How far can they smell

[aim]

I've been hunting with dogs for quite a few years now and one thing that has always got me thinking is how far the dog can smell?
Lets say I'm working a field with a crosswind. I walk from one end to the other and then move about 50-100 or so yards into the wind and go back to the other end. (or lets just say a zig zag into the wind)
How tight do you guys work a field? Do you think a dog can smell a bird or bunny from 50-100 yards out?

[DonF]

Maybe and maybe not. If you watch a dog work a bird from to far out, unless you stop the dog it will usually continue on in. I don't think it's because it can't smell it necessarily but rather that it hasn't got a good locate on it. Years ago when a guy I respect very much was a young guy, he'd taught a dog to point from way the h*ll out. Really impressive except he had trouble locating the pointed bird. Sometime there was no bird to be had. Non productive? Certainly. False point? Not necessarily so but rather the dog was unable to better locate the bird. I suspect that the farther away from the dog the bird is, the wider the scent cone and harder to accurately point. I have watched dogs by pass a bird they were down wind of from farther out than I'd like the dog. At the same time I've seen the same dogs hit the scent out way to far and work it in. As we cannot smell things the way a dog does it become's hard if not impossible to understand what the dog is really smelling or why. What I am very sure of is that the dog must be down wind of the bird to smell it. At 100yds? I think that is a myth.

[aim]

I also doubt that a dog can smell one at 100. Maybe if it were a really stinky one.

Back when my other two dogs were at their best (6-8 years ago) and we had LOTS of pheasant at that time. I would work a great big pattern (couple hundred yard zig zag) through the field and if the dogs didn't get birdy at all I would simply leave and go to the next field. If they got birdy I would tighten up to about a 50 yard pattern. Now I don't really trust my old springers nose and my new dog is just starting.

I just always would wonder if the fields I left early on did in fact have birds that my dogs weren't close enough to smell. But back then it was no big deal. Limiting out was usually a max of 2 hour 2 field hunt. God I miss those days.

Now it's a two week 20 field hunt.

[cjuve]

Are you talking about birds or a bird because it makes a difference. I do know that it is possible in the right conditions for a dog to "Smell" a covey of birds at over 100yds, to accurately locate is a different question and not the one asked here. Also, I don't think that the scent given off by a single bird is strong enough to be scented near as far as a covey.

[Gordon Guy]

I've had my dog point large covey's of Quail at over or close to 100 yards. The ground was snow covered and I didn't see bird tracks for quite a ways. He had to have several relocations to get close enough. I've seen several 50 yard + points on coveys of Huns. Yes, under the right conditions (to include covey size)it's possible.

[Doc E]

Lots of factors here.
Temperature, humidity, dew point, wind speed, species of bird, and the list goes on and on.



.

[Hattrick]

Yes they can.

[AHGSP]

A good long ways sometimes.....

[Fran Seagren]

But back then it was no big deal. Limiting out was usually a max of 2 hour 2 field hunt. God I miss those days.

Now it's a two week 20 field hunt. [/quote]

So, when was 'the good old days', how many birds (roosters? quail?) would you see in a 2-hr 2 field hunt? What state?

Thanks. Fran

[Fran Seagren]

I messed up on my last post. I was trying to "quote" the part that "aim" had mentioned "missing those days" of hunting when there were more birds. My question was when and where was that, and about how many birds in a two hr, two field hunt.

Fran

[birddogger]

I am not sure how far they can smell a bird but sometimes it can be quite a ways for some dogs and that is why I don't want a dog that locks up at first scent. I want a dog to get "birdy" [tail ticking and getting excited] at first scent and working the scent until they locate and lock up at a proper distance so I don't spend 20 minutes trying to flush a bird when I have no idea where it is. That is also why I allow them to relocate on their own, once they are honest.

Charlie

[DonF]

I am not sure how far they can smell a bird but sometimes it can be quite a ways for some dogs and that is why I don't want a dog that locks up at first scent. I want a dog to get "birdy" [tail ticking and getting excited] at first scent and working the scent until they locate and lock up at a proper distance so I don't spend 20 minutes trying to flush a bird when I have no idea where it is. That is also why I allow them to relocate on their own, once they are honest.

Charlie

That's close to what I used to do. I'd relocate them into the bird and at about 10yds pop the bird on them. They got to where if they had good location, they would not relocate, knew I had the bird then. The distance they would stop on wild birds was taught them by the wild bird itself.

[aim]

I messed up on my last post. I was trying to "quote" the part that "aim" had mentioned "missing those days" of hunting when there were more birds. My question was when and where was that, and about how many birds in a two hr, two field hunt.

Fran

I live in the very North West corner of Ohio. About 5-10 minutes from the Indiana and Michigan borders.
I would say that our bird population really started getting good about 15 - 18 years ago. Then about 10 or so years ago it really peaked out and lasted until about 5 years ago. Since then it has been a steady decline to what we have now which is pathetic to say the least.

In an average couple hour hunt to see a couple dozen birds was pretty normal. Enough birds that you could sort of "pick your shots". I remember that if the dog didn't get the flush we wouldn't shoot.
Now out of these couple dozen birds I would say that the dogs would get 6-10 good flushes. Some were multiple birds and the rest were just birds that would flush out of the end of the field or one of us hunters would kick them up. It wasn't anything like the South Dakota stories I've heard but it was still a pretty awesome time to be a pheasant hunter in NW Ohio.
I was fortunate to have some pretty decent dogs through this. Brandi was a English cocker and then I got serious and got 2 English springers, Gunner and Tori. Gunner is gone now (last summer and Tori is 12 almost 13 and getting kinda bad.

[birddogger]

I am not sure how far they can smell a bird but sometimes it can be quite a ways for some dogs and that is why I don't want a dog that locks up at first scent. I want a dog to get "birdy" [tail ticking and getting excited] at first scent and working the scent until they locate and lock up at a proper distance so I don't spend 20 minutes trying to flush a bird when I have no idea where it is. That is also why I allow them to relocate on their own, once they are honest.

Charlie

That's close to what I used to do. I'd relocate them into the bird and at about 10yds pop the bird on them. They got to where if they had good location, they would not relocate, knew I had the bird then. The distance they would stop on wild birds was taught them by the wild bird itself.

Yep, the birds will teach them the proper distance and like you say, if they don't relocate you know they have the bird/birds nailed.

Charlie

[Waterdogs1]

Dogs can smell much farther than you think. Well Coyotes anyway hunt those little dudes and if they get down wind of you two hundred yards out I have been busted. When I was training detection dogs I had one little female that would smell anything and indicate twice as far as any other dog I had seen. Lots of factors determine distance and where a dog can smell things.

[Francois P vd Walt]

When scenting is REALLY good they can pick up the scent far away not 100 though, imo

[Francois P vd Walt]

Dogs can smell much farther than you think. Well Coyotes anyway hunt those little dudes and if they get down wind of you two hundred yards out I have been busted. When I was training detection dogs I had one little female that would smell anything and indicate twice as far as any other dog I had seen. Lots of factors determine distance and where a dog can smell things.

If birds were as big and stinky as humans they to would pick birds up at 200!

[SetterNut]

I have several times had my dogs when training on Pigeons go no point 50-75 yards away.
Under the right conditions I would not be surprised if dogs could scent birds while hunting at 100 yards or more.

[Waterdogs1]

Ha! Ha! I am stinky!! I agree but the question was asked how far can they smell not how far can they smell a bird. We also assume we are talking about a single bird or a covey. Dogs will have a change of behavior much farther away it depends on if they are trained to do something at that first nose full or are taught to source or fringe. We assume we know when they smell something when often time they have a nose full long before we think they have. That is the mistake I think is often made assuming a dog either can or can't smell something.The thing that amazes me is a dogs ability to recognize so many different scent and learn them with just one intro and not forget them for years. They are pretty amazing.

[Sharon]

A good long ways sometimes.....

Impressive.

[aim]

Ha! Ha! I am stinky!! I agree but the question was asked how far can they smell not how far can they smell a bird. We also assume we are talking about a single bird or a covey.

Yes I actually meant a single bird or a single rabbit. I guess I should have been a bit more descriptive in my question.

What the question boils down to relates directly towards my second question which was how closely do you work a field? Do you take a big wide meandering stroll and count on your dog to assess the situation or do you tromp over every square foot?

[Neil]

Ha! Ha! I am stinky!! I agree but the question was asked how far can they smell not how far can they smell a bird. We also assume we are talking about a single bird or a covey.

Yes I actually meant a single bird or a single rabbit. I guess I should have been a bit more descriptive in my question.

What the question boils down to relates directly towards my second question which was how closely do you work a field? Do you take a big wide meandering stroll and count on your dog to assess the situation or do you tromp over every square foot?[/quote

Unless the field you are talking about is a section of land (640 acres, 1 mile by 1 mile), I walk in one end and out the other, it is the dogs' job to find the birds by going from objective to objective. And there are always objectives, places that are most likely to hold birds (it is true you might find birds in transition in odd places, but not often).

The way you are hunting is better for flushers or even the dogless hunter. You just don't have to cover that much ground yourself, that is the dogs' job. If they are having a hard time covering all the objectives, hold up on a rise (or watch the Garmin) and let them hunt them out.

Every serious upland hunter needs at least 2 dogs, and 4 is not too many, so you can rotate 2 at a time. I have had very successful

[Neil]

Kindle would not let me edit.

Was trying to say, i have had very successful hunts with 6 dogs on the ground at a time.

[whoadog]

I know it has been awhile since this thread was posted but yesterday I had something happen that gives me something new to contribute. I started my training session by weighing and measuring all the pups I am working in preparation for selling them. So, I just happened to have a tape measure in my pocket while I was working dogs on birds. On of the best pups in the bunch not only has a good nose, but he also trusts it. When he hits solid scent he locks up no matter how far out the bird is. I have always just guess-timated distances. This time I tossed my hat down where he was standing and took out the tape when we were done with the bird.

Here were the conditions: 62 degrees, light north wind between 5-8 mph, very very dry but also in very short grass not much taller than a lawn that needs mowing, around 3 pm with good light, dog was on his second bird and had been out of the pen no more than 15 minutes, bird was a big stinky pigeon that had been in a coop with 10 other birds for 4 days.

Here's what happened: We were working across the wind and the dog, an 8 month old male, made scent at approximately 100 yards (I did not measure when he actually turned toward the bird) and after about 15 yards he stopped but the point was not solid. I relocated the dog and he pointed intensely and staunchly. I made him stand for two full minutes before I popped the bird and he did not attempt to relocate on his own. After he finished the retrieve I took out the tape and measured the distance. It was 205 feet. That's 68 2/3 yards, over half the length of an entire football field including endzones!

[RayGubernat]

Some years back I set out a remote launcher with a pigeon in it in a pasture and then walked a young dog up alongside the pasture fence on the outside... heading toward the gate. The dog was a tad over 12 months old and JUUUST about steady. Anyhow we got crosswind from the trap and the dog locked up...tight as a tick. I didn't want the dog to get any closer because the fence was hot, so I flushed around a bit and launched the bird.

I reloaded the launcher with another pigeon and then did the same thing with a littermate. i walked about five yards farther away from the fence with the littermate. Darned if he didn't lock up right about where his sister did. Afterwards I paced it off. The first dog pointed at thirty two long steps and the second at about thirty seven.

So yeah...a long way sometimes.

RayG

[UpNorthHuntin]

I've been hunting with dogs for quite a few years now and one thing that has always got me thinking is how far the dog can smell?

I haven't a ton of experience with training bird dogs, but I have over 20 years with training narcotics and explosive detector dogs, and tracking/trailing dogs. My opinion is "it depends". It depends on wind conditions, scent and moisture, humidity, and the stregth of the odor. It also depends a great deal on training. A dog, in Narcotic training for instance, has to be trained to detect odor in an open area environemt. As their training progresses, they expand their range a great deal. I had a narcotic dog once, I kid you not, that could hit one gram of heroin from about 50-75 yrds out given the right conditions. I don't knoe the specifics, but that doesn't smell nearly as strong as a "stinky" pigeon. It is an awesome thing though to watch a dog's change of behavior and then watch them Bracket the scent cone in to a final response. You cvan almost see the scent in the air by watching the dog work it.

[Duckdon]

How far is far and how do you measure the distance? I have no idea, but we run rivers allot and I swear, I believe when the breeze is slite, cool, steady and blowing down stream, my lab and DD can smell a pair of mallards at a very far distance, like a 1/4 mile or more. Moose or bears, even farther. Hard to prove but when they get up high on the wind and work it, work it until a pair of ducks flush, then settle back down it's hard to dismiss. I know when they are on alert and working the wind they get my attention. Don

[ezzy333]

I look at this question different I guess. Dogs can only smell what scent get to their nose and 99% of that depends on the conditions you are hunting in. Wind, humidity, temperature, amount of scent the bird has, the recent activity of the bird, and time of the year are some of the things that affect how far the scent will travel from the bird. If you can answer all of those variable then maybe you could have a better idea of how far can a bird be scented by a dog. The other 1% is how good is the dogs nose and I think there is little difference in most dogs of any breed and also how does the dog respond to what it smells

Ezzy.

[UpNorthHuntin]

How far is far and how do you measure the distance? I have no idea, but we run rivers allot and I swear, I believe when the breeze is slite, cool, steady and blowing down stream, my lab and DD can smell a pair of mallards at a very far distance, like a 1/4 mile or more. Moose or bears, even farther. Hard to prove but when they get up high on the wind and work it, work it until a pair of ducks flush, then settle back down it's hard to dismiss. I know when they are on alert and working the wind they get my attention. Don

I agree Don. The big factor is wind speed, humidity, and temperature. I have seen some amazing things with sent dispersion. It even applies indoors when you are working a drug dog working wind patterns in a warehouse for instance. The olfactory of a dog is an amazing thing....

[whoadog]

I also think that how much time that has elapsed in the field is important in dry conditions. As the dog's nose dries and dust builds up, they just can't smell as well. I like to hunt early season prairie chicken with my pointers. I always carry water not only keep them hydrated but also to keep that nose clear.

[UpNorthHuntin]

I also think that how much time that has elapsed in the field is important in dry conditions. As the dog's nose dries and dust builds up, they just can't smell as well. I like to hunt early season prairie chicken with my pointers. I always carry water not only keep them hydrated but also to keep that nose clear.

Good point... Not only does dry temperatures cause odor to evaporate quicker and dissipate in the air, but the moisture of the dogs nose and mouth has a great deal to do with it's ability to pick-up scent at greater distances.

[buckeyebowman]

I look at this question different I guess. Dogs can only smell what scent get to their nose and 99% of that depends on the conditions you are hunting in. Wind, humidity, temperature, amount of scent the bird has, the recent activity of the bird, and time of the year are some of the things that affect how far the scent will travel from the bird. If you can answer all of those variable then maybe you could have a better idea of how far can a bird be scented by a dog. The other 1% is how good is the dogs nose and I think there is little difference in most dogs of any breed and also how does the dog respond to what it smells

Ezzy.

Good points. I've seen my buddy's GSP stand on its hind legs and throw its nose around trying to catch more of a scent that it just got the tiniest whiff of. This usually happens on days when the air is warming and rising with just a very mild and steady breeze moving. As she hones in on the scent we can tell we're getting close when all the dog has to do is throw her nose in the air rather than stand up. I've seen her do this from some impressive distances, easily the better part of 100 yards.

[Oscar]

Nose-reaching. I think the quail did not run because I had just released my dog ​​did not have much time to point , the grass was high by allowing them to feel safe ... and the flock was united. This dog does not make mistakes with birds , ever boot his birds and if they move she seems to know where they are going and relocated direct if I send.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qExr7jJiHXQ

[deseeker]

Nose-reaching. I think the quail did not run because I had just released my dog ​​did not have much time to point , the grass was high by allowing them to feel safe ... and the flock was united. This dog does not make mistakes with birds , ever boot his birds and if they move she seems to know where they are going and relocated direct if I send.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qExr7jJiHXQ

Oscar---Nice video. The cover was pretty tall---just wondering how hard the wind was blowing to carry the scent. Any way, the dogs look real GOOD

[Elkhunter]

I have had my pointer point coveys over 150 or so yards away. More than once,it was cold with some snow on the ground and a decent breeze. I would rather have to relocate then watch birds fly from a dog creeping around. Especially late season birds in the snow.