree with starting him on live birds asap. I got my 2nd GSP in September (she was 4months). Worked her 2-3 times a week to intro birds and the gun, teaching the here command between bird contacts. Been hunting over her every weekend the past month, and she is doing great - steady to flush most of the time. One can tell by watching her in the field that she is focused on finding birds. I didnt start my other GSP (very similar breeding too) until she was almost a year old (due to relocating and other issues) and you can definitely tell a difference. They're both doing good though. Just plant some birds and bring him in cross wind on a check cord. I try to always have a few pigeons or quail at home for a quick session. I live in a suburb neighborhood and got a chicken hutch from tractor supply for $100 that works great. Maybe you will even be able to get him out hunting towards the end of the season. I didnt expect to take the young pup this year but i have some quail in the freezer thanks to her.

[SpinoneIllinois]

Start searching Craigslist for pigeon and quail sellers. Buy a trap and drive around the countryside, looking for places where pigeons flock. I found a particular farm where they flocked, and I gave my trap to a youngster at the farm. For a small fee, he trapped some and caught some with a fish net. Some people catch them at overpasses, with a flashlight and net.
Also check for local pigeon-racing groups. For early training, when shooting wasn't required, I got pigeons from a local racer. I basically rented them from him, because they'd fly right back to his coop. Eventually, it got to the point where I'd call the guy on 10 minutes' notice, and if he wasn't home, he'd tell me to just grab however many I needed, and pay him later. It's been a great arrangement -- almost as convenient as having my own coop.
Later on, you'll want a supply of shooter birds.

[Bberry20]

Greg,

I found a source in Bismarck for quail, chuckar, and pheasant if your interested in getting some. I used quail with my pup this summer. Worked great. PM me for more info if you are interested. And I would suggest getting the Perfect Start Perfect Finish for your dog. Great program to follow. I got some info on that as well if your interested.

Brandon

[ptrthgr8]

Thanks, Brandon. I'll keep your offer in mind and will holler if I'm not able to find a good source closer to home.

~ Greg ~