Handling a big runner

[Bigriver05]

I have a 9 month old setter who is built to run. He makes 600 yard casts already and does hold it together somewhat in the timber. Whenever I get near fields or a power line he just lets it go and disappears. I am looking for advice on handling him without taking it out of him. I have not touched him with electric yet . I am gonna run him in coverdog puppy stakes this spring as long as I can get a hold on him.

[Saddle]

Are you on foot.

[Bigriver05]

Yes I am on foot , he is from a known grouse line in Northern PA. He is heavy Sunrise and Brannigan and heavy coverdog with Reroy, Storm, Ultimate Reissue, Bodyguard, Spencer and others. He is tall and leggy and just covers ground. He has it all a great tail and he really cracks it.

[cjuve]

600 yds does not sound like he is off the rocker yet but that really depends on the country. Is he running to run or is he hunting?

[SetterNut]

Is the dog finding birds and holding them until you get there?

[birddog1968]

drop some pigeons for him, make him believe (at first anyway) that birds are found in conjunction with you.


Does he get lost? or does he always pop up looking for you?

[buckeyebowman]

drop some pigeons for him, make him believe (at first anyway) that birds are found in conjunction with you.


Does he get lost? or does he always pop up looking for you?

This is a great point, as is the one previous to this. Does the dog become, as Trekmoor would put it, a "self employed hunter", or does he keep you in mind? It does no good for the dog to find, and point, a bird if you can't find it. Some dogs have such an abundance of energy (God, how I envy them!), that they need some settling down time, some time to blow off steam until they throttle down and hunt the way we'd like. My buddy has GSP's that are like this. When we first let them out of their crates they're off like rockets! Once they've calmed down they work more closely, and produce plenty of birds. We've tried plenty of ways to get this result right off the bat, but no success yet!

[SCT]

It takes my 8 month old pointer 3 straight days to "throttle down". 600 yards blows by the first 10 seconds (probably exaggerating) and he's been an "Outlaw" since he was 5 months old. He is now under scrutiny and will be handling better and better with the CAREFUL use of an ecollar. I've finally decided (with some help) there's no way around it. Can't wait to see him more often than 1 1/2 hour intervals .

Steve

[rinker]

drop some pigeons for him, make him believe (at first anyway) that birds are found in conjunction with you


+1

[4dabirds]

My dog is out of spencer . He will run till he finds birds . keep the birds close and the dog will hunt them Teach him to whoa and catch up. Im considering a horse!

[RayGubernat]

Come and whoa need to be installed and well ingrained in the yard. Without those two commands in the dog's head...you ain't got much. With them...you have all you need.

Down the road, once you introduce the collar, you can do "bending" drills which is nothing more than letting the dog range out and when the dog has gone near to the limit of your comfort zone, in that particular situation, you give the dog a turn command(which has already been introduced and practiced in the yard) and simultaneously give the dog a low intensity nick. After a time, you can dispense with the verbal command and just do the low intensity nick.

Bending is about conditioning the dog to operate within YOUR comfort zone, so be consistent and be patient. If you want the dog to be close in cover and wider in the open, condition the dog to those conditions...and that is what the dog will want to do...eventually.

RayG

[UpNorthHuntin]

Come and whoa need to be installed and well ingrained in the yard. Without those two commands in the dog's head...you ain't got much. With them...you have all you need.

Down the road, once you introduce the collar, you can do "bending" drills which is nothing more than letting the dog range out and when the dog has gone near to the limit of your comfort zone, in that particular situation, you give the dog a turn command(which has already been introduced and practiced in the yard) and simultaneously give the dog a low intensity nick. After a time, you can dispense with the verbal command and just do the low intensity nick.

Bending is about conditioning the dog to operate within YOUR comfort zone, so be consistent and be patient. If you want the dog to be close in cover and wider in the open, condition the dog to those conditions...and that is what the dog will want to do...eventually.

RayG

Awesome post. I've been wondering how to go about beginning to work the distance conditioning into my dog and I had never heard of the "bending" drills.

[smittty]

for bending drills i use the tone button followed by i nick after a few drills they usually come around to just tone

[RayGubernat]

I don't have a tone feature on my e-collar. If I did I would probably transition to that from verbal.

You know you and the dog are on the same page when you are reaching down for the transmitter and the dog turns.

Yeah, if you work at it, it really does happen like that...sometimes... and after a few years, even most times.

RayG

[UpNorthHuntin]

I don't have a tone feature on my e-collar. If I did I would probably transition to that from verbal.

You know you and the dog are on the same page when you are reaching down for the transmitter and the dog turns.

Yeah, if you work at it, it really does happen like that...sometimes... and after a few years, even most times.

RayG

I have been using the tone to reinforce the come (here) command. I have recently stopped because it is no longer needed. But I noticed that first the tone, then the nik. Now regardless of the command, usually if he sees the handheld in my hand he is as obedient as can be, if not the tone gets his attention. Very seldom do I have to nik him anymore. Take the collar off though and forget it. He definately knows when I can reach out and touch him and when I can't. I have been using the whistle for direction change, but I think I might try to transition that to the tone.... I hate blowing the whistle and making all that noise:)

[Francois P vd Walt]

You better of pulling on a rope than pushing it!

You need to work on recalling when he runs out of sight you need to turn him back towards you praise him when he comes around! You might sound like a cop blowing that wistle keep at it, nothing beats speeds&style! Do NOT FOLLOW the dog he has to watch were you going. It takes some time he will learn to watch you and stay with you. After all he hunts for you he HAS to learn to do as you want, if he runs to much for you you have the wrong dog for your style. My 2c

If it doesnt run it doesnt get on my truck....

Remember to have fun

[Winchey]

I don't know if the dog is screwing off on you all the time or if it is just making a couple 600 yard casts. Either way it is not uncommon in the coverdog world. If it is a really independant big running dog most guys would want to get a handle on it and keep it in until it is good on its birds and handlng. There are a ton of experienced coverdog guys in PA. Call your breeder, or ask around at the next trial.

[Neil]

Get a Garmin and let him roll. At that age just keep him to front.

[UpNorthHuntin]

Get a Garmin and let him roll. At that age just keep him to front.

+1.

I wouldn't think you would want to restrict his range if he is actually hunting and casting at 600 yrds. Whatever you take away from his range you more than likely won't get back later if you want it.

[x Bred Pointer]

I wouldn't think you would want to restrict his range if he is actually hunting and casting at 600 yrds. Whatever you take away from his range you more than likely won't get back later if you want it.[/quote]

I'm not sold on that. If a young dog shows it has the run in him it will usually come back. Most coverdog pros that I know of will rein in the derby aged dogs until they are honest on their birds and broke out. They're putting a handle on them at the same time. Once broke, they let them role again and it generally comes back especially in a trial situation..

[Wenaha]

The dog needs to learn to keep track of the handler. I do this at an early age by BEING QUIET when the dog is running. With young pups, this works, since they usually don't want to get separated from the security of the handler. With an older dog like yours, you need yardwork and the BENDING training that Ray G. described.

If you break the dog STWSF he will usually shorten considerably and handle better right after breaking - from that point you can choose how much you want to enforce range restraints. I let my setters run, but can bend them and recall them when I need to.